►
From YouTube: BasingstokeGov 15/12/2022 - Council
Description
If there is buffering on the YouTube stream, the webcast can be viewed through the council's website https://www.basingstoke.gov.uk/webcast
A
A
A
Now
you
might
expect
we
humanists
to
rail
against
the
very
idea
of
Christmas
and
respond
like
Scrooge
with
bar
humbug
for
any
passerby.
It
might
be
an
earshot
creating
grumbling
discontent
and
cynicism
throughout
the
neighborhood,
but
it
might
cause
a
surprise
that
most
humanists
do
celebrate
Christmas.
After
all,
it's
a
family
event
in
the
real
world,
but
Christians
have
challenged
me
in
the
past
by
asserting
that,
if
I'm,
not
a
Christian,
I
should
not
be
celebrating.
A
Christmas
and
I
have
often
answered
with
comments
about
Christmas,
originally
being
a
pagan
Festival,
but
there
is
a
deeper,
more
profound
answer
to
that
question.
You
see
the
very
assertion
that
Christmas
is
exclusively
for
Christians.
This
is
the
point.
That's
because
Christmas
is
a
time
of
Good
Will
to
all,
and
humanists
can
certainly
bind
to
that
idea.
A
It
is,
or
it
should
be,
a
time
when
men
and
women
can
put
aside
their
differences
and
as
famously
happened
at
the
Western
Front
in
1914,
even
their
weapons,
to
one
side,
of
course,
most
religions
have
their
own
similar
celebrations.
Joys
Jews
enjoy
Hanukkah
Hindus
of
Diwali,
Sikhs
have
Guru
in
that
ex-birthday
Muslims
have
Ramadan
and
Missouri
austrians,
it's
now
ruse.
A
A
It
is
our
kinship
that
makes
us
all
human
with
the
same
needs,
aims
and
loves,
and
any
Dogma
that
tries
to
deny
that
fact
is
bound
to
be
false
festivals,
like
these
offer.
You
me,
and
every
human
being
the
opportunity
to
come
together
in
love
and
shared
humanity,
and
also
the
chance
to
always
bear
those
sentiments
in
mind
and
keep
that
love
in
our
hearts.
A
A
A
We
need
to
be
long,
we
need
each
other
We,
Are,
One
and
even
our
various
beliefs,
sincerely
held
as
they
may
be,
should
never
be
allowed
to
divide
us,
so
it
is
as
a
humanist
and
with
the
greatest
respect
and
humility
that
I
will
want
to
to
wish
everyone.
Christian
Jew
Muslim
Buddhist,
Hindu,
Sikh,
zoroastrian
and
humanist,
the
very
happiest
of
Christmases,
with
all
the
tinsel,
the
bright
lights,
the
giving
the
feasting,
the
silly
hats
and
those
joyful
moments
of
fun
and
laughter
with
our
family
and
friends.
C
Good
evening
everybody-
and
hopefully
this
is
one
of
the
last
of
the
cold
nights-
the
forecast
does
say
it's
going
to
warm
up
warm
up
again
we're
freezing
on
Saturday
right.
Let's
start
off
on
the
agenda.
The
gender
item
number
one
apologies
for
absence.
C
C
C
C
Office
of
the
mayor
and
Deputy
Mayor
item
number
four
and
I
will
read
this
for
the
record.
In
accordance
with
the
method
of
choosing
a
mayor
and
Associated
matters.
Protocol
members
are
advised
that
councilor
David
Leakes
is
invited
to
stand
for
election
as
mayor
of
the
next
annual
meeting
of
the
council
for
the
next
Municipal
year.
C
C
C
Move
on
to
item
number
five
announcements:
there's
only
one
announcement
I
want
to
make
I
held
my
Civic
day
as
every
mayor
does,
and
we
have
former
mayors
in
this
room
that
know
exactly
what
I'm
talking
about
at
the
witcher's
silk
Mill.
This
had
never
been
done
before
the
silk
Mill,
but
I
consider
that
the
silk
Mill
is
a
jewel
in
the
crown
of
this
Borough.
C
It
really
is,
and
under
some
of
the
new
managements
they
have
really
bought
it
on,
with
the
help
of
not
Heritage
Lottery
funding,
to
improve
it
to
an
excellent
state
for
both
not
only
accessibility,
an
improvement
for
the
visitor
experience,
but
also
to
maintain
the
Victorian
looms
that
are
churning
out
some
wonderful
silk
material
and
I'd.
Like
you
to
note
that
there
is
one
loom
we
saw
last
two
days
ago,
that
is
being
woven
for
the
coronation
for
his
majesty
the
king.
C
Now
bearing
in
mind
the
time
scale
between
the
proclamation
and
now
the
order
went
into
that
Silk
wheel
very
quickly,
because
it's
going
to
take
them
quite
a
long
time
to
actually
weave
this
particular
garment
and
it's
in
a
beautiful
Scarlet
I.
Can
assure
you
with
something
very
special
and
it's
a
great
honor
for
this
Borough
and
our
silk?
C
Well
to
do
it
now,
in
addition
to
that,
the
suitableus
who's,
the
director
of
the
silk
Mill
apologized
to
me
as
I
arrived
and
she
said,
I'm
sorry,
Mr,
Mayor,
I'm,
going
to
have
to
go
as
soon
as
I.
C
Welcome
your
guests
and
I
said
why
I
said
I've
got
to
go
to
Brighton,
because
we
have
won
three
Awards
very
prestigious
awards
given
by
it's
an
organization
in
the
south
of
England
for
Heritage
Heritage
places
and
people
who
manage
these
for
excellence
primarily,
and
they
ended
up
with
one
of
their
individuals
who
organizes
the
visits.
She
got
a
Gold
Award,
the
cafe
itself
got
a
Bronze
award
and
one
of
the
other
aspects
of
the
shop
and
the
the
Heritage
Mill
itself
got
a
silver
award.
C
So
something
else
we
can
be
very
proud
of
I
traveled
across
this
morning
from
an
early
morning
start
for
those
entirely
knew.
I
opened
the
new
level
this
morning
and
we
went
for
a
photo
shoot
at
the
silk
Mill
with
those
particular
prizes
and
that
will
go
on
to
the
websites
something
again
we
can
celebrate
and
be
proud
of
in
this
Borough
and
I.
Just
thought:
I'd
invite
you
this
evening
of
of
those
activities.
I
have
no
other
announcements.
C
The
congratulations
has
already
gone
from
my
office
to
this
simple
by
the
way
and
it
will
be
on
the
Press
tomorrow.
They've
issued
a
press
statement
and
we'll
get
it
on
The.
Wire
next
is
I,
don't
know
six
questions
from
members
of
the
public
and
I
invite
Mr
Harrison
from
the
croquet
club
just
to
confirm
Mr
Harrison
that
everything
in
the
ordered
paper
is
accurate.
E
E
Who
is
our
chairman
as
I
wrote
the
question
that
I'm
doing
the
honors
I
really
wanted
to
say
something
about
croquet,
because
it's
a
much
misunderstood
sport
which
actually
requires
a
great
deal
of
skill
at
a
game
of
strategy
and
it's
a
game
of
tactics
and
it's
a
something
of
a
Pity
that
if
it
ever
appears
on
television,
you
see,
probably
elderly
people
backing
a
ball
through
a
croquet
hoop,
as
the
television
producers
might
imagine
it
to
be.
That
is
as
far
away
removed
from
serious
croquet
as
French
cricketers
from
test
cricket.
E
E
E
E
We
believe
that
we
can
find
a
way
forward
if
the
council
will
be
willing
to
to
work
with
us
and
to
look
again
at
the
planning
application
and
sit
down
and
works
out
something
as
a
forward
plan.
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor.
F
And
thank
you
Dr
Harrison,
for
your
question.
I'm,
very
pleased
to
hear
that
the
Basingstoke
crooked
Club
has
seen
a
growing
interest
in
croquet
following
the
move
from
downgrange
to
the
thorny
Croft
Bowling
Club,
where
the
bowling
lawn
doubles
up
as
a
croquet
Court.
The
aspiration
to
continue
to
encourage
further
growth
of
croquet
players
in
the
borough
is
very
welcome
for
context.
The
Howard,
Park
and
thornycroft
bowling
clubs
are
adjacent
to
each
other
in
the
Russell
Howard
Park.
F
Unfortunately,
the
Howard
Park
burning
Club
does
not
currently
have
the
capacity
to
share
their
lawn
to
accommodate
a
croquet
Court.
It
should
also
be
noted
that
the
council
has
supported
both
the
Howard,
Park
and
thorny
crop
bowls
clubs,
with
investment
to
improve
Clubhouse
facilities
and
continues
to
heavily
subsidize
the
maintenance
of
the
bowling
lawns.
F
This
year,
the
Basingstoke
croquet
Club
met
with
Council
officers
on
site
to
discuss
a
potential
planning
application
to
create
a
second
croquet
Court
adjacent
to
the
current
bowling
Lawns.
Following
consultation
with
the
council's
natural
environment
team
officers
made
the
club
aware
that
an
application
for
planning
permission
on
that
site
was
unlikely
to
be
successful,
and
why,
once
the
planning
application
has
been
refused,
it
cannot
be
reconsidered
other
than
through
the
formal
appeal
process.
However,
that
should
not
be
the
end
of
the
discussion
about
future
facilities
for
croquet
in
the
borough.
F
The
sports
infrastructure
team
are
Keen
to
meet
again
with
Dr
Harrison
and
the
club
to
explore
other
options,
and
I
too
would
welcome
an
invitation
to
visit
the
club.
It
is,
for
example,
important
to
analyze
the
current
usage
and
demand
for
croquet
at
thorny
craft
to
understand
the
drivers
for
another
court
and
to
explore
in
more
detail
the
reality
of
the
viability
of
having
two
courts.
An
outcome
may
be
that
croquet
would
be
better
supported
located
elsewhere
in
the
borough
rather
than
within
south
ham,
where
there
is
a
shortage
of
publicly
accessible
green
space.
C
Thank
you,
Council
folks,
Mr
Harrison.
You
have
time
for
a
supplementary
question.
C
Number
seven
petitions
and
I
understand
petition
from
Dane
Miller
Maria
Miller
MP.
G
Can
I
thank
council
members,
but
also
you
Mr
Mayor,
for
the
the
opportunity
to
present
this
petition
this
evening
that
basings
token
Dean
Borough
Council
reconsider
their
housing
targets
to
a
more
sustainable
level
in
the
upcoming
local
Plan
update,
Building
Homes
Mr
Mayor
is
important
to
the
residents
of
Basingstoke.
That's
why
we've
built
over
100
homes
for
over
150
000
people
in
the
last
50
years,
double
the
rate
of
the
rest
of
the
country,
but
the
boroughs
current
build
rate
of
around
1200
new
homes
a
year.
C
Excuse
we'll
be
allowed
the
speaker
to
present
the
petition
please
without
you
stopped
it
counselor.
G
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor.
If
the
council
does
not
take
this
approach,
we
risk
sacrificing
the
needs
of
our
own
residents
for
the
sake
of
other
authorities,
who
have
failed
to
build
sufficient
homes
for
their
own
Community.
When
the
last
local
plan
was
developed
in
2014
and
taken
to
inspection
in
public
I
was
amongst
a
few
others
in
this
room
today
to
Advocate
to
reduce
the
number
of
houses
that
are
being
built.
G
That
didn't
happen,
then,
but
we
have
a
new
opportunity
now,
with
the
local
plan,
that's
being
developed
to
shift
away
from
ratcheting
up
house
building
and
year
on
year
and
make
sure
that
we
are
simply
focusing
on
the
existing
population
and
their
needs.
These
needs
include
expanding
services
for
our
rapidly
aging
population.
C
Thank
you
very
much
and
if
I
could
invite
you
James
to
present
your
petition,
you've
got
the
petition
already
and
I
believe
it
will
be
addressed
to
the
head
of
sustainability
and
infrastructure.
Thank
you
very
much.
