►
From YouTube: Climate Dividends intro and open discussion
Description
A recording of the Hyperledger Climate Action and Accounting Special Interest Group on November 16, 2021 featuring a discussion with Ivan Communod, Pierre Lagarde, Medhi Coly about Climate Dividends.
To get involved with the Hyperledger Climate Action and Accounting Special Interest Group, find out more at: https://wiki.hyperledger.org/display/CASIG
More about the event is at: https://wiki.hyperledger.org/display/CASIG/CA2+SIG+-+Meeting+November+16
----
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A
Fantastic,
we're
also
still
also
recording,
okay,
well
welcome
everybody
to
the
november
16th
meeting
of
the
climate
action
and
accounting
special
interest
group.
We've
got
a
group
of
really
interesting
speakers
today
to
speak
about
climate
dividends,
I'm
very
interested
in
hearing
about
this.
I
want
to
kind
of
start
off
just
with
a
couple
housekeeping
things,
just
a
quick
reminder
that
that
our
group
and
hyperledger
follow
the
anti-trust
policy
of
the
linux
foundation.
A
So
keep
that
in
mind
in
sharing
the
sharing
information
that
you
have
or
any
code
that
you
submit
there's
more
information
at
the
bottom
of
this
meeting
page.
In
addition,
we
follow
hyper
ledger's
code
of
conduct
so
really
important
to
make
sure
that
everybody
behave
in
a
respectful
and
responsible
manner.
There's
a
link
there.
You
can
find
out
more
about
that
before
we
hop
into
the
meeting.
I
wanted
to
give
a
chance
to
see
if
there
are
any
newcomers
to
the
meeting.
A
C
C
A
Okay?
So
with
that
in
mind,
so
I
want
to
introduce
ivan
kumunod
and
I'm
apologized
by
butcher
names,
pierre
legard
and
betty
coley
there
with
time
for
the
planet
and-
and
so
a
lot
of
you,
I
mean
everybody
on
the
call
kind
of
knows
a
little
bit
about
the
background
here.
But
this
is
really
a
discussion
about
dividends
and
and
and
carbon
emissions
and
and
using
blockchain
to
kind
of
to
drive
this
and
so
I'll
I'll.
A
D
A
D
So
my
background
is:
is
I'm
a
tech
sales,
tech
entrepreneur?
I
joined
time
for
the
planet
and
we
co-created
a
company
called
carbon
time
and
I'm
currently
running
this
company
for
a
carbon
removal
solution,
especially
mineralization,
but
today
we're
going
to
present
something
that
we
work
for
carbon
dividends
so
I'll.
Let
pierre
also
present
himself.
B
Yes,
thank
you
so
tiana,
I'm
work
for
microsoft
in
windows,
organizations
and
I'm
follow
time
for
the
planet
to
create
the
connection
between
time
for
the
planet
and
the
green
software
foundations
based
on
linux
foundations.
Maybe
you
know
you
know
the
the
green
software
foundations
and
to
to
try
to
to
create
this
connection.
B
So
I'm
here
to
to
create
this
connection
again
and
happy
to
to
join
this
call,
and-
and
thank
you
for
take
the
time
to
to
follow
this
project,
because
in
I'm,
chair
of
the
green
software
innovations
working
groups
in
the
software
in
the
in
the
foundations
and
I'm
supporting
this
project
in
in
the
width
software
foundation.
So
that's
why
it's
very
interesting
to
create
this
connection
between
two
foundations
based
on
the
linux
foundations.
B
E
F
F
Are
you
a
human
being
good
we're
talking
to
you
if
you're
also
personally,
concerned
by
the
climate
emergency-
and
you
are
an
executive
of
a
company,
a
bank
or
an
investment
fund,
then
we
have
more
good
news.
You
have
great
power
to
act
and,
as
you
probably
know,
with
great
power
comes
great
responsibility.
F
The
first
part
of
these
responsibilities,
as
you
know,
is
to
take
stock
of
your
carbon
footprint.
You
take
everything
you
have
emitted
this
year
in
co2
and
you
categorize
it
into
the
main
types
of
emissions.
From
now
on,
your
mission
is
to
reduce
everything
you
can
reduce,
but
unfortunately
we
know
emitting
zero
co2.
