Toronto City Council Government Management Committee, 30 Apr 2018

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From YouTube: Government Management Committee - April 30, 2018

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Government Management Committee, meeting 27, April 30, 2018
Agenda and background materials:
http://app.toronto.ca/tmmis/decisionBodyProfile.do?function=doPrepare&meetingId=13041

Meeting Navigation:
0:16:04 - Call to order
03:11:37 - Public Session

Agenda Items:
0:17:47 - GM27.1 - (9:45 AM) Apportionment of Property Taxes - April 30, 2018 Hearing (Ward All)
0:23:35 - GM27.2 - (9:45 AM) Cancellation, Reduction or Refund of Property Taxes - April 30, 2018 Hearing (Ward All)
0:18:49 - GM27.3 - 2017 Accounts Receivable Write-off Report (Ward All)
0:19:05 - GM27.4 - Semi-annual Treasurer's Report on Activities of the Accounting Services and the Purchasing and Materials Management Divisions - December 31, 2017 (Ward All)
0:19:23 - GM27.5 - 2017 Annual Report on Non-Competitive Purchasing Activity (Ward All)
0:19:37 - GM27.6 - Largest Property Tax Debtors with Tax Arrears Greater than $500,000 as at December 31, 2017 (Ward All)
0:19:52 - GM27.7 - Procurement of Professional Services from SAP Canada for the City's Implementation of SuccessFactors to Support Enterprise Transformation Initiatives (Ward All)
2:07:55 - GM27.8 - Award of Tender Call No. 267-2017 for the Construction of the Bessarion Community Centre (Ward 24)
0:20:49 - GM27.9 - Amendment to Purchase Order No. 6045108 for Replacement of Window/Curtain Wall System, Roof Systems and Safety Anchors at North York Civic Centre at 5100 Yonge Street, Toronto (Ward 23)
0:21:13 - GM27.10 - Community Space Tenancy Lease with North York Harvest Food Bank at 2975 Don Mills Road West, Rooms 123 and 124 - Community Space Tenancy Lease and Municipal Capital Facility Designation with North York Harvest Food Bank (Ward 33)
0:24:21 - GM27.11 - Designation of Two Designated Areas for Vending on Nathan Phillips Square (Ward 27)
0:21:43 - GM27.12 - Indemnity Provisions in Real Estate Acquisitions from Public Entities (Ward All)
0:21:54 - GM27.13 - Transfer of TTC Lands at 546 Lansdowne Avenue to the City of Toronto (Ward 18)
0:22:08 - GM27.14 - Expropriation of 30 Newbridge Road and 36 North Queen Street (Ward 5)
2:08:31 - GM27.15 - Fair Wage Office - 2017 Annual Report (Ward All)
0:29:46 - GM27.16 - Queensway Excavating & Landscaping Ltd. - Disqualification from City Contracts, Fair Wage Policy Non-Compliance (Ward All)
1:33:53 - GM27.17 - Ruffolo Contracting Ltd. - Disqualification from City Contracts, Fair Wage Policy Non-Compliance (Ward All)
3:15:31 - GM27.18 - Enactment of By-laws (Ward All)

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Attention please, when members of the government management committee, please report to committee room one for quorum. Thank you.

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Attention, please would members of the government management committee, please report to committee room one for quorum. Thank you.

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So the morning everyone I'll call the meeting to order.

C

So we'll start by welcoming everyone to the meeting 27, as the government management committee welcome to all the members and for those of for those in the room with us today, the screen at the back of the room provides real-time updates concerning where we are in the agenda and what's coming up next, you can follow the agenda and debate on your computer tablet or smartphone at triple w Toronto CA, / Council and the government management committee needs to be gratefully acknowledges.

C

It is meeting on the traditional territory of the Mississauga of new credit first nation, the.

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Shawnee, the Huron, when dot and home to many diverse indigenous peoples, so.

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So any declarations of interest under the municipal conflict of interests, okay, there being none. We need confirmation of the minutes of April 3rd 2018, moved by Councillor Troisi, all in favor opposed okay and now we'll go through the speaker's list.

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Go through the agenda now: okay, all right! So the first item on the agenda: GM 27.1 apportionment, apportionment of property, taxes, April 30th, 2018,.

C

Anybody wish to hold, or anybody wish to move counselor Shannon.

C

I'm being told this is a timed hearing, so I think we'd better for well 9:45. So anyone in attendance for this does my check. Okay, there being no nobody in attendance, then it's moved by Councillor shut, all in favor proposed and next item: 27.2 cancellation reduction or a refund of property taxes.

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Okay I'm told we have an amendment so I'll hold that down to a little later, I'll hold that item. 27.3 accounts receivable write-off report. Anyone would like to hold you're going to hold like to move adoption. Okay, all in favor opposed okay and 27.4.

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But I would like to move or hold okay concept. I see moving a 27-point for us all in favor, okay, passed 27.5 at 2017 annual report on non-competitive, purchasing activity moved by Councillor Shan, all in favor, 27.6, largest property tax debtors with tax arrears greater than 500,000 as of December 31st.

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Any move adoption by Councillor Davis on a favor, both 27.7 procurement or professional services from us, ap Canada for the city's implementation of successful factors to support enterprise. Transformational initiatives, move adoption, anybody consider Davis all in favor, okay, pass 27.8 award of tender call number 267 2017 for the construction of the the Syrian community center.

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We need mover insertion on a favor.

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Hold that one or 27.8 held by councillor since the pass I'm told I got a reopen it. So it's reopening all in favor, okay and now we will hold it for councillor, Davis and 27.9 amendment to purchase order, 604, 50, 108 for replacing of window curtain wall system, roof systems and safety anchors at Northridge, Civic, Center and I'd like to hold move.

C

Okay, it comes to the choices moving adoption and the chair just arrived good morning, all that so at 27, a 1-0 community space tenancy lease with North York Harvest Food Bank at 2975, Don Mills. Anybody would like to hold this item no move by all of you. Counselor oh I, see mm-hm.

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27:11 designation of two designated areas for vending on Nathan Phillips, Square.

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Have a speaker on that so we'll hold that down.

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27:12 indemnity provisions and real estate equip our positions for public entities, any movers councillor Shan on favor, okay, 27:13 transfer of TTC lands of 546 Lansdowne Avenue, and you better like to move counter Ainslie on a favor.

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Okay opposed 27:14, appropriate appropriation of thirty Newbridge Road and 36 North Queen counter agencies moving on a favor opposed 27:15 I believe this is on the speaker: 27:20 7.1, fair wage office, two zero one, seven annual report.

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Concert why see moving you like to hold that concert? Davis is holding 2715.

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2716 Queensway ask evading and landscaping limited disqualification from city contracts. We have speakers on that 27:17. We have speakers on that as well. That's it.

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Alright, so first item on the speaker's list.

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Anybody here for 27.2 this is the cancellation reduction or refund of property taxes. Anybody in attendance to speak to that all right, since there is no one in attendance, there is told a technical amendment, that's on the screen and have a look at that and I'll be moving. That item now with the technical amendment, as shown on the screen, all in favor opposed.

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The item is amendment as amended as well: all in favor opposed okay, so that passed.

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All right so now we're going to the speaker's list 27:11 first item: this is the designation of two designated areas for bending on Nathan Phillips Square and the first speaker is miro suave Oh girls, slop welcome.

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Good morning you have five minutes, you know the routine, so.

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Ever you're ready.

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Go ahead, five.

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Minutes right, yes, I.

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Might seen the wrong.

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Stewart, you all know you all know what Nathan Phillips Square looks like anyways.

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My one issue that I have.

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Okay, thank you, anyways, the the the one issue I have. If you move the thing to reddish orangish Square from the original PDF, it hasn't being anything how to go. No effect. If you, if you move an item, you may be blocking people, people with in wheelchairs and scooters and things and things like that when you move around those hot dog vendors I'm, please don't cancel them that beautiful food, because there's no real food in this area. When you.

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This it might be knowing that in enough room for people, people in wheelchairs or scooters, my aunt isn't on the scooter. It's a bit on the wider wider side. If you move this, absolutely nothing on this report, unless I miss liner to the talks of our hearts are going to affect a people with different mobility devices or under AODA. I have spoken about AODA here permit many years, there's absolutely nothing here about it, and that's just my main concern. If you want to revitalize Nathan Phillips Square go for it.

E

Just leave my heart of vendors alone, but the accessibility issue. You know, even if you move it 10 meters, to most of you, it may not seem like a lot, but but somebody on a scooter. What's ago, those walkers it may change change or a lot they're their life if they leave they're going to go out, get get a hot dog or a burger or those trucks. You know that just my main concern. Thank you.

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Thank You mr. clutch, does anybody have question to the deputy, seeing none Thank You mr. glove appreciate it questions of staff on this item.

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Councillor Davis, you.

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Just tell us what's happening and why they're being moved and how it will affect users.

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We've actually had through you, mr. chair, we've, actually had in place an agreement with these four hot dog vendors since 1999.

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At that particular point in time, the city went out for a request of expression of interest for the revitalization of Nathan, Phillips Square and the agreements have been on a month-to-month basis since that time, since the completion of the revitalization of Nathan Phillips Square, where we want to proceed forward with a longer-term agreement for these four vendors and.

D

The longer-term agreement is for what locations.

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The locations, as indicated in the report through you, mr. chair, are on the fronting on Queen Street. Yes, at the south side of the property, as indicated in the report, there's two areas: one on the east side, which is larger and one on the west side. Okay,.

D

And the vendors are not here so I presume they're satisfied with this alternative, correct.

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We've been working with the vendors ongoing to ensure that they're complying with the terms of the arrangement in terms of containing themselves to the allocated space. Okay,.

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Okay, thank you.

F

Okay, Thank You councillor Davis. Are there questions of staff? May I like to speak to this move. The recommendations surname is moving the recommendations all in favor carried.

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And our next item is GM 27 point 16, Queensway, excavating and landscaping limited disqualification from city contracts, fair wage policy, non-compliance. We have two speakers listed the first one is McDonald Allen from we're folds LLP, and just so everybody knows there is a package in front of you from the deputy. It contains some confidential material we received on Friday.

F

If you have questions on the confidential material, we would have to go in-camera at some point, sir. You have five minutes to address the committee whenever you're ready. Yes, there.

D

There is information in this document that is the beginning section prior to exhibit a that contains no confidential information related to identifiable individuals.

D

So I'm wondering if you could look at section the beginning section, verses, Exhibit A, to determine whether or not we can ask questions related I suspect that the first section we're going to hear submissions about in any event. So if legal or somebody could look at that section and tell us whether or not we're able to do that, my.

A

Understanding is that the material that you have before you came two clerks on Friday and that their intention is to review the document following the meeting and determine what information in the document can be made. Public I think that the decision that clerks have made in relation to the manner in which we're proceeding today is that members of council can ask in open session questions about the document of the deputies this morning, but should refrain from asking their questions in a way that would disclose information in the document that is related to identifiable individuals. So.