C
C
C
Moving
on
to
agenda
item
number
eight
resignations
and
appointments
and
appointments
the
leader
Council
bound.
Thank.
H
You
Mr
Mayor,
as
Peter
discussed.
It's
probably
easy
if
I
just
talk
about
the
people
that
we're
going
to
put
in
to
fill
the
vacant
post,
that
we
have
as
a
conservative
group
so
for
the
one
vacancy
at
CP,
councilor
Taylor
for
eph,
the
vacancy
Council
Robinson
and
the
reserves
as
Council
of
jeans
and
councilor
Edwards
for
the
reserves
for
audit
and
the
cat.
Oh
actually
ignore
that
one
and
we
I
think
the
last
vacancy
we
have
is
a
foray
reserve
for
the
standards
committee,
which
will
be
councilor
McIntyre.
C
Thank
you
very
much
Council
McCoy.
Do
you
have
anything
to
add
nope?
Thank
you
and
of
the
other
notes
on
this
particular
one
to
receive
recognition.
Coonies
is
in
printed
in
red
on
the
update
paper.
H
H
Robinson
at
two
reserves
for
eph,
which
accounts
for
jeans
councilor
Edwards.
You
need
to
remove
councilor
Robinson
from
the
reserve
list
for
audit
and
accounts
for
human
resources.
I
need
to
remove
councilor,
Taylor
and
councilor
jeans.
As
the
reserve
add
councilor
McIntyre,
as
the
reserve
for
the
standards
committee
remove
Council
councilor
McIntyre
from
the
many
Town
overview
committee
and
add
him
as
the
reserve
vacancy
that
I
have
ad
councilor
Taylor
as
the
actually
I
think.
D
That
one
okay
yeah,
obviously
we've
had
a
last
minute
change
to
our
limit
and
there's
some
committee
vacancies
and
what
I
would
propose
is
that
we
promote
and
we
have
a
vacancy
on
DC
I
will
be
promoted
as
Reserve
onto
DC
to
be
a
full-time
member
and
councilor
Freeman
will
come
off
many
down
overview
committee.
C
Fine
and
thank
you
very
much,
Council
McCormick
and
just
for
the
record
councilor
hertzel
will
be
appointed
to
the
many
down
over
could
be
a
committee.
C
And
I
understand:
there's
no
amendments
to
the
outside
bodies
at
this
council
meeting
nope
fine.
Thank
you
very
much
move
on
to
item
number
nine
and
recruitment
of
an
independent
member
of
the
audit
and
accounts
committee
and
our
invite
councilor
Faulkner
to
introduce
the
paper.
J
J
For
several
years
now,
there's
been
debate
about
whether
to
have
external
experts,
stroke
advisors
as
part
of
the
committee
to
help
members
understand
some
of
the
more
difficult
aspects
of
the
accounts
and
treasury
management.
As
this
paper
says,
there's
a
lot
of
support
for
the
idea,
one
or
two
people
such
as
myself,
used
to
say.
J
Well,
it
sounds
good,
but
what
we
don't
want
to
do
is
discourage
members
from
seeing
back
and
letting
the
experts
just
do
the
meeting
or
some
members
may
feel
intimidated
by
the
experts
and
not
participate
out
of
feeding
fear
of
feeling
foolish
so
that
debate's
been
going
on
for
some
time.
It's
now
reached
a
point
where
the
the
governing
body
sit
has
now
issued.
J
The
position
statement,
along
with
in
this
paper,
is
a
very
interesting
guidance
for
held
it
and
accounts
committee
should
work
and
then
the
position
statement
is
that
there
should
be
two
independent
members
of
the
committee
who
receive
remuneration
for
being
on
the
committee
and
and
participating
and
Advising.
J
J
So
we
will
have
to
do
it.
So
what
this
paper
is
is
saying
and
asking
Council
to
prove
is
Let's
Make
a
start,
because
it
won't
be
a
quick
exercise
and
we
don't
know
how
it
will
work
out,
because
the
expectation
is
these.
Experts
will
get
a
remuneration
of
two
thousand
pound
per
annum,
but
will
they
be
prepared
to
do
it
for
that?
Well,
we
don't
know,
but
this
makes
a
start
gets
us
on
the
path
and
the
results
will
come
back
to
council
for
final
approval.
Thank
you.
Mr
Mayor.
C
K
C
Move
on
to
gender
item
number
10.
C
L
James,
thank
you.
Mr
Mayor,
this
I
apologize
to
the
wording.
I've
asked
an
officer
to
try
and
simplify
as
much
as
possible
because
it's
a
very,
very
tiny
Amendment.
But,
as
you
know,
if
you
go
to
anyone
in
the
finance
department
that
is
as
simple
as
it
gets,
this
is
a
a
thing
that
potentially
affects
14
residents
of
this
Borough
at
the
moment.
L
According
to
the
papers
we're
reading
and
it's
born
out
of
a
bit
of
a
casework
I
did
I
went
to
visit
a
resident
on
my
ward,
Denise
and
I
can
say
her
name
because
he's
more
than
happy
for
me
to
talk
about
her
story
tonight.
She
has
lived
in
the
same
property
since
1978..
Her
kids
have
grown
up
there.
Her
grandchildren
were
regulars
there.
L
Unfortunately,
fire
came
and
unfortunately,
when
you
have
a
fire,
you
also
have
a
flood,
because
it's
the
only
way
the
fire
brigade
can
get
rid
of
the
fire,
and
it's
not
just
the
fact
that
the
house
was
very
badly
damaged.
The
entire
life
was
just
washed
away:
40
Years
of
happy
memories
disappeared
overnight,
she's
there
and
she's
in
her
70s
she's
sorting
out
with
her
husband.
L
She
has
no
roof.
Most
of
the
roof
beams
have
gone.
The
house
I've
seen
all
the
builders
surveys,
don't
really
understand
them,
but
she's
not
going
to
be
in
there
for
another
year,
and
so
when
she
came
to
the
council
and
said
what
can
you
do?
The
council
office
is
quite
rightly
went
to
the
policies,
but
we
recognize
this.
You
get
a
50
discount,
which
I
thought
was
fair
and
I
think
this
has
come
every
year,
this
time
through
the
chamber
and
we've
all
gone.
L
Okay,
yeah,
fine,
fine,
and
it's
only
when
she
said
to
me.
Well,
my
insurance
company
put
me
in
South
hands.
I've
got
a
house
over
there
I'm
living
there.
It's
all
good.
It's
a
lovely
house
really
appreciate
the
insurance
company.
Neighbors
are
lovely,
but
don't
tell
me
I'm
getting
a
50
discount
because,
whilst
I'm
there
I'm
paying
full
council
tax
so
actually
I'm,
still
paying
50
extra,
so
I'm
paying
full
council
tax
in
the
house.
L
I,
don't
really
want
to
live
in
I'm,
paying
50
for
the
house,
I'd
love
to
live
in,
but
come
I've
canceled.
My
post
I've
told
them
to
redirect
it
I've
canceled
the
bins,
I've,
canceled,
everything
and
I
just
think,
and
it's
a
tiny
cost
to
this
Council.
To
do
this,
the
families
who
go
through
that
should
be
burdened
with
paying
a
50
surcharge
of
council
tax.
We
should
allow
them
to
have
full
discount
on
the
property
they're
not
living
in
if
they're
living
elsewhere
in
the
borough
and
paying
full
council
tax
there.
L
That's
all
if
the
motion
is
asking
us
to
do
so,
I
think
it
was
an
unfortunate
situation
that
I
hadn't
been
aware
of
I
sat
through
and
nodded
this
through
every
year
and
not
realized
the
impact
I
was
having
on
people
the
good
news
for
her
is
she
lost
no
people,
her
family
are
all
alive
and
well
I,
imagined
that
the
conversation
with
her
would
have
been
even
harder
had
been
a
fatality
of
other
fire,
so
this
is
just
for
for
Denise
and
the
other
people
in
our
situation
that
lose
their
properties,
that
they
just
get
the
full
discount
for
12
months
or
until
they
move
back
into
the
property.
L
M
Well,
as
counselor
James
said,
this
is
an
owner
is
charged
to
inflict
on
someone
after
already
enduring
the
loss
and
Trauma
involved
in
fire
or
flood
and
I
believe,
there's
another
consideration.
We
could
take
into
account
last
June
two
separate
incidents
took
place
over
the
same
weekend.
Two
women
residents
were
the
victims
of
their
respective
Partners,
setting
fire
to
the
homes
while
they
were
inside.
M
Both
women
were
thankfully
rescued,
but
had
to
find
alternative
accommodation
I
find
the
idea
of
charging
people
such
as
them
even
50
of
their
council
tax
on
the
burned
property
abhorrent
to
me.
It
does
not
sit
well
with
our
Couch's
white
ribbon
pledge
either
it's
not
enough
to
not
use
Excuse
or
remain
silent.
If
we
then
inflict
a
50
Council
charge
on
the
damaged
home
as
well
as
charging
for
the
alternative
accommodation,
we
should
support
the
victims
of
us
and
not
penalize
them.
They
may
be
rare
events,
but
they
obviously
do
happen.
M
C
D
Yes,
I
think
it
might
be
helpful,
Mr
Mayor
if
I
just
said
that
I'm
grateful
to
the
councils
for
bringing
this
anomaly
to
our
attention.
I
think
that
having
discussed
it
with
the
executive
director
of
corporate
services
and
assets
that
I
think
that
as
the
portfolio
holder
responsible
for
finances,
is
it's
something
that
I'm
I
would
get
behind.
I'm
very
happy
to
support,
particularly
at
this
time
of
year.
B
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor,
just
wanted
to
say,
I
welcome
the
amendment
and
the
the
sentiments
of
it
completely,
and
he
dealt
with
the
case
recently
in
the
ward
of
fire
in
a
bottom
flat
leading
to
the
residents
having
to
try
to
navigate
the
council
tax
system
to
deal
with
it
was
incredibly
complicated
and
so
simplifying
the
process
and
making
it
more
direct
and
easy
to
use
and
also
resulting
the
issues
that
many
of
those
residents
face
is
the
right
thing
to
do
so.
D
Thank
you,
Mr,
Mayor
and
I'm
speaking
in
support
of
the
amendment
looking
at
the
table
on
page
44.
We
have
this
escalating
scale
of
Levy
percentages
for
properties
that
are
empty
for
two
five,
ten
or
more
years.
I
have
a
particular
property
in
my
ward,
that
is
fire
damaged
and
has
been
empty
for
approximately
five
years
and
it
has
got
water
damage
and
the
building
is
in
a
serious
state
of
deterioration
to
the
extent
that
it
will
affect
the
Integrity
of
the
neighboring
properties.
D
So
I
would
like
to
ask
a
question
that
can
have
a
written
answer
which
is
under
what
circumstances
would
we
intervene
to
compulsory
purchase
a
property
to
make
sure
that
it's
structural
Integrity
is
maintained
and
the
structuring
Integrity
of
the
neighboring
properties
is
maintained?
I,
don't
think
levying
people
200
or
300
of
itself
is
enough.
In
some
of
these
extreme
cases,
we
may
have
to
intervene.
C
Because
it's
a
separate
question
I
think
submitting
it
if
I
can
say
not
in
isolation
but
in
the
context
of
this
particular
amendment
that
it
would
probably
do
you
a
lot
of
good
and
the
probably
goes
through
Council
Isaac
himself.
If
you
put
that
in
writing
to
cancelize
it
councilize
it.
Would
you
be
happy
to
accept
that
question
and
respond?
I
think
that's
the
best
way,
Mr
Matt
right!
Thank
you,
but
thank
you
very
much
for
your
intervention.
C
I'll
pick
up
where
I
was
going
on
this
one
on
the
recommendation
is
what
the
amendment
is
all
about
to
update
that
recommendation.
Three
I'll
read
it
if
you
wish,
but
it's
on
the
order
paper
and
are
we
agreed
to
the
amendment
right
as
we're
agreed
on
the
amendment
that
is
approved,
it's
been
moved
and
seconded
for
the
substantive
motion
of
this
Council
taxes.
