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From YouTube: City Council Work Session, Golf Cart Ordinance, 2/28/23
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B
B
C
Her
Father
in
heaven
give
us
the
power
to
clearly
discern
right
from
wrong,
allow
our
words
and
actions
to
be
governed,
thereby
and
by
the
laws
of
this
land.
We
ask
for
your
inspiration
to
strive
in
our
endeavors
to
serve
the
public.
We
also
ask
that
you
direct
us
so
that
Above
All
Things
We
Will
discharge
our
duties
for
the
benefit
of
the
people
we
serve
this.
We
pray,
amen.
D
C
B
Thank
you,
Tom
welcome
everyone
next
item
on
our
agenda
is
the
oldsmeyer
public,
open,
Forum,
I,
don't
think
there's
anybody
here,
so
I'm
going
to
close
the
oldsmeyer
public
open
forum
and
our
next
item
on
the
agenda
is
item.
One
is
review.
The
golf
cart
ordinance.
The
sheriff's
department
just
gave
us
this
little
golf
cart,
low-speed
vehicle
chart
for
us
and
we're
going
to
open
this
up
for
discussion.
Does
anybody
wish
to
make
any
changes
or
make
any
updates
to
the
current
the
current
any
changes
anybody
have?
E
Man
yeah,
this
came
back
to
us.
Tom
brought
the
ordinance
to
us.
There
were
some
challenges
to
that
ordinance
or
some
concerns.
I
should
say
not
challenges
and
we
were
trying
to
figure
out
a
way
to
make
sure
within
the
bounds
of
state
law.
When
we're
writing
this
this
ordinance,
but
also
you
know
what
do
we
want
to
do?
Do
we
want
to
open
this
up
to
14
year
olds
per
state
law?
E
Do
we
want
to
not
do
we
want
to
keep
it
I
think
we
just
got
to
have
a
discussion
about
what
do
we
want,
but
the
challenge
that
I
had
when
I
started
going
through
this?
Was
we
really
don't
have
golf
carts
right?
We
have
golf
carts.
There
are
some
golf
carts.
There
are
some
identified
as
low
speed
Vehicles,
as
the
sheriff
has
presented
us
this
information
today
and
really,
what
do
we
want?
The
future
of
Oldsmar
to
have
inside
of
it?
E
For
instance,
Safety
Harbor
did
a
lot
of
golf
carts
but
low
speed
Vehicles,
which
is
what
you
see
throughout
Safety
Harbor
they're,
all
tagged,
titled,
insured
everything
else,
I,
don't
know
where
we
want
to
go.
I'm
not
trying
to
get
rid
of
golf
carts
I
just
want
to
make
sure
that
we're
putting
this
in
the
right
direction
that
we
don't
have
to
revisit
this
for
the
next
10
years.
Just
get
it
done
anything.
F
Well,
the
one
thing
that
I
believe
and
he's
not
here
to
speak
and
I'm
not
going
to
try
to
put
words
in
his
mouth,
but
council
member
grab
identified
with
some
of
the
language
about
as
it
relates
to
golf
carts
and
and
trying
to
make
any
changes
based
on
how
it's
currently
written
and
the
way
our
ordinance
reads
right
now,
and
it
might
just
be
semantics
or
how
you
look
at
whether
it's
if
you
say
something,
is
lawful
versus
if
it's
unlawful
but
the
one
part
in
the
state
statute,
where
it
says
any
any
more.
F
But
then
kind
of
at
the
earlier
part
of
that
it
says
it
can
be
operated
on
any
road
that
the
municipality
designates
right.
So
we're
designated
essentially
where
we
can't
use
it.
So
I
don't
know
if
there's
any
issues
around
that,
as
as
far
as
designating
where
it
can
be
done
versus
where
it
can't
and
again
it's
just
like.
Do
you
look
at
it
from
what's
allowed?
F
What's
a
Pro
versus
a
con,
you
know
antonyms
of
each
other,
so
I
I,
remember
where
some
of
the
discussion
went
before
as
far
as
trying
to
do
what
we
felt
would
be
the
safest
option,
as
it
relates
to
golf
carts,
because
I
think
it's
pretty
cut
and
dry
as
it
relates
to
low-speed
vehicles
and
what
the
restrictions
are
there,
which
I
think
are
more
stringent
from
a
insurance
perspective,
licensing
perspective.
All
that
I
think
the
the
risk
is
where
golf
cart
usage
is
permitted.
F
B
G
You
mayor
vice
mayor
and
council
member
nav,
have
essentially
covered
the
the
discussion
items.
Vice
mayor
brought
up
the
low
speed
vehicle
versus
golf
cart.
I
was
curious
as
to
our
city
attorney's
opinion
as
to
letting
state
law
govern
the
use
of
low-speed
vehicles
in
Oldsmar
and
just
keeping
golf
carts
in
our
ordinances,
as
opposed
to
trying
to
do
both
I,
don't
know
the
pros
and
cons
one
way
or
the
other.
G
Then,
as
council
member
Knapp
mentioned
the
the
issue
of
where
you
can't
drive
them
versus
where
you
can
and
the
age
restriction
and
I,
it
doesn't
necessarily
bear
repeating,
but
the
whole
golf
cart
may
not
be
operated
on
public
roads
or
streets
by
any
person
under
the
age
of
14
is
what
the
statute
says
and
then
our
code
says
be
in
possession
of
a
valid
driver's
license.
So
I
I
just
wanted
to
get
some
some
clarity.
I
know,
residents
were
looking
for
clarity,
so
I'm
open
to
discussion
about
all
these.
B
Thank
you
all
for
all
that
discussion.
All
I
can
say
is
I,
don't
want
to
lose
golf
carts
in
the
city
of
Oldsmar
I
know
a
lot
of
residents
have
been
questioning
me
on
this,
and
they
all
want
to
keep
them.
I
agree
with
councilman
Knapp
about
where
they
can
drive.
I
get
crazy
texts
that
people
are
crossing
Tampa
Road,
and
they
want
me
to
fix
that
and
I'm
explaining
them.
That's
a
state
road.
It's
never
going
to
be
allowed
for
a
golf
cart
or
a
golf
cart,
yeah.
B
C
Sure,
first
of
all,
I
think
it's
on
the
ordinance
that
we
have
doesn't
regulate
low
speed,
Vehicles.
It
only
regulates
golf
carts
and
we
know
that
because
in
section
66-100
it
defines
a
golf
cart
and
that
defines
a
golf
cart
based
upon
what
the
state
statute
is
and
the
state
statute
says.
