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A
B
Good
afternoon
and
welcome
to
the
regular
meeting
of
the
police
conduct
oversight,
commission
audit
subcommittee
for
march
24th
2021-
I
am
robert
pino-
I
also
go
by
jackson
or
commissioner
pino.
I
am
the
chair
of
the
subcommittee
as
we
begin.
I
will
note
for
the
record
that
this
meeting
has
remote
participation
by
members
and
city
staff
as
authorized
under
minnesota
statute,
section
13d
021
due
to
the
declared
local
public
health
emergency.
B
This
meeting
will
be
recorded
and
posted
to
the
city's
website
and
youtube
channel
as
a
means
of
increasing
public
access
and
transparency.
This
meeting
is
public
and
subject
to
the
minnesota
open
meeting
law.
At
this
time
I
will
ask
the
clerk
to
call
the
role,
so
we
can
verify
a
quorum
for
the
meeting.
B
A
C
D
B
D
D
B
That
motion
also
carries,
and
the
minutes
for
august
2020's
meeting
are
accepted.
Next
order
of
business
is
the
acceptance
of
public
comments.
I
will
now
open
the
floor
and
invite
comments
from
the
community
we'll
limit
public
comment
period
to
no
more
than
two
minutes
per
speaker
and
with
that
is
there
any
member
of
the
community
on
the
line
who
would
wish
to
address
the
subcommittee.
E
B
F
Hey
everybody,
hopefully
you
can
hear
me.
I
had
some
internet
issues
earlier,
all
right,
perfect,
so
yep.
So
last
year
we
had
two
items
that
had
been
moved
kind
of
review
for
the
audit
committee,
which
you
know
hasn't
met
for
a
little
while
I
think,
as
mr
vicki
actually
alluded
to.
So
I
think
one
of
the
things
that
we're
going
to
try
to
figure
out
today
is
you
know
what
it
looks
like
and
getting
a
methodology
in
place.
F
You
know
that's
in
line
with
what
this
group
would
like
to
see
from
those
reports
in
order
to
get
the
actual
work
moving
forward.
The
first
item
that
had
been
referred
to
audit
was
a
review.
It
was
actually
in
conjunction
with
the
city's
trans
equity
committee
and
that
one
was
relating
to
hate
crime
reporting
against
members
in
the
trans
community
with
mpd.
F
I
believe,
there's
a
there
was
like
some
questions
or
concerns
over
the
way
that
things
are
coded
or
the
way
that
they're
referred
with
regard
to
a
standardized
process
that
I
think
exists.
You
know
for
those
to
make
their
way
to,
I
believe,
would
be
the
minneapolis
or
the
you
know:
the
branch
of
the
fbi
in
the
twin
cities.
So
I
know
our
equity
staff
was
being
trying
to
trained
up
on
the
system
to
make
sure
that
they
could
start
doing
queries
for
those
who
don't
know.
F
That's
also
the
group
that
runs
our
urban
scholars
program,
which
is
sort
of
ramped
up
here
kind
of
in
the
interim.
So
I
believe,
they've
been
fairly
busy
with
that
now,
but
I
actually
just
spoke
with
the
director
and
she's
looking
forward
to
getting.
You
know
that
up
and
running
again,
but
we
do
need
to
connect
her
with
with
this
group
to
get
the
methodology
and
kind
of
figure
out.
F
What
specifically,
you
know
is
out
there
and
what
specifically
you're
interested
in
looking
at
the
second
item,
we
have
again
is
more
broad.
We
had,
and
that's
kind
of
sort
of,
relates
to
the
topic
that
I
know
this
group
has
been
discussing
quite
a
bit,
which
is
coaching,
but
one
of
the
items
was
sort
of
at
the
the
former
chair
action.
F
Foruzon
had
just
sent
a
memo
to
the
city
attorney's
office,
asking
for
responses
on
a
number
of
items
that
were
identified
from
another
commissioner's,
like
some
independent
research
they
had
done.
The
city
attorney
had
issued
their
response.
For
that
I
don't
know
if
everyone
in
the
group
has
it,
but
I'll
send
you
something
after
we're
done
it's
kind
of
based
on
where
we
land
with
this
discussion,
so
I
know
they
had
issued
their
response
from
their
office.
F
In
terms
of
you
know
what
like
what
the
history
of
certain
parts
was
what
they
were
looking.
I
don't
know
what
like
what
their
interpretation
was,
etc
and
then
the
other
part
was
he
just.
