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Description
One of the world’s pressing challenges and opportunities is realising the full benefits of digital trade – for everyone, everywhere. COVID-19 highlighted the fragility of global trade’s reliance on paper-based processes and the pandemic has added urgency to the need for a resilient rebuild of digitisation of the global trade ecosystem. Since its inception five years ago, Hyperledger technologies have played a key role towards achieving this goal.
In this panel, you will hear from the International Chamber of Commerce (ICC) on its major new initiative to establish a globally harmonised, digitised trade environment. Hyperledger members and blockchain leaders will discuss the development and state of blockchain solutions for trade and trade finance today. The panel will examine issues including:
- the progress, pitfalls and opportunities companies and consortiums working on blockchain for trade and trade finance are facing
- which are the platforms to watch
- progress in interoperability and identity
- regulatory developments and challenges
- how to monetise on a blockchain trade finance platform
- how small and medium sized enterprises can take part – democratising access to global markets
Mark Cudden, CTO, we.trade
Emmanuelle Ganne, Senior Analyst, Economic Research Department, World Trade Organization
Oswald Kuyler, Managing Director, Digital Standards Initiative, ICC
Atul Patel, Chief Platform Officer, dltledgers
Parm Sangha, Global Blockchain Leader for Trade & Trade Finance, IBM
Julian Gordon, VP Asia Pacific, Hyperledger
----
Hyperledger – Open Source Blockchain Technologies
Hyperledger is an open source community focused on developing a suite of stable frameworks, tools and libraries for enterprise-grade blockchain deployments.
It serves as a neutral home for various distributed ledger frameworks including Hyperledger Besu, Fabric, Sawtooth, Indy, as well as tools like Hyperledger Avalon, Cactus and libraries like Hyperledger Aries, Ursa. Learn more about Hyperledger projects: https://www.hyperledger.org/use
Case Studies: https://www.hyperledger.org/learn/case-studies
Training & Certification: https://www.hyperledger.org/learn/training
Tutorials: https://www.hyperledger.org/use/tutorials
Webinars: https://www.hyperledger.org/learn/webinars
Events: https://www.hyperledger.org/events
Vendor Directory: https://www.hyperledger.org/use/vendor-directory
Subscribe to the Hyperledger Newsletter: https://www.hyperledger.org/newsletter
Follow-us on Twitter @Hyperledger
Learn about Hyperledger Membership: https://www.hyperledger.org/about/join
#Hyperledger #Blockchain
A
Hey
hello,
everyone
and
welcome
to
hyperledger's
webinar
on
examining
blockchain's,
transformative
role,
transformative,
sorry
role
in
digitizing
trade
and
trade
finance.
This
is
hyper
ledger's,
fifth
anniversary.
We
started
with
a
simple
announcement
on
december
17th
2015
about
this
exciting
new
project.
A
To
I
I
also
to
integration
with
legal
systems
and
all
sorts
of
regulatory
kinds
of
environments,
but
I'm
really
excited
about
the
role
that
trade
finance
has
played.
Trade
finance
is
one
of
those
spaces
that
is
international.
By
default
by
nature,
it
is
one
that
has
resisted
digitization
for
so
long
and
blockchain
technology
really
has
a
unique
role
in
helping
automate
so
much
of
it
and
so
much
power.
A
I
think-
and
it's
where
we've
seen
so
many
companies
and
deployments
of
this
actually
start
to
create
real
and
tremendous
value
using
this
technology.
So
I
I
I'm
really
excited
to
hear
this
panel.
I'd
like
to
now
hand
it
off
to
julian
gordon
who's,
hyper
ledger's.
Vice
president
for
the
asia
pacific
region
to
introduce
and
moderate
the
panel
julian.
B
Thank
you,
brian.
That
was
a
great
introduction
and
yeah
very
exciting,
this
fifth
anniversary.
So
I'm
delighted
to
be
here
today
and
we
have
such
an
amazing
panel
and
we're
gonna
discuss
one
of
the
world's
most
pressing
challenges
and
opportunities.
So
what
is
that?
That's?
How
do
we
as
individuals,
companies
and
governments,
realize
the
full
benefits
of
digital
trade
and
trade
finance
for
everyone
everywhere,
and
the
key
role
that
blockchain
and
hyperledger
are
playing
in
this?
B
As
most
of
you
know,
the
hyperledger,
we
are
an
open
source,
non-profit
blockchain
project,
hosted
by
linux
foundation
and
through
our
open
source,
open
governance
approach.
The
hyperledger
community
has
created
a
number
of
leading
blockchain
code
bases
which
are
widely
used
across
industries
and,
as
brian
said,
for
trade
finance.
We've
had
a
lot
of
activity
and
many
of
our
projects
have
been,
I
think,
pretty
impactful.
In
creating
these
these
these
networks,
we
have
hyperlaser
fabric,
hyperledger,
indie,
so
identity
and
hyperledger,
basically
for
ethereum.
B
So
much
has
been
achieved
in
these
five
years,
but
I
said
when
here
today,
there's
still
much
to
do,
but
still
much
to
do
so.
Today,
you
will
hear,
from
this
panel
we're
going
to
speak
to
kind
of
three
ways,
we'll
talk
about
the
vision
of
hyperledger
and
others
have
for
blockchain
in
trade
and
trade
finance.
B
C
Thanks
julian
and
delighted
to
be
here
good
morning,
good
afternoon,
good
evening,
good
night,
depending
on
where
you
are
so,
my
name
is
emmanuel
gan,
I'm
a
senior
analyst
in
the
economic,
research
and
statistics,
division
of
the
world
trade
organization
based
in
geneva,
and
I
lead
work
on
digital
technologies,
in
particular,
blockchain
and
small
and
medium-sized
enterprises,
and,
as
I
put
on
my
linkedin
profile,
I'm
a
blockchain
enthusiast.
I
truly
believe
that
blockchain
can
have
a
big
impact
on
international
trade
can
be
transformative
for
international
trade,
but
I'm
also
a
blockchain
realist.
C
I
do
know
that
it's
not
a
magical
wind
and
that
if
we
want
this
technology
to
truly
have
a
transform
transformational
impact
on
trade,
we
need
more
than
the
technology.
This
is
actually
what
I
explained
in
a
in
a
book
that
I
published
in
2018
and
which
is
entitled
can
blockchain
revolutionize
international
trade,
that
was
to
sensitize
trade
officials
to
the
potential
of
the
technology
and
then
stop
there
thanks
julian.
D
Hi
everyone,
and
thanks
again
for
inviting
me
my
name,
is
oswald
taylor.
I
am
the
managing
director
of
the
digital
standards
initiative
at
the
international
chamber
of
commerce,
so
the
international
chamber
of
commerce
is
the
institutional
representative
of
over
45
million
companies
globally,
so
across
different
industries
and
truly
global
in
nature,
by
being
represented
in
over
100
countries.