D

You're confirming what I said, which is the first section, does not identify any individuals and is a statement of their case and their facts. And presumably we can both question and speak to this.

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Largely yes, I think that there are a couple of references in that document to individuals and clerks has a concern with respect to those references.

A

Page three of the document in the second paragraph great thank you.

F

Councillor, Davis, I'm, fine, okay, so sir, we have five minutes to address the committee. The way it works here once you address the committee, any member of the committee can ask you questions for up to five minutes once that part of the process is over, we've heard from all the deficits we do.

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We call what's bringing back in the committee where we ask questions of staff on this item, then each councillor can speak for up to five minutes on this item and move motions and then we'll vote on the end on the report or any motions that are put forward. Yeah five minutes to begin whenever you're ready.

G

Okay with Mike and Edith Ragnar, who are the owners of Queensway their two children, Mike and Edie Ragna, who also administer Queensway and to current employees and machine operators, Robert lukovitch, as well as one former operator and employee Rosa, we're here today to respond to allegations arising from a 2018 investigation from the fair wage office.

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The first allegation which is set out in my written letter deals with a 2006 investigation into Queensway in 2003 2016, not 2006 in 2016 Queensway was investigated and it was determined that they were paying their employees an hourly wage rate that was below the fair wage rate. Queensway complied with. The investigation.

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Queensway agreed to provide additional wages to nine employees of these nine employees. Five of those employees voluntarily decided to give those additional wages back to Queensway. The allegation is that they were required to do so in order to keep their employment. That is just false. The two operators that are here today, mr. lukovitch and mr. Yates, they were part of that 2016 meeting. They were two of the five that voluntarily agreed to give the money back to Queensway, and they did so as part of that agreement.

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They also signed additional acknowledgments and releases indicating they knew that they were entitled to those wages. They could have kept him if they wanted to and they voluntarily decided to give them back and the reason they did that this is a this is a small business. These owner operators don't tell their employees what to do. They all make decisions together, and so that's how that operated. I'm happy to answer questions with respect to the 2016 allegation.

G

There are documents in that material that address that allegation specifically, but I'd also like to move forward to the current allegation, which is that in 2018 and 2017, the two most recent contracts that Queensway has been awarded by the city. The allegation is that they are paying their employees less than they are entitled to not on an hourly wage rate basis, but on an hourly basis.

G

When a Queensway operator goes to a city, job site, Queensway receives a call, Queensway notifies one of its employees or operators that you have to go to job site a or B or C. They attend Queensway. They pick up a machine, they drive out to that city job site and they either wait for their job to be completed, or they immediately get to work in either circumstance the city staff and the project manager of that job site sends them home at a certain time.

G

Generally, there are two shift periods. The first is a morning or day shift at 7 a.m. to 3 p.m. and the second one is 3 p.m. till I believe 10:00 p.m. sometimes it can start at 2 p.m. and go till 9:00 p.m. I believe those are the shift periods. However, what happens is that when their work is finished on the city job site, they get sent home, they get sent back to Queens way, but they get issued a shitty-ass City shift card.

G

Okay and on that city shift card, it records that day's shift, which will either be eight hours, plus one additional travel hour or in some circumstances it can be a double shift. So you work the day shift and the evening shift when that Queensway employee returns to the Queensway yard, they self-report the hour that they returned to the Queensway yard and then they go home. So there's a discrepancy between I'm, just gonna put a little diagram up here for you, so everybody can understand what we're talking about.

G

There's this discrepancy between the city's shift card, examples of which are included in Exhibit C of my written materials and the actual time worked by the Queensway operators.

G

I, don't think the pages are numbered in your packages, but if you flip loosely forward to a contract or work card dated January 10th, it's about 12 or 13 pages through that Exhibit C you'll see an example. This is a January 10th City of Toronto district or Toronto water district operations contractor work card.

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It says that he worked at a city, job site from 7:00 till 3 Records 8 hours, plus one additional travel hour. That is included in the contract.

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If you turn the page in your package, you will see the employees self-reported actual hour worked card, they returned to the yard and at the bottom they write in when they return that's what they get paid for. They get paid for the actual hours they're supposed to work, or they do work. That's what the fair wage policy requires them to do so I'll. Stop on that point and answer. Questions on the fair wage policy doesn't require that Queensway pays their operators in accordance with this shift card.

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It requires them to pay for actual hours worked and that's what they do. Okay,.

F

Thank you, sir questions of the DEP unit, counselor Davis,.

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The two points you're making here, but what I like to know about is the contract you have with Toronto water, which requires 8 hours shifts. Are you and are you? Is the company being paid as though those workers are working? Those.

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On behalf of the company to meet the city of to meet the city of Toronto's obligations, your obligations to the City of Toronto contract, so.

G

I can explain that for you, so the operator that the company is required to invoice pursuant to those shitty City shift cards. Okay, that's the eight-hour mandatory requirement and.

D

Presumably, the city is paying for that correct.

G

Correct but those individual operators and employees don't work those full hours. They bring the carb the machine back to the Queensway yard. They hand off the keys to Queensway. Queensway then does the maintenance, the cleaning they're required to get the insurance for the vehicle. So they are the ones who are available. The for administrators are the ones who are available. 24/7 I think.

D

You're missing my point: is the city assuming they're getting 8-hour shifts out of your employees under their Toronto water contract I.

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Don't know what this city's understanding is of how the water department operates. I do know that the water department issues eight hours time cards, okay,.

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They don't issue actual time cards, they actual time cards related to the shift that they hire.

D

Employee your shortchanging people on their eight-hour shifts is what it sounds like to me and that the City of Toronto is paying you for eight-hour shifts and somebody's making up the difference, getting the difference in their pockets. So.

G

That's that's not what's happening. The employees have signed up to work certain hours for Queensway I understand we were saying yes, the city is being invoiced for 8-hour shift cards- okay, because that's been in practice since and if I could just explain this one for because it's important this, this water department contract started with a pilot project in 2012, okay and in 2012 the city issued shift cards for the actual hours worked, so it would be three hours four hours or five hours.

G

They didn't issue these standard, 8 hour shift cards and everybody determined that they couldn't operate like that. That wasn't a viable model that allowed the city to get the required service they they wanted and have operators bidding on those services. Okay,.

D

I mean I know we're talking about the fair wage policy and whether those hours are paid and I don't know if anyone's here from Toronto water, but at some point I, wouldn't mind asking Toronto water questions. Thank you.

F

You know questions the deputy encounter Asante in five minutes. Yes,.

C

Or just a couple of questions came up as councillor Davis was questioning as well now, I don't know if I can make reference to the shift card and the confidential report or not.

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C

I know I'm just looking at a I'm looking at a shift card and, and so I think this is already public information where it's. It seems clear that this card is shows an individual who signed from a start date to a fin or a start time to a finish time from 7 a.m. to 3 p.m.

C

8 hours, so so they're obligated to sign these cards employees of the Queensway correct, correct right, so that would mean that then the employee will get paid. What's on that card, that's.

G

Not correct so.

C

So they sign a card saying they worked eight hours, but they don't get paid eight hours.

G

So what happens is that the water department issues this card when they say operator, we don't need your services. We don't need the machine at this site any more today. Thank you for coming out for the day, chef's, here's your shift card that reflects that you attended our city site for the day shift. He could receive this card at 11 a.m. and it would say the same thing. The city keeps a copy of this card. We required an operator for this day shift. We didn't need him for the entire time.

G

They don't record the actual hours that he was on site. They hand him a contract, a work card that reflects the shift that he was required to show up for, but he doesn't stay for the entire shift. Now, the difference between what happens with this small business and with other operators is that my understanding is that other companies require their employees, and even the city requires our employees to stay on site for that entire shift. That's not what happens here.

G

They return to the yard, the Queensway yard, they return, Queens ways, machine to Queens way and the individual operator goes home. They can go home and pick up their kids from school. They can do a whole bunch of other things in the afternoon. Queens ways required to stay. They they get this sheet from their operator. Saying, there's all these problems with the machine. Can you fix it so that the next time I have to go out for a shift? I have a machine that I can run and Queensway.

G

Does that and that's the justification we say for being permitted to invoice the city based on those shift cards, so the.

C

Eight hours, then, are not necessarily work to buy this one individual. That's they get sent home at noon. The remaining three hours will be picked up by Queens. Way correct. Is that what you just graduated.

G

They retain that those three hours from that invoice does.

C

This card get adjusted to reflect the true hours worked. No, and why is that? I do and I've signed an eight hour card right. I expect to get paid for eight hours with.

G

The exception that were in Queens Way when they come back to the yard. They they log in the time on their Queens Way card that they go home and that's what they expect to be paid. The employees expect to be paid for the actual hours they work for Queens. What Queens Way is not saying employee thanks. You got let off early by the city, but you have to stay here for your full eight hours, so.

C

That's what they expect. Why are planes coming in? That is the the expectation. So, if I know that the agreement between us is that I can work up to eight hours or I can only work to the point that you send me home because you're not my services are not required, then I'll get paid, I'll get paid less than eight hours, but why are we signing or is it employee even signing for eight hours? Well,.

G

If the employees signing the shift card that the city gives them as to the motivation of the complaints, I can't speak to that I understand. Some of the complainants are here. If, if I had specific dates, that they're complaining about I would say that we would actually have documentary and even video evidence from Queens ways- yard of them. Coming back to the Arden going home before the time that they're saying that they're entitled to be paid so.

C

In terms of our fair wage policy and and the way it's it's written.

C

The city is invoiced for the full shift correct, even if the individual is sent home early, correct.

G

So, if I can just make one clarification, how the city is invoiced is not reflected in the fair wage policy. There's a specific section of the fair wage policy that talks about the the operator, the company's obligations, and in that section the obligation of the company is to keep a list of names and classifications of all workers employed in the work, the hourly rate and the hours worked per day. They have to keep their own record of the hours their employees work and that's what the fair wage policy says that they should be paid it's.

G

There are two separate issues: I know we're trying to to join them and and everyone when I got presented with this issue, I struggled with why they shouldn't be joined, but they're not did.

F

C

Are a counselor croissant hats, your last question: do the employees understand what you just said yes and they sign off on all right, Thank You.

F

Councillor Shan five minutes.

B

Thank You mr. chair, my first question is: are on the first case of 2016. You mentioned about five of them: nine employees returning their increase of the payment act on a voluntary basis, correct. How does that happen? It was it like. Did they come into an agreement that they said that they will be doing this on their own like signed, so.

G

Yes, so what happened was Queensway met with their employees and said during this 2000 Festa Gatien with fair wage office, it's been determined that you're entitled to additional monies. This is how much you're entitled to and several of those operators set up, stood up and said. We don't want that money. We want to return that money to Queensway. We want to keep working for Queensway and, yes, we'll agree to be paid. The higher fair wage rate going forward which they have been, but we're not worried about this last year.