I
believe,
at
the
end
of
the
meeting.
The
research
itself
is
sort
of
referred
to
this,
this
group
as
well,
for
further
review.
F
So
I
think
that
that's
one
of
the
things
to
kind
of
determine
as
well
as
you
know.
What's
the
goal
of
this
group,
you
know
in
terms
is
it
in
terms
of
that
specific
request?
Is
it
to
go
through?
You
know
that
like
kind
of
individual
research
and
figure
out,
you
know
what's
correct:
what's
not
what
might
be
you
know
a
gray
area,
etc
and
then
so
yeah
the
I
mean,
that's
kind
of
the
update
on
that.
B
Yeah,
I
appreciate
the
high
level
overview
on
both
of
those
correct
me.
If
I'm
wrong,
there
might
be
a
third
that
is
really
more
housed
in
the
audit
department,
with
the
surveys
and
evaluations
of
three
one
one
calls
I
remember,
we
had
a
conversation
about
that
last
year
and
I
know
that
it
was
something
that
was
like.
I
said.
The
lion's
share
of
it
is
is
not
within
pcoc
or
opc,
ours
work,
but
more
the
the
audit
department
and
they
had
an
ongoing
survey.
F
D
F
B
Yeah
and-
and
I'm
you
know,
I'm
struggling
to
remember
which
one
of
it
it
was
as
well
with,
but
that's
why
we're
restarting
and
recapping
right,
and
we
want
to
make
sure
that
we
refresh
ourselves
of
all
the
work
that
we're
doing
and
making
sure
that
we
start
off
on
the
right
foot.
So
yeah
would
love
to
hear
more
about
that
at
the
next
meeting.
B
Definitely
I
guess
what
we
can
do
is
rather
than
dive
way
into
the
weeds
on
any
one
of
these
right
now.
I
think
it
would
be
a
great
time
to
either
have
the
three
of
us
ask
questions
of
mr
hawkins
and
try
to
dig
in
a
little
bit
more
of
what
the
current
status
is
of
the
two
that
he
mentioned
the
trans-equity
group
coming
in
and
reporting
on,
the
absence
of
hate
crimes
from
their
perspective,
which,
from
my
own
personal
experience,
I
remember
seeing.
B
B
I
do
believe
it
was
commissioner,
sarah
who
was
doing
that
independent
work
and
that
ended
up
finding
its
way
over
here
for
more
of
an
evaluation
to
get
a
fundamental
understanding
of
where
we're
at
in
terms
of
coaching
what
it
means,
how
we
got
to
coaching
as
its
current
status
quo,
really
starting
at
the
fundamentals
and
and
taking
an
earnest
look
at
that.
But
I'd
be
more
than
happy
to
open
up
the
floor
to
commissioner
sparks
or
commissioner
crockett.
F
F
I
think
there
was
there's
there
was
a
learning
curve,
but
I
know
they've
been
in
contact
with
them
to
begin
putting
that
together
and
yeah
I
reached
out
earlier
as
soon
as
they
have
kind
of
some
preliminary,
because
I
don't
know
that
we,
if
the
methodology
for
that
one
came
from
this
group,
or
it
was
something
where
it
sort
of
originated
from
the
trans
equity
committee.
But
I
do
want
to.
I
want
to
sort
that
out.
B
I
remember
having
the
discussion
with
caitlin
the
former
chair
of
the
subcommittee
about
a
year
ago,
and
we
were
just
beginning
to
have
that.
Setting
up
the
structure
around
methodology
we
weren't
even
getting
to
you,
know
an
instrument
more
along
the
lines
of
what
sort
of
questions
should
we
be
asking
ourselves
while
staff
is
exploring
what
data
is
available
really.
D
F
Yep,
I
think
this
one
because
it
didn't
come
from
another
group.
It's
a
more
broad
topic.
It
kind
of
depends
on.
I
think
what
this
group
wants
to
focus
on
you
know,
like
I
said,
there's
there's
been
some
other
there's
been
some
various
areas
that
have
been
explored
by
you
know
like
the
responsible,
like
parties
like
whether
it's
the
attorney's
office
or
mpd.
F
If
you
don't
already
have
some
of
that
from
the
it
was
meetings
prior,
but
I
believe
it's
all
on
limbs,
but
I
think
that's
stuff,
that's
all
kind
of
worth
reviewing
and
figuring
out
what
questions
you
might
have
based
on
some
of
their
responses
and
that
might
guide
the
direction
we'd
go,
and
then
I
mean,
in
addition,
you
know.