Scrutiny
tax
support
scheme
is
that
agreed.
C
Right,
a
general
item
number
11
is
reporting
an
urgent,
a
special
urgency
decision.
This
is
a
report
from
the
monitoring
officer.
It's
as
per
the
ordered
paper
on
the
council
agenda.
I
will
move
it
from
the
chair.
C
C
And
from
the
from
myself
Council
McCormack,
if
you
pass
on
our
best
wishes
to
councilor
Grant
I'll,
leave
it
there,
but
our
best
wishes
and
I
hope
she
has
a
comfortable
Christmas.
C
Move
on
to
item
14.,
notion
notice,
the
motion
patient
pleasure
past
draft
master
plan
and
councilor
Freeman
gosh
I'd
like
to
present
it.
N
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor
we
had,
we
were
issued
the
the
master
plan
for
the
Leisure
Park
a
few
months
ago,
but,
looking
through
it
and
being
part
of
the
map,
I
was
quite
disappointed
really
on
the
map.
We
have
spoken
many
many
times
about
the
need
for
big
draws,
for
you
know
something
that's
going
to
pull
in
all
the
people.
This
Leisure
Park
regeneration,
is
Once
in
a
generation
chance
to
do
something
really
big.
It
needs
to
be
inspired.
N
N
We
talked
about
the
things
we'd
like
to
see,
but
looking
at
the
master
plan,
very
little
of
what
we
talked
about
on
the
map
has
is
actually
there,
and
there
are
no
reasons
given
as
to
why
these
things
aren't
in
the
plan.
All
we're
asking
with
this
motion
is
that
we
we
cause.
We
put
a
pause
on
the
on
accepting
the
plan
and
take
it
back
to
this
drawing
board.
It's
not
good
enough
for
our
residents.
We
could
have
a
vision
here
and
have
a
Leisure
destination
for
the
South.
N
We
could
even
maybe
include
the
croquet
club
that
was
spoke
of
earlier.
That
needs
a
new
venue.
There
are
so
many
different
things
that
we
could
put
on
that
Leisure
Park.
That
will
bring
people
to
Basingstoke,
but
the
offering
that
we
have
before
us
and
with
the
current
master
plan
is
devoid
of
pretty
much
any
of
that
inspiration.
There's
very
little
of
what
we've
talked
about
on
the
map,
Within
plan
itself
and
I'm
at
a
loss.
N
I,
don't
understand
why,
when
we
had
such
big
Ideas
such
good
Visions
from
various
counselors
cross-party
I
I
do
not
understand
why
we
have
come
up
with
such
an
insipid
master
plan.
That
really
really
we
could
do
an
awful
lot
better
for
Basingstoke.
Now
there
are
people
that
talk
about.
Oh,
where
will
the
money
come
from?
Where
is
the
funding
coming
from?
But
in
my
experience
where
there's
a
will
there's
a
way,
if
you
want
to
build
it,
you
can
find
the
funding
from
somewhere
and
again.
N
We're
really
asking
this
motion
is
that
it's
taken
back
to
cep
no
eph
minor,
State
apologies
taken
back
to
eph
with
a
view
to
actually
doing
something.
That's
going
to
be
good
for
basing
Stoke
in
some
instead
of
something
that's
more
of
the
same
and
not
really
good
enough.
We
need
some
inspiration
and
it's
sadly
lacking
in
this
master
plan.
N
Hopefully
you
can
get
behind
and
support
this
and
and
think
that
we
could
do
something
really
really
good
for
Basingstoke
instead
of
just
something.
That's
it's!
Okay,
but
it's
it's
not
really
a
vision.
You
know,
but
I
hope
that
you
all
can
support
the
motion.
O
Let's
go:
that's
okay,
Mr
Jack
can
I
reserve.
D
Thank
you,
Mr
Matt
I'd
like
to
thank
the
councilors
for
their
motion.
I
suppose.
Firstly,
I'm
disappointed
that
you
think
that
the
Leisure
Park
master
plan
recently
approved
by
cabinet,
lacks
scope,
ambition
and
vision.
D
I,
don't
think
this
is
an
accurate
at
all,
fair
representation
of
all
the
work
that
has
gone
into
the
master
plan,
not
least
from
the
map,
but
all
the
work
that's
gone
into
it
over
the
last
12
months
by
our
Splendid
officer
team,
our
top
level
consultants
and,
very
importantly,
taking
on
board
what
our
residents
said
they
wanted
when
we
consulted
them
at
the
outset.
In
the
spring.
D
I,
don't
think
that
this
Council
committing
to
building
a
new
aquadrome
at
a
cost
of
some
40
million
pounds
in
cost
is
going
to.
It
demonstrates
any
lack
of
ambition
on
the
part
of
this
Council.
Quite
the
reverse,
absolutely
we
are
ambitious
and
bold
and
want
the
reimagined
Leisure
Park
to
be
a
regional
attraction,
bringing
many
more
visitors
to
the
borough,
creating
lots
of
excellent
new
career
opportunities
and
mutually
benefiting
Our
Town
Center.
D
D
What
is
important
is
firstly,
that
in
choosing
operators
we
provide
a
range
of
attractions
aimed
at
residents
of
all
ages
and
interests,
secondly,
that
they
that
they
are
financially
viable
and
can
be
expected
to
be
in
business
in
the
years
ahead
on
snow
domes,
there's
been
no
expressions
of
Interest
according
to
our
marketing
so
far,
but
we'll
we'll
look
at
it,
we'll
look
at
it
further.
Oh
we've
examined
the
case
for
a
50
meter
pool
in
detail,
but
it
is
costly
to
run
and
limits
other
popular
swimming
activities,
but
we
are
ambitious.
D
We're
looking
at
a
competition
standard,
eight
Lane
25
meter
swimming
pool
rather
than
the
six
Lanes
we've
got
at
the
moment.
Yes,
if,
if
a
viable
business
case
comes
forward,
we
will
consider
it
equally
in
terms
of
a
a
at
any
any
approach
from
beijing's
tank,
basing
Stoke
Town
Football
Club.
We
wait
a
business
case
to
come
forward
from
them
if
they
are
not
happy
about
their
current
home.
D
Yes,
we
are
committed
to
making
the
new
Leisure
Park
as
carbon
neutral
as
feasibly
possible.
The
opportunities
for
heat
and
cooling
exchange
are
exciting,
but
the
challenges
are
also
big,
not
least
the
energy
required
to
heat
a
new
actual
drone.
Of
course,
we
will
comply
with
the
more
stringent
policy
with
more
stringent
policies
in
the
new
leisure
in
the
new
local
plan.
D
D
Thank
you
we're
now
entering
the
exciting
implementation
stage.
Yes,
of
course,
we
will
continue
to
update
and
listen
to
the
views
of
eph
and
other
counselor
committees
and,
finally,
to
end
I'm,
hoping
councilors,
and
it
will.
It
will
be
possible
in
in
the
coming
months,
to
make
a
major
announcement
which
will
prove
just
how
amazing
the
new
Leisure
Park,
the
new
Leisure
attractions
in
bases
Institute
in
Beijing
Stoke,
can
be
in
the
future.
Thank
you.
D
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor,
I'm
speaking
in
support
of
the
motion.
I
appreciate
that
work's
gone
into
the
master
plan,
but
the
master
plan
is
really
something
that
is
not
inspiring
our
residents
and
and
many
of
our
councilors
and
I
think
we
should
be
aspirational.
We
should
be
bold,
I,
don't
think
that
we
should
be
completely
looking
at.
D
Well,
okay,
so
nobody's
expressing
to
us
right
now,
but
economically,
this
country
is
in
a
bad
way
right
now,
I
wouldn't
expect
people
to
be
making
speculative
proposals
at
this
stage
with
risk
attached
to
them.
But
if
you
just
look
at
what
provision
there
is
in
the
south
of
England,
the
nearest
snow
Dome
is
at
Hemel
Hempstead
and
there's
another
one
at
Milton.
Keynes,
and
there
are
millions
of
people
in
close
proximity
to
Basingstoke,
which
has
slowed
down
at
Basingstoke,
would
be
the
closest
one,
and
the
site
lends
itself
sites
on
a
slopes.
D
The
site
would
lend
itself
to
that
and
swim
dinner.
Looking
at
going
ahead
with
a
snow,
Dome
they're
within
easy
reach
of
Bristol,
but
we're
in
Easy
reach
to
the
towns
on
the
south
coast
and
the
big
cities
Southampton
and
Portsmouth.
There
are
more
and
The
Sims
Valley
as
well
there's
more
people
in
close
proximity
to
Basingstoke
that
are
after
Swindon,
so
we
should
be
aspirational
in
looking
for
a
regional
draw
that
gets
people
back
into
Basingstoke.
D
D
Let's
be
bold
about
this
when
we
look
at
what
the
provision
is
in
nearby
areas,
they're,
not
that
many
50
meter
pools
within
close
proximity
to
Basingstoke
and
similarly
in
terms
of
the
provision
all
I
would
ask
for,
is
provision
for
a
football
stadium,
make
it
passive
provision
to
have
some
space
set
aside
for
it.
I
appreciate
that
at
the
moment
the
club
may
not
have
the
financial
muscle
to
build
a
large.
D
You
know
2
000,
plus
seat
of
Stadium,
but
in
20
years
time
we
might
have
a
football
club
that
has
that
Financial
Muscle
and
if
we
put
this
master
plan
to
place,
we
only
get
one
shot
at
this.
If
we
put
this
master
plan
into
place-
and
we
don't
have
the
passive
provision,
then
we're
basically
going
to
Locks
out
that
opportunity
from
there's
your
park
for
the
next
50
years.
So
that's
why
I'm
in
support
of
this
motion,
thank
you.
M
Thank
you,
Mr
Smith.
Well,
within
the
motion.
There
is
a
the
thing
about
a
multi-use
stadium
and
I
am
very
much
in
favor
of
including
a
multi-use
stadium
and
Event
Center
at
the
Leisure
Park
such
as
Stadium
could
be
I.
Think,
as
the
developers
speak,
is
a
destination
venue
helping
to
bring
people
to
baiting
Stoke
and
provide
a
boost
to
the
town's
economy.
It
would
give
the
opportunity
to
hold
outdoor
events
theater
performances,
as
well
as
the
ability
to
hold
differing
sporting
events,
but
especially
a
much
needed
venue
for
our
football
team.
M
I
myself,
I'm,
not
the
greatest
football
fan,
but
many
others
are,
and
colleagues
May
well
have
noticed
recently
that
it
is
a
pretty
popular
sport
that
perhaps
we
could
consider
bringing
home
my
own
great-grandfather,
Johnny
Holt
played
football
for
Everton
reading
and
England.
He
was
described
as
one
of
the
greatest
and
most
popular
players
of
the
time.
If
I
didn't
speak
in
favor
of
this
motion,
especially
the
stadium
I,
would
be
letting
down
the
memory
of
the
little
Everton
devil.
Thank
you.
M
Q
You
thank
you
very
much.
I
speak
in
in
support
of
this
motion.
I'm
an
advocate
of
actually
a
community
Sports
Hub
being
built
at
the
laser
Park.
A
community
Sports
Hub
is
a
multi-functional
activity
where,
where
an
artificial
grass
pitch
plays
a
big
part
in
attracting
people,
the
work
that's
been
done
by
the
council.
Q
The
football
foundation
and
others
has
identified
a
need
for
four
additional
artificial
grass
pictures
in
the
in
the
basic
Stoke
area,
but
actually
it's
not
connected
up
and
it
hasn't
identified
the
Leisure
Park
as
a
potential
candidate
for
one
of
these
extra
artificial
grass.
Pictures
I
believe
that
a
community
Sports
Hub
with
surrounding
activities
linked
to
multi-use
artificial
grass
pitch,
would
be
a
very
attractive
issue.