D
I'm
very
very
much
looking
forward
to
this
panel
because,
as
a
part
of
the
work
that
I'm
doing
we're
trying
to
see
how
do
we
further
accelerate
the
adoption
of
digitization
especi,
especially
in
trade,
and
I
met
julian
from
hyperledger
about
four
years
ago
when
I
actually
started
my
journey
on
having
conversations
around.
How
do
we
digitize
trade?
So
it
almost
feels
like
a
full
circle
julian.
E
Yeah
hi
julian.
Thank
you
and
high
pleasure.
Having
me
today,
I
am
honored
to
be
on
such
a
great
panel.
You
know
I'm
the
cto
of
wetrade.
I
lead
the
product
and
technology
teams
within
we,
trade,
our
trade
finance
platform
is
built
on
hyperledger
fabric
and
we've
been
working
with
the
hype
ledger
community
for
over
three
years
now
and
we
actively
participate
in
the
community.
For
example,
we're
active
members
of
the
trade
finance
special
interest
group.
We've
been
participating
in
member
summits.
E
F
Yes,
hello,
everybody
and
yeah.
Thank
you
for
having
us
today
on
this
panel
discussion.
Looking
forward
to
the
the
debate,
I'm
palm
sanger,
I'm
globally
responsible
for
blockchain
networks
involved
in
trade
and
trade
finance,
I'm
also
a
member
of
the
international
chamber
of
commerce's
digital
working
group.
F
Looking
at
trade,
finance,
digitization
and
yeah,
I
I
got
involved
with
the
hyper
ledger
forums
and
the
special
interest
groups
back
in
late
2016
early
2017,
when
we
were
looking
at
designing
and
deploying
into
production
one
of
the
first
trade
finance
networks
around
the
world
and
certainly
the
governance
that
hyperledger
has
in
this
openness
was
needed
when
we
were
looking
at
the
non-functional
requirements
of
deploying
into
production.
So
certainly
the
the
hyperledger
project
on
on
this
initiative
is
is
valuable
to
us
in
the
way
that
it
works.
A
G
B
Okay,
great
and
what
a
great
panel
right,
so
we
have
a
wide
spectrum
of
great
experiences,
so
I'm
going
to
start
off
with
you
know
why
so
we
talked
about.
We
talked
about
this
in
our
prep
right.
What
was
the
vision
for
five
years
ago?
Why
blockchain
and
trade
trade
finance?
So
I
couldn't
think
better
people
to
ask
here.
I
think
we're
going
to
start
on
the
broader
spectrum.
I
think
we've
talked
about
manual.
Maybe
you
start
with
your
your
your
higher
perspective
of
of
trade
and
trade
finance
and
blockchain
and
digitalization
as
a
whole.
C
Sure
sure,
yes,
well,
as
we
all
know,
trade
is
very
labor
paper
intensive.
There
are
multiple
actors,
multiple
documents
for
a
single
letter
of
credit
transaction.
For
example,
there
are
20
players
on
average
10
to
20
documents,
5
000
data
fields,
interaction,
but
only
one
percent
of
these
5
000
data
fields,
interaction
creates
value,
so
trade
and
trade
finance
are
full
of
frictions,
full
of
inefficiencies.
C
Blockchain
is,
in
my
view,
very
interesting
for
a
number
of
different
reasons.
First.
Why?
Because
it
creates
trust
which
you
see
is
what
I
see,
and
so
I
have
the
guarantee
that
you've
not
played
with
the
data,
and
this
is
critical
for
trade,
because
trade
is
built
on
trust.
You
need
to
trust
your
suppliers
and
the
companies
you
deal
with,
and
this
is
particularly
important
in
the
digital
age
as
supply
chains
are
becoming
increasingly.
B
All
right,
a
good
thing:
we've
got
a
few
people
who
are
working
on
the
maglev
stuff
right,
so
elon
musk's
of
their
world.
So
we
have,
we
have,
I
think,
mark
and
actor
and
palm.
Do
you
want
to
talk
about
your
vision?
You
you
work
predominantly
with
platforms
so
mark.
Do
you
want
to
talk
about
what
we
trade,
one
of
the
first
and
biggest
of
these
platforms
and
what
you're
doing
now.
E
Yeah
I
mean
yeah,
I
mean
I
can
yeah
so
effectively.
I
love,
we.
Traders
are
very
simple
motto:
it's
effectively
more
trade,
more
trust,
and
I
think
you
know,
as
we
all
know,
I
mean
one
of
the
biggest
pillars
of
blockchain
and
enterprise.
Blockchain
has
been
the
trusted
trade,
I
mean
it's
been
able
to
where
you
know.
Parties
are
brought
onto
a
network.
They're
validated
and
people
can
actually
trade
with
reduced
risks.
E
You
know
trade
would,
you
know,
reduce
fraud
and
trade
with
you
know,
with
with
parties
who
they
may
have
never
traded
with
before,
and
so
therefore
you
know
they
could.
They
might
be
apprehensive
about.
You
know
engaging
in
new
trade,
but
you
know
being
part
of
you
know.
You
know
a
platform
such
as
we
trade
people
can
onboard
onto
a
new
platform
and
can
engage
in
trade
with
new
trading
partners,
which
is
great
for
business
because
it
helps
grow
their
business
from
a
technology
perspective.
E
We
you
know,
we
we
have
a
platform,
we
bring
buyers
and
sellers.
You
know
traders
whether
they're
arrested
it's
a
large
corpse
and
they
can
trade
with
one
another
based
on
the
settlement
conditions
of
smart
contracts
based
on
a
platform
that
offers
a
rule
book
that
governs
the
behavior
of
all
of
the
participants
on
the
network.
It
is
the
platform
that
actually
brings
the
banks
together,
so
the
banks
can
you
know
and
and
the
traders
so
that
they
can
effectively
offer
services
such
as
you
know,
payment
services
pay.
E
I
mean
key
services
to
their
customers,
so
it
actually,
it
opens
up
cash
flow
and
liquidity
and
lending
opportunities
to
companies
that
you
know
and
given
today
I
mean
we're
in
covert
time.
So
you
know
that
may
be
struggling
with
cash
flow.
So
this
is
the
benefit
of
what
we
can
do
on
the
wechat
platform,
but
also
leveraging
by
leveraging
technology
such
as
hyperledger.
E
We
do
love
that
we
do
let
leverage
many
many
features
in
hyperledger
fabric
and
we're
built
mainly
on
hyperledger
fabric
such
as
the
dlt.
We
use
the
channels
and
we
use
private
data
collection
because
privacy
and
whole
you
know
making
information
and
data
available
to
only
those
who
need
the
information
is
key.
The
information
is
not
proliferated
around
the
whole
network
for
everybody
to
see
so
we
do
respect.
You
know
the
privacy
of
the
traders.
We
respect
the
privacy
of
the
banks
and
we
pre.
E
We
are
really
talking
about
digitizing,
optimizing
and
really,
you
know
making
trade
more
efficient
than
it
is
today,
because
there's
still
inefficiencies
as
emmanuel
has
highlighted,
there
are
still
we're
on
a
journey.