There's
I
mean
again
it's
a
broad
topic.
Is
there?
Is
there
interest
in
you
know
the
background
specific
to
minneapolis?
Is
there
interest
in
what
this
looks
like
across
other
jurisdictions?
F
You
know,
is
you
know,
as
far
as
both
like
implementation
or
wording
and
use
you
know
or
looking
at
I
guess
you
know
yeah,
like
you
know,
limitations
on
civilian
oversight.
It's
whatever
relates
to.
You
know
that
I
think
that's
that
that
this
was
that's.
What
this
group
you
know
does
is
sort
of
fine
tunes
like
that
research
and
so
yeah
I
mean,
if
you
have
questions
and
stuff.
I
think
now
is
a
perfect
time
to
try
to
like
hone
in
on.
F
So
you
know
what
I
mean
like,
I
believe
the
aza
the
chair.
Pinot
said
it's
like.
I
can't
don't
imagine
we're
gonna
get
to
like
that
finite.
You
know
methodology
by
the
end
of
this,
but
I
think
you
know.
Hopefully
we
get
us.
You
know
we
get
us
closer
and
like
we
kind
of
get
a
list
together
in
terms
of
like
what
you'd
like
to
see
and
then
from
that
universe
you
can
parse
it
down
and
have
something
specific
ready
to
go
here
soon.
E
B
You
know
she
is
the
chair
of
that,
and
so
it
ended
up
coming
in
through
the
the
full
commission.
The
full
commission
decided
that
it
would
be
an
appropriate
next
step
to
have
our
subcommittee
look
at
it
and
evaluate
that
process,
and
there
has
been
no
action
since
then.
It's
been
referred
to
this
committee,
and
this
is
the
first
time
we're
talking
about
it
as
a
committee,
so
you're
coming
in
just
at
the
right
time,
whereas
the
the
hate
crime
reporting
of
transgender
people.
B
That
is
something
that's
been
going
on
for
almost
a
year.
It's
been
february
when
the
the
group
that
originally
initiated
that
sort
of
discussion
with
us
that's
when
they
brought
it
to
our
attention
back
in
february
of
2020.
I
believe
so.
That's
that's
the
rough
idea
of
comparison
of
the
timelines,
and
you
know,
since
we've
had
time
to
think
about
that
for
me
personally,
since
referring
coaching
to
here.
I've
definitely
come
up
with
some
questions.
B
Around
methodology,
but
I
think
I
I'm
going
to
personally
hold
off
until
the
two
of
you
have
the
opportunity
to
review
those
documents.
You
know
mr
hawkins
said
that
he
was
going
to
send
out
both
the
the
the
document
that
was
reviewed
as
well
as
the
city
attorney's
response.
I
think
that
is
a
fair
way
of
just
looking
at
the
whole
picture
of
the
issue,
and
it's
something
we
can
talk
about.
You
know
next
meeting
really.
C
B
F
Yep
and
I
I
think
it
can
vary
depending
on
the
subject
matter-
that's
being
looked
at,
I
mean
there's
been
some
in
the
past
that
have
moved
fairly
expeditiously.
There
have
been
some
more
just
like
because
of
the
depth
of
the
data
can
take
a
while
longer.
It's
definitely
hard,
I
mean
and
again
like
having
gone
through
at
least
part
of
it.
I
think
sherpina
will
probably
attest
to
this
like
using
last
year
as
a
measuring
stick
is
probably
not
a
good
idea.
You
know
between.
F
Like
you
know,
I
mean,
there's
a
reason
that
we
have
such
a
you
know,
new
group
of
people,
and
it's
just
you
know
like
between
this
group
falling
below
quorum
and
between
you
know.
Having
some,
you
know,
positions
that
were
vacant
that
were
frozen
and
us
being
like
definitely
short-handed.
On
our
end.
It
was
just
kind
of
the
you
know.
There
was
a
lot
going
on
that.
I
think
you
know
this
was
like.
F
I
didn't
get
the
attention
that
you
know
I
normally
would
have,
and
so
I
I
would
expect
with
you
know,
positions
being
being
brought
in
in
this
group.
Having
you
know
a
healthy,
you
know
the
largest
size
we've
had
it's
like
I'd
like
to
think
that
this
gets
moving
again,
pretty
pretty
quickly
so
yeah,
sorry.