G

We're gonna give that money back to Queensway. Four of those five individuals signed documents that reflect that it was a voluntary return of money. It candidly, one of them, did not and I understand from my client that that was just an administrative oversight, but that that individuals continued to work for a full year plus for Queensway. Before these allegations were raised.

B

The the question around hours, so the second case when you're going to think you know so, there's been basically employees signing a card for eight hours, but not being paid for eight hours. The understanding from the company is that part of the hours is was compensating the work. They were doing to complement. What needed to be done. Was this ever communicated to the city as the aggressive way the function is happening. My.

G

Understanding was that there had been discussions at some of these meetings about how this worked. I mean the city and the water department certainly knows that they are there signing time cards for eight hours when they're sending the guys home before that. So my understanding was that they had had conversations the specifics of those conversations. I actually don't have the information today for you, but this has been a practice. That's gone on ever since that pilot project, so from 2013 forward with these water department contracts. This is how its operated. Okay,.

B

F

Another question socket, sir sorry, can you explain to me so you're saying this has gone on since the pilot project correct.

G

So my understanding was, the pilot project was set up where the city department, water department, time cards were issued for actual hours worked. So if you show up at 7 a.m. and you leave at 11 a.m. you get a city water card that says you've done at 11 a.m. the issue became they couldn't service. The demand that the city wanted with that structure. So what they implemented was okay.

G

If we call you out for a shift, if you have to fire up the machine getting in a drive, some in some cases, two hours to our site and drive back work that machine for sometimes you only have to dig a hole for an hour. We're gonna give you a minimum payment for that shift that we called you vote for and that minimum payment is this shift card that you get and that's that's the justification for the water department, signing it at 8 hours, even if they leave at 1 a or 1 p.m.

G

and it's the same justification for the employee. Signing right.

F

So you're your client- this is his second, so he's been found in violation and the fair wage policy ones right. This is a another accusation that they've been found in violation and you're saying this has been going on for a while, but nobody on your client side contacted the fair wage office and said this is the issue that we're seeing is taking place well,.

G

Well, they didn't see it as an issue to be honest, that's how they they thought it operated. So they didn't come to their attention to say. Well, we better go get this rubber stamp by fair wage office. What actually happened was there was an audit in June 2017 in September.

G

My client followed up with the city and said: are we okay, you've had our stuff for the whole summer, we're about to bid on a couple other contracts. There was a response from the fair wage office. That said your numbers, your figures are correct, but no mention of this discrepancy between the shift card issued from the city and the actual self-reported card from Queensway. There's one caveat to that that I learned recently. The actual time reported these these self-reported time cards that Queens ways.

G

Employees kept I, understand that those weren't given to the city in its request for material.

F

So sorry, your your client didn't have there's no concerns the your employees were working from 7:00 a.m. to 1:00 p.m. and that there was paperwork being submitted that they were being paid from 7:00 to 3:00. Your client didn't have a concern with that. Well,.

G

Their understanding with the water department was that they they were had to invoice based on the shift cards because they mobilized their fleet to opera to service the city. For those shifts, that's what they were to build the city for so that's how it worked all.

F

Right and the comment in the report that says that fair wage office went out and talked with the backhoe operators that said that they were working from 7:00 to 3:00 and we're only be paying being paid from 7 to 1. So your employees were lying to the your clients. Employees were lying to the fair wage office. Inspectors I, don't.

G

Actually believe that that allegation came from my clients, current employees, I think that was from some former employees, but fair wage can justify.

F

Those to their current complaint, that's.

G

Before us from past employees from employees who left my client in December, 2000,.

F

So that so sort of the current complaint, we're in bastian, says that fair wage office interviewed numerous workers employed by Queensway engaged on the worksite the backhoe operators indicated. They typically worked from 7:00 a.m. to 3:00 p.m. however. They only get paid for the hours worked from 7:00 a.m. to 1:00 p.m. at the prescribed fair wage rate. So you're saying that those workers they were interviewed, saying this are no longer with the firm I.

G

Don't know who said those comments, so I can't answer that question directly: here's how it worked for Queensway and the people that I do know about. Okay, no.

F

Sorry I asked about doc I.

G

Don't know who made that allegation so I can't answer that question. Okay,.

F

All right, thank you very much. You have another question, counselor Davis, so.

D

In the first instance of your fair wage policy violation in 2016, the company claimed that the employees were not employees and that they were subcontractors or independent contractors, and yet the city found them to be in the city's opinion. Employees are you considering them employees now? Are you arguing still that their independent contractor.

G

No so I think that's a bit of a different issue in 2016. My understanding was that they were shareholders and as a shareholder, they were owner operators of the company and that that position was not agreed to by fair wage office. Currently with respect to Queens ways: clients they are employees, okay, they are employees, they're, not saying that that doesn't apply. However, it's still a small business. Their fair wage office is taking the position that, under the fair wage policy, sorry good. That's.

D

Fine I just wanted to clarify the employer, employer question yes, so they are employees and do they have terms and conditions of work that are set out anywhere. They.

G

Do not have written employment agreements no, so.

D

There are no terms and conditions of work that you're, aware of that. Is it formally understood by the employees not.

G

That I'm, aware of not that I'm worth.

D

So there is nothing that says you get paid by strictly the number of hours you work, no.

G

So there was, there was a meeting amongst employees before bidding on this current contract. Okay, and- and this is how that meeting went, they turned to the employees, the operat, the owner of the company, said. What do you guys? What's a fair wage for you? What what do you want to be paid because what the what the employees did not want? They did not want to only be paid for the day that they worked. Okay, because then they they had no guarantee of income over a course of time.

G

They could not rely on a constant income. So what they asked for was an average was that they would receive six hours average over a period of time minimum if they were. If they went over the eight hours, they would be paid for over eight hours. It's a bit of a complicated structure, but the intention was driven by the employees to ensure that they could rely on a met amount of income over time, but.

D

There is a fair wage, correct. The city has a fair wage policy right.

G

And not in their paid yeah.

D

We're going to be paid somewhere some amount of hours that would have somehow, in the end, a fixed amount of income, no.

G

So, in the circumstances when they came back to the yard at one o'clock or before 1 o'clock, 1:00 p.m. so they worked less than 6 hours, they would be paid a minimum of 6 hours for that day from Queensway. Okay, in the circumstances, when they worked over 8 hours, they would be paid for the actual hours worked over 8 hours, but the difference was if it if they, for example, worked a double shift. No.

D

But so you were kind of making up the hours, no.

G

No, they record the actual hours.

D

For the city, they thought the staff are being paid 8 hours, I.

G

Don't know the understanding of the city's the city's understanding of how of what happened. I knew do know that the city wanted Queensway to invoice pursuant to the city shift card. Would you bid on this correct job.

D

You knew the fair wage policy was in place. You knew what the fair wage was and you signed on that. You agree to the fair wage policy and the rates contained in the fair wage policy.

G

Correct: okay,.

D

G

They are paying the fair wage rates for.

D

Some questionable number of hours well.

G

The position is that they actually pay for the actual hours worked, and then it's averaged over a week so that they get six hours every day.

D

Okay with deductions and all of correct.

C

I just want one more question so clearly some employees of Queensway feel that they're not being paid for the full hours worked. Why is that? The.

G

Employees that I've spoken to feel like they're being overpaid because they're be paid this minimum so when they come back early they're guaranteed a minimum number of hours that they chose because they wanted to be able to spread it out over the week. Okay, okay, so the allegation. My understanding is that the allegations related to being underpaid come from two of Queens ways: former employees who have left to work for a competitor on the same contract and if Queens, Way and and my friends Ruffolo here are deemed non-compliant. There's only one contractor left so.

C

They're complaining because maybe the other employer is paying differently on a different.

G

Scale, I, don't know the motivation for their complaint. What I'm saying is that the employees that currently work for Queens wait do not feel that, like they're being underpaid.

F

Just on a point of order, so earlier, when I asked you that question about whether the employees that were complaining- you said you didn't know if they were current employees or former employees and now you're, saying they're former employees. So so.

G

We had a meeting with the fair wage office last week and I was informed that there was allegations from two former employees with respect to the report. The report came out and I don't know who specifically made that allegation.

G

The report came out after our meeting with fair wage office, so I don't know who specifically made that complaint. Sorority.

F

And tropicalis Arcosanti, my apologies.

C

And I just have one final question: does a fair wage office understand we're from the very beginning where they ever explained how the policy is with Queens way in terms of how they pay out? No.

G

So my understanding is that our meeting last last week was the first time that this was laid out for them how it works.

G

They hadn't actually seen the actual time cards that the employees self-report with the time they returned, so they were operating under the assumption that the city's the city shift card, the employees were working, those full eight hours all.

C

Right then, we'll have questions of staffing, I'm sure all right. Thank you. Thank you. Okay,.

F

Thank you. Somebody else have any questions: nope, okay! Thank you, sir. The next step you dent is Fulvio Savini.

F

Morning, mr. Savini I'm not sure if heerd the directions I gave you the previous step. You have five minutes to address the committee with your comments, each member, the committee can ask you questions for up to five minutes. After that we bring about what we call bring it back into committee, where we can ask questions of staff on this item and then each member of the committee can speak for up to five minutes and move motions or and we'll vote on the motions and this report there's a speaker in front of you.

F

There should be a light on in front of it on the table. That means the speakers on and you have five minutes to begin, whenever you're ready.

I

Thank you, I just want to say a few words, not a lot.

I

These self reporting time sheets that the gentleman was indicating were circle check sheets. They, the contractor, did not submit those to the city for payment this they submitted the actual receipt from the job foreman signed by the operator and the foreman witnessed as form of payment. So we never- and my colleagues never signed any papers saying that we agreed to six hours a day when I first started with Queensway I was being paid eight hours a day and after they were first audited, they decided to pay us six hours a day.

I

So I thought that we would go back to eight hours a day like we were making when I first started, because I was making $25 an hour when I first started at eight hours a day, then later on, they were forced by fair wage to give us a raise and they cut our hours. So basically our pay was the same, and the city gives us eight hours, plus one our traveling time, which the traveling time we never got. Never.

C

I

Got so they say six hours a day they pay six hours a day. We come back at 1:00. Sometimes we come back after one o'clock. Many many times come back after one o'clock, even three o'clock, but still only getting paid till 1:00 and no traveling time. So.

I

We were me and my colleagues we're looking for other employment and when we did find other employment with another contractor that works for the city under the same contracts, we decided to leave now we are making eight hours a day, plus traveling time with another contractor. So this practice that's still going on. There me and my colleagues are wondering: how long is it going to go on for before?

I

Something is done? That's all I have to say.