Q
What
I
would
like
to
do
is
to
draw
lessons
from
my
involvement
as
a
director
of
basis,
Oaktown
Community
football
club
working
with
others
to
try
and
save
the
camera's
ground,
and
a
key
lesson
for
me
was
that
that
was
lost
because
from
the
outset
we
didn't
work
collectively
together
to
make
clear
to
Mr
razak
that
the
approach
that
should
have
been
adopted
was
to
say
to
Mr
razak.
If
you
are
going
to
develop
the
cameras,
you
need
to
make
sure
that
a
brand
new
pitch
is
made
available
for
football
in
the
borough.
Q
We
didn't
make
that
clear
enough.
We
weren't
strong
enough
in
that
approach,
but
the
key
thing
was:
we
didn't
work
in
Partnership.
We
all
operated
within
our
own
particular
Silo,
myself,
included
and
I
believe
that,
actually,
if
we're
going
to
make
a
successful,
bold,
ambitious
pitch
here
for
the
Leisure
Park,
that
means
working
effectively
with
the
football
foundation
with
sport
England
with
the
Hampshire
fa
and
above
all,
this
Council
pulling
that
together
and
making
sure
that
we're
not
working
in
our
narrow,
silent,
be
ambitious
support.
This
motion.
R
Yes,
hello
good
evening,
Mr
Mayor
I
would
like
to
support
this
motion.
I
think
it's
got
some
really
good
pointers,
I
think,
instead
of
aspiring
to
a
Poverty
of
aspiration,
I
think
we
should
be
thinking
as
bold
and
as
big
and
as
ambitious
for
a
wonderful,
vibrant,
basing
Stoke
and
I
think
it's
very
telling
that
Winchester
announced
quite
recently
that
they
have
a
developer
who's
very
seriously.
Considering
building
an
Olympic-sized
ice
rink
in
Winchester,
the
population
of
Winchester
is
80
000..
R
B
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor
I
was
with
you
Andrea
until
you
mentioned
Everton
being
a
red
I'm,
sorry
that
was
just
the
line
that
got
crossed
through
that
regard.
That's
all
right!
It's
all
right,
though,
something's
never
showed
you.
K
B
They
say
it's
interesting.
This
whole
debate
about
the
Leisure
Park.
Isn't
it
because
I
think
this
borough
has
been
through
the
rigmarole
over
the
past
15
years
or
so
with
Ledger
needs
Assessments
in
the
early
days
of
the
first
conservative
administrations,
when
they
started
doing
a
proper
analysis
that
led
to
a
whole
series
of
things
from
3G
pitches
being
needed
to
reviewing
downgrange.
B
That
meant
for
our
Bora
and
that
came
acroper
didn't
it
rightly
so,
really
if
you
dig
enough
and
dig
into
it
as
to
what
was
actually
involved
and
that's
all
the
history,
and
it's
almost
as
if
this
is
living
in
the
shadow
of
all
of
that
and
I
guess,
that's
the
issue.
Isn't
it?
We
don't
want
a
second
rate:
Leisure
Center,
Leisure
Park.
B
We
don't
want
to
have
that
Poverty
of
aspiration
and
the
master
plan
takes
you
so
far
and
that's
the
point
it
takes
you
so
far
and
that's
the
point
of
this
particular
motion
I
feel.
So
there
is
an
awful
lot
on
the
green
agenda
that
I
think
needs
to
be
fleshed
out
and
if
you
think
the
MRT
being
a
bus
is
a
bright
idea,
I
mean
no
traffic
transit
system
is
a
bus
on
the
existing
roads.
I
mean
others
have
got
ambition
far
more
than
that.
B
If
you
think
the
ambition
is
to
ground
our
vision
solely
on
the
Leisure
Park.
Well,
where
does
it
connect
to
the
town
center
and
how
does
it
connect
to
basing
View?
Because
the
holistic
picture
of
Basingstoke
needs
to
be
part
of
this
equation?
It
can't
just
be
a
master
plan
in
isolation
there
or
a
town
center
strategy
over
there
or
something
for
basing
view
over
here.
B
The
whole
thing
has
got
to
connect
in
a
way
that
is
communicable
to
people
to
understand
the
ambition
the
council
has
for
the
town
and
Beyond
the
town
to
our
Villages
and
our
towns
and
Beyond.
The
borough
I
think
the
issue
around
energy
and
how
the
park
is
powered
in
the
future
is
a
really
good
area
to
explore.
We
can
directly
Empower
businesses.
B
We
may
not
be
able
to
do
it
for
our
residents,
yet
that
Law's
got
to
change,
but
you
can
do
it
for
businesses,
so
why,
in
the
world,
aren't
we
talking
about
generating
the
power
this
Leisure
Park
will
need
in
that
way,
there's
lots
of
conversations
that
we
could
be
having
I
think
the
idea
of
redoing.
The
aquadrome,
of
course,
is
no
small
thing,
but
if
Winchester
can
do
it,
why
can't
we
it's
that
old
routine?
Isn't
it
they've
got
there
with
a
brand
new
Leisure
Center?
B
B
So,
there's
a
lot
of
conversations
that
need
to
take
place,
and
the
draft
master
plan
at
the
moment
is
a
pure
starting
point,
but
it
doesn't
go
anywhere
near
the
ambition.
Colleagues
are
having
I
want
to
share
this
evening
and
you
can
see
in
those
that
have
sat
on
the
map,
those
that
have
spoken
to
councilor
Isaac.
The
way
our
residents
have
spoken
in
the
survey
returns
they've
given,
and
if
we
listen
to
them,
we
want
to
avoid
that
Poverty
of
our
mission
and
we
want
the
aspiration.
Really
we
want
for
a
Leisure
part.
B
H
You
very
much
Miss
mayor
I
will
be
brief.
I
think
it's
really
important
to
put
out
there
that
I
am
going
to
support
the
motion.
I
think
it's
really
important
that
we
do
not
stop
thinking
about
how
bold
and
how
we
can
generate
that
real
interest
in
what
can
be
delivered
in
Basingstoke.
It
is
a
framework
we
will
keep
looking.
H
It
is
about
not
closing
anything
down
and
I
just
would
like
to
deal
with
something
that
has
been
mentioned
in
the
chamber,
which
is
a
report
in
a
newspaper
about
Winchester
and
an
ice
rink
I
met
the
leader
of
the
Winchester
City
Council.
Only
10
days
ago
talked
to
him
about
that
opportunity.
I
think
we
need
to
be
very
careful
about
believing
what
a
developer
themselves
puts
into
a
newspaper
for
an
article
and
not
treating
it.
As
fact.
C
Thank
you,
councilor
bound
Council
McIntyre,
and
you
will
have
less
than
three
minutes.
S
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor,
I,
I
think
I'll
be
fairly
quick
anyway.
I
might
surprise.
My
colleagues
I'll
support
the
motion
as
well.
Much
like
what
councilor
bound
said,
I
think
the
the
spirit
of
wanting
to
do
the
best
for
our
town
I
think
we're
absolutely
all
in
agreement
with.
However,
I
disagree
with
the
wording.
I
think
the
master
plan
is.
It
is
a
good
document.
I
think
it's.
S
The
starter
of
a
grid
framework
and
I
also
recognize
the
portfolio
member
coming
up
and
saying
that
the
council
is
still
open
for
business
and
I.
Think,
let's
be
on
the
solution,
it
takes
two
to
tango
and
absolutely
it
involves
businesses
coming
and
wanting
to
do.
Work
with
us,
let's
be
under
no
Illusions.
There
is
no
magic
money
tree
with
this.
Council
is
well
run.
We're
financially
prudent
and
I
wouldn't
want
to
risk
our
residence
money.
Thank
you.
P
I
know
how
to
be
brief:
I
want
to
speak
in
support
of
the
motion.
I
played
football,
till
I
was
61.,
and
my
last
games
were
played
at
the
cameras
with
a
veterans,
team
and
I
found
there.
That
deep
was
brought
me
together
with
the
community,
because
the
team
consisted
of
people
from
across
the
borough
and
it
was
socially
engaging.
It
was
competitive,
which
is
always
fun
and
I
feel
that
we're
losing
the
football
stadium
and
the
associated
all-weather
pitches
that
we
had
for
the
veterans
and
young
people
was.
P
O
O
I'm,
not
going
to
repeat
some
of
the
persuasive
arguments
we've
heard
already
this
evening,
but
let
me
very
Briefly
summarize
why
I
believe
that
this
motion
deserves
everyone's
support.
This
nation
has
been
drafted
with
input
from
all
of
the
groups
represented
in
the
chamber
this
evening.
It's
genuinely
cross-party
in
its
Origins.
It's
not
a
partisan
motion
designed
for
political
Point
scoring,
and
it's
certainly
not
a
criticism
of
our
wonderful
officers.
O
C
C
S
S
Talk
who
I
am
privileged
to
say,
will
be
the
expertise
behind
this
motion
as
its
secondary.
Let
us
not
pull
any
punches
Mr
mere
our
rivers
are
threatened.
They
are
threatened
by
the
adverse
impact
of
a
wide
range
of
human
activities
from
a
continuous
discharge
of
treated
sewage
from
water
compares
to
pollution
by
nitrogen
and
phosphorus
from
fertilizers
spread
on
Farmland.
This
is
happening
today
in
arborough.
I
commend
the
actions
of
this
government
in
recognizing.
There
is
an
issue
here.
S
Recent
proposals
contained
within
both
the
leveling
up
and
regeneration
bill
and
the
recently
enacted
environment
act
can
only
be
a
positive
as
a
Public
Authority
in
England.
This
Council
has
a
duty
to
conserving
biodiversity
as
part
of
our
decision
making.
This
was
enshrined
in
law
in
2006
in
the
natural
environment
and
Rural
communities
Act.
However,
these
duties
must
now
go
further
with
the
introduction
of
local
nature
red
recovery
strategies,
the
aim
of
which
being
to
help
reverse
an
ongoing
decline
of
biodiversity
in
England.
S
S
In
our
bottle
alone,
we
have
the
London
Meandering,
past
Sheffield
and
London
through
Basin
and
into
business
look
itself.
We
have
way
Brook
in
my
own
world
the
test
that
travels
on
its
merry
way
through
which
church
in
Overton
the
born
that
will
Journeys
through
Saint
Mary
burn
and
the
candle
of
a
brick
and
the
light.
Our
borough
has
an
abundance
of
these
chalk
waterways
and
we
all
have
a
duty
to
ensure
they
are
protected.
S
C
C
T
T
They
are
rare
and
to
represent
one
of
the
UK's
most
important
contributions
to
Global
biodiversity,
On,
a
par
with
the
Amazon,
a
quote
from
the
catchment-based
approach.
These
clear-watered
streams
are
a
valuable
habitat
for
Atlantic
salmon,
sea
trout,
Grayling
and
Lamprey
for
otters,
waterfalls
and
Kingfishers
for
rare
invertebrates,
such
as
the
winterborne
stainfly
and
plants
like
stream,
water
crayford,
but
they
face
considerable
threats.
T
T
A
Victorian
house
next
to
me
was
replaced
with
four
dwellings,
but
the
single
four-inch
sewer
remained
the
same
I'm
responsible
for
the
drain
rods
in
my
household,
it's
at
least
an
annual
Joy
I
can
tell
you
exactly
what
my
neighbors
put
down
the
drains
as
it
all
reappears
in
my
garden,
wet
wipes
being
the
least
of
my
worries
members.
We
all
know
that
Thames
water
has
a
statutory
obligation
to
provide
sewerage
and
that
they
cannot
say
no
to
planning
applications,
and
yet
we
are
Beyond
capacity.
T
Our
local
plan,
approved
by
the
inspector,
requires
the
borough,
the
environment
agency
and
attempt
water
to
monitor
the
water
quality
of
the
Lord
and
annually.
Sadly,
the
environment
agency
decided
to
derogate
from
our
plan
A
couple
of
years
ago.
This
is
unacceptable.
We
have
just
had
a
year
of
severe
drought
with
water
levels,
never
seen
so
low
in
life.