C
A
golf
cart
means
a
motor
vehicle
that
is
designed
and
manufactured
for
operation
on
a
golf
course
for
sporting
or
recreational
purposes
in
recreational
purposes,
and
that
is
not
capable
of
exceeding
speeds
of
20
miles
per
hour.
So
this
only
deals
with
golf
carts,
so
low
speed.
Vehicles
is
really
kind
of
a
side
consideration.
C
Golf
carts
do
not
require
a
driver's
license
under
the
statute,
so
I
would
suggest
making
a
couple
of
changes
to
the
ordinances
that
it
currently
exists,
and
that
would
be
in
section
66-100
I
I
am
suggesting
that
we
delete
a
few
words
and
those
words
would
be
holding
in
in
possession
of
a
valid
driver's
license.
So
the
first
paragraph
would
read:
it
shall
be
lawful
for
a
person
to
operate
a
golf
cart
as
defined,
and
then
it
goes
on
so
we're
just
taking
out
the
reference
to
valid
driver's
license
there.
C
Why
are
we
taking
it
out?
There
is
a
state
statute
that
specifically
provides
now
that
a
driver's
license
is
not
necessary.
It's
Exempted
and
that
exemption
is
under
Florida
statute
322.04.
It
says
the
following:
persons
are
exempt
from
obtaining
a
driver's
license
and
subparagraph
East,
as
any
person
operating
a
golf
cart,
is
defined
in
section
320.01,
which
is
operated
in
accordance
with
the
provisions
of
316
212..
Those
are
the
those
are
some
of
the
statutes
that
you've
got
in
your
pocket.
C
The
attorney
general
has
opined
on
registration
of
golf
carts,
and
the
Attorney
General
suggests
that
it
just
being
a
voluntary
basis
and
not
mandatory
so
I'm,
suggesting
that
we
reword
that
paragraph
to
reflect
that
as
well.
But
those
would
be
the
only
changes
that
I
would
suggest
that
are
needed
to
to
bring
it
in
compliance
with
the
state
statutes
that
have
been
talked
about
in
these
last
couple
of
meetings.
The
way
that
would
be
handled,
of
course,
would
be
for
me
to
draft
that
ordinance
and
bring
it
back
for
your
consideration.
C
G
C
G
Okay,
so
I
I,
wanna,
run
and
I
know
this
is
Elementary,
but
this
is
a
question.
I've
been
asked,
let's
say:
I'm
14
years
old,
I'm
driving
down
the
road
I
think
I'm
in
a
golf
cart.
I
am
not
in
a
golf
cart.
I
am
in
a
low
speed
vehicle
I
get
pulled
over
by
the
sheriff's
office,
because
I
I
don't
know,
went
through
a
stop
sign.
C
G
G
G
C
C
I
need
to
understand
as
to
the
safety
requirements
for
a
golf
cart
versus
the
safety
requirements
for
a
low-speed
vehicle.
Okay,
when
you
look
at
golf
carts
and
our
our
code,
provision
hits
them
all.
It's
almost
words
for
word
so
for
a
golf
cart.
They
have
to
have
safe
tires,
a
rear
view,
mirror
a
red,
reflectorized
warning
device
on
the
front
and
back
of
the
golf
cart,
and
if
you
are
a
golf
cart
that
operates
between
sunset
and
sunrise,
you
have
to
have
headlights,
brake
lights,
turn
signals
and
a
windshield.
C
It
says
it
has
to
be
equipped
with
headlamps.
Stop
lamps
turn
signal
lamps,
tail
lamps
reflex,
reflectors
parking
brakes,
rear
view,
mirrors,
windshields,
seat
belts,
which
is
an
important
one
and
vehicle
identification
numbers
okay.
So
there
are
a
few
more
safety
equipment
requirements
for
a
low
speed
vehicle
I
think
it's
probably
because
of
the
fact
that
it's
faster
so.
G
F
B
E
D
E
D
E
Well,
you
can,
you
can
say,
we'll
only
allow
low
speed
vehicles,
but
that
opens
up
St
Pete
drive
that
opens
up
Forest
Lakes,
all
the
way
up
to
the
North
End
of
the
Walmart
parking
lot.
Yeah
I,
don't
remember
the
name
of
that
road.
It
opens
up
Pine
crossing
the
crossing
tampa
road
at
Pine.
It
opens
up
a
lot
more
for
that
person.
If
they
do
convert
right,
you
don't
have
to
convert.
E
E
You
got
to
be
15
to
drive
it
I,
don't
want
to
get
rid
of
golf
carts,
I
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
residents
that
have
these
and
I
don't
want
to
impact
the
residents,
but
I
think
there's
looking
towards
the
future
of
five
years
down
the
road.
Maybe
you
only
go
low
speed
vehicle
at
that
point
in
time.
Maybe
I,
don't
know,
I,
don't
know
what
the
answer
is.
E
E
B
G
C
C
It
we
cannot
draft
a
ordinance
that
talks
about
age
right.
You
know,
you
know
if
we
wanted
to
make
it
more
restrictive
change
it
from
14
to
15
or
16
or
17,
or
whatever
we're
absolutely
prohibited
from
doing
that,
got.
F
F
C
C
I
found
a
an
attorney
general
opinion
that
talks
about
you
know.
What
does
that
mean
when
you
say
ordinances
refer
to
in
this
section,
most
applied
only
to
an
unlicensed
driver
and
the
legislative
legislative
intent
review
by
the
ago
said.
C
C
As
noted
in
section
316.212,
Florida
Statutes
generally
prohibits
the
operational
golf
Parts
on
public
roads
and
streets
of
the
state,
but
specifically
authorized
as
municipalities
designate
certain
roads
for
use
by
golf
carts.
A
municipality
May
enact
an
ordinance
relating
to
golf
court
operation
equipment
which
is
more
restrictive
than
those
enumerated
in
316
to
212,
but
it
may
apply
only
to
an
unlicensed
driver
and
the
Attorney
General
is
saying
you
request.
Clarification
of
the
term
must
apply
to
an
unlicensed
driver.
This
language
was
added
to
section
316.
C
212
Florida
statute
was
amended
during
the
2005
legislative
session,
as
initially
proposed.
House
Bill
1697
contained
language
that
authorized
local
governments
to
enact
more
respective
golf
cart,
equipment
and
Opera
operation.