F

Okay, thank you very much questions. Councillor Davis I, don't.

D

Think I got information well how many people are working there. Do you know I, don't know? Okay,.

D

So just I asked this question and it's very clear: there are no terms and conditions of work that are set out either in a collective agreement or in any kind of agreements. But your understanding when you started the job was, it was eight hours yeah.

I

I was originally making eight hours and.

D

Everyone assumed that yeah, that was the verbal agreement. Yes,.

I

And also a verbal agreement that we would repay the money that was deemed ours by fair wage when they were first audited and I did repay it, but I didn't sign any papers agreeing to it. Mine would give.

D

Rectum you did give back money, yes,.

I

Nine thousand three hundred dollars.

D

Thank you. It's.

I

All documented, with fair wage.

F

Counts for santi question of the deputy. Yes,.

C

Thank you for coming in and your presentation. So when you first started at Queensway, you started.

C

Understanding that you would get paid for eight hours and you actually got paid for eight hours, yes at somewhere down the line that change yes,.

I

After they were audited the first time the City fair wage Department mandated that they pay us an increase from 25 to 40 something an hour. So they decided to cut our hours by two to make up the difference in pay increase. Okay,.

C

And you said you went if eventually you left, you went to another contractor, the other contractor the work you do there was. Is it the same in scope and exactly the same same machine as well right and you're? There are you still there? Yes, okay and and you're getting paid what it says on the city ticket eight hours, yeah plus travel plus travel. So that's a plus yeah all right, Thank You.

F

Councillor Shan Thank.

B

You, mr. chair now what the employees were all the employees who are working with you aware that this is money coming from the City of Toronto to pay you tract, we don't know how much it is. No, not the money, but you knew the City of Toronto was the like. The was the source of the work right. Yes,.

I

Well, we work for the City of Toronto every day on emergency repairs. Okay,.

B

And, and were they were they aware of ways in which they would be able to contact City of Toronto to make those complaints? If there were any myself, not you just in general, the workers were they aware of what there.

I

Is we were very aware of each policy? Yes, because the the first time they were audited? We were aware: okay,.

B

Well, you aware, before the audit happened, that not ever you weren't aware of the fair wage policy before they all it happens, no! Okay, thank you.

J

F

Thank you very much, sir appreciate you come in this morning. Questions of staff, councillor Davis.

D

So if I understand what's happened here, the first time they were in violation in 2016 was identified, they weren't paying the fair wage, and so the wage was adjusted up to the city's fair wage. Is that correct? That is correct and then the second infraction with the policy it appears that they have reduced the hours of work and then asked or employees to pay back, because hours of work were cut to compensate for the fair wage. Is that your understanding what's happened? The.

H

Workers were paid for about six hours per day per worker, although the hours that we were able to determine where worked were based on Toronto water work, contractor work, arts so.

D

We really have no way of knowing what the hours were, because it sounds like. There was some kind of weird averaging going on. At least they claimed it was some averaging and some fixed amount that somehow was verbally agreed to somewhere at some. According.

H

To the workers that made these allegations, they have indicated that they were up to three o'clock and perhaps more than that, so.

D

The city's expectation is that they were working eight hours, that is Craig in Toronto waters, expectations, Toronto water expectations that we're working eight hours. They bid on a contract and said through.

I

You, mr. chary, absolutely they those feed the machines and the operators were embedded with our crews, our work, our crews, work an eight-hour day, and so our expectation is that the resources were available to us drove that period.

D

Okay, so what is outstanding if they were to pay the difference this time, I.

H

Believe it's about two hundred and seventy thousand dollars, or so currently we only have information from for 2017, however, we're in the process of obtaining additional information from January 2018 to the most current pay period. So our estimates it's about two hundred or three hundred thousand or so, and.

D

How much of that has been it? Does that include the amount that amounts that work so called payback.

H

The 2016 non-compliance wages that we're return are not part of the 2018 calculations, but.

D

That was all cleared up, presumably in.

H

2016, a workers were requested to come in and pick up their back wage payments. In fact, the fair wage office instructed Queensway to process back wage payments. Deliver that to the fair wage office. The fair wage office then notified the employees for distribution. Workers came in signed off that the the agreed to the investigation and the amounts in back wages, and then, when we were conducting our 2018 investigation, new information came forward where Queensway number of Queensway employees provided documentation. That shows that they returned money back to the company.

H

So they're not.

I

H

Was returned back to the company? Okay.

D

Do you have any idea how significant that was.

H

In one case, non-compliance a minor to about 20,000 with source deductions- it was about 9,000 or so in one case, but I could check other cases for you if you wish so.

D

How is this contract still in effect, what's happening now? There's a 2017 contract. Oh it went oh, it is supposed to go until September, that's right, the end of September. So what is happening now? How many employees are there now and what are they being paid and the employees.

H

D

H

Yeah, the employees are being paid under for the nine hours of work at the fair wage rate, but they're not being paid the additional hours that they purport to be working, so that is still ongoing. We have worked closely with shauna water to withhold back wage payments so that we can secure funds on behalf of the roll workers, I'm.

D

Sorry I didn't understand that so they're being paid eight hours at fair wage, but there's some dispute about over to our additional hours. No.

H

They're being paid for the six hours at the fair wage realize that they're not being compensated for the additional hours worked.

D

So is there any evidence of what we heard from one of the workers, which was that they were hired on the assumption? They were working eight-hour.

H

No I don't have anything available to us anything.

D

That shows they were working six hours.

H

A

We do have the contractor.

H

Where carts that demonstrate that.

D

If we were disqualify this company I mean the hard part is all of those workers will lose their jobs and that's or will go somewhere else. Presumably, hopefully, so is there a way they can be compensated?

D

Let me think about this. I'll ask you maybe offline. Thank you.

B

Thank You mr. speaker, just just quickly in terms of number of employees impacted if this was to be. You know if the if the company was under this particular action recommended. Do you know how many employees would be impacted, I.

H

Believe, there's about 15 employees that are part of the 2018 investigation and the 2016 an investigation and involved 19 employees and.

B

That that's the number of employees that are supported by the city's contract work right. Okay. How long has this company worked with the city of Toronto? How long has, as this company been in in in any form of purchase of services with the city of Toronto? Well,.

H

Queensway has been around for quite some time. In fact, I can remember. We dealt with Queens way back in the ninth 1990s or so, and.

B

In terms of in terms of voluntary repayment of fair wages, is that something you can come across very often in our work, or is this the first case of voluntary payment, and is that something that is formalized in any form of acceptance? With an look? That's.

H

Not common I've been with the fair wage office 29 years and I have not had that issue come up before, but we received confirmation of the back wage payments that were directed back to Queens way and you.

B

Said the situation now in terms of in terms of when we purchase services, and it includes fair wages for a certain number of hours. We expect those hours to be paid. There were some conversation about the other kind of work that needed to be done to do the work needed to be taken up by the company and that's why it was three hours for use. You know if it's eight hours, do we not compensate for those type of words when we purchase services I.

H

Can't speak to that all I can basically say if a company requires clarification prior to the award of the contract, that's always available to them, where they can provide that to the city's purchasing and management material division. That will clarify a lot of those issues now.

B

In terms of rectification, that is done right now for the for the employee employees, who are working now until September. If this was to continue, you said they now they're, now being paid fair wages for the six hours per day rate am.

H

I right that is correct, but not for the additional hours up until three o'clock that they purport to people.

B

Then was that change brought in like was that a formal change that was brought in when the investigation started taking place? I.

H

Believe the change occurred after the 2016 investigation now.

B

The other question I have is around around employees, where we have fair wages, policies that are impacting them or supporting them. Do we take any any additional steps to? Let them know about this, like, for example, when I ask the question about the employees know about the city's fair wages policies before the investigation. The answer from the gentleman Dapitan was no. Is there?

B

Is there any any any kind of conditions or requirements that that, when we enter into until purchase of service or contract, that employees are made aware that that their there, under the fair wages policy.

H

We do have a website that really provides good information for workers. Secondly, when we do go on to job sites, we do post the fair wage policy in a place where workers can view that. So in this particular case, it's it's very difficult because it's there's no trailer per se. That's stationary, where workers can view their rights in terms of what wages are paid, but.

B

In the absence of here, we saw an example of where there were no formal contract type materials between the employer and employee. From what I'm hearing is there any any precedence from our site? We've actually said you know, this is a form that outlines fair wages, policy from the City of Toronto, give this to every employee and have them sign receipt of dipped or some sort of a way where we actually make where employees about the fair wages policy directly as part not directly, but through a particular requirement and.

H

Unfortunately, the the contractor has the contract documents in terms of what their obligations are, but the employees don't necessarily end up seeing what what their, what their rights are under the fair wage policy just.

B

Just as a reminder, what what is our our investigation into a fair wages related complain looked like? Does it look like looking at payrolls, looking at what type of information I'll be able to access from employers to do that? Well,.

H

Typically, we request to see payroll documentation or any other material that may be desired in terms of determining compliance. In addition to that, we also are able to work closely with our divisional staff in order to obtain a logs of work that is being performed so.

B

Would I be correct in thinking that in 2017, the City of Toronto would have assumed 15 full-time employers employee in this situation, where in actuality there were 15 part-time employees in 2017 that we supported part-time employment in the last year? Last.

F

That was your last question: counselor I'm.

H

Not sure whether that applies to these contractors, I mean there are part-time workers, but from what I can tell most of these workers are directly employed by these two companies to perform the work. Thank.

B

F

Saw a chemistry course on tea and then counselor troi see.

C

Thank You mr. chair: how long has Queensway been doing working for the city? You know I believe.

H

The going back to the 1990s, or so this.

C

What a long time yes, and so these issues have been coming up more recently, it thinks there's been a good relationship, otherwise, well.

H

Not necessarily I think Queensway going back to 2016 in order to circumvent or sidestep the fair wage policy or pay the appropriate wage rates. The there their inclination was to deem some of their employees or workers as shareholders, and that certainly did not meet our meet the test in terms of applying to the fair wage requirements. But.

C

They've since adjusted their policy there, they no longer do that.

H

I'm sorry, yes, we did have an issue going back in the old city of Toronto in the 1990s, with respect to Queens Way, okay,.

C

They've they've served the City of Toronto a long time, yes and and- and so it seems like the only this is their there one of their major contracts. So I guess the potential is depending on what happens here today and I. Think councillor Davis alluded to it that there's could be up to 15 people that could lose their jobs. If there is a hard-and-fast suspension.

H

Potentially, that may be the case. These are skilled workers in terms of operating equipment, and there is a need for that. Type of skill set out in the industry has.

C

Queensway ever explained how they actually build the city when I'm looking at time cards without mentioning any details of it but other than there was one in front of me. That says nine hours, including an hour travel.

C

So do they invoice the city based on this time card or based on different information they supply. They.