C
U
Thank
you,
Mr
bear
I
would
just
like
to
say
that
I
support
this
motion,
which
reflects
local
concerns
and
agree
to
write
the
letters,
as
requested
in
the
motion
and
I
just
wanted
to
confirm
that
the
action
requested
does
support
previous
letters.
U
Through
these
letters,
we
hope
the
council
can
continue
to
to
urge
expediency
and
set
an
environment
at
Targets
support
the
EA
in
their
investigations
into
potential
non-compliance
by
water
companies
regarding
discharges
as
serious
treatment
works
and
support
the
implementation
of
the
25-year
environment
plan,
which
includes
chalk
streams
as
a
priority
for
restoration.
So
I
thank
the
movers
of
the
nation
and
we'll
make
sure
those
letters
are
all
sent.
D
Activist
there
I'll
be
as
big
if
possible,
and
it's
great
to
hear
the
citation
of
the
2006
National
environment,
of
real
world
communities,
Act
passed
by
our
previous
labor
government.
It
was
evidently
a
good
app
to
start
off
with,
but
the
state
of
the
current
privatized
water
companies
needs
a
lot
to
be
designed
and
I.
Think
even
the
current
Tory
government
is
considering
renationalization
of
the
water
companies
as
a
means
to
get
the
necessary
investment
in
to
our
sewage
infrastructure
and
our
water
supply
structure
with
the
protection
of
rivers
across
the
country
in
mind.
D
You,
especially
our
chalk
streams,
just
one
point
to
correct
the
the
Mover
on
when
he
described
the
flow
of
the
river
lobbying
from
basing
from
Sherman
St
John
into
Basingstoke
actually
throws
the
other
way
goes
towards
to
all
Sheffield
on
London
and
then
down
towards
the
River
Thames
at
twyford.
So
I'm
happy
to
support
this
motion.
I
think
it's
High
time
that
we
did
step
up
and
make
a
bold
statement
in
support
of
our
Rivers,
because
once
they're
gone,
it's
very
hard
to
get
them
back
into
the
pristine
State.
D
We
would
like
them
to
be
in
we
spent
many
decades
with
rivers
Nationwide
trying
to
restore
industrial
pollution,
and
it's
only
in
the
last
two
or
three
decades
that
we've
had
any
success
in
that
and
we
started
to
see
Fish
return
to
our
Rivers
I'd
hate
to
think
that,
with
what
the
threats
that
we've
got
to
our
chalk
streams-
phosphates,
nitrates,
sewage,
whatever
you
know
it
would
be
a
complete
Calamity
if
we
didn't
protect
them.
Thank
you.
V
Thanks
Mr
Mayor
difficult
not
to
support
this,
but
I've
just
got
a
couple
of
comments
really
to
be
noted.
It's
difficult
really
to
put
this
into
context
when
it
development
control.
We
accept
the
offset
of
nitrates.
I
mean
that's
completely
hippocracy
to
me.
V
So
where
are
we
going
with
this
I
mean?
Are
we
going
to
keep
going
on
that
route
or
not,
and
the
second
thing
is
just
for
everybody's,
noting
Lance
Riley,
a
310-year
history
of
paper
making
closed
in
Overton,
but
there's
local
concern
how
that
will
affect
the
river
test
that
councilor
McIntyre's
mentioned
so
I
would
hope
that
that's
closely
looked
at.
B
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor
can
I
thank
the
cabinet
member
for
agreeing
to
write
the
letters
and
could
I
ask
her
to
share
them
with
the
council
and
also
Council
Ganesh
for
writing
the
earlier
letters,
and
could
you
share
them
also
I'm,
conscious
that
the
ministers
you
wrote
to
are
not
the
same
ministers
now
that
councilor
ages
will
be
writing
to
the
merry-go-rounders
gone
around
a
lot
since
then
so
getting
to
as
many
of
them
as
you
can
possibly
get
to
to
make
the
case
isn't
a
bad
thing
in
that
sense,
I
just
you
know
every
time
we
talk
about
water
in
this
Borough
and
we
talk
about
southern
water
and
Thames
water
and
I
want
my
blood
pressure
Rises
for
the
very
simple
reason
that
you
know
when
we
add
the
local
plan
back
in
2014,
we
identified
so
much
infrastructure
that
was
required
to
cope
with
the
level
of
housing
being
discussed,
not
so
that
we
didn't
build
houses
but
that
those
houses
were
built
in
a
way
that
had
the
infrastructure
in
order
that
they
could
be
appropriate,
that
they
had
the
skills
and
the
doctor
surgeries
and
the
rest
of
it.
B
That
went
with
it
and
it's
shocking
to
look
back
at
that
local
plan
and
just
see
what
has
not
been
delivered
by
any
of
those
providers,
let
alone
Southern
water
and
Thames
water
who
consistently
fail
to
give
us
the
infrastructure
we
need
and
I
think
you
know
it
is
worth
mentioning.
You
know,
we've
all
got
to
be
consistent
on
this,
and
so
when
amendments
get
put
in
Westminster
I
expect
our
representatives
to
approve
those
amendments
and
not
Dodge
them.
B
I
mean
the
point:
was
the
pollution
that's
come
there
after
is
directly
their
fault
because
they
had
it
on
a
plate
to
stop
it
and
they
didn't
support
the
Amendments.
So
we've
all
got
to
play
our
part
in
this.
If
we
are
truly
to
succeed
in
exactly
the
frame
of
mind
that
councilor,
McIntyre
and
councilor
took
are
putting
this
motion,
which
is
100.
The
other
point
about
strategies,
I
think
which
is
interesting.
B
The
particular
rewilding
strategy
that
we've
all
got
to
to
push
through
is
that
I
don't
want
it
left
to
Hampshire
County
Council
alone
to
be
doing
that
it
is
their
bag.
That's
the
way
the
law
is
written,
but
I
don't
want
to
leave
it
to
Hampshire
I
want
us
to
be
involved
in
that
I
want
us
to
shape
that,
and
so
I'd
like
to
to
hope
that
the
cabinet
members
probably
already
been
doing
that
for
all.
We
know
I'm
sure
she
has,
and
the
leader
will
do
the
data's
on
that.
B
B
I
think
in
terms
of
going
forward
on
this
particular
issue,
it's
getting
rid
of
the
get
out
of
jail
cards
that
the
water
companies
have
and
that
the
development
industry
has
and
I
think
there
is
an
issue
here
with
resourcing
it
and
stopping
it
and
removing
those
get
out
of
jails,
as
councilor
filling
more
rightly
points
out
that
we
can
arm
our
development
control
committee,
which
should
stay
a
development
control
committee.
It
shouldn't
suddenly
have
its
name
changed
just
because
somebody
thinks
it
should.
B
B
Any
further
we
have
got
to
draw
the
line
if
nobody
else
will
and
so
I
think
this
is
cross-party
and
cross
chamber.
The
question
is:
okay,
guys.
What
are
we
going
to
do
about
it?
Now?
We've
got
to
take
the
initiative
and
take
the
lead
in
this,
so
I
wholeheartedly
support
what
council
took
and
councilman.
C
Thank
you,
Council
Checker,.
C
W
Can
I
say
this
I
support
my
two
colleagues
who've
brought
this
Motion
in
the
reason
this,
and
it's
not
only
about
the
pollution,
but
everywhere
you
go
around
the
world.
England
is
famous
for
its
rivers
for
its
streams
and
that
when
you
see
only
14
of
Rivers
School
well,
there
is
a
disgrace,
because
sooner
or
later
we
won't
have
those
beautiful
Rivers
in
our
Borough
as
well
as
nationally.
W
What
I
would
like
to
say
is
if
we
do
something
now
in
20
or
30
years
time
and
Beyond,
the
generations
who
are
going
to
be
after
us
we'll
say,
are
brilliant.
Someone
did
something
about
this
and
they'll
say
they
did
think
about
us
to
give
us
opportunity
to
enjoy
these
Rivers
streams
Etc
in
all
different
seasons.
Why
don't
we
do
achieve
something
amazing
this
evening
by
supporting
this
motion
for
the
generation
to
come,
because
one
day
they'll
say:
we've
lifted
a
legacy
for
them
to
enjoy.
Thank
you
very
much.
L
Thank
you,
I
speak
in
the
support
of
this
I.
Think
the
first
thing
I
should
say
is:
we
should
be
very
careful
about
asking
our
local
MPS
to
do
anything
because
about
six
months
ago
we
had
a
motion
to
reduce
housing
numbers
and
we
all
passed
that
motion
asking
our
MPS
to
act
and
do
something
about
it
and
the
same
MP
came
back
tonight
with
a
petition
to
us
to
do
exactly
what
we'd
asked
her
to
do
so.
I've
Got
a
Feeling.
L
If
we
asked
Maria
Miller
the
pantomime
name
to
do
anything
at
all
about
this.
She'll
probably
just
do
another
petition
and
then
bring
it
back
to
us.
So
perhaps
we
shouldn't
bother.
We
could
of
course,
write
to
Romeo
Jay
wardina,
he's
one
of
the
few
environment,
secretaries
that
stayed
in
place
for
an
entire
term
of
a
Prime
Membership
Prime
ministership
as
having
been
there
for
Less
trust
for
an
entire
term,
which
was
slightly
shorter
than
a
school
term.
L
I
I'm
sure,
like
none
of
us,
he
I
read
his
resignation
letter
where
he
mentioned
the
word
Rivers
exactly
no
times
in
his
achievements,
so
I'm
not
sure
he'll
be
particularly
interested
and
I.
Don't
know.
The
Malt
guy
I've
never
met
him
or
heard
of
him
really.
L
What
I
am
pleased
to
see
is
that
councilman
McIntyre
has
begin
to
build
up
a
theme,
because
in
this
motion
he
has
reminded
us
that
the
environment
agency
suffered
significant
cuts
and
if
he
goes
back
and
looks
at
some
Tory
policy
around
bonfire
of
the
Quan
goes,
he
will
find
the
environment
agency
with
one
of
those
cuangroves.
That's
always
tried
to
bonfire,
so
obviously
the
conservative
party
are
responsible
for
that
and
but
he's
still
joined
them.
L
I
also
would
like
to
point
out
that,
when
the
environment
acts
went
through
Parliament,
all
three
local
MPS
voted
against
the
amendment
to
put
greater
protection
in
throughout
Rivers,
although
it
was
subsequently
amended,
but
they
voted
against
it,
and
I
should
also
mention
that
the
water
framework
directive
is
EU
legislation
which
is
expected
to
be
removed
by
the
conservative
government
to
unleash
the
economy
from
all
this
red
EU
red
tape-
that's
holding
it
back,
so
you
may
find
out
River's
under
greater
threat
in
future
than
they
are
today,
but
I
wish
him
well
support
the
motion,
hoping
it
gets
the
outcome,
but
I
worry
that
when
those
letters
arrive,
they
won't
be
read
very
carefully
or
acted
upon.
C
K
I
would
be
happy
to
share
the
lettuce
and
to
Secretary
of
State
for
referee
as
well
as
leveling
up
that
was
sent
in
summer.
I
have
also
requested
the
officers
to
send
one
last
week,
I'm,
not
sure
if
that
was
sent
to
our
new
secretary
of
state,
if
that
was
sent,
I'll
be
happy
to
share
that
to
you.
Thank
you.
C
Thank
you
very
much,
no
more
speakers,
because
I
can
tell
you
what's
them
up.
S
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor,
I,
never
realized
I
got
to
sum
up
as
well.
I
just
I.
Just
thank
you
to
the
labor
members
for
supporting
this
and
we're
bringing
politics
into
it
too.
Much.
Thank
you
for
the
independence
for
supporting
this,
not
bringing
us
into
too
much,
and
thank
you
very
much
for
my
conservative
colleagues
for
not
bringing
it
to
politics.
Councilor,
James
and
pantomime.
S
Dem
I
can't
forget
you
either
do
you
know
I
mean,
but
no
I
I
in
all
seriousness,
I
think
this
is
more
than
politics
and
I'm
quite
happy
to
have
a
few
little
digs
thrown
in
at
me,
because
this
is
an
important
matter
and
yeah.