We
are
five
years
in
with
you
know,
with
with
digitizing
trade
today
and
from
an
optimization
perspective,
you
know
being
able
to
bring
these
parties
together.
Our
goal
is
to
you
know,
to
to
to
further
expand
into
digitization
opportunities
for
all
of
the
participants.
E
We
we're
connecting
all
of
the
participants
to
the
end-to-end
flow.
So
today,
from
a
we
trade
perspective,
we
have
banks,
smes
large
corps.
We
are
looking
at
already
looking
and
heavily
engaging
in
in
logistics,
insurance
and
many
many
other
areas.
We
won't
be
able
to
do
this
all
on
our
own,
so
we'll
know
that
at
some
stage
we
will
have
to
and-
and
we
are
already
engaging
with-
you
know-
other
networks
and
trying
to
connect
these
networks
and
we'll
come
to
that
later.
E
I
think
the
biggest
part
and
the
challenges
that
we've
had
to
overcome
have
been,
like.
You
know
like
getting
a
system
like
we,
trade
live
in
production
in
a
heavily
radical
lake,
a
heavily
regulated
industry
that
has
been
probably
one
of
our
biggest
hurdles
to
date.
You
know-
and
I
think
that
shouldn't
be
overlooked-
and
I
think
that
you
know-
and
I
think
it's
great-
that
now
that
we
have
you-
know
world
trade
organization,
icc
and
many
many
other.
You
know
either
local
regulators.
E
You
know
they're
becoming
more
aware
of
what
the
technology
can
do.
So
I
do
think
that,
okay,
I
know
emmanuel
has
said
like
we
want
to
be
the
maglev.
I
don't
think
we're
running
at
the
speed
of
a
maglev,
yet
we're
kind
of,
but
we're
getting
faster
as
the
technology
matures
through
the
years
so
atoll
you're,
going
to
share
some
perspectives.
G
Yeah
and
absolutely
thank
you
mark,
and
I
think
my
colleagues
have
actually
shared
why
why
it
is
important.
So
I
want
to
just
give
a
couple
of
more
data
points
to
say
if
there
is
a
way
to
put
this
into
the
business
use
case
and
put
that
into
the
context
of
the
trade.
There
are
700
000
class,
a
traders
in
the
world
right
so
and
those
people
initiate
and
execute
the
trade,
and
you
know,
like
emmanuel
mentioned
inefficiencies-
contributes
to
about
20
of
that
cost
in
running
the
execution
of
trade.
G
And
finally,
I
explained
blockchain
to
someone
who
is
in
trade
as
it
very
simply.
I
could
now
authenticate
your
document
and
I
and
and
and
basically
present
it
back
to
you
now.
That
document
could
be
just
a
simple
contract
or
that
document
could
be
the
bill
of
lading,
but
that's
something
that
I
can
do
it
in
the
privacy
that
you
prefer
in
the
privacy
that
you,
you
think,
is
acceptable
in
your
private
network.
G
So
I
think
trade
and
trade
finance.
Obviously
you
know
we
are.
You
know
we
are
based
out
of
the
trade
capital
of
the
world.
You
know
one
of
the
biggest
trade
you
know
flow
happens
out
of
singapore
me
and
oswald
is
also
here,
because
we
are
building
also
next
generation
of
digital
standards.
Singapore
government
has
been
very
focused
on
this,
so
certainly
this
is
an
area
where
there
was
no
other
technology
that
could
have
actually
fixed
this
inefficiency
problem.
F
F
So
if
we
take,
if
we
take
it
on
two
strands
or
two
streams,
first
of
all,
global
trade
is
growing
and
then
also
the
trade
finance
gap
is
also
growing.
So
if
we
take
the
trade
finance
gap,
first,
that's
growing.
As
emmanuel
said,
the
frictions
and
the
costs
are
very,
very
high
and
the
risks
are
very
high.
F
So,
from
a
bank's
point
of
view,
the
cost
of
risk
is
too
high.
Affordability,
then,
is
much
lower
for
the
smes
and
that's
where,
from
a
a
process,
point
of
view
within
the
trade
finance
from
the
banks
to
its
clients
and
then
the
ecosystem,
then
blockchain
does
bring
in
trust,
because
that's
the
major
hurdle
for
the
reasons
why
there's
so
many
people
so
many
so
much
paperwork
in
all
of
those
processes
in
those
workflows.
F
So
when
you're,
following
the
data
with
regards
to
a
typical
transaction
for
trade
finance,
it's
high
high
cost
high
risk
high
administration.
Many
silos
lots
of
handshakes
of
the
data
going
from
one
party
to
another.
Blockchain
simplifies
and
decentralizes
it.
As
mark
said,
smart
contracts,
consensus
mechanisms,
the
the
security
by
which
the
data
is
being
shared,
the
private
permissions.
As
the
manual
said
you,
I
see
what
you
see,
what
we
need
to
see
only
even
though
the
supply
chain
and
the
participants
could
be
so
broad.
F
So
from
a
trade
finance
point
of
view.
Blockchain
is
beginning
to
play
a
role
in
allowing
banks
to
service
a
market
segment
that
they
couldn't
afford
to
before
because
of
the
risks
involved,
and
then
how
that
capital
was
being
treated
by
the
banks
under
the
regulations
and
then
was
it
a
profitable
business
for
them
to
to
to
service
that
market.
F
So
from
a
trade
finance
perspective,
blockchain,
absolutely
playing
a
role
and
we're
seeing
live
systems
and
platforms
in
production,
then,
from
a
global
trade
point
of
view,
because
finance
is
just
one
pillar,
then
it's
the
movement
of
the
goods
and
the
movements
of
the
documents,
as
well
as
the
movement
of
the
funds
and
again
those
individual
areas
are
all
fraught
with
inefficiencies
and
silos
and
frictions
of
again
many
people.
Many
processes
and
much
paperwork
in
moving
those
goods,
ultimately
between
the
buyer
and
the
seller.
F
And
what
we
are
seeing
is
because
of
the
private
permissioned
way
of
sharing
data
and
the
fact
that
your
supply
chain
is
global,
then
sort
of
by
design.
Now
we're
actually
seeing
more
platforms
being
established
in
the
logistics
side
of
things
in
the
movement
of
goods
by
containers
and
trade.
Lens
is
a
good
example
of
that
and
the
partnership
with
mask
and
then
also
the
movement
on
and
the
provenance
and
the
supply
chain.
Visibility
of
those
goods,
as
they
actually
are
being
shipped
so
again,
ibm
food
trust
is,
is
a
good
example
to
use
there.
B
Excellent,
thank
you
palm
and
I
think
now
that's
a
great
overview.
Thank
you,
everybody.
There.
I
think
what
we
we
discussed
now
is
we're
going
to
look
at
where,
where
we
are
today,
so
you
know,
we've
had
the
vision.
Five
years
been.
You
know
this
journey
a
long
time
in
in
in
maybe
a
short
time
in
trade.
We
actually
decided
a
long
time
so
where
we
are
today.