H

Build the city on the Toronto water work hard that Queensway signs off on trying to water signs off on and and and the worker as well.

C

However, you've discovered that they're playing there in paying their employees differently other they're not paying their employees on the same scale that they're building the city. That is correct.

C

And do you know so when they would they build the city for four eight hours and pay their employees six hours through your discussions or investigations? Have you found out were the other two hours goal well.

H

Queensway explanation is has indicated to us that those hours could be an hour for lunch half an hour for our two coffee breaks or for that matter, some travel time as well.

C

All right, thank you, sir.

F

Croissant, a counselor troi see question is stopped five minutes ex.

A

Mr. chair, along the lines of councillor Shan the represent the representative, basically said the owners didn't know if their practice didn't align with the fair wage policy. Can you clarify what their obligations are to make themselves aware of their responsibilities? Well,.

H

In the actual call document there there is a copy of the fair wage policy and it also indicates what the fair wage scheduled for that type of work is not only that prior to the award of the contract of the fair wage office sends a declaration to the company that they have to complete.

H

So they have to identify whether or not they will be engaged in any subcontracting type of classifications of workers that they will be employing what hourly, wage rates and benefits they will be paying their employees and, based on that information, the fairway Java signs off with a recommendation to award and purchasing issues that purchase order as a result. So so there there is a mechanism in place to ensure that companies are aware of their obligations.

H

And secondly, if the company requires clarification, then there is a process also through the purchasing process, to submit their request in writing so that so that an addendum can be issued to all the vendors for great.

A

B

Question so in in a situation where, where the suspension or any kind of disciplinary action is taken, what's the? What are the rights of the workers to be paid for the eight hours that they have claimed to have signed in going backward? Is that something that fair wages office have any any kind of power of mandate to say if, if they have, if they have been giving us tired our sheets, our timesheets, whatever we have for eight hours, would they still be eligible to get that as part of our retirement.

H

There is a process in place and the bylaw allows the manager fair wage office to recoup funds on behalf of the employees. So we also have tools available to us where we can hold money back from the contract. Take that money, pay the workers and deduct that from from the company's contract. Thank.

B

F

F

Didn't I already give you two rounds all right, you can have one minute for one question.

C

Since you've been really close to this file, we're here today just spending, you know half an hour absorbing a lot of information plus the document we just got given to us. So is there a way to fix this going forward other than what you've recommended or recommendations you've made in front of us that will maybe satisfy the employers or the employees and.

C

Setting the company straight on a new method of of adjusting the way they're paid they're paying out I.

H

Believe the final decision is with counsel and and committee in terms of of ensuring that the the bylaw is adhere to. However, if companies are willing to pay up all their bet, all the workers back wages and, quite frankly, I'm not quite sure if these workers will receive these but they're back wages for that matter. So what happens next time if we are in a position similar to what happened in 2016, where the workers will just turn turn the money over back to the company, so I think it.

H

There needs to be a clear message sent out to the construction industry that this type of practice really should cease.

F

Counts for Davis. You have one last question. Well,.

D

And maybe we should go in-camera because I'd like to get some legal advice and we're not supposed to get that in public. So, but this just so I understand this contract ends at the end of 2018, which presumably is September 31st the end of the season. But there is, there are two option years: I presume your that we wouldn't recommend any extension of the option years, but I wonder I want to understand how that is different than sanctioning and disqualifying.

D

Going forward I.

H

Believe that, through the purchasing process, the option years when a company is non-compliant, we may, if we are asked to approve Queensway, we may not necessarily approve them, because the fact that they have not made restitution and not complied with the fair wage policy. But.

D

So that is an option here, so that those are two option heirs, so their discretionary on our part anyway, right Oh, presumably with two fair wage violations. We would not renew for those option years in any event, but what you're suggesting here is that they'd be disqualified for a two-year period.

D

Does that include the that would be from council decision date that.

H

D

Correct so, in other words, you're only disqualifying them really from now until the end of September, all those those those were not automatic. Renewals those were option years.

D

Beyond September 2018.

D

So you would recommend, would you not that there not be an option, renewal or 2019 2022 or.

A

Just by way of clarification, the recommendation and the staff report is that council disqualified Queensway from conducting business on city projects for a period of two years, inclusive, it's not simply on this contract. It's it's an e city contract.

D

What I'm getting at is those two years o do they have other city contracts.

A

Do the chair councillor? The report is echoing that the wording in the bylaw, so the bylaw basically says once you're found in non-compliance and the recommendation can be a disqualification for a two-year period from bidding or being eligible to work on city contracts. So it wouldn't matter whether it's an option year. We wouldn't renew the options, but if they bid on anything else coming in, then there would be a list of companies ineligible to be awarded. Okay,.

D

So they would be disqualified from the option years. The remainder of this year to the end of September 2018 they'd be disqualified for any extensions for the option years and they would be disqualified from bidding on any other contracts and I guess I want to know. Do they have currently have any other contracts, I presume not. We would have heard about it.

A

The chair, I'm, not I'm, not positive, but my understanding is. They don't have to have any other contracts, except for this, their sub, whether their use as a subcontractor I, don't know, but they would also be prevented from being a sub just.

D

Finally, could we compel them to pay back the wages outstanding, pay, the fair wage and an eight-hour day until the end of December, and then disqualify them from bidding for two more years to.

D

The end of September yeah and that's why asking whether we need to have this conversation in camera, I think there's some legal implications. There.

A

I'm I would suggest that, if we're, if we're going to, engage in that kind of a discussion that should take place in an in-camera in a closed meeting.

A

D

And I'd like to do that, if I could sorry.

F

Keller Davis.

D

Then I would like to do that if we okay.

F

D

Right now we could set this one down until the end of it.

F

So the committee has two options to go: in-camera. We can do at the end of the meeting. We have another fair wage item after this or we can go into camera now and come back in I'd.

D

Like to suggest we go at the end after we've had the second wage, okay, councillor.

F

Santi comes from everybody; fine with that; okay, so we'll go in-camera at the end of this meeting and we'll deal with this item. Okay, so we're going to hold this item down. Our next item is GM 27 point 17 Ruffolo contracting Limited disqualification from city contracts, fair wage policy, non-compliance.

F

We have four speakers listed the first speakers, mr. Alex Triano.

F

Mr. Alex Tran, oh here morning, sir I'm, not sure if you heard the directions I gave to the speakers on this item. You have five minutes to speak. You have each member of this committee has up to five minutes. Ask you questions on your presentation and remarks and then we, after all of the deputies, are heard. We bring it into committee and we ask questions of staff and then we vote on in any motions put forward or the reported as it is.

F

So you have a microphone in front of you there's a light there on the table when it's on. It means your microphones on, and you have five minutes to start whenever you're ready.

F

You can spin it around if you want.

J

F

Spinning there you go.

J

There you go hello. My name is Alex Triano and I'm here today to speak to you about my former employer, Ruffolo contracting, who has been defrauding myself and my co-workers for the entire calendar year of 2017. We are the backhoe operators that are currently working for the City of Toronto water and sewer division. We believe Ruffolo contracting is submitting the full hours worked for the services provided, but are not paying the employees the designated hours performed according to the fair wage policy, resulting that the operators received less than the hours they worked.

J

During my employment with Ruffolo contracting, we worked in 8 hours shift from 7:00 a.m. to 3:00 p.m. plus a 1 hour travel time for a total of 9 hours a day.

J

Ruffolo contracting would only pay his employees a total of 6 hours a day, noting that during any shift there are no designated times for lunch or breaks the City of Toronto employees have what is called a running lunch, which means you could take a few minutes to eat what you can during the job or wait until the job is repaired to eat your lunch as most of our jobs are emergency related and homeowners or businesses are out of water until the repair is completed.

J

The repair is always our first priority on some occasions we will get signed off prior to 3 p.m. but we are still on call and, if required, be available to go to another location. This is when we go back to our yard and fuel up the machines, grease our machines and have something to eat if time allows occasionally during the work week, there are premium afternoon shifts which are scheduled from 3 p.m. to 11 p.m. which is considered a secondary.

J

This is where we are asked to stay and continue the job in order to complete it or if the operator is needed for an emergency at a different location. In these cases we would receive the full eight hours worked for the secondary shift, but it would be at our regular rate of pay and not at the premium hourly rate as per the fair wage schedule. This would also not include the additional one hour for travel time, but the employer would invoice the city for this any weekend performed or Saturday or Sunday.

J

For a three for a 7:00 a.m. to 3:00 p.m. shift. We would only receive six hours total at our standard rate of pay. Overtime was never payable to the employees at time and a half or double time for working statutory holidays, but once again was invoiced to the city at these rates by Ruffolo contracting each morning each operator is given an address to go to to work with the team of City of Toronto employees to fix the problem involving the water and sewer division.

J

At the end of each day, the on-site Foreman issues a contract card which I have on the display here. The operators card specifies the hours performed 7:00 to 3:00 the address of the location and the work order number both the on-site Foreman and the operator print and sign their names on the card which is located on the bottom of the card. The white copy goes to the office of City of Toronto and the yellow copy goes to the employer, Ruffolo contracting, where he submits for payment for services provided mr.

J

Tony Ruffalo has given his employees myself included instructions to just scribble our names or make up fake names on these timesheets so that they were unreadable. He asked us to do this as he didn't want. The city to know which operator was working over are permitted 16 hour daily maximum.

J

He would ask us to work over the daily max on a regular basis. I would work 24 hours straight sleep in my car for four hours and go back to work. The next.

J

Unfortunately, I listened to my employer mr. Ruffolo, at the time his instructions and I scribbled on a large number of timesheets. Now the fair wage is doing an investigation on Ruffolo contracting. They are unable to allocate a large number of my timesheets, as my signature or scribble were unreadable. I am now losing out on thousands of dollars, as they are unreadable.

J

Unreimbursed me for the hours I'm entitled to.

C

I'm not finished sorry, I know you just have a few more seconds go ahead. I've.

J

Provided fair wage with all my personal timesheets and payroll slips for all of 2017 in order to cross-reference dates with the unreadable timesheets to prove that those scribbles were indeed my signature. I had worked and I got paid for those days. In addition to my personal slips, I have also requested a fair wage to cross-reference, with unreadable with the city daily Hanson reports or personal log, not to wrap up sir, which indicate the operators name that worked in each location. That day.

J

In addition, I believe that my Canadian citizen human rights in the workplace have been violated on multiple occasions throughout my employment, with Ruffolo contracting mr. Ruffolo subjected me to an environment of rapido repeated verbal harassment on a daily basis.

C

Your time is up. Sir I gave you an extra 30 seconds. Thank you. You had five minutes, so I gave you an extra thirty, but thank you any fumes. Some more information could come up any questions of the deputy.

B

Starting to touch on Human Rights for later, yes, can you tell me what what actually well.