Is
it
possible
to
understand
this?
Let's
look
at
the
remaining
emissions,
the
ones
you
absolutely
can't
reduce
see
these
are
other
people's
emissions.
This
is
what
we
generally
call
scope.
3
of
the
carbon
footprint.
F
As
long
as
the
air
conditioning
you
use
in
your
offices
contains
powerful
greenhouse
gases
as
long
as
your
raw
materials
are
extracted
thanks
to
oil
and
as
long
as
your
servers
consume
vast
quantities
of
carbon-based
energy,
you
can't
go
any
further
in
your
reduction
process
to
reach
a
net
zero
contribution.
We
need
a
collective
global
investment
to
finance
the
necessary
innovations
for
change
and
create
carbon
sinks,
and
for
that
we
currently
use
carbon
credits.
F
F
Every
year,
this
dividend
corresponds
to
a
number
of
tons
of
co2,
equivalent,
captured
or
reduced,
for
example,
the
co2
reduced
thanks
to
a
company
that
markets,
the
first
air
conditioning
without
hfc
gases,
which
are
2800
times
more
harmful
to
the
climate
than
co2,
become
a
shareholder
of
this
company,
and
you
will
receive
climate
dividends
every
year,
based
on
the
number
of
tons
of
co2
that
have
been
captured
or
reduced
thanks
to
this
system.
Yes,
every
year
with
zero
time
limit
with
time
for
the
planet,
we
can
be
even
more
effective.
F
We
only
create
companies
based
on
an
innovation
which
aims
to
reduce
greenhouse
gas
emissions
on
a
global
scale.
These
innovations
are
open
source,
allowing
any
company
to
copy,
improve
and
market
them.
So
every
year
we
add
up
to
the
co2
reduced
by
our
own
companies
and
those
of
all
the
companies
that
use
our
innovation
in
open
source
and
that
can
add
up
to
a
lot
of
companies
a
lot
of
co2
and
a
lot
of
dividends
that
total
co2
is
then
distributed
to
our
shareholders
in
the
form
of
climate
dividends.
F
If
you
own,
one
percent
of
time,
shares
you
get
one
percent
of
that
total
co2
back
thanks
to
the
open
source,
shared
innovations
and
continuous
improvement
year
after
year,
the
climate
dividend
is
exponential,
and
it's
all
thanks
to
a
single
initial
financial
investment.
In
short,
the
sooner
you
invest
the
greater
your
climate
returns.
This
is
a
snowball
effect.
You
receive
climate
dividends
from
all
the
companies
created
after
your
investment.
Thus,
the
older
your
time
for
the
planet
shares
are
the
greater.
Their
impact
is
with
climate
dividends.
E
E
E
E
But
the
problem
is
that
when
you
invest
on
something
that
is
good
for
the
climate,
so,
for
example,
let's
say
here:
you're
an
investor
and
you
target
a
company
that
can
sell
carbon
credits
to
other
customers.
Here,
for
example,
let's
take
the
most
sim.
The
simplest
example
is
just
forest
company
that
plants
trees.
E
E
E
E
It
was
ey
who
made
the
the
the
contents
and
we
had
a
working
group
with
the
french
government.
We
had
the
collaboration
of
people
from
a
large
number
of
different
companies,
global
companies,
small
companies
and
as
well,
the
french
government,
and
so
this.
This
first
version
now
needs
to
become
a
standard,
and
so
for
that,
what
we
need
is
to
to
have
a
second
working
group
and
in
this
second
working
group,
we
would
really
like
to
have
linux
with
us.
E
The
goal
for
for
us
will
will
be
for
linux
to
provide
the
the
software
that
the
open
source
software,
obviously
where
the
data
that
allows
to
distribute
the
climate
dividends
will
be
stored.
For
example,
if
we
contact
gold,
standard
or
vera
or
any
other
standard
like
that,
they
have
the
information
that
can
help
to
create
the
climate
dividends.
For
example,
they
know
which
company
has
edited
and
sold
which
carbon
credits,
and
so
with
this
information.
E
Last
thing:
we
believe
that
blockchain
could
be
the
technology
behind
the
this
this
software
and
we
believe
that
it's
possible
to
have
climate
dividends
as
a
kind
of
electronic
money.