C
Thanks
julian
yeah,
that's
not
the
slide
yeah!
So
just
to
to
start
so.
Last
year
I
I
published,
with
a
deepest
patel
of
trade,
finance,
global
and
a
periodic
table
of
dlt
projects
in
trade
and
trade
finance.
We
thought
that
it
would
be
useful
to
get
a
sense
of
the
different
projects
that
were
out
there,
because
we
saw
projects
popping
up
continuously,
and
things
are
evolving
so
fast
that
we
decided
to
update
this
table
this
year,
and
so
this
is
what
you
have
on
the
slide
here.
C
C
But
so
what
does
this
show
us?
It
actually
shows
us
that
we
have
a
digital
island
problem
and
that
this
problem
is
not
getting
smaller.
It's
getting
bigger,
we
have
many
platforms
out
there
and
that
periodic
table
covers
not
only
trade
finance
but
also
transportation,
logistics
and
digitalization
of
trade
documents
insurance.
But
I
think
the
message
is
there
that
what
is
critical
if
we
want
to
remove
frictions
from
international
trade
and
the
inefficiencies
that
we
mentioned
earlier,
is
that
we
connect
the
dots.
C
So
we
need
to
work
together
to
connect
these
different
platforms
to
allow
for
seamless
exchanges
of
data,
and
that
means
working
at
a
technical
level
to
allow
for
technical
interoperability,
because
these
different
platforms
that
you
can
see
it's
a
bit
small
but
we've
put
the
underlying
technology,
and
these
platforms
are
built
on
different
technologies,
some
on
hyperledger
fabric,
others
on
other
dlts,
and
so
this
causes
a
problem
of
technical
interoperability.
But
we
also
need
to
work
at
the
level
of
data
models
to
allow
for
seamless
exchanges
of
data.
C
Now
there
are
already
some
data
models,
but
they
are
either
very
specific,
like
customs,
for
example,
or
for
specific
documents
with
sometimes
multiple
standards.
If
you
look
at
invoices,
I
mean
there
are
more
than
30
standards
out
there,
so
we
we
need
to
for
to
develop
these
global
standards
and
for
these
standards
to
succeed,
it's
critical,
that
they
have
visibility
and
that
they
have
traction
that
they'll
be
accepted
by
a
critical
mass
and
third.
C
We
also
need
to
work
at
the
regulatory
level
and
I
think
we'll
we'll
discuss
it
a
bit
later,
but
we
need
to
create
an
enabling
regulatory
framework.
Mark
of
with
a
trade
mentioned
the
importance
of
that
regulatory
framework,
and
he
mentioned
that
it
was
actually
one
of
the
key
challenges
that
they
faced
when
they
were
entering
into
production.
So
I
think
what
is
critical
is
that
we
think
in
terms
of
of
the
entire
chain,
end-to-end
solutions,
it's
a
chain,
thinking
spirit.
C
We
have
to
involve
all
the
different
actors
and
what
our
study
shows
is
that
when
it
comes
to
digitalization
actually,
customs
developments,
for
example,
are
trailing,
which
is
a
big
problem,
because
in
international
trade
goods
cross
borders,
so
customs
are
a
key
element
of
the
chain
of
the
international
trade
chain.
So
we
need
to
develop
these
end-to-end
solutions,
and
for
this
I
think
it's
very
important
that
we
all
work
together
and
the
longer
we
wait,
the
more
difficult
it
will
be.
So
it's
very
important
that
we
do
this
now.
B
F
Yeah
now
I
think
the
the
study
that
emmanuel
and
dipesh
commissioned,
I
think,
gives
you
a
great
insight
to
where
we
are
today
and
the
fact
that
people
are
using
and
organizations
are
using
blockchain
to
get
those
efficiency
gains
and
then
to
connect
the
end-to-end
workflows
a
little
bit
tighter
together.
So
there's
less
friction
in
the
process.
F
What
we
also
did,
which
we'll
just
quickly
share
with
you
now,
is
also
a
global
study
as
to
where
organizations
were,
and
it
really
does
concur
with
what
emanuel
is
sharing
with
her
study,
but
we'll
also
share
with
you.
Where
do
people
want
to
go?
Where
do
organizations
want
to
go
and
how
do
they
think
they
can
get
there
to
this
end-to-end
digitization
of
trade
and
trade
finance?
F
We
conducted
this
study
with
our
colleagues
at
the
institute
of
business
value,
quick,
shout
out
to
mina
and
via
smita
and
vina,
and
basically
there
were
three
chapters
to
the
study.
First
of
all,
and
this
is
endorsed
by
emmanuel.
Your
study
is
when
you
looked
at
the
platforms
that
emanuel
captured
in
the
periodic
table.
What
you
have
there
are
consortium
they're
companies
that
came
together
to
create
a
platform
on
the
capability
for
either
their
vertical
industry
or
for
their
supply
chain.
F
69
now
want
to
work
together,
and
they
want
to
work
together
by
opening
up
their
workflows
where
the
data
is
being
processed
for
that
trade
and
the
trade
finance
transaction,
and
they
want
to
work
more
collaboratively
because
69
say.
Actually,
there
is
value
with
blockchain
in
making
ourselves
more
efficient
and
why
they
doing.
That
is
because
they're
all
in
pursuit
of
what
we
call
the
network
effect
and
the
network
effect
best
demonstrated
by
uber,
which
entered
into
a
marketplace,
which
was
a
taxi
marketplace
which
is
worth
5
billion.
F
Now
uber
has
a
valuation
of
80
90
billion
dollars.
Why
is
because
they
created
a
platform
where
they
were
able
to
bring
suppliers
and
like
taxis
and
then
the
more
taxis
that
came
into
the
platform.
The
more
passengers
and
buyers
came
onto
that
platform,
and
then
you
know
the
motivation
was
there
for
the
the
passenger,
because
it
was
less
of
a
wait
time
and
then
same
for
the
supplier.
F
So
where
we
are
today,
people
are
seeing
the
value
they're
getting
returns
and
the
mindset
has
changed.
The
mindset
to
change
in
chapter
two
then
comes
down
to
working
more
collaboratively
for
the
network
effect
is
to
share
data,
and
how
can
you
share
data
in
a
trusted
way?
75
more
than
75
wanted
to
share
data
throughout
their
workflow
from
their
company
throughout
the
supply
chain
up
and
down
stream,
but
less
than
50
percent.
F
Actually
trusted
the
sharing
of
that
data,
hence
the
use
of
blockchain,
because
if
you
can
get
that
trust
in
the
sharing
of
data
in
that
workflow,
that's
been
digitized,
but
across
your
supply
chain,
then
what
we
were
finding
was
that
the
study
was
telling
us
is
that
if
you
can
get
the
trust
in
the
processes,
then
actually?
No.
F
If
you
can
then
also
maybe
get
the
trust
in
the
asset,
that's
being
traded
or
the
products
that
being
bought
and
sold,
and
what
about
digitizing
that
also
and
then
moving
off
into
the
tokenization
of
that
asset,
and,
as
mark
mentioned
earlier
on
about
introducing
more
liquidity
into
your
platform.