J

Mister Ruffolo asked us to sign this letter and in the letter it's asks if we were satisfied working with the company when I asked him. What does this mean he yelled at me? Can't you read what are you an idiot that in front of other operators, which made me feel embarrassed and I feel that also I was wrongfully dismissed for not signing this letter?

J

When I asked for an explanation, he told me it was just because are you satisfied working here, but now we know that the truth of this letter was for the six hours being paid, but it doesn't display that in the letter, I also I also have an audio recording that I've supplied to fair wage. That is available to the committee. Upon request of a conversation of myself and mr. Ruffalo the day, I was fired, the audio proof that we have.

J

He clearly states that we got paid 6 hours a day and he also said unnecessary and just discriminatory comments made towards employees and City of Toronto, fair wage representatives.

B

How long have you worked for this company before you left? I worked.

J

From in 2016, I worked for several months, I left because it was only getting paid. Twenty twenty three dollars an hour at the eight hours a day, I received a phone call from fair wage. That I was gonna, get a reimbursement check for the missing hours. I went to fair wage I got the check for $12,000.

J

Mister Ruffolo asked me to come back. I came back. He told me that fair wage was giving him an increase, a raise to the fair wage policy and because of that, I was gonna, get only six hours a day, but I was getting an increase in pay from from twenty three dollars to fifty five.

B

Did you before the before the investigation? How familiar were you about fair wages, policy and I'm? Sorry, how familiar were you about fair wages policy or the office I had.

J

No idea about fair wage, the policy anything until after the investigation was being done. This prior year, 2017 I, was approached from fair wage to give any information anything that I can help and then, at that time, when I got fired, I got fired from mr. Ruffolo December 28th three days after Christmas and I had no job and I went and I worked for Queensway for a small period of time, maybe one month and after I realized what was going on.

J

I approached Queensway and I told them that I cannot continue working for you getting paid six hours a day, because I had no idea that I was entitled to more. It's.

B

Going back to the question about about how familiar were you about fair wages? Was it the same thing among your co-workers, who are doing similar job that they weren't as familiar or you were? You were working in what way we.

J

B

J

Our employer, the fair wage, said we were getting six hours a day now, instead of eight because of our pay increase, that's what we were advised. We were led to believe that when I asked mr. Ruffolo mid-july for an increase in hours instead of six, maybe give me seven, he said no there's the door, you don't like the job go, find another job. He threatened my job. Thank.

B

A

F

Thank You counselor Shan other questions. The deputy sorry I saw Kent. Sir Davis is hemmed.

D

When did you get this letter, I can't see the date there date on there. This.

J

Letter is December 28th 2017. They.

D

Are still claiming this company that the workers are independent contractors, we.

J

Were paid as subcontractors through this company, but we are not owner operator. We do not have shares, we are just operating their machines. Okay,.

D

I was about to say you don't bring the machine with you, no.

J

D

Are just doing the labor I'm.

J

Just a laborer operating the machine for my services and I'm considered an employee. I went down to Bay Street to try to get a labor I'm. Sorry I forgot what is WSIB certificate number because I'm a sole proprietorship on my own company, and they told me that I was not responsible for WSIB, because I'm, not an owner operator and the employer has to pay the WSIB I'm. Just an employee running in a machine.

D

So is that happened since then, or is this continued on where people are just paid like their owner operators, even though they are employees? This practice continued to this day, I.

J

Do not continue I'm not currently working for Ruffolo anymore, no I, don't know.

D

Okay, so all right, that's fine! Thank you.

F

Yeah Thank You councillor Davis other questions of the deputy seeing them. Thank you very much, sir appreciate you coming in this morning. The next deput in is Mikey mu. So thank you.

F

Mr. Jamie, oh so you have five minutes to address the committee. You're gonna start whenever you're ready so.

E

I just wanted to say that whatever Lux stated is true and I never heard of anything about this one hour lunch and pretty much. What's.

C

About it, you know.

F

Any questions of the deputy councillor Davis so.

D

You were asked to fill in forms that didn't accurately reflect what you were actually working. That's right. Thank you. Thank.

F

You, sir I hate you coming in this morning.

F

The next step in is mr. Paul DaSilva.

F

Or mr. D'silva yeah five minutes to address the committee, you can start whenever you're ready.

K

Yep I am Paul de Silva I worked for Ruffolo contracting. Like my colleague there we were told that's what the hours he was paying, which we agreed. I am I, get laid off in the wintertime, so I do find other employment throughout the winter, because my regular company doesn't have work for me and mr. Ruffolo offered me a job but I shaded, but those were the standards, his hours of working and kind of did what I had to do just to provide for my family and.

K

There are also some scribble sheets, maybe I, scribbled a few myself, but because of the hours but.

F

Sorry, counselor Shannon I saw your hand. Did you have questions just just.

B

To be clear, you're a former employee of the company and you're currently employed at I went.

K

Back to my original company that we just started back a couple last week, so.

B

You're not looking right now. No thanks.

F

Other questions, a definite I.

D

I just wondered so we said similar to what we heard earlier. You were working, you assumed you were working eight hours and then you were ended up working all six hours and.

K

Yeah I was invoicing. Basically, we would work our nine eight hours plus one hour travel. We would take our equipment from the yard to the location and back at the end of the job, and we would invoice him for we were there for nine hours. We would three hours and get paid six.

D

Right and you were asked to fill in a form that declared you were an independent contractor. Do you own your own equipment.

K

Master yeah I am Oh subcontractor, you're.

D

Known or operator yeah.

K

But don't have my own equipment, that's what.

D

I, need you, don't have you any criminal, so you didn't get a I when you were laid on.

K

No I didn't collect no.

D

Deductions that kind of thing no, no okay, Thank You.

F

Counselor Crisanta, you have questions the deputy so.

C

As a known so you're an owner operator yeah that way you just said so as an owner operator, then you were hired as a subcontractor by roof. Oh yeah.

K

C

And and I don't.

K

Have my own equipment.

C

No, they provide the equipment. Yes, so did you consider yourself an employee or a sub? Contrary much yeah just.

K

Just submitting an invoice to him every weekly.

C

Okay, so so by submitting an invoice, then you were acting as a subcontractor, correct, correct yeah, but they supplied the the equipment. Yes,.

K

C

All right, thank you.

F

Other questions that happen seeing none. Thank you very much. Mr. D'silva, and our last step you know listed is mr. Ryan Freeman Norton Rose Fulbright Canada LLP. Mr. Freeman I think you heard everything I was saying earlier. You have five minutes to address the committee whenever you're ready, I.

L

Apologize it's a bit unorthodox as we relate addition, but I do have written submissions to hang to help the committee members follow through with one.

F

Of the clerk's LLL pick it up from you.

L

So thank you for including me today. My name is Ryan Freeman I'm here on behalf of Ruffolo contracting. Just by way of background Ruffolo sometime in 2016, was found for a first violation of the fair wage policy based off of that violation for non-compliance. They requested advice from the fair wage office about how to comply and they received that advice and implemented it so again in 25th and 2017 roof low contracting was again investigated, provided payroll documents and we heard from our friends at Queens way that they received time cards from these individual workers.

L

Ruffolo had a similar practice where they received time cards from individual workers who invoiced for their time. They provided the fair wage office with all that information and that information was returned to them in September, with no further complaint later in January, 2nd 2018, they received another request for documents which they provided and nothing new was added. The important part is that all the same documents were provided from that initial 2017 investigation, but with the out-of-time that was the difference between the June and January investigation.

L

It was based off of that investigation. They're found to be in non-compliance with the fair wage policy, so essentially Ruffolo contracting issue is that the first investigator sorry, the second investigation they were found to have complied with the fair wage policy and they relied off the advice from the fair wage office to continue on with that practice, then in January 2018 they were lulled into a false sense of security that everything was on board and then found to be non-compliant for the entire 2017 period. I.

L

Imagine it's a little ironic that we would say it's unfair in this circumstance, but to have a contractor rely on advice, provide the documents to the fair wage office and then get two different results based off the same documentation is unfair.

L

Second, we heard a bit from Queensway about the practice and I don't want to go over old ground, because the committee's time is valuable. However, Ruffolo contracting had a minimum agreement with ours agreement with their workers to provide them with at least six hours of work, paid work per day or pay for the hours that they actually worked.

L

I've been advised my client that was actually carried out, that it followed its promise to its employees to pay minimum six hours per day and then pay for the difference should they work longer than six hours the discrepancy here, however, it comes with the Toronto cards, the contracted cards from the Toronto Water Department.

L

What we have is a difference between what's reported for billing and, as we heard from our friends from Queens Queens way, that's what these cards were being used for is to generate a bill and the discrepancy of the actual cards or timesheets provided by the workers. The fair wage office had access to this information and would've. Seen that there's a discrepancy here and to my understanding, it never investigated why that is and never requested further information. It simply disregarded the time cards that the workers provided and relied on Toronto waters.

L

Can you wrap up, sir apologies? Finally, and just as a small point towards that, is that if they did rely on the Toronto Bart cards rather than the worker cards, it never investigated?

L

Which information is accurate and from my understanding on schedule, 67 of the bylaw, the fair wage office manager is responsible for providing this committee with accurate information and right now we just don't know it's very confusing, and we have heard from workers who say that they followed a practice to deduct hours. I've been advised that that's not true, they were never advised to do that and that fruit flow fulfilled its promises to these workers.

L

And finally, as a technical point, if we look to the bylaw at section a5 application- and this was something I- just rights- are.

F

Key to wrap up please share five.

L

And this was something I just read: it wasn't based off of roof low, the understanding, but from my understanding, the application of the policy applies to small businesses and then typically owner operators, partnerships or principles of companies as long as they undertake the work themselves. My understanding is mr. roof float, undertakes the work himself, so he could qualify for this small business exemption under the wording of this policy, and that's a huge question mark for me and I understand that you.

F

L

Understand there was a practice to apply to all contractors. However, in this instance, I am concerned that it's been misapplied. Okay,.

F

Thank You councillor sham.

B

Mr. chair, you mentioned that there was two times the same documents were provided and the outcomes were different from our side. Can you clarify the first time you said there was no response and that gave a false of security around or for sense of compliance. So.

L

In June, 2017 Ruffolo received a request from the fair wage office to provide payroll documentation which they did comply with and they satisfied and those documents were returned again in September, with no further complaint or concern raised by the fair wage office and I've also been advised. My client that when those documents were returned, he was informed sorry Sandra. His wife was informed that they were in compliance. So.

B

They they were informed that they were in compliance and not just returned the documents. You say.

L

Morally correct, thank you.

F

Thank you, counselor Shannon, councillor, Davis questions, the deputy.

D

I just wanted to understand this question of owner-operated: are they owner operated, employ the owner operated contracts? A true flow.

L

I'm sorry you're referring to the workers themselves. Yes,.