That
would
be
maybe
the
third
step.
It's
not
something
we're
gonna
do
now,
but
the
what
we
do
right
now
for
for
next
year
is
to
create
the
second
working
group.
It's
something
we
want
to
do
collectively.
D
Exactly
thank
you,
so,
just
just
just
couple
of
lines
before
we
we
we
kick
up
to
the
the
qa
session,
because
we
are
here
to
really
discuss
the
the
concept
is
as
you've
understood
into
the
into
the
video,
as
well
as
on
the
different
presentation.
This
is
not
a
a
cabin
credits.
This
is
really
something
that
is
not
financial.
D
A
A
I'm
assuming
that,
if
they're
investing
in,
for
example
in
airlines,
let's
assume
that
that
airlines
is
also
accounting
for
all
the
emissions
that
they're
responsible
for
and
so
in
my
mind
for
some
reason,
I'm
kind
of
I'm
I'm
I'm
understanding
that
it's
double
counting
in
a
certain
way
right,
because
the
investment
is
counting
for
carbon
emissions,
that
an
organization
is
accounting
for
itself
right.
If
an
organization
is
accounting
for
soda
missions,
does
it
make
sense
to
break
it
up
according
to
all
the
different
investment
investors
who
own
a
piece
of
that?
A
If
all
those
investors
are
also
facing
their
missions,
like
I'm,
assuming
on
the
percentage
ownership
that
they
have
in
that
organization,
that
are
there
kind
of
two
to
account
for
that
one,
the
organization
itself
and
then
all
the
stakeholders
are
also
adding
that
to
their
books
as
well.
Isn't
that
double.
E
E
A
Got
it
yep?
Okay,
we
we,
I
kind
of
the
reason
I
asked
that
is
because
we,
my
mindset,
is
in
the
world
of
this
of
this
climate
accounting
system
that
we
kind
of
talk
a
lot
which
double
counting's
is
a
major
problem,
but
what
you
said
makes
sense.
I
had
another
question
for
you
with
regards
to
the
solution
that
you're
developing
I'm,
assuming
that
the
met
the
mr
you're
not
looking
at
really
solving
the
mrv
solution.
A
At
the
very
end,
that's
grabbing
the
data
you're,
essentially
just
looking
to
build
the
blockchain
system
that
can
bring
in
all
the
data,
that's
provided
by
whatever
mrv
solutions
provided
and
and
kind
of
track.
That
information
is
that
correct,
yeah
yeah,
exactly
that's
correct!
Okay,
and
this
is
another
one.
Can
you
re-explain
the
difference
between
carbon
carbon
credits
and
a
carbon
dividend.
E
Okay,
so
first
difference
is
about
value:
carbon
credits.
It's
a
financial
value,
because
one
carbon
credits
is
100
co2
and
is
a
number
of
dollars,
because
you
are
going
to
purchase
the
carbon
credits
on
the
platform,
so
it
can
be
five
dollars.
Six
dollars
can
be
a
lot
more.
Co2
dividends
is
an
extra
financial
value.
It's
it's.
An
annual
disclosure
of
the
amount
of
total
student
capital
reduced
as
a
result
of
my
investments.
E
The
second
thing
is
that
the
carbon
credits
can
be
transferred,
you
can
buy
crowd
credits
and
then
you
can
sell
cap
on
credits
in
in
the
co2
in
the
climate
dividend.
Here
it's
written
co2
dividends,
but
the
the
the
good
name
is
climate
evidence.
So
the
climate
dividend
cannot
be
transferred
transferred
because
you
you
have
each
year
the
information
of
the
climate
dividends
that
you
can
own
because
you
are
a
shareholder
of
the
company.
E
So
as
long
as
you're
a
shareholder
of
this
company,
you
will
earn
climate
dividends,
you
don't
have
to
buy
something
else.
You
just
need
to
be
a
shareholder,
that's
all,
and
the
legal
nurture
is
very
different,
because
carbon
credits
is
a
fungible
personal
property,
something
you
own
and
the
co2
dividends
is
a
shareholder
rights.
It's
something
that
you
can
earn
one
each
year
because
you're
a
shareholder,
so
that's
very
different,
but
for
for
double
counting.