Hopefully
it
will
be
cross-party,
cross
chamber.
Thank
you.
C
Thank
you
very
much,
I
again,
once
again,
I
get
a
sense
that
there
is
agreement
across
the
chamber
for
this
motion.
Is
this
motion
agreed.
Thank
you
very
much.
That
motion
is
carried
gender
item
number
16,
note
of
emotion,
building,
affordable
homes,
conscious.
X
All
right,
Mr
Mayor
for
the
councilors.
The
motion
before
you
this
evening,
as
they've
printed
on
the
agenda
is
short
but
very
relevant
today,
unlike
many
of
the
earlier
motions
and
the
petition
that
we
had,
the
cutting
of
this
motion
will
not
result
in
our
having
to
ask
somebody
else
to
take
action.
This
will
be
in
the
control
of
this
Council
to
deliver.
X
X
X
Last
year,
repossessions
in
the
UK
have
gone
up
by
91
percent,
and
that
was
before
interest
rates
have
risen
to
the
levels
not
seen
for
years
with
inflation
and
other
pressures
that
will
be
inevitably
be
more
than
will
be,
seeking
an
alternative
accommodation
as
they
cannot
afford
the
homes
they
now
live
in
and
rents
in
the
private
sector
remain
high
and
are
already
beyond
the
reach
of
many
people,
the
average
age.
Now,
for
a
first
time,
buyer
is
37..
X
X
Low
interest
rates
have
allowed
borrowers
to
take
on
mortgages
many
times
their
salaries,
but
this
recent
hike
in
interest
rates
has
now
made
it
unaffordable
for
so
many
people
to
even
get
on
the
housing
ladder,
and
it's
not
just
the
Young.
Many
older
residents
would
like
to
downsize
but
might
want
to
have
an
accessible
home
for
the
long
term,
but
Bungalows
are
not
being
built.
X
House
builders
seem
to
want
to
build
retirement
homes
where,
after
that,
it's
more
expensive
than
the
three-bedroomed
house
that
the
people
currently
live
in
colleagues,
you
can
do
something
to
take
that
control.
We
can
explore
how
we
might
again
provide
Council
houses
and
affordable
homes
for
our
residents,
as
we
did
before
93.94.
you.
X
You
when
we
agree
to
sell
our
housing
stock
to
to
housing
associations
after
paying
off
the
debt,
we
got
65
million
pounds
net
from
that
sale.
10
million
was
used
in
96
for
secure
lands
at
many
down,
but
we
haven't
built
a
house
there,
and
2
million
went
to
housing
associations.
The
remainder
went
into
our
Capital
receipt
pot
and
have
been
spent
over
the
years,
and
nobody
really
can
tell
me
what's
on
perhaps
it's
time
that
we
put
some
money
back
into
providing
homes
for
people
in
our
Borough.
X
C
X
Just
coming
to
that,
and
so
all
councils
across
England
have
got
examples
of
what
they
can
do,
including
some
locally.
We
are
financially
stable,
I
believe
that
we're
well
placed
to
emulate
them
I
urge
you
to
support
the
motion.
Please
take
back
control
and
build
affordable,
sustainable
homes
in
the
best
places,
the
right
time
to
give
hope
to
our
needy.
Let
us
take
forward.
C
X
X
R
Members
I'm
honored,
to
be
able
to
Second
cancel
this
lemon
on
her
motion
tonight,
I
have
been
on
public
record
for
15
years
as
a
supporter
of
Building
Council
houses,
I
believe
that
our
Borough
should
be
building
their
own
Council
houses
and
indeed,
should
have
built
Council
houses
with
the
money
that
we
were
paid
from
the
sale
of
a
housing
stock
back
in
the
90s.
R
We
promised
that
then
tenants
that
we
would
use
their
money
to
build
more
houses
and
instead,
as
councilor
Simmons
said,
we
use
their
money
to
buy
an
option
on
land
which
we
still
have
not
built
one
house
on.
We
don't
need
to
look
very
far
for
an
example
of
how
we
can
do
things
differently
and
how
we
could
be
Brave
and
Bold.
Winchester
City
Council
decided
to
buy
its
Council
housing
stock
back
in
the
90s
and
I
I
spoke
to
both
or
with
both
councilor
Paula
Ferguson.
R
So
liberal
Democrats
and
conservatives
so
cross
party
and,
as
members
know,
Winchester
has
a
significantly
smaller
population
than
we
do
and
their
current
Council
housing
stock
is
worth
I
understand
a
fortune
and
it
involves
five
and
a
half
thousand
homes
and
I
spoke
to
a
former
Cabinet
member
today
and
he
said
for
residents,
it's
a
dedicated
and
a
council
managed
relationship
with
the
housing
officers
all
responsible
to
a
Cabinet
member.
So
there's
really
good
visibility
and
accountability,
and
it
also
gives
confidence
in
building
new
houses
on
the
council
balance
sheet.
R
The
current
Deputy
leader
said
you
have
an
in-house
benefit
as
a
public
service
body
and
you
can
build
high
quality,
well-designed
energy,
efficient
low
carbon
homes
to
meet
the
tenants
needs
and
high
ECB
ratings,
which
enable
reduced
costs.
At
times
like
today,
with
High
Cost
of
Living
and
energy
efficiencies,
the
housing
revenue
account
has
to
be
separate
from
the
general
fund
and
it
has
to
be
sustainable
over
a
30-year
period
and
have
a
viable
plan.
They
borrow
to
build
through
the
public
loans
board.
R
These
are
all
information
and
data
that
we
need
to
go
through
and
I
don't
have
the
answers.
I
don't
profess
to
be
an
expert,
but
both
leaders
said
that
Winchester
City
Council
was
privileged
to
own
their
own
Council
housing
stock.
I
knew
councilor
Keith
Woods
many
years
ago,
and
he
was
a
great
Visionary
and
they
consider
that
they
are
in
a
much
better
position
to
look
after
their
tenants
than
many
other
authorities.
They
ensure
they
have
robust
policies
and
a
robust
revenue
account
with
their
tenant
surveys,
repeatedly
reaffirming
high
levels
of
satisfaction.
R
They
buy
both
off
the
shelf
from
the
likes
of
Taylor
wimpy,
but
they
also
have
a
dedicated
team
and
they
regenerate
stock
by
building
housing
or
regenerating
their
stock
by
building
houses
in
the
place
of
garages
on
and
under
the
right
to
buy.
They
sell
approximately
30
houses
a
year,
so
they
need
to
keep
on
restocking.
R
It's
wonderful
that
a
cross-party
view
of
a
council
right
next
door
to
us
is
so
keen
on
social,
rented
housing.
They
also
like
building
not
only
off
the
shelf
from
Taylor
wimpy
and
the
likes
of,
but
they
also
like
building
social,
rented
housing
on
single
plots,
and
we
know
that
this
government
is
very
keen
for
councils
to
build
Council
houses
on
Council
owned
land
and
we,
as
a
council,
have
a
lot
of
council
owned
land.
They
work
very
closely
with
homes
England
and
have
a
great
relationship
with
them.
R
She
then
said-
and
this
is
this
evening-
I
can't
think
of
a
better
action
for
a
district
council
to
take
than
to
build
Council
houses
for
our
less
fortunate
residents.
Members
I
hope
you
agree
with
councilor
Simmons
motion.
We
have
a
moral
duty
to
look
after
our
residents
who
are
less
fortunate
and
more
vulnerable.
Many
thanks.
C
Thank
you,
Council
Cabot,
and
thank
you
for
keeping
on
time.
I
have
eight
speakers.
We
are
time,
Limited
I,
just
advise
you
we'll
see
how
we
go
councilman.
V
V
However,
there
are
no
losers
in
this
new
motion.
Both
the
coach
was
finances
and
all
residents
can
benefit
from
it.
The
current
housing
policy,
as
dictated
by
central
government,
is
not
fit
for
a
purpose,
and
it's
been
followed
dogmatically
by
our
current
Administration,
even
though
it
seems
that
the
base
of
MPS
now
had
a
road
to
Damascus
moment,
developers
are
allowed
to
bank
plan
applications
build
at
their
own
pace,
controlling
the
market
and
abusing
the
notion
of
local
democracy,
delivering
unwanted
houses
on
unwanted
sites
across
our
Borough.
V
These
are
extraordinary
times,
but
these
are
not
Extraordinary
Measures,
just
common
Financial
measures
that
Encompass
all
our
residents,
not
just
those
that
wish
to
own
their
own
homes.
We
need
to
acknowledge
and
support.
The
socializing
gives
the
current
idea
of
forcing
residents
in
a
private,
rented
accommodation
and
deeming
them
to
be
adequately.
Hosed
is,
frankly,
a
mockery.
Only
massages
the
housing
figures.
V
V
We
need
to
acknowledge,
not
not
everyone,
especially
those
on
low
income,
may
wish
to
be
aspirational
and
set
on
themselves
with
a
mortgage,
but
just
be
content
to
raise
a
family
and
a
safe
and
decent
house.
These
ideas
are
not
new,
as
others
are
said,
and
the
motion
explains
they're
being
successfully
operated
in
Winchester,
eastleigh
and
Southampton.
V
Return
on
investment
should
be
greater
than
any
of
our
current
Investments
and
can
only
generate
more
homes,
and
what
we're
here
for
is
not
to
support
our
residents.
This
is
an
ideal
solution
to
our
housing
crisis
and
I
hold
a
heartfly
support.
The
motion.
N
Thank
you
sitting
here.
I've
realized
there
possibly
should
have
declared
an
interest
in
in
this
motion.
I
currently
am
living
with
my
mother,
I
was
in
private,
rented
accommodation,
but
unfortunately
the
rent
was
put
up
and
I
could
no
longer
afford
it.
So
I
have
been
living
at
my
mother's
house
for
a
good
year
and
a
half
nearly
two
years
now,
I
can't
afford
private
rented
housing.
N
I'm,
therefore
stuck
with
living
with
my
mother,
who
I
am
so
grateful
that
she
can
put
us
up,
but
at
the
end
of
the
day,
for
as
a
person
of
my
age
to
be
living
with
your
mother,
isn't
really
great,
so
I
would
love
for
more
affordable
homes
in
the
borough
somewhere.
That
I
can
raise
my
son
that
that
doesn't
encroach
on
my
mother
and
I.
N
Y
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor.
How
can
I
not
disagree
with
the
first
two
lines?
This
Council
believes
that
our
Borough
faces
a
housing
crisis
and
I
need
to
deliver
more
homes
generally
affordable
homes
to
meet
local
need,
and
we
need
to
be
absolutely
aware
that
we've
got
conflicting
views
within
this
Council
and
within
this
Borough,
and
some
people
don't
want
any
more
development.
And
yet,
as
councilor
slimming
pointed
out,
our
housing
list
is
huge.
Y
Many
thousands
and
getting
bigger
and
the
elephant
in
the
room
is
that
we
have
net
migration
of
500
000
a
Year.
Where
are
we
going
to
put
those
people?
Because
if
we
they
are
genuine
Asylum
Seekers,
they
need
to
be
housed
properly.
We
have
a.
We
have
a
duty
in
this
Council
to
look
after
everybody,
but
we
also
have
a
duty
to
make
sure
that
our
finances
are
in
the
best
state
possible.
So
for
30
years
we've
improved
our
bank
balance
and
I
think
it
is
genuinely.
We
have
let
the
Market
deal
with
it.
Y
Z
Mr
Mayor.
Thank
you,
members
for
raising
the
issue
of
homes.
It
gives
this
conservative
Administration
an
opportunity
to
set
out
our
records
and
to
highlight
our
work
to
address
the
housing
crisis.
Locally.
Enhancing
opportunities
is
at
the
heart
of
this
administration's
purpose.
As
conservatives,
we
believe
in
helping
residents
find
an
affordable
home
to
call
their
own
with
homecoming
security,
Independence
and
the
space
to
start
a
family
or
build
a
business
and
for
those
who
dream
of
home
ownership.