D

L

Believe at this point we understand that they're workers in some instances their owner operators may be I'm, not sure they're, at least operators, and, for instance, we have one with us today. His name is mr. Anthony oka, and he has signed a letter that was prepared by Ruffolo that he is a worker and all this was in compliance with what I explained today that he provided a number of hours per work per day and was received a minimum and that the city cards were four bills.

L

He is at least an operator of ten years experience, and at least one with Ruffolo.

D

So that's one example: correct.

L

D

How many our owner operated versus employees I.

L

Don't have the answer for that I'm. Sorry.

D

So the other issue had to do that. I was curious about his paying workers in cash. Is that a normal practice? I wasn't.

L

Aware that was navigation, that they were paying workers in cash, but it's in our report. Okay, it would be a false one. Then. My client has never advised me that they paid money in cash. Okay,.

D

You're not disputing, though they what the issue of the employees being told to report eight hours on these forms, even though or the workers, even though they were working less than that. That's.

L

My understanding is that they were provided these cards counselor. Sorry, no.

D

I'm not asking you to call counselor that they were counseled, they were asked, they were told, oh no directed to say they worked six. No, they.

L

D

L

That's not correct from my client advises me that they've signed city cards that provided them with an hour four hours for the company. However, they were told to self-report the hours that they worked back to the company and that they weren't we're. Told, though not.

D

To put six hours on the city cards, they.

L

Don't fill out the city cards, oh, oh, the city officer fills out the cards and they sign them. Okay,.

D

Some suggested they were asked to scribble, so they couldn't be detected. Yeah.

L

That's the first time, I've heard it today here and I'm, not sure if I have an answer for that. However, they signed cards and then in self-reported the hours back to the company. Okay,.

F

Other questions is the deputy seeing none. Thank you very much, sir questions. The staff.

F

Well, questions of staff. First, we'll see yep counselor, Shannon, counselor Davis, said he's seen so far. Sorry.

B

Just a clarification on that conversation we had earlier about receiving the document and providing, according to the deputy and some sort of an assurance of compliance and then going back with the same document. And can you clarify that initial.

H

Initially Ruffolo provided invoices not a role of their workers, so there is something like for individuals that invoiced under a company name and then there's a three employees that had invoiced under an employee name. Just the hours worked so their their practices to invoice rather than then, then, beyond a normal payroll type of thing. Now our initial investigation appeared to be in line with the fair wage requirements, so what Ruth law presented we looked into and they were paying your wage rates for the hours that they disclosed.

H

Now the fair wage office has the ability to revisit investigations at all times and after further information came forward. We naturally looked into this a lot further, where we went to Toronto water and requested their contractor work cards in order to determine number of hours worked. So in essence, it's almost parallel to what happened with Queensway we're six hours, our work but like additional hours are unaccounted for. You.

B

Did have additional information, was the additional information presented by the by the company or by Colonel water for the second set of investigation, or was it based on the same documents.

H

It was based on the complaints.

F

The questions of the staff, counselor Priscilla, sorry I, saw councillor Davis and then counselor course aunty councillor Davis, so.

D

It's the same recommendation for to your qualification disqualification period from the decision of counsel. That is.

H

Correct: okay,.

D

And they also have only one contract. Is it the same period looks like it I.

H

D

It ends this September and are we holding back any payments in order to rectify any outstanding non-payment in this contract? We.

H

Have requested tryna water with all payments until we resolve this matter with both companies and determining the full extent of the non-compliance and.

D

Are we fairly confident that the amount of money that's been withheld will cover what we believe are the outstanding payments.

H

I will pass that over to Toronto water.

I

Through you, mr. chair, what we have outstanding right now is with Queensway one hundred twenty-five thousand dollars of unpaid invoices and twenty thousand dollars of invoices in hand with respect to Ruffolo.

D

I'm, sorry, how much have we withheld all.

I

Right, that's 125 for Queensway and 20 thousand for Ruffolo.

D

Okay, we're not talking about Queensway, but.

D

But the projected, owing in this second round of violations for 2018, do we know how much that is. I.

H

Would I believe it's in two hundred and fifty thousand dollar range? Okay.

D

So we're not anywhere close to holding back the full amount, we think is owing correct.

D

F

You councillor Santi at five minutes. First in questions of staff.

C

I'm not sure if he received this document, we just got page by page three where the deputy da spoke, but he signed it and had it distributed so they're saying that they're unclear on whether or not the fair wage policy is intended to apply to a small business as referral. Can you just comment on that? That does it apply and or is it? Is it potentially not the case? The.

H

Fair wage policy does not apply to an owner operator as long as they perform the work themselves. So once you hire someone to perform work, then they become an employee or if you subcontract irregardless, they still have to pay the fair wage rate, whether you're subcontracting or paying workers directly.

A

Just so, you know Ruffolo raised this in 2016, as did a number of other similar contractors on us, and we gave the opinion to them as part of the non-compliance that they did not.

C

A

Gave them the opinion that they did not fall within the small business exemption owner/operator because they had staff they had workers, they were paying WSIB, etcetera, etcetera, so they were an employer as opposed to just a small business owner operator, just mom-and-pop doing the work themselves.

C

Yeah I just wanted that curve right. Thank you. Thank.

F

You are there, questions our staff on this, seeing none speakers I.

F

Know it's up to the will of the committee nobody's sent out and to me about this one you you want to go in and camera on, both of them yeah. Okay, all right! So do you want to go into camera now and then finish the rest of the agenda or going camera at the end?

F

Okay, all right, so we're gonna hold both of these down until the end of the meeting when we're going in camera. So we'll go back to the beginning of the agenda for the unfinished items and we're item number councillor Davis, you hold number eight award a tender call number two.

D

I will just release it. Sorry, oh I should have told all the staff who've been sitting here. Probably Daniel.

F

D

F

You're gonna move the recommendations on memory.

F

Councillor Davis, yes, I'll move the dump. Anybody else have questions on number, eight, all in favor of the recommendations in number eight Jerry Daniel, you're free free to go.

F

Our next item is number 15. Ironically, the fair wage office 2017 annual report held by councilor Davis, come on back councillor, Davis fair wage office report, the annual report you held it I.

D

Will release it gonna.

F

Release head: does anybody have any questions on a fair wage office report?

F

Okay, no questions on the fair of wage office report. At this point, though, I would like councillor Shan. You have questions on the fair wage office report, not.

B

It's connected in some ways, but let me ask anyways I'm just trying to figure out. You know in light of the conversations we've had, what mechanisms are available for employees to know about the fair wages policy and about mechanisms to make complaints or initiate investigations and.

H

As mentioned earlier, we do have a very good website in terms of the fair wage policy how it applies. We also when we are on job sites. We do post a fair wage policy. In addition to that, we do have multilingual brochures that we distribute to workers when we are out in the field. Conducting investigations.

F

B

Shan you're done sorry I'm, just trying to do a motion up for that as well. So, just just in terms of access accessing, you know many of the workers.

B

These are not. These are centrally done. Not done through asking are the companies that are vendors or purchasing services? Do we do we? Do we request them to do anything related to it? Yes,.

H

We do, in fact the by law requires that contractors are to display legible copies of the fair wage policy in a prominent position in his or her workshop accepts accessible to all employees. So it is already in the Bible.

F

Counts for Shane you're done councillor Davis questions now.

D

Since you started when a contractor bids on a contract, I know there's a provision that says yes I'm aware of the fair wage policy and, yes, you know I am in compliance or intend to comply. Could you just clarify? Does that also include that we provide what the fair wage rate is to potential bidders for those jobs.

H

Okay, so, prior to the award of the contract in the call documents, there is a notification in terms of what the fair wage schedule is. That applies to contract plus. The fair wage policy is also included in the call document after bids are open, been purchasing requires the fair wage office to confirm whether or not a company's compliant or not, and through our through the declaration process. We provide the company one-page declaration that they have to complete where they agree to comply to the fair wage requirements. So.

D

All they do is make a declaration at the outset. You do not ask to see the wage rates that are currently being paid or, as these wage rates were not being paid, I don't understand how a company can sign a declaration and then know what the wage wage rates are go through an entire contract paying a wage rate that is non-compliant.

D

Do we not at the outset in some way, confirm that these workers are being paid properly, like the very first payroll.

H

We don't look at every single contract right at its original stage to determine whether or not they are compliant. So we have to rely on the declaration in order to determine compliance now if there are specific allegations or issues that can be brought forward to our attention and we can flag that down for further investigations down the road so.

D

If there are companies that have had a history of flagrant violation of the fair wage policy in the past, do we not take extraordinary measures to make sure they're in compliance when they get a new contract?.

H

Well, we we, we do flag that down and we do target those companies are those industries from time to time.

D

H

Addition there's only three of us in the fairway job is to be able to deal.

D

Thank you, Michael patty Locke, for reminding us how understaffed another department is.

F

Counselor Troi see you questions and stuff.

A

Thank You mr. chair, before I heard your staff compliment. I was going to say that perhaps there should be more education or training or some type of workshop to the industry, so that they're more aware of the obligations that they need a face.

H

We we do work closely with purchasing and material management division in providing information to supplier briefings, meetings and sessions that they put on to the public to contractors and even internally as well.

F

Are there questions of staff? Sorry, mr. paprika, how long's a fairly Joff has been in existence.

H

1893 since.

F

1893, so it's it's fairly well known in the the industry or that people are. You know what the fair wage office is. I.

H

Would think so, I think the City of Toronto, fair wage policy and office are the premier in the whole country for that matter. In fact, just recently the province of Ontario reviewed their fair wage policy and they seeked our advice on a lot of the aspects of what what we do here in the city and.

F

So if hypothetically, if I was a bidding on a city, contract and I, wanted the and there's there's one you bid on it or a 5 bid on a contract, there's language in the paper that I have to file the explain explains that I have to comply with the Fair City of Toronto, fair wage policy, correct that.

H

Is correct and.

F

When, if I won, that contract is somebody from the fair wage office reach out to me and make sure that I understand the parameters of the fair wage policy and what I'm expected to do.

H

We actually prior to the award. If companies aren't unclear on any aspect of the policy, our office provides that detailed information to them upfront even before they commit to putting in a bid so.

F

You're you so we see some words: they get 10 companies that bid on them. So even before we're we've looked at awarding that bid before they've filed the paperwork, use somebody from your office that stand with them and explains to them what the fair wage policy is and how they're expected to comply with it.

H

Yes, there is a lot of language in the documentation, first, first of all, plus when, when companies complete their declaration, if we observe that it doesn't comply to the fair wage schedule, we would then point number of things out as well and in terms of their subcontractors or appropriate classification of trade, work, etc. Okay,.

F

And once and once the contract is awarded, your staff do regular checks on paperwork what's being submitted, so as a contractor could expect you to show up on a regular basis on my job sites, and if you find issues I would get a warning before. It's not. You don't see an issue and that just bring a report to this committee and say you know this is what we recommend to do with this contractor.