A
C
Thanks
sherwood
appreciate
it
a
great
presentation,
gents,
a
quick
question
for
you,
just
as
I'm
we're
watching
the
world
of
greater
shareholder
activism
around
esg,
this
seems
to
fit
really
really
well
in
there
and
I
just
want
to
make
sure
I'm
understanding
the
the
dynamics
you're
you're,
aiming
at
those
companies
that
are
working
to
sequester
or
some
way,
minimize
carbon
emissions
and
or
the
investors
in
those
companies
a
is
that
correct
and
b?
How
has
that
process
gone
in
explaining
and
kind
of
educating
those
two
kind
of
unique
demographics.
E
E
The
first
way
is
just
to
say:
okay,
I'm
going
to
invest
in
companies
that
are
respectful
for
the
environment,
who
have
a
strategy
to
not
have
too
much
emissions.
It's
not
what
we're
targeting.
What
we're
targeting
is
the
second
it's
it's
companies
that
have
been
created
because
they
have
an
innovation
that
can
decrease
climate
change,
for
example,
a
acclimatization
with
no
hfc
gas,
which
is
two
percent
of
global
co2
emissions.
E
If
you
have
this
innovation
and
that
you
want
to
bring
it
to
the
market,
then
you
will
say
to
your
investors:
hey,
come
put
money
here
and
you
will
have
climate
dividends
a
lot
of
climate
dividends,
because
this
this
product,
each
time
it's
going
to
be
installed
somewhere,
it's
going
to
be
5
ton,
10
ton,
100
tons
of
co2
that
will
be
reduced,
and
so
it's
it's!
It's
it's
more
about
finding
and
the
the
best
innovation
then
having
a
good
behavior
in
choosing
in
which
in
in
which
company
you're
going
to
invest.
D
A
C
B
B
E
C
That's
all
right,
I
appreciate
it
yeah.
Thank
you
for
sharing
your
idea
this
morning.
My
question
is,
you
know,
I
understand
the
that
the
benefit
of
creating
the
the
dividends
in
order
for
people
to
get
back
kind
of
a
badge
of
honor
for
their
participation
in
the
network
of
you
know,
building
up
business
that
does
take.
You
know
that
that
does
reduce
carbon
emissions.
Are
these
companies,
though?
Are
they
going
to
be?
You
know?
C
Are
they
going
to
be
working
with
vera's
and
gold
standards
on
the
other
side
than
issuing
carbon
credits?
That
will
you
know
that
will
count
for
the
reduction
in
emissions,
because
that's
going
to
bring
in
more
revenue
to
the
company,
which
is
also
going
to
be
used
for
more
investment.
So
in
a
way
that
was
kind
of
mentioned
before,
like
that
it
does
seem
like
double
counting,
even
though
this
is
not
a
fungible
asset,
because
it
is
used
to
generate
more
revenue
and
encourage
more
investment
into
the
project.
E
Yeah
clearly,
our
goal
now
is
to
have
vera
gold
standard
and
sptr
on
board.
On
the
on
the
second
working
group,
we
believe
that
it's
not
a
problem
to
have
this
double
counting,
it's
more
a
solution,
because
you
need
to
be
able
to
value
what
you
do
as
a
client
customer
you've,
you've
bought
credits
and
you
can
use
those
credits
to
claim
climate
neutral,
something
like
that
for
your
company.
E
So
that's
the
first
part
and
the
second
part
you
need
to
show
that
you
use
your
money
to
help
resolving
the
problem
of
climate
change,
and
for
that
you
will
have
climate
dividends
and
those
climate
dividends.
You
cannot
add
them
to
your
carbon
credits,
to
say:
hey,
I'm
carbon
neutral,
it's
not
the
same
goal,
and
so
it's
clearly
written
in
all
the
documentation
of
the
climate
dividends
that
you
cannot
add
them
to
something
else
or
subtract
it
to
your
carbon
footprints.
E
E
C
Yes,
I
have
three
what
ifs:
how
does
it
work
if
you
are
only
responsible
for
your
scope,
one?
How
does
it
work
if
it
is
only
available
to
individuals,
and
it's
only
the
ceo
that
gets
all
of
the
credit
for
the
company
and
how
does
it
work
if
a
financial
genius
monetizes
the
reputational
value,
and
when
can
we
beta
test
the
operational
product.