Regulations
in
the
state
law
provides
the
language
limiting
such
ordinance
to
an
unlicensed
driver
was
by
Amendment
on
the
senate
floor
without
discussion.
There
is
no
readily
discernible
legislative
history
indicating
any
intent
behind
adding
such
a
restriction
other
than
the
plain
language
of
the
statute
so
even
ago
doesn't
know
what
that
means.
C
So
I
wouldn't
try
to
figure
out
how
much
more
we
can
restrict
the
use
of
the
golf
carts
because,
right
unless
what
we
did
was,
we
have
prepared
an
ordinance
and
we
had
sent
it
to
the
ago
and
said
the
city
council
of
the
city
of
Oldsmar
wants
to
know.
In
your
opinion
whether
or
not
this
more
restrictive
requirement
is
authorized
under
State
Statute
to
get
an
ago
to
either
support
us
or
tell
us.
No,
we
can't
do
that.
That's
another
option
ago.
D
C
B
F
B
F
C
D
C
D
C
Because
remember
that
state
statute
322.04
specifically
says
that
golf
carts,
any
person
operating
a
golf
cart,
is
not
required
to
have
a
driver's
license.
So
there's
no
question
on
that:
it's
it's.
F
I,
sorry
to
interject
that'd
be
the
only
thing
would
be
it's
like
if
you're
not
focusing
on
age,
if
you
had
something
that
says
unlicensed
drivers,
even
though
we
know
because
it's
like
the
language
is
in
there
right
says,
you
can
make
something
more
restrictive
as
it
relates
to
an
unlicensed
driver.
So
if
they
are
unlicensed,
there
are
restrictions
in
place.
F
What
that
is
as
far
as
all
only
these
streets
only
these
times,
anything
like
that
would
be
more
restrictive
to
a
unlicensed
driver.
If
it's
focused
using
that
language
from
State
Statute,
essentially
right,
that's
the
only
opening,
because
we
know
it
can't
be
based
on
age
or
saying
driver's
license.
C
Maybe
it's
you
know
eyesight,
maybe
it's
you
know,
you
don't
have
the
correct
if
you
don't,
if
you're
a
hearing
impaired
person
that
you
want
to
restrict
that
person,
maybe
maybe
it's
Vision
I
mean
I
mean
there
are
other
things.
I.
Think
I
really
haven't
spent
a
whole
lot
of
time
on
that.
But
but
what's
the
goal,
I
guess
figure
out
what
the
goal
is
and
then
let's
just
figure
out
backwards,
how
we
can
get
to
that
point.
Whatever
that
point
is.
E
F
E
D
C
D
C
B
G
Agree
with
the
stated
goals
that
vice
mayor
said,
I
think
in
a
way
it
sounds
like
it's
a
little
bit
of
a
public
awareness
campaign
of
the
fact
that,
like
you,
may
have
a
low-speed
vehicle
and
your
14
year
old
cannot
drive
it.
If
it
is,
you
could
be
cited
for
it
and
you
need
to
have
insurance
and
a
tag
on
it
and
congratulations.
You
don't
have
to
abide
by
the
golf.
G
You
know
the
golf
cart
ordinances
right,
but
but
I
mean
that
that
is
my
big
concern.
People
think
that
they
have
a
golf
cart
and
they're
driving
it
around
thinking.
I'm
allowed
to
have
a
golf
cart
I'm.
My
kid
can
drive
it
they're
14,
when
what
they
actually
have
is
a
low
speed
vehicle
that
needs
to
be
insured.
They
need
a
licensed
driver
and
they
need
to
have
insurance
and.
G
That's
my
concern,
I
guess
when,
when
you
said
what's
the
goal
that
would
be
my
goal
is
to
make
sure
people
know
the
intent
of
the
golf
cart
ordinances
for
the
city
of
Oldsmar
versus
what
do
you
have
in
your
garage?
And
what
do
you
think
you're
allowed
to
do
with
it?
Because
you
might
be
misunderstanding
because
honestly,
I
was
misunderstanding.
Some
of
the
restrictions
between
low-speed
vehicles
and
golfers
I
mean
the
Sheriff's
Office
fire.
D
G
You
know
an
incorrect
statement
on
golf
cart.
Operators
must
possess
a
valid
driver's
license
pursuant
to
the
statute
that
that
you
just
read,
is
Exempted
now
so
in
any
event,
I'm
in
agreement
with
the
recommendations
of
council
to
amend
our
ordinance
but
I
do
think.
There's
still
a
concern
about
the
low
speed
vehicles.
I,
don't
know,
I,
don't
know
what
to
do
with
it.
I
don't
know
if
that's
something
we
can
talk
about
at
a
later
date
or
how
we
can
address
that,
but
I
think
we
all
share
that
concern.
Excellent.
F
I
have
I
have
a
question
sure
in
that
is
General
to
the
the
statute,
and
this
is
for
the
city
manager.
The
last
section
in
last
sentence.
Excuse
me
in
section
one
States,
Upon
A
determination
that
golf
carts
may
be
safely
operated
on
a
designated
Road
or
Street.
The
responsible
governmental
entity
shall
post
appropriate
signs
to
indicate
that
such
operation
is
allowed.
We
don't
have
any
such
signage
anywhere,
that's
designated.
What,
where
it
is
or
isn't
allowed
is
sent
correct.
A
I
believe
we
have
signs
that
that
that
indicate
the
limits
of
of
where
the
allowable
usage,
yeah,
okay,.
G
E
Right
vice
mayor
I
just
really
have
a
question
about
process.
Are
we
still
working
under
the
authorization
to
write
the
ordinance
that
we
authorized
Tom
to
do
or
do
we
have
to
reauthorize
and
then
go
to
two
public
hearings
so.
C
There's
nothing
under
your
code
or
your
policies
and
procedures
that
require
you
to
review
it
and
then
authorize
the
City
attorney.
It's
just
a
practice
that
that
we've
had
here
at
the
city
council.
So
whatever
is
your
pleasure,
if
you
would
like
to
put
it
on
the
agenda
for
seeking
authorization
to
have
the
City
attorney,
do
it
and
then
the
two
public
hearings
after
that?
In
other
words,
it's
here
three
times
you
know
that's
up
to
you.
B
C
No,
the
this,
this
change
would
only
correct
a
situation
where
the
person
could
be
cited,
and
so
it
basically
is
an
unenforceable
provision
in
the
code.