H

Yes, it is complaint based, but at the same time we we do conduct site investigations as well. We are able to go to the head office of the company if necessary, request to see payroll and, if payroll matches to the fair wage schedule. There's no issues. However, if there is a variance, then obviously we would enforce the provisions of the fair wage, bylaw. Okay,.

F

All right, thank you very much. I counselor Davis, you held this item. Did you want to speak to it.

D

I did note that the numbers of violations.

D

We're pretty consistent over the years, which surprised me considering the the growth I presume in the work we do or they and probably the number of contracts that are come under the department's responsibilities and I did come to what was probably the same conclusion that was pointed out by mr. potchuck, which is there's only so much capacity within the organization and so I wondered whether or not had there been more employees to do more investigations. Whether or not we would find ourselves with more violations of of the policy. I see heads nodding and smiling.

D

Is that a big? Yes? Oh.

D

Yes, sorry, I, see, okay, I, see heads nodding and smiling on the other side of the table, so I assume that that does mean that, while there's a consistent level of activity and a consistent level of non-compliance, we have probably understaffed this department and would see greater non-compliance if there was additional resource were additional resources.

D

One of the other issues that I have been thinking through all of this is trying to understand better how non-compliance fits into future contracts and whether or not they're being considered in what we call KPIs key performance indicators. I presume they are, as we give future contracts and issuing future contracts.

D

I also think it's it's strange that we continue to get these areas of non-compliance, and it sounds like in these cases today and I know we're talking about in general that there was very clear understanding of what the rates were, and yet it seems there was non-compliance from day one. So there has to be some kind of reinforcement of these rates and some immediate evidence that they're, in effect from the beginning of the contract.

D

So we don't find ourselves in a retroactive situation trying to correct it or when we find ourselves that it takes workers some time to recognize that they should have been paid more so I, don't know what improvements might help with this other than more staff, but I'd certainly like to hear more, and maybe we can have that discussion offline.

D

F

Thank You councillor Dave councillor, Shannon I, think you were on the list.

B

Thank You mr. chair I have a motion.

B

This is basically to figure out, so you know, there's been a recurring story in terms of some of the deputies about how much they were aware of fair wages policy. You know we we boast about our favorites policy outside, as a form of you know, being fair as a form of poverty reduction strategy as a form of contracting out not leading to precarious and exploitative an environment for workers and so on.

B

So those often you know cite as an example: III I see, there's also a big gap from what the community knows about this policy and how much flexibility and protection workers have in terms of raising concerns and and and partly maybe these things are in paper, but not necessarily effectively communicated, not know or not not to be pointing to the very short staff team that is out there.

B

But if we were to even expand the team or if you were to look at other ways where some of the other departments can actually help how the divisions can help it's it's important for us to explore what else could be done so I'm moving this motion to ask for looking at effective ways to inform employees and the public about the policy and the complaint process and and report back.

B

You know this is this- is a very, very strong component of our work as a city and and as we have been contracting out more and more in the past decade, or so, this becomes even more important because it impacts in the. In the examples we saw it's it's a smaller number of employees, but on a grander scale. It impacts thousands of people out there within our city, so I'm, hoping that the committee would move this and I'm getting some some formal recommendations as to how we can expand.

B

It could be recommendations along with a budget line or a recommendation, along with staffing components and other things that are necessary, that we need to take care of and and little on, the education and the compliance that is necessary from the vendors and people who are purchasing the services. But this is a way to make sure that are the employees at the end of the day are aware of all of their rights and and the kind of consequences when they, when they start choosing certain processes within their workplaces.

B

That may lead to them not being protected as well, which has happened in some of the examples we've seen.

F

Right microphones to kill sir councillor Davis, you have a question: a counselor shall come over elsewhere. Davis has a question.

D

Would you be willing to put in a date so that it's clear when they have to report back and also including any additional resources required for consideration in the 2019 budget, I'm, not sure whether that can be done in time for the 2019 budget, but sure.

B

I guess, after the word and report back on any possible changes or improvements, as well as additional resources required to the commuter and add that and and.

C

B

I wasn't I was canary not much time to talk to the staff to see you.

D

Could be just in time for the 2019 budget, sure.

B

It would be added as a time for a.

D

Prior to the 2019 I.

F

Think that is a friendly emoji amendment.

F

Other questions of the mover, seeing none counselor troi, see just.

A

My question on the education piece: could this also include the industry as well? Not just the employees or education.

B

Yeah I mean my understanding is there's two levels of understanding of this policy people who enter into contract and and have very strong interaction with the staff at our office. So they have a different level of interaction with our office. We can put it in, but I. My focus was at the next level. I, don't want the focus to be taken off. We can add it as a way, but I would like the prioritization to be at the employee level rather than.

A

Does that mean there's another motion to put for then regarding the industry.

B

You can add.

F

All right, counselor, Shannon, I, missed that. Are you, okay, with counselor troi, see amending yours? Yes, thank.

A

You great thank you.

F

Okay, other speakers.

F

Sir councillor Tracy won and businesses added.

A

Businesses, the industry so.

B

After the word employees, comma businesses, so this to inform employees, call my business than the public about the policy.

F

Councillor Davis, you have another question in the mover.

F

F

Councillor cool want to jump into this one you're. Okay, all right.

F

Okay, any other speakers on this item.

F

None no other speakers. Okay, I, just I all speak last. I can be supporting this report. I want to start by thanking mr. paprika for all the work that he's been doing in the Farrell AG office. I know he hasn't been here since 1893, but I think he has been here for how many years mark 38 mark has been looking after our fair wage office for 38 years, and this is actually his last meeting he's finally decided to retire. So I just wanted to thank mr.

F

mica for all of his hard work that he's done on behalf of the city and on behalf of the employees and the contractors that have done business with the City of Toronto. I've been a city councilor for 12 years now, and I can think of a number of different instances where, if it wasn't for mr.

F

public and the work that was done in a fair wage office, employees would be very much behind the 8-ball when it comes to the wages that they thought they were getting the workplace that they thought they'd been hired to work in I. Always blue I'm, a firm believer that as a city councilor we're here for our residents, we're here for the people in the City of Toronto, and we can't always safeguard everything.

F

As we learned last week in the City Council office, we have a number of accountability offices, the ombudsman, the integrity Kitchener, the Auditor General, but the fair wage office is also one of those offices that we depend on as city councillors to ensure that the the rights are. The people that live in the city are safeguarded. In the fair wage office, going back to 1893 was one of the first fair wage offices established in North. America has been fulfilling that Duty for over 125 years. Mr. palooka was there for a good chunk of it.

F

It seems so I want to thank you for all hard work that you've done with the City of Toronto and thank you and I hope you have a long, happy, healthy retirement. Thank.

H

You for all your support.

D

Mr. chair, yes,.

F

Sir, yes, there.

D

Are almost 4,000 workers and 4.2 million dollars in back wages that have been awarded since 2004 and I know? Mark was very critical in making sure that happen. I too want to commend him and thank him and wish him all the best in his retirement.

F

Ok, we have the Reclamation's or receive the report by a motion before us on the screen. All in favor of the motion on the screen carried well item, as amended all in favor carried.

F

Ok now we are gonna, go in-camera on items number 16 and 17 councillor Davis has a motion and before I'm, just gonna move a motion that we move to extend this meeting past the lunch recess to finish the agenda because we supposed to break for lunch at 12:30 and then councillor Davis. So all in favor of that motion opposed seeing none that carries councilor Davis. You have the motion. Yes,.

D

I'd like to move that the government management committee recess its public session to meet in closed session to consider GM 27 point 16, Queensway ex excavating and landscaping limited disqualification from city contracts, fair wage policy, non-compliance in GM, 27, point 17, Ruffolo, contracting, limited disqualification from city contracts; fair wage policy, non-compliance that the items relate to the receiving of advice that is subject to solicitor, client, privilege, litigation or potential litigation that affects the city or its agency.

D

F

Any questions of the mover saying none all of promotion.

D

Anders about an identifiable person, sorry.

F

All in favor of the motion opposed that carries. Thank you very much. So what this means for everyone in the room, so the committee is gonna, go into. What's it called in-camera, so I need all members of the public and any staff or citizen city employees that are not involved with one of these two items they have to leave the room. Thank you.

F

F

We just have to wait for technology to catch up to us now we're good all right, so I'm calling meeting number 27 out of its close camera session, we're currently considering item number 16, Queensway excavating and landscaping limited disqualification from city contracts, fair wage policy non-compliance. Does anybody want to speak to this item in public.

F

Councillor Davis I.

D

Will not move I understand, I won't make the motion to introduce and the staff recommendations. Are we dealing with one of them right now? Yes,.

F

We're doing with number 16 and then we'll deal with number 17. Okay,.

D

So mr. chair I will be voting in favor of the recommendations that are before us.

D

It's clear to me that this company understood that when they bid on this job that they were required to maintain uphold the provisions of the fair wage policy, it's also clear to me that they haven't and I have explored and discussed and considered other alternatives and I, don't believe that there are any and so I I do believe that it's very clear there has been a pattern of conducting businesses in a way that is both non-compliant with a fair wage policy and I. Think unethical and I will be supporting the staff recommendations. Thank.

F

You councillor Davis other speakers, seeing none sorry counselor for Santi, no good. Nobody else, Oh I'll be removing the the recommendations on the report that are before us today. As I said earlier. In my comments, you know the fair wage policies is here to protect those employees that are are contracted out work under contract with the city of Toronto. We have a our Ombudsman, the integrity commissioner, the Auditor General and our fair wage office.

F

All of those people together ensure that we treat the residents of this city fairly to make sure they're treated fairly oblah contractors that bid for contracts under the fair wage office have an obligation to follow. What's banded in the fair wage policy, it's very clearly explained to the contractors before they bid on contracts during the process after and it's followed up, and we have an obligation to ensure what's delegated to us by City Council is to be followed and so I'll be moving.

F

The recommendations in this report, all in favor of the recommendations, opposed and that's unanimous and now we're on to number 17.

C

F

Ruth tracking limited disqualification from city contracts, fair wage policy, non-compliance.

F

Anybody want to speak to this item, saying none I'll be moving the recombine the recommendations in the staff report I'm not going to Akal with the same comments that I just made, but I think both of these cases are very similar and we have an obligation to look after the employees of these contractors.

F

All in favor opposed not seeing animus all right, Telstra Cole, you have the bills they do. Mr. chair.

A

That the government Management Committee, passed and declare as a bylaw confirmatory bill, to confirm the legislative proceedings of the government. Management Committee acting.

F

Under delegated authority at meeting 27 held on April 30th 2018, all in favor of the Bill's motion before us opposed that's unanimous motion to adjourn councillor santi. All in favor carried this meetings adjourned.

A

A