E
So,
first
first
thing:
if
you
are
in
a
company
where
you
have
classic
the
ceo,
some
founders
and
you've
got
financial
funds
inside
then
the
climate
dividends
will
be
very
interesting
specifically
for
the
financial
part.
Clearly,
because
the
ceo
will
be
happy
to
have
a
climate
dividends,
but
it's
not
something
which
will
be
game
changer
for
him.
E
What
you
can
do
if
you
want
to
value
that
death
differently
and
it's
something
we
do
in
time
for
the
planet,
it's
that
in
or
when
we
invest
in
the
rules.
You
know
the
the
that
are
done
at
the
moment
when
we
invest,
we
say
time
for
the
planet
is
going
to
earn
100
of
the
climate
dividends
that
would
be
generated,
and
in
exchange
we
give
you
more
shares,
or
we
give
you
more
more
importance
in
something
else.
It's
it's
something
that
you
can
discuss
because
it's
an
asset.
E
So
it's
it's
exactly
the
same
as
anything
else
that
you
would
be
important
in
your
company.
You
can
distribute
it
as
you
want,
but
if
there's
nothing
that
has
been
specifically
been
written,
then
if
you've
got
15
percent
of
the
company
and
you've
got
50
percent
of
the
dividends,
the
climate
dividends,
then
what
happens?
E
For
example,
kpmg
now
is
label
labelized
for
climate
dividends,
so
it's
official,
and
so,
if
you
don't
have
this
company
who
is
going
to
say
here
is
the
the
official
number
of
climate
dividends
that
you
can
give
to
your
shareholders
this
year,
then
your
climate
dividends
is
is
not
a
real
one.
It's
not
official.
So
that's
that's
very
important
and
last
thing
as
climate
dividends
is
not
something
you
can
sell.
E
What
you
can
sell
is
the
shares
of
your
company,
and
if
you
share
this,
the,
if
you
sell
those
shares,
then
the
person
who
is
going
to
buy
the
shares
will
earn
climate
dividends
every
year.
So
that's
a
way
for
shares
to
have
more
value,
because
there
is
the
value
linked
to
the
financial
part
of
the
company,
but
as
well
to
the
impact
part
of
the
company.
And
we
really
believe
that
in
some
at
some
points,
this
is
going
to
be
more
important
than
the
financial
value.
D
And
just
to
add
to
you
to
your
latest
point,
so
the
better.
The
better
is
already
available,
because
this
is
the
way
time
for
the
planet
is
incentivizing
all
the
investors,
whether
whether
they
are
companies,
individuals
or
funds,
to
basically
invest
in
time
to
get
as
early
as
possible.
Because
if
they
invest
in
the
company
very
early,
they
will
have
the
investment
of
the
year
that
is
being
performed
by
by
the
investment
fund,
which
means
it's
an
an
hesitation
to
invest
earlier
into
impact
fund
projects.
A
I
so
tr
and
elizabeth.
You
still
have
your
hands
up.
Do
you
have
additional
questions?
No,
I
I've
I'm
struggling
a
little
bit
with
the
dividend
concept
still
because
in
my
mind
I
think
dividend
I
think
financial
value.
My
understanding,
my
misunderstanding
was
that
the
dividend
was
essentially
going
to
be
like
a
carbon
credit,
something
that
the
gold
standard
would
kind
of
verify
and
by
having
an
ownership
stake
in
that
company.
You'd
have
a
dividend
of
carbon
credits
that
you'd
be
then
able
to
sell
for
monetary
value.
A
What
I'm
kind
of
hearing
is
that
the
dividends
are
more
kind
of
like
a
just
an
impact
recognition
exactly
for
an
organization
with
and
that
impact
recognition
essentially
allows
that
organization
to
kind
of
show.
You
know
the
the
environment,
the
positive
environmental
impact
that
it's
important,
that
investments
are
are
making
right.
A
E
E
First
question
is:
is
so
if
company
c
has
a
carbon
footprint
of
500
tons
of
co2
equivalent
for
year,
a
y
then
then
are
invested
in
time
for
the
planet
and
they
earn
100
dividends
from
time
for
the
planet
in
in
this
year.
Can
companies
see
then
report
only
400
tons
of
co2?