So
digitizing
the
asset
also
introduces
more
liquidity.
F
However,
now
there's
a
challenge
is
how
where
do
I
actually
operate?
Where
do
I
go
to
allow
for
a
degree
of
interconnectedness
where
interoperability
has
been
mentioned?
How
do
I
traverse
one
platform
on
one
technology
and
again,
as
emmanuel's
periodic
table
shows,
there's
lots
of
underlying
technology
platforms
that
then
are
moving
data
and
they
all
have
their
own
way
of
moving
that
data?
How
do
you
hop
from
one
trusted
platform
to
another
trusted
platform
in
a
trusted
way?
F
Why
do
we
have
to
choose?
Why
do
organizations
have
to
choose
one
trade,
finance
provider
versus
another
or
one
kyc,
know
your
customer
service
versus
another
or
one
digital
id
service
person?
Another
can't
we
go
somewhere
where
there's
a
common
standard
where
we
consume
it
in
a
common
way,
because
it
saves
the
duplication
of
cost
and
then
the
gluing.
That
needs
to
happen
afterwards
and
again.
The
chapter
in
chapter
three.
The
study
was
telling
us
this
notion
of.
F
Where
can
we
go
and
have
this
natural
incentive,
which
is
neutral
and
open
governance
very
much
like
hyperledger,
in
the
way
that
it
manages
open
source
code?
Where
can
we
go
and
start
trading
with
less
friction
and
a
platform
and
a
venue
that
has
more
trust?
So
we
got
a
very
clear
insight
as
to
where
organizations
want
to
go
now
that
they're
beginning
to
master
what
blockchain
value
can
bring,
and
that
is
take
the
value
and
the
benefit
of
digitizing.
F
Your
processes
with
blockchain
get
the
cost
savings,
but
then
start
looking
at
growing
your
business
and
grow
with
the
network
effect,
not
just
your
market
share,
but
also
the
size
of
the
market.
So
julian.
That
was
the
kind
of
findings
we
found
as
to
where
the
direction
was
in
complement
to
what
emanuel
shared
with
her
survey
as
well.
B
That's
great,
very,
very
interesting.
The
network
effect
I
mean
one
to
10
gdp
growth
is
significant
right,
so
very,
very,
very
exciting
stuff.
So
from
from
from
now,
if
we
just
take
a
step
and
look
at
the
technology,
so
maybe
we
have
a
cto
mark.
So
what's
your
perspective
of
where
we
are
today
in
terms
of
the
technology,
and
we
looked
at
things
like
the
interoperability
etc,.
E
Yeah,
yes,
where
we
are
today,
I
mean
look,
you
know,
as
both
emmanuel
and
and
and
perm
have
already
kind
of
stated,
I
mean
look,
there
are
a
number
of
systems
that
are
live
and
in
production,
so
we're
no
longer
at
the
you
know
for
those
systems
that
are
live
like
like
we
tried,
for
example,
you
know
and
dlt
ledgers.
I
mean
it's
we're
no
longer
just
trying
to
see
what
we
can
do
with
the
technology.
We're
actually
already
able
to
realize
and
deliver
value
to
our
customers.
E
You
know-
and
that's
you
know,
and
to
do
so
in
a
heavily
heavily
regulated
industry
has
been
challenging
as
I've
alluded
to
earlier,
but
I
mean
we
have
actually
come
through
quite
a
lot
of
those,
and
you
know
those
challenges
to
be
live
in
the
countries
that
you
know
respectively.
We
are
live
in,
the
technology
is
still
maturing.
E
To
be
honest,
I
mean
yes,
there
are,
like
you
know,
with
hyper
ledger
for,
for
example,
open
source,
open
governance,
new
features,
requests,
new
new
capabilities
are
always
in
development,
so
I
mean
you
know
and
as
that
as
the
technology
matures,
it
will
open
up
new
business
models,
new
revenue
models,
new
ways
of
doing
things,
and
even
you
know,
from
a
technology
perspective,
optimizing
on
how
we
actually
and
develop
our
platforms
and
our
solutions.
So
we're
always
going
to
be.
E
You
know
continually
looking
at
what
are
the
new
features
and
functions
and
capabilities
of
blockchain,
and
you
know
what
you
know.
What
we
can
excuse
me
what
we
can
actually
get
from
cloud
services
and
even
our
process,
and
how
we
deliver
our
services
into
production.
What
we're
trying
to
do
really?
What
we're
trying
to
do
is
using
the
technology
to
simplify
digitize
and
optimize
many,
the
efforts
of
all
of
the
participants
in
the
network
or
on
the
platform
at
first
we
were
trying
to
you
know.
As
we
trade
was
going
live
I
mean
effectively.
E
E
You
know
people
are
not
always
they're,
not
so
comfortable
in
embracing
new
technologies,
especially
something
so
so
alien
to
them,
because
before
organizations
are
used
to
developing
projects
and
solutions
within
their
own
walls,
blockchain
opens
it
up
you're
no
longer
waiting.
Only
within
your
wall,
you
are
actually
becoming
part
or
joining
a
network,
and
in
some
cases
you
know
the
actual
operations,
the
the
the
development.
You
know,
the
evolution
of
that
platform,
you've
delegated
or
depending
on
how
you.
E
Actually
you
know
how
you're
procuring
your
blockchain
services,
your
debt
you've
delegated
that
to
somebody
else,
so
that
then
you
actually
even
need
to
build
up
a
trust
between
a
supplier
and
a
provider
yeah
or
and
a
consumer
of
those
services.
You
know
so
and
then
you
know,
I
mean
a
lot
of
people.
I
mean
we
were.
You
know
having
to
educate
a
lot
of
people
on
what
we
mean
by
consensus.
Algorithms
and,
like
you
know,
you
know
we're
having
to
to
be
honest.
E
We
had
to
break
the
myth
of
oh
blockchain,
cryptocurrency
yeah.
We
have
to
dispel
that
myth.
You
know,
and
these-
and
these
are
the
challenges
that
we've
had
to
overcome.
I'd
say
for
the
last
two
or
three
years,
so
we're
still
very
much.
I
would
say
you
know,
on
in
in
the
infancy
of
our
journey,
to
get
to
be
that
maglev.
You
know,
that's
literally,
you
know
creating
frictionless
trade
as
emmanuel
has
as
they
did
earlier.
E
It's
we've
had
other
challenges
in
terms
of,
as
parm
has
said
earlier.
On
I
mean
you
know
some
banks
or
or
some
customers
what
they're
putting
on
on
their
premise
still,
so
they
still
want
to
participate
in
a
network.
That's
kind
of
open
and
you
know
kind
of
having
a
lot
of
other
participants
from
around
the
world
on
there,
but
they
still
want
to
do
so
and
manage
it
and
control
it
within
their
own
premise.