It
is
so
you
know
if
if
someone
was
pulled
over
and
they
were
age
14
and
our
code
says
16
and
they
went
to
County
Court
under
the
citation
that
all
the
defense
attorney
would
have
to
do
is
to
say
hey.
His
only
has
to
be
14
under
the
statute,
and
then
the
citation
would
be
dismissed.
C
G
D
H
H
B
B
Ann
is
the
one
who
started
this
and
what
happened
was
I
got
an
email
saying
that,
as
of
10-6
to
I,
believe
it's
four
four
twenty
three
I
only
have
593.19
left
on
my
budget
for
my
travel
expenses
for
the
the
year.
Also
I
want
to
just
bring
up
that
in
2015.
Mayor
Beavis
is
the
one
that
put
me
on
the
FLC,
the
Florida
Florida
League
of
cities
advocate
for
the
sun,
close
League
of
cities,
and
then
mayor
Seidel
put
me
on
the
PSTA
board,
which
really
there's
no
expenses
for
that.
B
But
a
lot
of
this
is
because
of
our
CRA
expenses
and
I.
Believe
you
guys
have
a
copy
of
that.
I
come
and
sent
that,
but
anybody
else
want
to
bring
up
any
other
expenses.
I
know
Jared.
You
mentioned
something
about
shirts
and
local
travel
vice
mayor.
Do
you
want
to
start
out
then,
with
that
or
I
mean.
E
E
E
So
while
I
understand
the
need,
I
want
to
make
sure
that
you
know
we're
smart
about
this
moving
forward,
but
I
think
there's
also
been
a
dynamic
shift
in
the
makeup
of
the
council,
because
when
I
look
through
this
and
I'm
trying
to
say
this
in
the
right
way,
but
Dan
you're
the
only
guy
up
here
without
kids
and
and
real
right
in
a
full-time
job,
so
we're
not
looking
to
do
an
exterior
travel
or
additional
travel,
or
at
least
I'm,
not
I
should
say
you
guys
are.
E
But
if
there's
an
education
opportunity,
you
know
I'm
going
to
the
mpo
course
for
Ford
Pinellas
in
April,
but
that's
not
City
expense.
That's
him!
That's
for
Pinellas,
but
anytime.
There's
an
area
for
opportunity.
That's
going
to
benefit
the
city!
Yes,
we
should
do
it,
but
how
do
we
get
smart
about
it
because
I'm,
seeing
globally
the.
E
E
G
I
think
vice
mayor
Buckman
brings
up
a
good
point.
How
do
we?
How
do
we
get
smart
about
this?
How
do
we
deal
with
this
and
to
me,
our
city
clerk,
put
some
helpful
questions
on
the
agenda
item
originally
from
December
6
2022.
G
G
Are
there
other
expenses
which
should
be
considered
that
are
not
currently
reimbursed,
so
my
inquiry,
of
course,
because
I
am
who
I
am
led
me
back
to
the
Charter,
so
our
Charter
makes
very
clear
in
section
3.04,
salary
and
expenses.
Members
of
the
council
shall
also
receive
their
actual
and
necessary
expenses
incurred
in
the
performance
of
their
duties
of
office.
G
G
I
mean
I,
it's
hard
for
me
to
say
this
out
loud
I'm,
a
bit
of
a
conservative
person
when
it
comes
to
construction
of
the
language
in
our
Charter.
So
for
me,
when
I
see
actual
and
necessary
expenses
for
the
performance
of
their
duties
of
office.
Well,
our
Duties
are
too
under
3.01.
Adopt
resolutions,
appoint
Charter
officials,
exercise
the
powers
here
and
after
provided,
and
we
shall
review,
amend
if
necessary
and
approve
the
budget
and
appropriate
all
monies
to
the
city.
G
G
We
as
council
members,
are
very
privileged
to
be
asked
to
join
certain
boards
participate
in
certain
activities
like
leadership
Pinellas,
for
which
I'm
a
board
member
forward
Pinellas,
for
which
vice
mayor
and
I
are
I'm
you're
on
the
forward.
Pinellas
I
don't
want
to
misstate
it.
G
One
is
your
I'm
on
the
school
transportation,
Safety
Committee
you're
on
the
board,
the
actual
board,
so
you're
on
the
actual
board,
Mayors
on
the
PSTA
and
Florida
League
of
cities
board
and
the
Suncoast
League
of
cities
board
I'm,
not
sure
of
everybody's
different
things,
but
we
are
privileged
to
be
able
to
participate
in
in
those
things.
G
In
my
opinion,
under
a
strict
reading
of
our
Charter
are
those
things
actual
and
necessary
expenses
incurred
in
the
performance
of
the
duties
of
office,
as
outlined
in
our
Charter.
No,
however,
I
recognize
that
it
has
been
customary
for
council
members
to
and
the
mayor
of
course,
to
attends
certain
educational
opportunities
that
make
us
better
at
what
we
do
here
in
Oldsmar.
As
you
mentioned
drinking
from
a
fire
hose
right,
emo
great
opportunity
to
learn
and
to
be
better
at
what
we're
doing
up
here.
G
There
are
certain
limitations
to
what
I
think
is
educational
and
necessary
when
it
comes
to
the
scope
of
activities
and
committee
appointments
and
things
offered
by
the
Florida
League
of
cities.
I
recognize
that
they
offer
a
lot
of
different
opportunities.
I
know
mayor
you've
taken
advantage
of
and
benefited
from
many
of
those
things.
G
While
the
legislative
committee
is
important,
we
don't
necessarily
benefit
directly
here
in
Oldsmar
from
those
activities.
The
benefit
for
us
has
come
directly
from
the
60
Grand.
We
pay
a
year
out
of
this
same
budget
to
our
lobbyist
in
Tallahassee,
for
things
that
are
very
specific
to
the
city
of
Oldsmar
and
not
just
general
legislative
policy
for
home
rule
again.
G
I
recognize
that's
extremely
important,
but
when
it
comes
down
to
it,
okay,
council,
members
mayor,
if
you
want
to
take
those
educational
opportunities
great
if
you
want
to
be
involved
in
these
things,
great
here's
your
allotment
of
money
with
which
to
do
that
and
I
think
it's
incumbent
upon
each
of
us,
just
as
we've
asked
charitable
organizations
to
decide
ahead
of
time
and
submit
ahead
of
time.
What
is
it
that
you
want
to
use
your
budget
for
in
the
coming
year?
Do
you
want
to
go
to
the
Florida
Legal
City's
annual
conference?