Z
The
conservative
government
has
delivered
Financial
products
such
as
help
to
buy
and
locally
we've
been
promoting
low-cost
home
ownership
opportunities,
including
shared
apologies,
including
share
ownership
opportunities.
I
should
have
said
sorry
and,
of
course,
our
Innovative
own
home
loan.
Now
housing,
affordability,
matters,
you
don't
need
to
tell
me
that
my
generation
builds
that
acutely
and
helping
folks
in
our
housing
register
and
supporting
residents
seeking
an
affordable
place
to
rent
is
a
top
conservative
priority
and
we
are
making
considerable
progress.
Z
This
Administration
has
exceeded
the
council's
target
for
new,
affordable
homes
every
year,
since
2018-19
delivering
399
homes
in
2021-22
alone
and
for
every
one
of
those
new
social
homes
delivered.
We
retain
the
nomination
rights,
and
so
we
are
able
to
put
our
local
residents
first
and,
of
course,
I
would
say
that
by
standing
firm
we
can
ensure
that
developers
meet
our
affordable
policy
requirements,
securing
the
affordable,
rent
and
social
rent
properties
that
our
residents
need.
Z
Equally
residents
seeking
a
social
home
in
our
Borough
face
shorter
waiting
times
than
the
rest
of
the
Hampshire
Home
Choice
region
in
2021-22.
900
homes
were
made
available
for
Lessing
the
second
highest
number
of
social
housing
vacancies
available
in
any
year
in
our
Borough
for
the
last
two
decades,
and
we
are
committed
to
boosting
these
affordable
numbers
by
working
in
partnership
with
our
registered
providers
to
deliver
regeneration
now
the
opposition
challenges
on
this
issue,
but
they
cannot
match
our
record.
Z
Now
I've
no
objection
to
this
motion,
insofar
as
it
enables
eph
to
have
a
discussion
about
affordable
delivery.
However,
I
I
would
counsel
against
this
approach,
Council
house
building
as
an
approach.
It
does
not
work
as
a
model.
It's
neither
financially
viable
nor
practically
deliverable.
It
would
not
serve
residents
of
this
Borough.
It
would
not
reduce
our
housing
register
nor
deliver
the
more
affordable
homes
than
the
current
regime,
which
is
the
planning
obligations
and
regeneration.
Z
This
council
could
not
secure
the
land
to
deliver
new
homes,
so
it
is
simply
wrong
to
say
that
it
would
grant
us
more
control
than
we
have
right
now
in
terms
of
location.
We
could
not
compete
with
the
land
promoters
or
the
large-scale
builders
who
have
that
Capital
to
leverage.
Nor
could
this
Council
secure
the
human
capital,
the
Staffing,
to
deliver
these
homes
ourselves.
Let's
not
underestimate
the
significant
development
management,
technical,
environmental
and
financial
expertise.
That's
needed
to
build
homes.
Z
Z
Is
that
in
today's
basing
Stoke
and
Dean
affordable
is
not
affordable
enough
and
it's
in
an
expensive
Market,
let's
be
frank,
affordable
rent
is
still
very
expensive
and
so
we're
very
conscious
of
that
as
an
Administration.
So
we
are
actively
working
at
the
moment
to
see
how
we
can
place
greater
preference
on
social
rent
in
our
policies
moving
forwards.
So
thank
you
very
much
for
raising
this
issue.
The
only
small
point
I
would
raise
at
the
end
is
that
the
population
of
Winchester
is
127
500,
not
80
000,
but
what's
fifty
thousand
between
friends.
AA
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor.
Thank
you,
counciloratican
for
drawing
attention
to
the
commercial
realities
of
building
social
housing.
AA
Thank
you
to
councilor
Carr
for
drawing
our
attention
to
the
the
track
record
of
this
Administration
and
and
the
the
the
I
think
his
wordsworthy.
It's
economically
unviable
to
build
Council
housing
I
was
rooting
through
some
audit
committee
papers
going
back
a
while
today
and
I
stumbled
across
something
I
thought
would
be
quite
useful
for
this
conversation
tonight
jll
this
council's
commercial
property
advisors.
They
came
to
an
audit
Committee
in
March
2021.
AA
So
what's
that
20
months
ago,
and
when
jll
were
questioned
about
a
property
strategy
and
in
particular
they
were
questioned,
whether
pursuing
more
residential
opportunities
and
I'm
reading
this
direct
for
the
minutes,
whether
pursuing
more
residential
opportunities
was
a
viable
option.
Jll
advised
that
it
was
predicted
to
be
the
biggest
investment
sector
over
the
next
20
to
30
years,
and
the
residential
investment
provided
regeneration,
long-term
income
and
had
attributes
to
produce
capital.
AA
AB
Good
evening
in
April
1978,
my
parents
moved
with
me
just
a
few
weeks
old
into
45
Fairfield
in
whitchurch,
a
council
house,
and
that
was
our
family
home
until
2021.
AC
AB
AB
I
just
want
to
finish
by
shouting
out
to
counselor
Freeman
tonight,
isn't
the
first
time
that
councilor
Freeman
has
offered
some
insight
into
her
own
life
to
actually
give
us
all
a
very
real
view
on
what
is
going
on
out
there.
So
thank
you
very
much
and
to
meet
you.
There
I
also
live
with
my
mum
and
I
feel
very
lucky
to
do
so.
Thank
you.
AD
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor,
really,
I
just
want
to
ask
a
question:
are
you
satisfied?
We
are
dealing
with
our
people,
those
in
Stoke
and
Dean
properly,
because
I.
Certainly
this
motion
is
good.
This
is
what
we've
been
talking
about
for
a
number
of
years
from
this
side.
We're
now
getting
the
quiet
bits
from
over
here
yeah.
It
sounds
good,
except
for
everything.
Do
you
remember
that
place
called
many
down
the
promises?
Were
there?
I've
worked
look
before
your
time,
but
a
few
of
you
will
remember
it
well
I've
been
a
counselor
for
a
long
time.
AD
We've
promised
the
earth.
Oh
yeah,
we're
about
to
house
our
people.
Everything
else.
That's
why
we
blooming
bought
the
thing
we
brought
up
with
the
money
we
had
from
the
sale
of
the
council
houses.
We
would
have
been
much
better
off
by
by
buying
land
and
building
more
houses,
but
we're
sitting
there
complacent
most
of
us
here
are
lucky:
we've
got
our
own
houses
live
reasonably
well.
What
about
the
ones
who
don't
come
on
wake
up?
Mr?
You
know
people
want
to
buy
their
houses.
Yes,
well,
I,
don't
I've
got
a
problem
with
that.
AD
O
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor.
If
anyone's
thinking
about
wavering
on
this
motion
or
haven't
made
up
their
mind
yet
whether
to
support
it,
can
I
draw
your
attention
to
the
second
paragraph
in
the
document
here
in
front
of
us.
This
highlights
some
of
the
housing
challenges
facing
us
as
a
Borough,
a
lack
of
housing,
affordability,
long
waiting
list
for
people
on
the
housing
register,
insufficient
infrastructure
delivery,
which
we've
already
talked
about
as
well
in
terms
of
the
pollution
of
our
Rivers
low
quality
design
and
build
poor
environmental
standards
and
inadequate
housing,
land
Supply.
O
Now,
as
counselors
I'm
sure
we're
all
concerned
about
these,
and
we
want
to
address
all
of
these
issues.
Private
house
builders,
aren't
their
primary
focus,
is
making
a
profit
helping
us
solve.
Our
housing
challenges
is
not
particularly
high
on
their
agenda.
So
if
the
house
builders
aren't
going
to
help
us
address
these
issues
and
let's
face
it,
they've
not
now,
so
what
makes
us
think
they're
going
to
change
and
suddenly
start
helping
us
in
the
future?
We've
got
to
start
taking
action
ourselves
and
that's
exactly
what
this
motion
is
all
about.
So
let's
take
action.
B
I,
don't
think
I'll
need
that
Mr
I
wasn't
going
to
speak
on
this
motion
because
I've
already
spoken
on
the
other
two
tonight
and
I
support
this
100
and
how
many
times
have
I
stood
in
the
chamber
and
said
the
same
thing
that
everybody
else
has
been
saying:
I
mean
councilor.
Carr
stands
up
and
lists
off
the
amazing
achievements
of
the
conservative
Administration
over
the
last
16
years.
I'm,
sorry,
well,
I,
don't
know
what
parallel
universe
you
live
in,
but
my
goodness
me
that
isn't
the
reality.
B
Our
residents
are
facing
in
social
housing
in
the
rented
sector,
the
bloated
rented
sector
in
Basingstoke,
because
that's
the
only
thing
that's
on
offer
and
when
we
put
them
there,
they've
got
no
choice
of
getting
back
on
the
register.
They've
got
no
choice
of
getting
back
around
under
the
housing
situation
that
they're
facing
they're
trapped.
Let's
not
forget,
a
lot
of
the
housing
that
has
been
built
has
been
one
and
two
bed
Flats
that
ain't
exactly
the
cleverest
of
affordable
housing
to
be
building
and
sticking
families
in
three
or
four
story
blocks
of
flights.
B
Is
it
really
so
our
record?
Isn't
the
rosy
picture
you
paint
and
in
fact,
if
anything,
I
just
had
to
take
us
back
to
some
of
the
things
that
would
we
did
do
as
an
authority
working
with
our
partners
and
it
was
Sentinel
at
the
time
still
suffering,
but
we
built
and
regenerated
Oak
Ridge
submitting
nearly
13
million
pounds
of
our
own
money
as
an
authority
with
our
Capital
receipt
reinvested
to
make
it
happen
and
make
it
possible.
B
You're
399
that
you
mentioned
it
wasn't
down
to
your
Administration.
It
was
down
toward
councilors
working
with
our
officers
and
Sentinel
delivering
New
Horizons.
Yes,
you've
taken
the
credit
for
it
and
I'm
not
going
to
fight
you
over
that
because
it
was.
You
were
in
power
at
the
time
fine,
but
by
hell
you
didn't
do
it
all
on
your
own
and
a
big
tick
in
the
Box.
For
you,
local
residents
worked
with
Sentinel
who
worked
with
us
as
Ward
councilors
to
regenerate
their
Community.
B
It
happened
in
Bishops
green
as
well
all
those
years
ago
in
Bishop's
green,
so
this
Council
has
a
very
strong
and
very
good
record
when
it
does
put
its
mind
to
it
to
deliver
socially,
affordable
housing,
housing
to
buy
and
intermediate
products,
and
if
we
don't
grasp
this-
and
we
just
play
the
ideological
games,
we're
going
to
go
round
and
round
the
circles
for
the
next
16
years,
so
I
say
enough
is
enough.
Let's
pass
this
motion,
let's
get
on
with
the
job
and
let's
build
some
houses.
C
Thank
you,
cancer
Ganesh!
You
did
give
away,
as
did
councilor
Harvey
earlier
on.
You
have
about
one
minute
just
over
a
minute,
if
you
want
to
say
anything.
K
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor,
while
I
would
like
to
agree
in
the
essence
of
this
motion
that
we
should
be
building
more
affordable
homes.
I
I
just
would
like
to
mention
that
as
an
Administration,
we
have
delivered
over
35
percentage
of
affordable
homes
while
some
of
the
neighboring
authorities
around
as
the
namely
the
Winchester,
which
was
mentioned,
delivered
half
the
amount
of
houses
and
will
still
be
less
affordable
homes
and
the
the
the
other
authority,
the
the
reading
and
Council
bill
just
14
percentage.
K
So
it's
not
about
politics,
but
we
all
agree
that
we
should
be
building
more
affordable
homes
in
Nevada,
and
we
all
agree
on
this
emotion
unhappy
to
support
that.
Thank
you,
foreign.
X
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor,
to
point
out
to
council
Carr
that
when
you
come
to
cabinet
and
that
this
document
I'm
presuming
that
you
think
the
Royal
town
planning
Institute
might
be
a
reasonable
place
that
they've
got
information
and
in
2019
pre-covid
they
produced
this
document,
which
is
called
local,
Authority,
Direct
Delivery
of
Housing
and
it's
research.