E
E
Kind
of
will
feel
today
that
you
know
blockchain
had
you
know
is
either
still
hasn't
fulfilled
its
you
know
it's
its
goal
in
some
cases,
some
people
and
I
would
say
that
the
naysayers
are
saying
the
blockchain
are
still
slow
and
we're
you
know
or
we're
in
the
you
know
the
trot
of
disillusionment
whatever.
I
think
a
lot
of
us
are
coming
out
of
that
trout
of
disillusionment,
because
we
have
platforms
that
are
live
in
production
and
are
realizing
value
to
the
customers,
but
we're
not
at
the
end.
E
Yet
we
have
more
and
more
challenges
to
to
overcome.
I
mean
you
know
as
we
see
as
we
as
we
engage
with
you
know,
other
parties
and
other
customers
in
you
know
other
jurisdictions
than
where
we
currently
are.
There's
more.
I
mean
we
thought
we
were
finished
with
local
regulations
and
and
and
and
local
regulators
regarding,
you
know,
rules
and
how
they,
actually,
you
know,
participate
in
a
blockchain
network.
E
We
haven't,
I
mean
we
still
engage
with
you
know
in
in
new
markets,
where,
again,
some
of
these
challenges
are
the
same,
and
some
of
them
are
absolutely
brand
new.
You
know,
so
I
think
until
we
kind
of
really
kind
of
work
on
the
on
the
together-
and
you
know,
with
all
of
the
different
blockchain
technologies
or
all
of
the
different
blockchain
platforms,
you
know
we're
all
facing
the
same
challenges
so
that
I
think
they're.
You
know,
as
we
kind
of
work
towards
the
standardizations
and
the
interoperabilities,
I
think
that'll
actually
help.
E
You
know
alleviate
some
of
the
issues
that
would
we
have.
We
do
see
that
you
know
that
the
blockchain
platforms
are
delivering.
You
know
we're
evolving,
to
deliver
and-
and
you
know,
and
to
realize
more
value-added
services
to
all
of
the
participants
as
the
technology
as
blockchain
becomes
ubiquitous
becomes
a
little
bit
more
known
and
becomes
you
know
it
really
does
become
that
trusted
technology,
because
we
spend
a
lot
of
time
in
actually
ensuring
that
people
understand.
E
You
know
the
actual.
You
know
the
technology
underlying
technology
and
you
know
differentiating
it
from
encrypt
currency
and
a
whole
lot,
but
understanding
the
whole.
You
know
the
underlying
technology
so
that
you
know
as
new
entities
you
know
look
to
onboard.
You
know
their
approval
process
are
less
painful
because
they
also
have
become
more
aware
of
the
of
the
technology.
E
There
are
many
blockchains
I
mean
with
manuel's
periodic
table
of
blockchain
solutions
and
especially
in
trade
finance.
There
are
a
lot
of
blockchain
solutions.
Some
many
you
know
some
of
them
in
production,
some
of
them
going
live
some
on
the
verge
of
going
live
and,
to
be
honest,
there
will
probably
be
more
that
are
still
not
on
that
periodic
table,
but
will
come
in
the
future.
You
know
so
it's
going
to
be
an
ever-evolving
space.
E
We
we've
already
said
that
we
trade.
We
know
that
we're
not
going
to
be
the
only
blockchain
network
to
rule
the
world,
so
I
mean
we
have.
We
have
a
strategy
of
you
know
creating.
You
know,
stack
instances
glow
around
the
world
and
by
doing
that,
then
we'll
need
to
be
able
to
connect
those
stacks
both
connected.
We
trade
stock
to
another.
We
trade
stack
or
effectively
connect
we
trade
to
a
non-we
trade
network.
E
You
know
so
this
is
where
we're
kind
of
looking
towards
the
whole
standardization
and
interoperability
and
interconnectivity
between
these
networks.
To
make
sure,
then
that
you
know
that
we
can
fulfill
the
drive.
You
know
the
vision,
I
don't
want
to
say
dream
the
vision
of
frictionless
trade
for
all
participants
and
that
you
know
participants
don't
need
to
actually
know
okay.
Well,
I
need
to
engage
in
trade
in
this
country.
Oh,
I
need
to
be
part
of
this
network.
Oh,
I
need
to
engage
in
a
trade
in
another
country.
Oh
well.
E
I
need
to
be
part
of
this.
That
confuses
the
story.
It
confuses
the
message
and
it
really
means.
If
that
is
the
case,
then
we've
actually
done
something
wrong.
So
I
think
you
know
it's
great.
You
know,
and
this
is
where
I
think
the
hyperledger
community
really
helps.
You
know
with
us,
because
we
have
you
know
the
likes
of
you
know
we
trade
and
dlt,
ledgers
and
and
many
other
participants
on
you
know
as
part
of
the
community
as
part
of
the
special
interest
groups
and
and
we're
already
talking
about
these
challenges.
E
And,
yes,
we
engage
with
with
ibm
on
various
other
things
about.
You
know.
You
know
you
know
in
in
you
know,
because
effectively
there
are
delivery
partners,
so
we
and
we're,
like
you
know
with
them.
We
actually
are
able
to
realize
what
we
can
realize.
You
know
what
we
have
realized
to
date
in
terms
of
getting
to
production
and
delivering
our
platform,
but
also
we
engage
with
them
very
very
closely
and
in
terms
of
what
we
want.
D
Thank
you
palm,
and
I
I
must.
I
agree
with
everything
emmanuel
and
and
palm
that
you've
shown
in
your
studies,
I'll
keep
it
brief.
Just
for,
for
the
sake
of
time,
standardization
is
really
something
that's
going
to
help
us
move
the
needle
move
us
from
single
digit
performance
when
it
actually
comes
to
the
adoption
of
these
technologies
to
something
that
has
scale,
and
so
standards
play
a
big
part
in
this,
because
it
enables
us
to
share
what
good
looks
like.
D
So
I
think,
in
short,
what
I
might
do
julian
is
just
give
everyone
a
high
level
view
of
what's
happening
in
the
standard
space.
Today,
that's
quite
supportive
of
the
work
that
emanuel
and
them
have
done
at
the
world
trade
organization.
I
view
it
in
three
different
levels
at
the
highest
level.
I
look
at.
D
How
do
we
ensure
that
we
have
standardization
for
truly
those
unique
elements
that
are
required,
regardless
of
use
case,
and
so
as
an
example,
we
think
about
items
like
identity,
identity
of
things
and
identity
of
organizations,
and
I
think
it's
really
good
for
us
to
note
that
we
don't
need
to
start
from
scratch
in
this
space.
There's
already
standards
out
there
that
everyone
can
actually
leverage.
So
when
you
think
about
standards,
the
one
thing
is
creating
a
group
of
people
to
try
and
create
new
ones,
but
the
other
part
is
potentially
looking
at.
D
What's
out
there
and
actually
adopting
standards
like
life
or
gs1,
and
the
solutions
that
you're
producing
the
second
one
I
would
highlight
is
when
we
think
about
that.
You
know
supply
chain
process
or
trade
process
itself.
Emanuel
spoke
about
all
the
various
different
documents
that's
found
in
there,
and
so
we
do
need
to
figure
out.