G
G
And
hopefully
you
know
you
can
articulate
what
benefit
comes
back
to
the
city
of
Oldsmar
for
participation
in
those
events,
I,
of
course,
did
math
problems
based
on
the
spreadsheets
that
were
provided
by
our
finance
department
and
just
so
that
the
Public's
aware
we
were
provided
a
summary
of
city
council
travel
and
education
expenditures
for
fiscal
years,
1920.,
20
and
2021
21,
2022
and
2022
to
2023
to
date,
keeping
in
mind
that
our
fiscal
year
begins
10,
1
2022,
so
there's
not
a
whole
lot.
Maybe
you
know
six
months
of
information
here.
G
My
understanding
and
somebody
please
stop
me
if
I'm
wrong,
but
my
understanding
is
that
we
began
keeping
this
spreadsheet
dividing
out
by
council,
member
and
mayor
everyone's
expenses
so
that
we
could
see
where
the
money
was
being
spent
on
what
beginning
in
2019,
when
mayor
Seidel
suggested
this
I
actually
requested
this
data
I
actually
was
hoping
to
obtain
data
for
further
back,
but
I
was
unaware
that
it
only
went
back
to
2019.
G
But
when
you
look
at
this
data,
it's
undeniable
and
very
clear
that
mayor
you've
spent
approximately
10
605
dollars
on
these
various
activities:
legislative
conferences
for
the
Florida
League
of
cities,
the
Florida
Florida
League
cities,
annual
conference,
the
policies,
the
different
Community
committees,
the
CRA
conference-
and
you
know
next
closest-
would
be
council
member
Knapp
who
of
the
folks
who
are
currently
sitting
up
here
at
6691.
But
his
includes
thirty
two
hundred
dollars
for
leadership,
Pinellas,
which
I
know
mayor.
You
participated
in
prior
to
the.
G
I'm
at
4812,
which
again
includes
twenty
seven
hundred
fifty
dollars
for
leadership,
Pinellas,
which,
if
you
deduct
that
then
Andrew's
at
3,
400
and
I'm
at
2
000.,
so
the
last
four
years
you
know
being
at
ten
thousand
six
hundred
and
five
dollars.
I
think
is
just
a
clear
question
of
budgeting.
I
think
it's
deciding
in
advance
what
you
want
to
go
to
and
when
I
don't
think
an
answer
to
Anne's
questions.
I,
don't
think
council
members
should
be
reimbursed
for
day
trips.
G
F
Looking
at
this
overall
and
kind
of
the
same
thought
process
of
looking
at
the
charter
kind
of
falling
in
line
with
what
council
member
Gannon
just
stated
as
far
as
the
actual
necessary
expenses,
you
know,
that's
the
black
and
white
reading
there
I
think
what
it
comes
down
to
again
is
there
is,
is
a
fair
assumption
that
there
is
value
in
all
these
types
of
activities
that
are
going
on
amongst
all
of
us
right,
I
think
the
one
that
is
probably
easiest
to
agree
upon
that
provides
the
most
impact
or
potential
impact
to
this
Council,
and
therefore
our
residents
as
well
is
the
opportunities
for
Education
and
Training.
F
F
That's
that's!
What's
going
to
allow
us
to
function
and
operate
as
a
body
as
efficiently
as
possible
as
it
relates
to
emo
and
then
also
you
know,
there's
the
FLC
conference
that
in
and
of
itself
you
just
say:
oh
it's
a
conference,
anybody
hears
that
think.
Oh
well,
everybody's
just
going
and
networking
whatnot,
as
we
all
know
for
being
there.
It's
like
there
is
a
substantial
amount
of
wealth
of
information
that
can
be
learned
by
all
those
different
sessions
at
the
conference.
F
If,
if
one
participates
in
said
sessions,
so
I,
that's
kind
of
where
I
stand
is
that's.
Where
I
see
the
most
value,
I'm
not
opposed
to
consideration
for
other
things.
As
long
as
as
we
plan
for
it
now
granted,
it
is
hard
to
kind
of
know
what
all
is
out
on
the
calendar,
especially
for
things
such
as
emo
Where.
The
dates
may
only
be
so
far
out
and
may
not
extend
far
enough
out
into
the
following
fiscal
year
when
we're
trying
to
budget
right.
F
So,
but
you
know
it's
probably
going
to
happen
to
where
you
may
not
know
the
exact
date,
but
you
know
it's
likely
to
be
offered
during
this
fiscal
year.
Therefore,
I
want
to
stake
out
some
amount
of
funds
for
said
activity,
so
I
think
really
it
comes
down
to
looking
at
what
we
want
to
do
being
more
being
a
bit
more
smart
about.
What
do
we
want
to
spend
money
on?
F
Let's,
let's
support
what
we're
going
to
do
instead
of
just
carving
out
whole
thousand
dollar
number
increments,
where
we
can,
we
can
be
a
little
bit
more
refined
and
sharpen
our
pencils
to
not
just
say
well
in
granted.
If
we
don't
spend
the
money,
then
you
know
we
make
a
budget
revision
and
it
gets
fixed
that
way
through
the
accounting
process,
but.
F
F
That
aside,
is
we
we
can
certainly
put
in
our
effort
to
budget
what
we're
responsible
for
ultimately
and
that's
kind
of
where
I
think
we're.
We
would
put
the
onus
on
us
a
little
bit
to
say
here's
what
what
we
expect
to
expend
justify
it
rank
it
accordingly,
and
if
we
have
to
prioritize
and
say
well,
you
know
this
might
be
a
little
excessive
and
kind
of
take
it
from
there
all
right.
We
obviously
would
have
to
do
that
in
a
public
meeting
to
do
it
all
in
advance,
possibly
of
the
the
main
budget
session.
F
E
I,
the
only
thing
I
would
say
is:
there's
a
value
of
visibility
right.
You
know
we're
not
the
biggest
city
in
the
state
for
this
and
going
some
of
things
like
the
Florida
League
of
cities.
E
The
conference
I
have
not
been,
but
my
question
is
I'm
I'm,
assuming
based
on
this
number
here,
it's
about
550
per
person
to
go
to
the
Florida
Legal
cities
conference
just
for
the
the
course
itself
and
then
another
is
that
where
a
condensed
version
of
emo
I
haven't
been
yet
so
I
don't
know,
but
is
that
a
course
that
that's
our
one
time
per
year
or
do
we
carve
that
out
just
throwing
ideas
out
so,
okay.