I
know
that
was
a
long-winded
answer,
but
I
feel
like
it's
worth
like
making
sure
that
it's
noted
that
last
year
it's
a
tough
one
to
measure
by,
but
but
yeah.
F
So
with
this
I
mean,
I
think,
some
of
it
yeah
like
the
coaching
one,
especially
if
there's
you
know,
there's
various
parts
of
it.
You
know
like
there's,
it
can
be
a
piece.
You
know
it
can
kind
of
be
a
piecemeal
thing
too,
where
there
might
be
like
an
initial.
You
know
initial
part
of
it.
That's
expanded.
You
know.
So
in
that
case
the
initial
part
runs
quicker,
but
you
know
the
whole
scope
of
the
project
takes
a
little
longer.
B
Yeah
any
final
questions
about
either
of
those
two
topics.
I
know
you
know
for
audience,
members
and
people
watching
virtually.
Unfortunately,
we
kind
of
mixed
both
of
those
together.
Obviously
this
is
a
little
bit
more
of
a
discussion,
oriented
format
compared
to
the
larger
commission.
I
promise
we'll
we'll
try
to
separate
the
topics
a
little
bit
better
next
time,
a
learning
process
for
us
all,
but
do
we
have
any
final
questions.
C
Question
for
mr
hawkins
there
so
as
far
as
like
process,
if
we
have
something
that
we
want
to,
you
know
take
through
to
the
audit,
it
would
be
you
and
your
team
that
would
that
would
start
that
audit
and
I'm
sure
you
guys
do
like
a
million
other
things
as
well.
So
how
much
like
time?
Do
you
guys
like
dedicate
to
the
to
the
artists
that
we
request,
or
I
guess
like
what
does
that
structure
look
like
in
in
everything.
F
Yep
so
I
mean
again
it's
new
with
you
know
my
group
being
the
one
that
does
this,
but
I
think
it
some
of
it
depends
on
the
subject
matter,
we're
doing,
and
I
think
some
of
it
in
the
past.
Just
like
you
know
from
what
I
was
just
doing
a
review
and
like
from
what
I've
seen
it.
It
depends
on
the
makeup
of
this
specific
group.
I
mean
if
people
in
this
group
have
that
you
know
data
backgrounds
and,
like
you
know,
have
that
like
desire
to
you
know
to
assist
with
the
analytics.
F
I
think
then
it's
there's
a
little
bit
more
interaction
and
things
can
move
a
little
bit
quicker
if
it's
solely
on
on
this
side.
It
just
depends
on
you
know,
like
staff
availability
and
like
what
we
can
do,
but
but
since
I
mean
census
has
been
on
pause,
I
mean
this
is
definitely
something
that
we
want
to
get
moving.
You
know
quickly
and
then
I'll
you
know
also
like.
F
If
there's
something
that
someone
has
a
question
you
can
always,
you
know,
share
it.
I
think
there
is
a
lot
of
back
and
forth.
You
know
as
we're
going
along
with
this,
and
so
you
know
between
now
and
in
between
when
we
meet
again
like
we
could
be
at
you
know
a
new
spot
in
this
process,
so
I
mean
at
least
that's
the
way
like
again
having
not
gone
through
this
in
its
entirety.
Before
with
this
group,
that's
at
least
the
way
that
I'd
like
to
envision.
F
It
happening
where
you
know,
otherwise
it's
just
going
to
be
essentially
like
a
review
and
report
to
this
group
and
then,
if
that's
the
first
time,
you're
seeing
the
information
you're
gonna
have
to
take
it
back.
You
know
I
mean
like
figure,
everything
out
and
then
the
next
meeting
you
know
you're
like
well,
here's
my
concerns,
whereas
like
it
seems
a
lot
easier
just
to
share
things
as
we're
going
and
then
you
know
we
can
have.
B
Way
all
right,
thank
you
both
for
for
your
questions.
It's
it's
good
to
be
jumping
into
some
of
this
work,
and
you
can
kind
of
see
where
the
the
roles
that
we've
been
talking
about
since
the
beginning
of
the
year,
starting
to
actually
mesh
with
the
the
concrete
work
and
the
results
that
we've
seen
from
this
type
of
group
in
the
past.
B
B
And
the
next
item
on
our
agenda
is
moving
into
a
discussion
section
again.
This
is
more
just
for
us
a
space
for
us
to
propose
ideas
to
one
another.
I
have
three
items
up
on
the
agenda
right
now.
I
would
encourage
both
of
you
if
you
are
interested
in
something
there's
something
that
you
want
to
talk
about.