D
How
do
we
standardize
electronic
bill
of
lighting
warehouse
receipts
and
start
removing
friction
so
that
our
smes
can
pick
the
platform
that
they
want
to
use
and
not
have
to
sign
up
to
five
or
six
and
execute
their
business
processes?
And
again,
the
good
news
is
there's
a
lot
of
great
work
that
is
already
happening
from
we've.
Seen
the
dcsa
releasing
an
ebook
standard.
Fiat
is
working
on
an
ebol
standard.
D
B
So
I
think
we're
going
to
cut
to
where
we
are
today
we're
going
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
regulatory,
but
I
think
we're
going
to
cut
to
now.
Basically
the
call
to
action
right.
So
we
see
you
know
regulatory
technical,
all
these
pieces
in
place
so
and
we
actually
have
a
question,
I'm
looking
at
the
q
a
so
some.
This
is
a
very
good
question
right.
So
what
can
public
private
partnership
do
to
accelerate
this
adoption?
So
I'm
not
going
to
pass
this
to
palm
beach.
I
think
he
he'll
build.
B
F
I'm
not
going
to
take
89
minutes
julian,
so
so
so,
certainly
from
again
from
what
we
learned
from
the
study
is:
how
do
we
move
forward
and,
as
as
oswald
said,
there's
already
standards
out
there,
but
people
are
looking
for
that.
Nirvana
end-to-end
standard!
Well,
that's
going
to
come
and
that
will
form
as
implementations
deployments.
F
Lessons
are
learned
as
to
how
trade
and
digitization
of
that
trade
and
trade
finance
happens.
What
we
heard
from
the
study
was
sort
of
four
phases
of
how
do
we?
How
do
we
bring
this
together?
One
was
how
to
establish
a
marketplace
where
people
could
come
together
in
a
natural
sort
of
place.
How
do
we
increase
membership
so
that
we
can
get
maximum
participation
and
have
inclusion
across
the
the
economy
from
microsmes
smes,
as
well
as
the
large
corporates?
F
How
do
you
drive
governance
and
then
how
do
you
drive
interoperability
or
interconnectivity,
because
underlying
technologies
are
fundamentally
different,
they're
apples
and
oranges
and
trying
to
get
into
the
weeds
again?
Our
study
says
well:
do
we
need
to
go
all
the
way
down
to
the
bottom,
but
it's
more
than
just
apis
at
the
application
there?
At
the
top,
is
there
an
interconnect
capability
and
what
we
found
was.
F
Look
at
academia
look
at
the
legal
aspect
of
the
movement
of
data
when
looking
at
documents
when
they're
digitized
and
how
the
the
law
commissions
in
certain
countries
need
to
re-look
at
what
they
are
doing
with
regards
to
the
digital
veracity
of
of
of
digital
signatures
and
digital
ids
above
and
beyond
documents,
and
that's
all
at
different
levels.
Singapore's
pretty
sophisticated
uk
is
going
through
a
whole
host
of
reviews
as
well
because
of
brexit,
so
there's
those
things
that
need
to
be
done.
G
Yeah,
if
I
can
just
add
in,
I
think
you
know
there
is
also,
if
you
look
at
the
lens
of
what
has
happened
right
in
the
last
five
years,
and
you
know
where
are
we
today
pumped
to
your
point
about
you
know
you
know,
are
we
actually,
according
to
the
study
you
know,
have
we
crossed
the
chasm
right?
So
you
know,
if
you
classically
look
at
you
know,
you
know
how
the
technologies
gets
adopted
by
the
businesses.
G
I
think
in
the
start
of
the
kovit-
and
you
know
nine
months
into
the
covenant
covetous
helped
us
to
cross
the
crazy
right.
So
we
are
now
into
this
early
majority,
where
a
number
of
customers
have
started
to
actually
see
and
create
that
ecosystem
of
network
themselves
to
feed
their
business
model,
and
that,
I
think,
is
something
you
know
I
to
a
little
earlier
fact
that
mark
talked
about
in
terms
of
the
challenges
that
exist
today.
G
Yeah
there
are
plenty
of
challenges,
but
if
you
look
at
the
positive
side
of
what
has
happened
in
last,
five
years
is
really.
There
is
a
success
in
terms
of
the
adoption
and
those
couple
of
things
that
we
saw.
We
could
be
helpful
to
share
here
because
there
is
always
challenges,
but
there
are
also
successes.
G
G
So,
in
other
words,
you
know,
if
he
does
process
x
way,
can
he
does
it
in
a
wide
way
and
then
looking
at
not
really
changing
the
world,
and
you
know
promising
a
lot
of
different
things
to
them,
but
implementing
a
japanese
principle
of
kaizen
doing
things
different,
but
slightly
incrementally
better
than
what
you
did
yesterday
and
then
providing
them
the
agility
to
stay.
The
course
I
think
has
resulted
into
you
know
the
adoption
that
we
saw
today,
then,
within
the
dlt
platform,
we
have
over
400
trading
companies,
21
corporates
and
45
banks.
G
Now,
if
you
look
at
emmanuel
your
table,
I
mean
the
production
approach
of
that
has
been
mirrored
with
the
challenges,
because,
maybe
only
apart
from
two
or
three,
what
you
see
on
this
betrayed
and
dealt
religious
and
others
there
are.
A
lot
of
people
are
still
in
the
in
the
concept
stage
because
they
get
stuck
on
the
the
technology
and
the
other
issues
which
cannot
be
solved
by
themselves.
G
But
if
you
look
at
the
trade
where
it
continues
to
happen
and
if
there
is
a
way
to
actually
help
them
with
an
adoption
model,
that's
why
I'm
a
big
proponent
of
actually,
you
know
solving
the
problem,
rather
than
saying
someone
else
needs
to
fix
it.
For
me,
who
is
not
a
part
of
this
panel
here
right,
it
is
about
because
trade
is
happening
to
palms
point
trade
is
increasing
right,
trade,
finance
grape
is
increasing,
so
if
people
are
doing
stuff
so
can
I
actually
do
it
better?
G
So
adoption
to
me
is
is
a
key
thing
where
we
have
invested
and
we
actually
have
come
out
with
a
patented
stuff
called
digital
readiness
index
which
actually
takes
along
every
party
in
along
with
you,
even
though
you
are
not
technically
into
the
any
of
those
roadmap
of
participating
into
the
network
right.
So
if
there
are
more
customer
facing
customer
related
adoption,
challenges
can
be
solved.
I
think
we
would
be.
You
know,
probably
looking
at
a
phase
two
or
phase
three
about
a
lot
of
different
regulatory
challenges.
G
That
could
come
our
way
because
we
can't
solve
that.
It's
the
government's
needs
to
help
and
solve
the
soul
to
us,
but
the
trade
happens
right,
so
just
wanted
to
kind
of
lay
that,
on
top
of
you
know
the
positive
aspect
of
what
has
happened
in
this
world
march
of
this
year
or
april
of
this
year.