B
B
D
B
Member
Norris
went
to
Washington,
DC
and
I,
don't
know
if
you
guys
are
on
council
at
that
at
that
time,
but
Anne
was
upset
that
she
spent
this
exuberant
amount
of
money
to
go
to
Washington
DC
to
see
President
Obama,
and
it
was
a.
It
was
the
first
time
that
the
expenses
of
a
council
council
person
was
brought
up
that
it
was
expensive
to
do
that.
She.
A
B
B
B
So
all
these
this
history
data
that
the
I'm
really
appreciative
of
the
of
the
City
staff.
To
put
these
these
expense
reports
together,
I
I
think
this
is
wonderful,
because
it
shows
that
the
education
is
so
important
for
us
here
as
council
members,
it's
so
important
that
I
went
to
all
these
things
and
I'm
going
to
give
you
a
perfect
example.
This
year,
I
attended
the
CRA
101
class
called
police
on
the
phone.
It's
eight
o'clock
at
night.
What's
our
vision?
B
B
Don't
have
one
so
there's
a
perfect
example
right
there
that
that
education
from
the
Redevelopment
agency
from
the
Florida
League
of
cities
helped
us
because
I
hear
oh
20
years,
20
years
we've
been
working
on
downtown.
We
never
had
a
vision.
We
never
had
a
mission
statement,
so
that
is
a
that.
Is
that
right
there
in
itself
the
education
that
that
that
particular
expense,
whether
you
call
it
the
people's
money,
whatever
you
want
to
call
it,
but
that
was
needed
for
us.
It
took
us
to
the
right
direction.
B
B
B
2018.
so
the
and
then
the
the
conference,
the
Florida
Redevelopment,
the
Redevelopment
conference
that
I
went
to
in
Daytona,
Beach
I
noticed
Paula
was
on
here,
but
she
didn't
even
go.
She
couldn't
go
and
that's
fine,
it's
on
there,
but
I
paid
the
75,
but
that
was
also
important
because
I
learned
about
the
the
the
hurricane
the
hurricane
came
through
Daytona
Beach
and
South
Daytona
Beach
was
completely
devastated
from
that
from
that
hurricane
still
flooded.
B
B
I
did
mention
this
to
Ann
and
to
Felicia
that
Friday
we
had
a
meeting
for
the
Suncoast
League
of
cities
and
I
explained
to
them
that
there's
some
expenses
that
are
due
and
the
City
would
like
to
know
if
there
would
be
any
type
of
reimbursement
from
the
Suncoast
League
of
cities,
and
they
did
agree
that
they
would
pay
for
some
of
my
expenses.
So
that's
been
approved.
That
was
voted
on
by
the
board.
B
It
was
unanimously
approved
by
the
sun
called
Sega
cities,
so
that
isn't
going
to
be
off
the
table
now
for
any
expenses
for
the
future
or
the
remainder
of
the
year
I.
Don't
when
I
go
to
these
things,
I
am
like
the
council
member
vice
mayor
just
said:
I
don't
have
any
kids.
This
is
a
full-time
job.
For
me
as
mayor
I
love
being
mayor
of
the
city,
this
is
what
I
do
I
want
to
do.
This
I
want
to
educate
myself.
I
want
to
learn.
B
I
want
to
keep
going,
I
want,
what's
best
for
the
city
of
of
Oldsmar
I'm,
not
going
here
to
play,
games
and
party
I'm
here
to
work
and
I
just
want
you
all
to
know
that
I'm
committed
to
this
city,
so
whether
it's
another
500
or
300
hours
I
wanted
to
get
this
all
on
the
table
right
now.
This
is
where
I
am,
and
this
is
where
I'm
at
it
I
don't
want
to
stop.
B
I
have
two
other
classes
that
I
want
to
attend
for
the
Florida
Redevelopment
agency,
they're
about
building
the
downtown
or
downtown
and
there's
there's
two
other
classes.
I
want
to
attend,
I'm,
not
interested
in
getting
my
certification,
because
Felicia
has
brought
that
up.
I'm,
not
interested
in
that
I'm
interested
in
attending
educational
classes
that
are
going
to
help
this
city
and
other
than
that
I'm
going
to
open
it
up
to
anybody
has
any
questions
for
me
and
I.
Think
council,
member
Gannon,
you
have
questions
yeah.
G
Just
a
couple
of
thoughts
vice
mayor
I
would
encourage
you
to
attend
the
Florida
League
of
cities
conference
if
you're
able
and
it
works
for
you
and
make
your
own
judgment
about
what
you
feel
the
educational
value
is
to
you
personally.
D
G
Mayor
I,
don't
debate
that
you
find
educational
value
in
these
things
that
you're
attending.
That's,
not
what
I'm,
saying
and
I
think
that
we
could
go
back
and
forth
as
to
what
each
of
us
thinks
is
of
benefit
to
the
city
of
Oldsmar.
What
I
am
saying,
though,
is
we
ask
our
staff
to
stick
by
their
budget
I
think
it's
only
fair
that
we
do
the
same
exact
thing.
I
understand
that
education
is
important.
G
You
know,
and
a
lot
of
this
information
can
be
learned
in
other
ways
that
don't
involve
travel,
that
don't
involve
you
know,
driving
across
the
state
or
flying
to
Fort
Lauderdale
I'm,
just
pointing
out
that
the
numbers
are
there.
I
understand
you
have
a
quest
to
become
more
educated
and
to
to
serve
the
people.
We
all
know
how
passionate
you
are.
I
am
as
well
I,
educate
myself
in
different
ways
and
and
that's
okay,
but
I
think
it's
important
that
we
hold
ourselves
accountable
to
what
we
have
budgeted.
That's
all
I'm,
saying
all.
A
To
defer
to
the
city
clerk
okay,
so
what
do
we
need
to
do
on
the
next?
But
our
next
agenda
I
think
you
have
on
their
mayor
to
request
an
increase
in
your
travel
budget,
so
that
will
be
on
there.
A
I
do
think
it's
important
to
note
that
there
has
been
inflationary
stuff,
but
we'll
talk
about
that
as
at
the
regular
agenda
item,
I'll
bring
that
up
so
for
those
wanting
to
attend
the
annual
conference
I'm,
not
so
sure
that
there's
enough
money,
so
I'm
going
to
review
that
and
I'll
bring
that
up,
but
and
as
I
understand,
though
part
of
the
question
was:
what
else
do
you
consider
to
be
reimbursable?
So
generally,
are
you
guys?