B
Obviously
we
can
always
talk
about
those
sorts
of
ideas
that
you
have
things
that
you
want
to
research
with
the
broader
commission,
but
because
that
is
the
primary
focus
of
this
subcommittee.
I
want
to
create
that
space
here
as
well,
and
it
doesn't
matter
in
my
opinion,
if
it's
duplicative,
I
want
to
just
make
sure
we're
creating
the
space
to
propose
ideas.
B
Talk
with
each
other
in
an
open
forum
about
those
ideas,
make
sure
the
public
hears
those
ideas
that
we're
considering
and
and
if
it's
something
that's
not
of
interest
to
the
either
the
three
of
us
or
with
the
larger
commission.
That's
okay!
You
know
it's
just
here
as
a
tool
to
make
sure
that
we're
articulating
the
things
that
are
of
interest
to
us.
With
that
in
mind,
the
next
item
on
our
agenda
is
a
discussion
about
our
2021
meeting
schedule.
B
I
know
we
had
a
email
exchange,
the
three
of
us
just
to
set
up
this
meeting,
but
I
want
to
make
sure
we're
setting
up
a
recurring
meeting
time
today.
Obviously,
is
the
fourth
wednesday
of
the
month.
I
know
that
the
public
the
policy
subcommittee
has
their
meetings
on
the
fourth
thursday
of
each
month
and
just
wanted
to
take
a
moment
chat
with
the
two
of
you
one
final
time,
hopefully
about
our
schedules
and
how
this
will
look
for
reoccurring
meeting
each
month.
C
B
I
I'm
fine,
I'm
totally
fine
with
that
on
the
weekdays,
particularly,
you
know,
since
we're
in
a
virtual
space
right
now,
the
only
days
I
can't
really
do
that
is
on
wednesday.
For
me,
this
is
the
last
day
that
I'm
not
having
my
job
take
over
my
wednesdays.
Basically
so
with
with
those
two
parameters
in
mind,
commissioner
sparks
do
you
have
you
know
a
tuesday's
mondays
thursdays,
anything
that
doesn't
work
in
your
schedule.
D
A
B
Thank
you
next
item
on
our
agenda
is
the
discussion
surrounding
evidence
recording
errors.
I
put
this
on
the
agenda
in
response
to
the
conversation
that
we
had
in
our
larger
commission
meeting.
Let
me
let
me
pull
up
so
that
way,
I'm
remembering
her
name
correctly.
I
for
those
of
you,
following
along
at
home,
I'm
referencing
the
meeting
minutes
of
the
police
conduct
oversight
commission
from
march
9th,
where.
B
We
did
not
have
a
motion
or
directive
to
talk
about
this,
but
in
the
spirit
of
wanting
to
make
sure
we
have
the
space
to
have
that
sort
of
discussion.
I
wanted
to
bring
it
up
to
the
two
of
you.
If
that
is
something
of
interest
to
you,
should
we
look
into
that
further?
What
are
your
thoughts
on
it,
etc?.
C
B
F
Hey
sorry
about
that,
anyway,
the
hand
was
intentional.
I
was
gonna,
say
yeah,
just
like
going
off
a
president
too,
with
in
this
group
in
the
past.
What
they've
done
is
like
these
discussions
have
taken
place
and
like
you
can
essentially
have
like
a
you
know:
it's
like
an
audit
committee
queue
of
projects
that
have
come
across
because
I
mean
again
like
there's
enough
that
comes
across
like
this
group.
You
know
at
any
given
time
that
you
can
lose
sight
of
it.
F
So
when
something
of
interest
comes
across
like
there
was
like
this
exact
type
of
discussion
so
like
in
the
group
and
then
you
just
basically
have
that
running
tally
that
exists
so
one
you
know
once
the
research
study
is
done
and
it
goes
to
the
full
group.
It's
basically,
you
know.
If
there's
not
something
else
that
was,
you
know
that
just
came
up.
That's
you
know
like
going
to
get
the
priority.
F
B
Quick
question
regarding
that
regarding
the
queue
you
know,
I
just
noted
this
in
the
meeting
just
by
happenstance
that
I
thought
okay.
This
would
be
something
good
for
us
to
to
talk
about.
Is
there
someone
who
like
actually
manages
that
cue,
if
not
I'd,
be
happy
to
be
that
person
to
just
be
writing
these
things
down
and
and
keeping
them
on
here?
But
if
there's
someone
else
who's
already,
has
that
responsibility
like
at
the
staff
level
or
there's
something
that
already
exists?