As
we
say
internally,
we
have
crossed
the
chasm,
so
we
are
into
the
early
majority,
and
that
is
really
positive.
C
Julian,
if,
if
you
let
me,
I
would
like
to
jump
in
and
come
back
to
this
question
of
a
public
private
partnership
which,
in
my
view,
is,
is
critical.
We
heard
oswald
about
the
importance
of
standardization.
Another
aspect
we
need
to
work
on
is
regulation,
and
we
heard
mark.
We
heard
atul
talk
about
that.
Why
is
it
critical?
It's
often
actually
somewhat
an
overlooked
dimension,
I
would
say,
but
you
can
have
a
great
technology
to
digitalize
trade.
C
The
fact
of
the
matter
is
that
if
your
legislation
does
not
recognize
these
signatures
and
it
documents,
you
won't
go
very
far
in
digitalizing
trade,
and
there
are
only
about
60
countries
around
the
world
that
allow
for
some
form
of
recognition
of
the
signatures
and
eat
arguments.
So
we
need
to
to
to
work
on
this.
On
this
I
mean
this
is
a
good
start
to
have
60
countries,
but
this
is
not
enough.
C
C
We
need
to
make
sure
that
we
have
this
public
private
cooperation
to
really
move
the
needle,
and
this
is
where
I
think
the
private
sector
has
a
key
role
to
plan,
so
this
is
in
a
way,
my
my
call
to
action.
Talk
to
your
regulators
explain
the
opportunities
that
blockchain
opens
in
simple
terms,
because
if
you
start
talking
about
hashing
etc,
they
won't
follow
you.
But
I
think
it's
critical
to
tell
them
that
you
need
that
enabling
regulatory
framework
that
you
need
legal
clarity
in
order
to
make
it
work.
D
Honest
honestly,
there's
two
things
in
my
mind:
the
first
is
exactly
what
emanuel
said.
We
can't
just
have
one
country
having
adopted
due
to
trolls
model
or
for
electronic
transferable
records.
We
need
to
all
mobilize
and
if
you
are
reliant
on
trade
digitization
for
business
continuity
or
productivity,
you
need
to
know
what
the
model
law
for
the
chronic
transferable
records
from
your
controllers
and
how
you
can
play
a
part.
B
F
A
quick
fire,
quick
10
seconder
for
everybody
julian,
which
is
first
of
all
just
on
interconnect.
It's
happening
so
keep
watching
space
but
kill
around
question
for
everybody
quickly.
How?
How
likely
do
you
think
we're
going
to
be
successful
with
trade
and
trade
finance
digitization
with
blockchain
mark
five
seconds
out
of
ten.
G
F
B
A
F
And
then
just
my
view,
digitizing
alone
is
not
going
to
be
enough.
Digitizing
with
trust
covid
has
shown
has
to
happen.
We
have
to
do
something
different,
we're
seeing
good
patterns
and
I
think
we're
at
about
seven
out
of
ten,
but
if
we
continue
to
to
digitize
and
start
playing
as
oswald
said
start
the
journey,
then
the
likelihood
is
far
sooner
than
20.
30
mark
you've
got
to
pull
it
in
a
bit.
E
Maybe
it's
me
being
a
little
bit
pragmatic,
but
I
mean,
as
I
see
like
me
like
you
know,
we've
got
60
countries
so
far.
Who
is
actually
accepting
ae
signatures?
I
mean
there's
a
lot
more
countries
that
we
need
that
need
to
accept
e-signatures
and
will
they
accept
it
within
the
next
five
years?
The
same
in
terms
of
digitization,
of
an
acceptance
of
that
digital,
you
know
documentation
one
country.
E
Do
we
think
that
all
of
the
other
countries
are
going
to
get
there
in
five
years?
I
would
want
them
absolutely
and
we'll
do
everything
we
possibly
can
to
enable
that
to
help
them
to
accelerate
it,
and
I
think
you
know
if
we
have
more
events-
and
I
say,
glow
global
events-
you
know
such
as
covet.
Yes,
it
has
accelerated
certain
topics,
but
has
it
accelerated
enough
or
do
we
feel
that
people
will
come
back
later
to
the
old
ways?
I
hope
not.
G
Absolutely
it's
again
80
20
right.
I
mean
it's
because
it
never
be
hundred
percent
in
that
sense
right,
so
it's
eight
or
ten
trade
routes
of
the
world.
If
those
can
be
digitized,
I
think
you
know
you
know.
Maybe
you
know
other
countries
bottom
part
may
never
be
there
right.
So
again,
it's
not
going
to
be
a
binary
answer,
but
it's
probably
eighty
percent
of
the
trade
route
I
see
being
digitized
end-to-end
in
the
next
five
years.
B
Awesome:
okay,
there's
a
lot
of
questions
julian.
There
are
14
questions,
there's
40
questions,
but
I
think
actually
we're
meant
to
we're
coming
up
to
a
wrap,
but
I'm
I'm
happy
to
extend.
You
know
this
is
like
football.
We
have
extra
time
right,
so
I
I
think
that
the
the
question
may
be
about
you.
We've
never
talked
about
the
sig
right,
so
where
can
we
have
a?
I
don't
think
we'll
get
to
all
the
questions
today.
G
G
So
I
think
one
of
the
great
way
to
interconnect
as
emmanuel
said
is
to
really
work
together,
join
the
siege
and
potentially
also
extend
the
sig
to
to
the
other
members
of
the
other
networks
julian
right.
So
if
you
can
get
even
you
know,
other
networks
providers
like
there's
a
question
about
coda
or
question
about
ethereum
I
mean
we.
G
Can
we
actually
look
at
more
to
also
kind
of
include
them
into
this
sig
if
you
will
to
really
just
provide
that
interoperability
a
bit
more
realistic
sense,
so
that
we
could
have
some
conversation
like
that
happening.
But,
yes,
the
course
action
is
to
get
everybody.
Those
who
have
not
signed
up
please
sign
up.
The
vk
is
out
there
actually.
B
You
have
to
bring
it
to
an
end
now
right.
I
think
most
of
my
looking
through
the
questions
most
to
be
answered,
but
to
those
people
out
there
we
will.
I
will
send
an
email,
we'll
send
an
email
to
everyone
attending
right
with
with
a
with
an
overview
with
this
video
right
and
answer
some
of
those
questions.
But
really,
if
you
want
to
do
the
questions,
maybe
we
should
have
a
session
in
our
sig
to
go
through
some
of
those
questions.
B
We
do
have
a
time
it's
at
4,
30,
singapore
time,
8
30,
uk
time
every
two
weeks,
so
I
will
go
through
some
of
those
questions,
probably
the
next.
The
next
session,
actually
where
we
have
china
systems,
are
working
through
something
on
electronic
biller
lading.
So
thank
you
so
much
all
you
panelists.
What
are
great
experts.
I
wish
we
had
more
time
now.
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
Thank
you
and
I
think
we're
gonna
finish
here.
Take
care
everyone
and
keep
safe
everyone.
Thank
you.
Bye.