A
B
E
G
D
G
B
G
G
D
G
F
G
G
A
A
Though
vice
mayor,
Buckman,
I
think
yeah,
we
we
had,
we
had
to
buy
the
or
we
ended
up
purchasing
two
shirts
for
forward
Pinellas.
As
you
know,
you
appoint
them
to
the
board
and
he
bought
two
shirts.
So
we
had
to,
we
paid
ended
up
paying
for
that.
It
was
City
money.
So
would
you
have
considered
that
is?
Okay,
I,
don't
know,
maybe.
F
F
Well,
that's
already
a
budgeted
line
item
and
again
it's
the
same
thing.
You
know:
we've
been
primarily
focused
on
travel
or
education,
but
same
goes
for
there
if
I
think
well,
man,
you
know,
and
in
the
past
we've
talked
about
man
it'd
be
nice
to
have
nice
shirts
segue
into
next
agenda
item
for
being
outside
right
at.
F
Instead
of
heavy
Cotton
shirts,
nice
lightweight
shirts,
well
that
falls
under
there
but
again
try
to
project
to
say
you
know
if
we
think
it's
appropriate
to
get
a
couple
more
shirts
adjust
those
adjusted
accordingly
on
the
budget.
So
we
have
that
line
item
as
a
breakout
of
our
overall
Council
budget.
A
F
A
B
I'm
also
going
to
talk
to
Scott
Dudley
in
regards
to
the
Florida
League
of
Mayors,
to
see
if
any
of
that
is
reimbursable
to
the
city,
because
I
and
the
city
has
been
paying
for
those
expenses
for
those
board
meetings
and
I,
don't
know.
I
haven't
I've,
never
asked
them,
since
this
has
come
up
but
I.
But
since
it's
come
up,
I
asked
the
Suncoast.
I
got
them
to
approve
it,
so
let
me
see
if
I
can
get
them
approve
it.
Okay,
yeah.
D
F
There
there's,
maybe
the
opposite
of
that
just
kind
of
looking
back
through
some
of
our
stuff
is
some
other
events
that
we've
attended
that
are
kind
of
bucketed
under
travel
right
now
on
here,
I,
don't
know
if
that's
necessarily
the
appropriate
place
to
do
it
like
an
awards,
dinners
and
things
like
that.
Yeah.
D
F
Know
if
it
would
be
appropriate
again-
and
this
is
maybe
pointing
towards
a
separate
work
session
of
a
council
budgeting
work
session
in
advance
of
the
general
budgeting
work
session
or
or
one
of
the
agenda
sections
of
it
to
say,
are
all
the
types
of
line
items
that
we
have
there
right
now,
the
appropriate
buckets
of
grouping
things
in
or
should
event
events.
Appearances
like
the
vice
mayor,
said
there
is
value
and
appearances
right.
F
A
And
so,
if
I
may
insert
here
as
I
work
on
the
budget
for
next
year,
I
did,
for
instance,
put
the
John
Maroney
dinner
in
into
the
commercial
activities
rather
than
the
charitable
contributions.
And
so
there
are
different
changes
like
that.
But
what
we
can
do
as
we
go
forward
once
the
final
department,
but
so
we
my
deadline
for
getting
that
budget
in
is
March
10th.
A
But
you
know
that's
by
line
item
and
I
and
that's
fairly
descriptive
and
so
I
can
send
that
to
you
guys,
and
that
would
give
you
guys
a
chance
to
kind
of
look
it
over
and
then
at
the
budget
meeting
where
we
have
the
operational
budget
meeting,
you
could
bring
it
up
and
say:
hey
I'm,
not
so
sure
that
this
belongs
here.
If
you
have
questions
like
that,
so
it
gives
you
actually
a
few
months
chance
to
review
it.
A
B
All
right,
so
we're
good.
Are
you
in
the
comments
it'll
be
on
the
agenda
of
the
city
council
meeting
and
we'll
I'm
going
to
do
my
homework
when
I
need
to
get
done,
because
you
guys
giving
me
a
lot
of
good
feedback
and
I'm
very
thankful
for
that
and
I'll
do
my
homework
and
I'm
at
that
council
meeting
I'll
report
back
to
you
then
next
item
are
agenda,
is
discuss
volunteering
as
a
council
at
community
events
and
I
believe
vice
mayor.
You
put
this
on
the
agenda:
I'm
gonna!
Let
you
have
the
floor.
E
So,
thank
you
mayor,
looking
at
what
we
volunteer
for
I'm
not
opposed
to
it,
I'm
not
against
it.
But
to
me
when
we're
out
in
the
public
eye,
you
know
I,
think
being
accessible
but
not
only
being
accessible
but
being
accessible
and
able
to
have
conversations
where
there's
no
risk
involved.
E
I
think
there's
a
value
to
the
community
in
that
measure.
I
think
there's
a
value
that
we
could
provide
back
to
our
citizens
that
we're
just
not
always
I'm
saying
this,
but
we're
always
not
in
the
beer
tent
right.
E
What
other
things
could
we
be
doing
when
I
left
the
meeting
the
other
night
Jason
Sanders
pulled
me
aside,
he's
like
what
do
you
want
to
do?
I'm,
like
I'll
run
around
and
pick
up
trash
I
mean
I
was
I
owned
the
trash
company,
one
point
in
my
life,
so
I
don't
mind
going
around
doing
that
and
it
gives
the
opportunity
to
meet
talk
to
other
people,
talk
to
Citizens
and
and
show
the
if
you
will
human
nature
and
I
know
that's
what
the
the
volunteering
at
the
tents
have
meant
to
do.
E
But
how
do
we
do
it
in
a
way
that
kind
of
opens
it
up
a
little
bit
more?
Do
we?
We
take
commuting
events,
but
do
we
adopt
the
street
in
January
I'll
go
out
and
clean
the
street,
my
family
in
February,
you
go
out,
so
we
have
to
call
a
meeting,
but
we
go
out
and
take
care
of
that
street.
Are
there
other
things
that
we
can
do
to
drive
Community
engagement,
to
show
that
we're
not
just
doing
this
on
communication
level,
but
we're
also
doing
on
a
personal
level
with.
C
E
Being
said,
we
also
spent
a
lot
of
time
on
Council.
We
have
had
I,
think
say
this
when
I
interviewed
with
all
of
you
prior
to
running
for
Council.
No
one
ever
said
it
was
this
many
workshops
and
this
much
going
on.