I
don't
want
to
reinvent
the
wheel.
F
I
mean
with
all
the
time
you
know
like
again,
just
with
you
know.
Last
year,
in
the
I
mean
the
group
as
a
whole,
not
meeting
a
lot,
I
don't
know
I
mean
I
can
go
and
look
and
see
what
I
can
find,
but
I
mean,
since
it's
a
whole
new
group
of
people.
I
think
it
almost
like
makes
sense.
For
I
mean
it
would
make
sense
for
me
for
that,
just
it
lives
with
this
group.
Okay
and
you
can
just
kind
of
maintain
a
running
telly
of
it.
F
B
B
Commissioner
crockett
you,
you
brought
up
a
great,
you
know,
point
of
just
the
practicality
of
data
collection
right,
that's
one
of
the
things
that
largely
defines
a
lot
of
our
research
is
what
is
available
to
us
as
far
as
collecting
meaningful
data,
and
I
think
it's
an
important
conversation
to
always
bring
up
based
off
of
the
conversation
that
I
remember
miss
hammerberg
had
with
us
it.
It
sounds
like
they
have
some
sort
of
system
put
in
place.
B
Obviously
that
system
is
housed
within
mpd,
but
I
think
if
it
is
something
that
is
concerning
to
us,
I
would
hazard
to
guess:
there's
a
shared
concern
there.
I
I
wouldn't
assume
that
they
would
want
to
continue
to
have
the
errors
at
the
frequency
that
they
have
and
if
it
means
better
policing
and
you
know
more
efficient
use
of
their
time
because
they're-
actually
you
know
not
having
these
concerns
around
evidence,
then
I
think
that's
a
a
great
starting
point
of
being
able
to
say
hey.
B
B
Yeah
and
again,
I'm
not
I'm
not
trying
to
say
that
we
need
to
do
something
on
this.
I
I
just
you
know,
wanted
to
create
a
space
here.
If,
if
people
want
to
go
down
that
road
great,
I
will
leave
that
conversation
here
and
just
make
sure
that
we
take
note.
We
put
it
in
this
queue
of
hey.
This
is
something
that
we
could
look
at
in
the
future
unless
either
one
of
you
wants
to
kind
of
take
the
reins.
B
B
All
right,
the
next
item
on
our
agenda
is
actually
one
that
I
have
added
on
here,
because
I
would
like
to
take
the
the
lead
on
it.
It
is
a
item
of
discussion
around
safe
and
effective
policing
practices
in
response
to
public
protests
a
little
bit
of
context.
Obviously,
the
the
trials
of
former
police
officer-
derek
shovin,
have
begun
with
witness.
No
sorry
what
do
they
call
them?
B
B
B
I
guess
my
end
desire
of
this
sort
of
discussion
point
is
to
hopefully
draft
a.
You
know
three
quarters
of
a
page
one
page
paper
to
chief
aerodondo
in
the
minneapolis
police
department,
just
simply
saying:
hey,
there's
a
literature
out
there
of
safe
and
effective
policing
practices.
So
that
way,
people
can
express
their
constitutional
rights
in
a
safe
and
structured
way
that
you
know
from
the
policing
perspective
allows
citizens
to
do
so.
B
What
the
outcomes
are
from
comparative
studies?
I
am
obviously
it's
something
that
I'm
passionate
about.
I
would
like
to
make
sure
that
it's
something
that
we
have
a
voice
in
of
saying:
hey,
there's,
literature
out
there.
You
know
by
no
means
accusing
the
police
department,
but
really
just
saying
hey,
look
at
this
literature.
It
would
be
really
great
to
have
policing
practices
here
in
minneapolis,
be
informed
based
off
of
this
sort
of
literature,
and
if
it
is
it'd
be
great
to
know
that.
B
That's
that's
where
I'm
coming
from
with
this
final
discussion
point
I
do
have
a
few
cited
sources
that
I've
kind
of
been
digging
into.
They
all
should
be
publicly
available.
I
made
sure
that
they
were
publicly
available
peer-reviewed
research
that
I
don't
know
the
best
way
to
share
those
those
documents
around
any
advice
from
the
clerk
links
that
I
could
put
into
the
chat
or
something
or
you
know
just
generally
discussion
from
the
two
of
you,
your
thoughts
on
that
sort
of
proposal.
B
D
It's
it's
a
good
topic
and
thanks
for
already
kind
of
looking
into
it,
I'd
be
interested
to
see
those
resources
that
you
mentioned.