That's
been
accepted,
there's
192
pages
of
examples
of
councils
across
this
country
that
are
doing
exactly
what
we
are
proposing
to
do
in
different
ways,
but
to
deliver
housing
for
their
people.
X
I
recommend
it
to
you
I'll
give
you
my
top
copy,
so
you
can
make
sure
that
you've
got
the
right
piece
of
paper.
It
is.
It
is
very
difficult!
Isn't
it
when
people
have
very
strict
views
that
people
all
want
to
buy
their
own
homes,
young
people
these
days
of
deciding
they
probably
want
to
rent
anyway,
mainly
because
it
allows
them
to
movement
and
also
because
they
can't
afford
it.
X
We
should
go
back
to
pre-war
after
the
war
and
how
things
were
done
so
that
we
could
try
and
improve
things
well,
one
of
the
things
that
we
did
after
the
war
was
produce
homes
that
people
could
afford
to
live
in.
So
why
are
we
not
doing
it?
Now?
We've
got
land
so
there's
Furniture
Jones
has
referred
to
many
down.
I
haven't
actually
said
that
we
should
look
at
many
town,
but
that's
in
my
head.
We
have
got
land.
X
That's
why
we
bought
it
and
it's
viable
and
people
make
money
out
of
it
and
we
will
get
the
revenue
and
we
will
be
able
to
spend
it.
Yes,
we'll
have
to
take
on
some
people
to
do
this
work,
but
that
will
all
be
generated.
This
council
is
not
broke.
This
council
is
financially
viable,
more
so
than
many
other
in
this
country,
and
we
should
be
putting
our
efforts
and
our
money
into
providing
decent
homes
for
our
people
arrest.
My
case.
C
Thank
you.
Thank
you
very
much.
It's
been
moved
and
seconded
the
motion.
I'll
try
it
for
the
third
time.
Is
there
agreement
on
this
motion?
C
C
Well,
I
take
it.
The
motion
is
carried.
C
Right
we're
going
on
to
item
number
17,
but
just
before
we
start
it
I'd
like
to
invite
all
members
in
this
chamber
back
to
the
Parlor
when
we
finish
this
meeting
tonight
for
some
Christmas
refreshments.
C
Right
questions
from
members
of
the
Council
on
notice,
councilor,
McIntyre
and
the
sequence
here
you
have
put
the
question
and
there's
two
minutes
to
the
answer:
one
minute
for
the
supplementary
question
and
for
the
supplementary
answer
here
we
go.
S
Thank
you,
Mr
Madden.
Please
do
keep
me
right
if
I
go
off.
My
tangent
here,
I
I
will
be
brief
with
this
question
following
the
tragic
case
of
ewabi
Shack,
the
the
toddler
and
Rochdale
who
died
as
a
result
of
prolonged
exposure
to
damp
and
mold
in
our
Housing
Association
property
I'm,
asking
the
cabinet
member
for
homes
and
regeneration
to
update
members
on
the
actions
this
council
is
taking
to
ensure
that
the
same
tragedy
does
not
take
place
in
our
Borough.
Z
Thank
you,
Mr
Mayor.
This
Administration
believes
that
residents
have
a
right
to
be
safe
in
their
homes.
This
deeply
saddening
case
should
prompt
all
councils
to
evaluate
their
approach
to
housing
standards.
I
want
to
reassure
members
that
we
take
dampen
mold
concerns
incredibly
seriously
and
that
this
council
is
committed
to
helping
residents
with
housing
disrepair
issues
regardless
of
tenure.
A
specific
meetings
regarding
the
management
of
dampened
molds
have
been
helped
between
my
senior
officers
and
the
boroughs
housing
associations.
Z
This
Council
has
emphasized
the
importance
of
Swift
action
by
registered
providers
and
landlords
to
resolve
damp
and
mold
issues
where
they're
raised
I'd
make
clear
to
my
officer
team
that
monitoring,
how
housing,
associations
and
landlords
manage
disrepair
issues
including
dampened
mold,
is
the
top
priority
where
registered
providers
do
not
deliver
for
our
residents.
The
council
will
investigate
and
where
necessary,
take
enforcement
action
in
cases
where
a
resident
reports
hazards
to
their
health
or
which
a
landlord
has
failed
to
address
officers,
undertake
specialist
inspections.
Z
My
officers
were
also
carried
out
a
review
of
capacity
within
the
housing
team,
a
housing
standards
team
rather
conscious
that
this
will
be
a
more
challenging
winter.
With
Rising
energy
bills,
we
have
increased
The
Specialist
staff
resourced
on
hand
to
support
residents.
Z
I've
asked
my
officers
to
prepare
further
information
and
guidance
on
how
Ward
members
can
support
residents
with
concerns
regarding
damp
and
mold,
and
this
will
complement
advice
that
we
have
circulated
to
Key
Community
groups
and
which
housing
associations
have
themselves
sent
to
residents.
Foreign.
X
X
The
question
on
the
paper
relates
to
the
cost
of
living
assistance
fund
and
the
reasons
that
I'm
asking
the
question
is
that
I'm,
a
truthy
of
decisions,
advice,
entadly
and
councilor
Morrow
and
myself
and
Kingsford
Parish,
Council
or
David
Conquest
have
been
working
with
our
communities
to
try
and
encourage
people
to
claim
the
cost
of
living
allowances,
and
we
just
need
to
know
where
the
situation
is
and
how
much
is
left.
Thank
you.
D
Yes,
Mr
Smith,
the
coloss
scheme
was
initiated
by
this
Council
in
July
this
year.
We
allocated
one
million
pounds
to
help
during
this
very
difficult
time,
those
residents
and
their
families
on
incomes
of
up
to
25
000
pounds
per
annum.
Payment
was
by
application.
D
A
significant
efforts
have
been
made
and
I'm
glad
to
hear
that
that's
reached
tadley
in
Kings,
clear,
significant
efforts
have
been
made
to
ensure
that
the
scheme
has
been
well
advertised
with
additional
sport
support,
given,
where
necessary,
necessary
to
assist
in
the
completion
of
individual
applications.
D
I'm
pleased
to
tell
Council
that
the
scheme
criteria
has
been
updated
and
is
now
being
implemented
to
enable
more
residents
to
be
able
to
benefit
from
the
scheme.
The
main
changes
will
mean
that
in
future
in
assessing
the
claimant's
income,
it
will
not
include
any
disability
benefits
received
on
behalf
of
a
child.
It
will
also
not
include
income
from
certain
benefits,
including
disability,
living
allowance,
personal
Independence
payments,
Armed
Forces,
Independence
payments,
attendance
allowance,
child
benefit
and
child
maintenance.
This
will
enable
more
residents
to
benefit
under
this
under
the
scheme.
C
D
D
Yeah
but
Mr
Mayor.
This
is
important
information
that
has
been
asked
for
by
councilor
slimmings
and
I'm
I'm.
Just
doing
what
what
I'm
being
asked
to
do
is
to
provide
the
information
this
evening
unfortunate.
C
Counselors,
please
no
councilor
Jones
just
hang
on
a
second
please.
We
all
know
what
the
rules
are
for
these
questions.
Thank
you
very
much.
May
I
suggest
that
whatever
you
have
in
your
speech,
if
you
could
provide
to
against
the
as
women
in
writing,.
X
Please
be
aware
of
the
timings
yeah.
I
would
just
be
grateful
if
that
could
be
put
in
writing
so
that
we
can
all
see
it
afraid
we
can't
write
quick
enough
and
and
I
certainly
would
like
to
record
my
thanks
to
the
fact
that
I'm
aware
that
citizens
advice
Hadley
had
14
000
of
that
money
that's
been
allocated
because
they
are
doing
a
fantastic
job
in
supporting
people
with
their
claims.
Thank
you.
Okay.
C
There's
no
question
there,
but
I
accept
that
and
you'll
get
everybody
will
get
that
answer
in
writing.
Thank
you
very
much.
X
People-
and
this
has
come
as
coverage
Town
Council,
which
I'm
a
member
of,
and
we
noticed
that,
in
fact,
the
schedule
for
leaf
clearing
in
tadley
has
again
slipped
to
the
end
of
the
of
the
list
and
that
when
we
looked
at
the
schedule
we
realized
there
was
an
awful
lot
of
discrepancies
between
people
that
got
it
in
the
town
and
on
Parish
there.
X
As
you
get
two
in
the
parish
areas
and
the
rural
areas,
we
only
get
one
and
many
parishes,
including
part
of
my
ward
in
Pumba,
get
nil
and
part
of
others
also
getting
on,
and
there
seems
to
be
an
awful
lot
of
anomalies.
I
would
ask
if
the
cabinet
member
would
have
a
look
at
this
and
come
back
with
some
ideas
of
a
better
schedule
to
save
the
members
of
our
public
falling
on
their
derri
heirs.
Thank
you.
AC
Thank
you,
Mr
I
will
try
and
be
brief.
So
thank
you
for
your
question.
Mechanical
Leaf
clearance
is
undertaken
between
two
and
four
times
a
year
out
of
lethal
season,
which
is
February
to
October
and
a
further
two
times
in
full
season,
which
is
November
to
January.
The
number
of
times
an
area
is
swept
depends
on
footfall
amount
of
leaves,
Leaf
litter
collected
based
on
historical
data
and
whether
the
roads
are
curved.
AC
We
collate
this
data
review
and
adjust
our
annual
schedule
as
required
to
ensure
we
carry
out
the
clearances
quickly
and
efficiently
as
possible.
The
exact
timings
of
the
sweeping
will
vary
depending
on
factors
such
as
weather
conditions
and
operational
factors.
This
year's
Leaf
clearance
schedule
is
currently
sorry
delayed
by
approximately
two
weeks
due
to
the
extreme
cold
weather
currently
being
experienced,
which
makes
it
impractical
for
the
sweepers
to
operate
sadly,
is
scheduled
to
receive
four
mechanical
sweeps
a
year
out
of
leave,
Four
Season
and
a
further
two
mechanical
sweeps
within
the
full
season.
AC
Tadley
was
last,
swept
early
November
and
was
due
a
further
sweep
starting
19th
of
December.
However,
this
has
been
delayed
due
to
the
cold
weather
and
is
now
scheduled
for
January.
The
work
is
undertaken
by
blowing
Leaf
litter
and
other
debris
from
the
Pavements
into
the
roads
and
then,
following
on
with
a
large
sweeper
Lorry
with
regards
to
non-mechanical
sweeping.
There
is
no
schedule
for
this
across
the
borough,
as
it
is
part
of
the
routine
work
of
the
operation.
AC
Operatives
based
in
the
area,
however,
tadley
Parish
Council
is
one
of
a
number
of
Parish
Town
Council
areas
who
receive
a
parish,
litter
Grant
from
the
Borough
Council
to
undertake
and
make
their
own
arrangements
for
a
little
clearance
within
the
town.
Following
on
from
the
concerns
raised,
we
will
contact
the
Town
Council
to
discuss
our
partnership
Arrangements.
Thank
you.
X
X
It's
not
just
sweet
seats
of
of
leaves,
which
are
obviously
on
the
road
and
obviously
you
do
cause
flooding
because
it
gets
down
into
the
drains,
and
it
is
very
bad
at
the
moment
and
I'm
sorry,
but
I
can't
agree
that
I
would
dispute
your
assertion
that
there
are
more
trees
in
the
areas
that
you
do
twice
than
there
are
in
the
rural
areas.
You
only
have
to
look
at
Google
Maps
and
see
how
green
we
are
in
the
rural
areas
and
I'm
pleased
that
you're
going
to
look
at
it
again.
C
There's
no
real
question
there
so
I'll
leave
that
at
that
point,
but
thank
you
very
much
for
posing
the
news.
We're
going
to
agenda
item
number
18.
questions
to
the
chair
or
cabinets,
remember
and
or
a
committee.
Are
there
any
questions?