So
we've
we've
been
a
very
busy
Council
and
we
all
have
families
and
times
away,
but
I
just
wanted
to
open
this
up.
What
else
can
we
do?
That
is
out
there
that's
available
to
us
as
ideas.
I've
got
the
street
idea
at
Baltimore
days
and
nights
to
celebrate
Oldsmar.
F
We
want
to
help
hold
water
bottles
out
at
the
water
station.
You
know
things
like
that
where
we
have
the
opportunity
during
Council
comments
to
be
like.
Maybe
that's
part
of
council
comments,
hey.
What
are
we
going
to
do
in
the
next
coming
month?
F
B
G
G
We
just
had
the
super
party
and
it
does
tend
to
be
a
bit
overwhelming
attending
all
of
that,
in
addition
to
all
of
our
city,
council
commitments
and
commitments
to
events
as
well
as
well
as
meetings
and
work
sessions,
I'm
not
opposed
to
changing
the
dynamic
of
because
it
was
kind
of
brought
up
like
the
serving
beer
at
whether
it's
celebrate
Oldsmar
or
Oldsmar
days
and
nights.
G
If
we
wanted
to
do
something
else
at
that
particular
event,
if
that
was
the
concern,
I
think
it's
incumbent
on
each
of
us
to
become
involved
in
whatever
capacity
we
we
feel
is
appropriate.
I
was
under
the
impression
that
you
know,
based
on
the
way
it
was
worded,
discuss
volunteering
as
a
council
at
community
events
that
you
you
were
saying
like.
G
We
should
all
do
something
together
at
one
time
so
I,
you
know,
I
I
wouldn't
be
opposed
to
it,
but
we
do
do
a
lot
together
at
one
time
when
I
saw
you
guys,
Saturday
I
saw
Dan
earlier
today
and.
F
G
G
Everything
we
do
is
volunteering,
but
I
do
understand
what
you're
saying
about
being
accessible
when
we're
at
different
events.
For
example
like
this
past
weekend,
when
we
were
all
out
at
BMX,
you
know
not.
Everybody
can
always
come
to
everything,
but
I
find
that
people
still
approach
me
at
different
events
and
I
feel
that
we're
accessible,
even
when
we're
serving
beer
I
feel
that
we're
really
accessible.
But
if
there's
some
event
in
particular
that
you
were
interested
in
having
us,
do
I
I'm
happy
to
talk
about
it.
E
It
wasn't
a
I
mean
it
started
with
the
beer,
tents,
yes
and
feedback
I
was
getting
from
citizens
like
why
you
guys
always
serving
beer.
Why
are
you
always
serving
beer
right
and
I'm
like
we're
serving
Diet
Cokes
and
Waters
too?
There's
regular
beverages
there
too,
so
it
was
just
something
that
I
wanted
to
bring
up
discuss.
E
You
know
not
trying
to
say
formalize
the
process,
but
you
know
I
like
what
councilmember
Knapp
said,
where
who's
going
to
cover
this.
Who
wants
to
cover
this?
Who
wants
to
cover
this
and
just
make
it
a
little
bit
more
formalized
so
that
in
advance
they
know,
hey
city,
council
member
is
going
to
be
there
somebody's
going
to
be
there.
This
person
can
be
there
at
the
big
events
BMX
days
and
nights,
celebrate
Oldsmar
they're
always
going
to
know
we're
going
to
be
there.
D
E
But
at
these
other
events,
I
I
think
just
making
it
known
and
then
is
there
any?
Are
there
other
events
in
the
community
that
we
can
team
up
together?
Because
there
is
a
value
to
the
team
building
inside
of
the
beer
tent.
B
E
B
Well,
I,
just
I
I
just
want
to
give
you
a
little
quick
example:
I
remember
when
I
first
got
on
Council,
they
were
doing
a
Thanksgiving.
Turkey
giveaway
over
at
Oldsmar,
cares
and
for
some
reason,
I
remember
there
was
me
Linda
and
somebody
else
was
there.
We
just
put
turkeys
in
people's
cars,
but
it
was
that
Community
thing
that
we
were
all
there.
You
know.
B
Yeah
I
know
but
I
mean
like
this
year:
I
didn't
even
know
when
it
was
I,
didn't
I
wasn't
even
aware,
but
I'm
just
saying.
Maybe
that
would
be
a
nice
event.
We
could
all
do
together.
I'm
just
saying
you
guys
have
kids
I,
don't
like
these
I,
don't
have
kids,
so
I
know
you
guys
are
busy.
Believe
me.
I
know
that
and
I'm
glad
they're
gone,
but
you
guys
are
busy.
You
know.
A
B
F
Know
I'll,
be
there
I
think
I
think
what
it
boils
down
to
it's
like.
You
know
that
the
working
at
the
different
chamber
events
one,
is
functioning
as
volunteering,
it's
opportunity
for
team
building,
but
it's
it's
kind
of,
as
it
was
mentioned
in
some
of
Prior
meetings.
We've
had
our
work
sessions
about
tradition
and
community
building.
It's
like
that's
just
what's
been
customary
traditional,
but
that
doesn't
mean
we
can't
forge
A,
New
Path,
to
say
what
else
is
is
an
opportunity.
F
Is
it
you
know
as
nice
as
it
is
to
to
attend
an
event
versus
be
part
of
the
event
as
an
example?
What,
if,
instead
of
sitting
at
a
table
at
those
Mark,
Harris
Gala,
we
we
help
the
gala,
you
know
I
mean
there's,
there's
there's
all
kinds
of
things:
it's
just
do
you
want
to
be
served
something
or
you
want
to
do
the
serving
that's
exactly.
B
What
it
boils
down
to
perfect
so
I
got
an
idea
vice
mayor,
since
this
is
your
idea,
would
you
be
in
charge
of
it
for
us
and
you
come
up
with
ideas
for
us
any
suggestions
and
then
we
can
discuss
it
in
our
public
Council
comments.
You
know
we'll
just
you
know:
hey
I
got
this.
What
do
you
guys
think
of
doing
this
and
you
be
the
leader
of
that?
Would
would
that
be?
Okay
with
you,
Vice,
not.
C
That
is
the
only
thing
that
I
would
remind
you
of
every
single
time.
You
have
these
situations.
You
have
to
be
very
careful
and
don't
put
yourself
in
a
position
that,
first
of
all
that
you
do
it
or
it
appears
that
you're
doing
it
right.
You
know
violating
the
Sunshine
Law,
so
I
think
you're
all
pretty
good
at
it.