It
was
good
that
you
were
able
to
find
something
that
was
kind
of
peer-reviewed.
As
you
said,
a
lot
of
talk
about
police
response
to
public
protest
tends
to
get
really
politicized
and
it's
good
to
have.
This
is
the
right
tax
to
take
right
like
something
more
neutral
like
hey.
This
is
what
studies
show
work.
This
is
what
other
places
are
doing
that
seem
like
it
works.
D
Maybe
this
is
a
little
opinion
based
or
maybe
it's
fully
opinion
based,
but
my
observations
on
mpd
conduct
last
year
during
the
protests
was
that
there
was
a
lot.
They
were
creating
a
lot
of
confrontation
and
provocation,
and
that
was
based
on
everything
that
I
observed
so,
but
if
you're
going
to
talk
to
them
about
that
or
suggest
changes,
that's
a
a
bad
place
to
come
from.
A
B
D
C
C
Question
would
be
as
far
as
the
research
piece
of
it
is
the
objective
like
more
of
to
have
you
know
these
source
documents
and
kind
of
a
evidence-based
statement
for
the
supervisor
rondo
that
messed
up
his
name,
but
the
the
police
commissioner,
or
is
it
to
do
like?
Would
we
be
looking
to
do
like
a
specific
study
kind
of
based,
minneapolis
based
and
then
provide
some
evidence
or
something
like
that?.
B
I
mean
my
initial
thinking
is:
is
a
timeliness
concern
I
would
hate
to
have
a
sit
on
something
and
be
doing
research,
for
you
know
four
or
five
months
without
doing
anything
else,
and
then
you
know,
we've
had
you
know
a
repeat
of
last
summer.
You
know
worst
case
scenario
and
all
of
a
sudden
we
come
out
much
later
saying.
Like
oh
hey,
you
should
be
doing
this.
You
know
I
I
think
you
could
do
both
where
you
could
say
hey
look.
B
We
just
did
some
quick
research.
We
found
these
articles,
take
a
look
at
them
see
if
mpd
is
already
implementing
some
of
these
things
and
if
they
are,
it
would
be
really
good
to
know
about
that.
To
know
that
you're,
taking
this
sort
of
approach
to
making
sure
people
have
the
ability
to
safely
and
openly
express
their
right
to
protest,
and
you
know
you're
keeping
members
of
law
enforcement
accountable
when
they
don't
do
that.
B
C
Yeah,
no,
that's.
That's!
That's
awesome.
I
I
I
do
agree
with
that
is
like
this
is
a
practical
actionable
step.
Another
question
is,
if
it
like,
because
I
guess
it's
probably
not
guaranteed
to
get
a
response
yeah,
I
I
guess
my
question
would
be:
is
there
any
way
that
or
any
connection
we
would
have
to
where
it
would
garner
at
least
a
response
of?
Oh,
these
are
the
things
we're
doing
yeah
instead
of
it
being
ignored
or
something
like
that.
B
B
That
shows
that
when
we
have
something
to
say-
and
we
take
our
time
to
really
make
sure
it's
well
backed
in
evidence,
they
listen
and-
and
I
think
that
that's
the
reason
why
I
put
the
work
ahead
of
time
of
saying-
hey-
it's
not
just
jackson,
pino
saying
you
need
to
change
something.
It's
jackson,
pino
showing
you
what
people
with
phds
in
you
know,
criminal
justice
policy
are
saying
about
the
issue.
B
It's
the
department
of
justice,
evaluation
of
the
four
jurisdictions
of
law
enforcement
that
responded
to
the
the
ferguson
protests
back
in
2015
are
saying
on
the
subject
and
that,
in
my
mind,
has
a
certain
sort
of
weight
around
it
of
saying
hey.
This
is,
this
is
a
legitimate
proposal
as
well
as
one
of
just
saying
I
I
would
like
you
to
consider
this
sort
of
stuff
and
and
that
to
me
I
would
hope,
encourages
a
public
response.
B
Saying
hey.
Thank
you.
So
much
for
this
information
here
is
what
we're
doing
on
x,
y
and
z.
And
again,
that's
that's
a
hope.
I
haven't
seen
it
yet.
I
I
haven't
been
here
long
enough
to
see
the
stuff
that
has
worked,
but
you
know
I
I
would
like
to
you
know
at
least
give
it
a
try
and
see
what
type
of
response
we
get.
D
I
I
think
we
should
it's
a
it's
a
good
idea
and
I
think
we
should
try
and
I
mean
if
we
don't
get
a
response,
we
can
always
just
report
back
to
the
pcoc
main
committee.
Okay,
we
sent
this
letter
here.
It
is
for
the
record
we
haven't
gotten,
we
haven't
received
a
response
and
I'm
sure
there
will
be
future
letters
and
feature
situations
too.
D
F
F
You
know
like
I
guess,
whatever
method
it
like
thinks
is
gonna
be
the
most
effective
off
the
bat
like
the
two
that
I
see
just
as
far
as
like
looking
at
what's
been
done
in
the
past
is
the
kind
of
the
initial
version
that
came
out
that
your
piano
talked
about,
which
is
you
know,
here's
what's
out
there.
You
know
like
this
is
concerning
we,
you
know
and
basically
putting
that
up
just
kind
of
saying
here's,
our
stance
on
it.
F
We
want
to
make
sure
you've
seen
this
and
then
there's
the
secondary
version
of
that,
where
it's
more
of
a
you
know
a
deeper
dive
into
it.
Where
there's,
actually,
you
know
more
of
a
report
and
recommendations
where
it's
you
know
here
are
recommendations
and
like
in
that
line.
You
know
we've
had
like
the
body
camera
policy,
like
you
know,
like
research
that
had
the
recommendations
you
know
please
adopt
the
following
with
you,
most
of
which
I
think
were
eventually
adopted.
Domestic
violence
response.
So
we've
had,
I
mean,
there's
definitely
stuff
like
this.
F
That
has
happened
before
so
I
think
there's
those
kind
of
two
different
directions
you
can
go
and
obviously
I
think
the
deciding
factor
in
each
of
them
is
time.
So
if
there's
an
immediacy
concern,
you
can
do
the
one
route,
but
then,
if
it's
something,
that's
still
you
know
is
on
people's
minds
is
something
you
want
to
explore
more.
There
is
a
kind
of
deeper
research
and
study
route.
That
would
then
come
with
recommendations
and
that's
passed
along
to
them.
F
D
I
had
the
impression
from
previous
chair
chair
for
forza
that
there
tended
to
be
a
lot
of
recommendations
or
stuff
that
would
come
up
during
discussion
that
maybe
there
wasn't
a
response
on,
but
they
would
notice.
Mpd
would
adopt
later.
You
know
after
the
fact.
Maybe
they
wouldn't
get
a
formal
response,
but
they
noticed
that
a
policy
procedure
or
something
like
that
would
update
to
reflect
something
that
they
discussed.
B
If
either
of
you
want
to
dig
around
and
and
find
peer-reviewed
research
that
you
know
is
of
this
similar
scope
and
I
can
throw
something
together.
I
can
send
it
in
email
form
to
the
two
of
you
and
we
will
not
only
submit
that
draft
in
next
meeting
for
us,
but
if
it
is
approved,
we
will
submit
it
for
review
to
the
commission
at
large.
It
will
be
part
of
my
report
out
at
the
next
meeting.
B
So
that
way
we
can
hopefully
get
it,
get
the
whole
commission
to
just
look
at
it
have
their
thoughts
and
opinions.
If
everybody's
okay
with
it,
then
we
can
sign
off
on
it
and
send
it
out
as
a
public
letter.
If
it
needs
review,
we
can
come
back
here
and
we
can
have
another
discussion
about
what
needs
to
be
fixed.
Is
that
one
clear
and
two?
D
I
think
it's
clear
and
if
you,
if
you
have
a
draft
like,
if
you
send
me
a
draft
I'd,
be
more
than
happy
to
take
a
look
at
it,
I
like
to
think
I'm
pretty
pretty
good
at
distilling
that
information
down
it's
something.
That's
digestible,
the
chief
is
a
busy
person
and
the
staff
are
are
also
busy
people,
but
if
we
can
get
them
something
that
grabs
their
attention
and
is
digestible
in
just
a
few
seconds,
we
probably
have
a
better
likelihood
of
or
the
best
likelihood
we
have
of
them.
A
B
Great
then
I
I'm
gonna
direct
myself
to
do
that.
One
procedural
question
for
the
clerk,
since
I
am
writing
something
not
in
the
public
light
I
would
like
to
have
it
submitted.
Is
it
possible
to
retroactively,
submit
a
draft
document
that
I
haven't
written
yet
to
this
meeting
or
what
we
have
to
wait
until
next
meeting.