So
the
answer
here
is
no
because
it's
forbidden
to
subtract
your
climate
dividends
to
your
carbon
footprint.
It's
very
important.
What
you
can
do
is
saying
hey
this
year.
I've
got
shares
from
time
for
the
planet.
E
E
E
They
are
targeting
classic
companies
and
then,
when
they
are
studying
the
the
opportunities
they
are
going
to
check
some
criterias
to
see?
Okay
here
they
respect
they're,
respectful
of
the
environment.
Here,
they're,
not
a
lot
respectful.
But
if
you
ask
vcs
to
find
innovations
who
can
that
can
generate
climate
dividends,
then
vcs
are
going
to
find
innovations
that
can
really
change
the
game.
A
I
think
there's
also
you
see,
the
suggestions
sounds
like
the
climate
dividends
would
be
a
great
instrument
to
propose
to
propose,
as
part
of
the
recommendations
of
the
task
force
on
climate-related
financial
disclosures
for
corporations.
I
think
they
would
soak
this
up
important
to
define
from
the
beginning
this.
This
is
not
a
spec
spatial
dividend
paid
to
shareholders.
C
C
I
think
that's
their
focus,
and
this
is
this-
is
clearly
on
their
lines
and
along
those
lines,
and
it
sort
of
you
know
sets
the
standards
for
reputation
for
creating
reputation
for
corporations
on
their
climate
commitments
and
that's
clearly
what
you
guys
are
doing,
but
you're
operationalizing
it
in
a
way
that
I
don't
think
they've
really
thought
about.
Perhaps
I
mean
maybe
they
have
but
it'd
be
interesting
to
see
how
you
know
some
sort
of
synergy
between
what
you're
doing
and
what
they're
proposing
as
an
actual
instrument.
Right.
C
C
A
Yeah
thanks
for
making
that
connection
vetron,
so
it
sounds
like
you
in
the
in
the
very
beginning
of
your
of
the
presentation.
Kind
of
part
of
your
motivation
for
for
kind
of
sharing,
with
the
group
and
and
kind
of
becoming
a
little
bit
more
just
well
known
within
kind
of
starting.
The
conversation
with
with
linux
hyperledger
is,
is
the
interest
in
beginning
to
build
out
some
of
the
infrastructure
for
kind
of
tracking
some
of
these
dividends.
A
So
I
was
wondering
if
you
might
share-
and
I
had
some
suggestions
for
you
know
how
you
might
be
able
to
kind
of
start
working
in
the
community
and
building
awareness
around
that.
But
I'd
love
to
hear
a
little
bit
about
the
specific
needs.
The
specific
features
of
this
solution
that
you
envisioned
to
kind
of
help
everybody
start
to
get
their
head
around.
What
what
would
need
to
be
built.
E
Yeah,
okay,
you've
got
the
first
thing:
is
the
companies
or
structure
where
we
can
find
the
data,
so
this
is
clearly
gold
standard
vera,
spt
et
cetera,
so
we
need
to
to
plug
with
them
in
some
way.
So
that's
something
to
discuss
with
them
so
that
we
can
have
the
information
on
the
platform
of
which
company
has
sold,
how
much
carbon
credits
we
don't
need
here
to
see
if
the
carbon
credits
is
linked
to
a
real
co2
emissions
reduction,
because
it
has
been
something
that
vera
and
christopher
has
already
checked.
E
So
that's
very
important,
then.
The
second
step
is
that
when
you've
got
this
data,
you
need
to
store
the
data
and
then
to
allow
any
company
to
say.
Okay,
I
see
that
I
can
create
an
account
to
claim
that
I
am
this
company
and
I
will
declare
my
shareholders
as
soon
as
I've
declared
my
shareholders,
then
the
personal
account
of
each
shareholder
is
created,
so
the
shareholder
can
receive
the
information
and
say:
hey.
Okay,
this
is
your
wallet
in
this
wallet.
E
E
E
Sweep
has
a
solution,
other
solutions
to
create
your
carbon
footprint
as
a
company
easier
easily,
and
so
you
can
have
modules
in
which
you
say:
okay,
this
is
my
carbon
footprint.
This
is
my
c
my
climate
dividends
you
can
plug
that
directly
and
last
thing.
It
can
be
interesting,
I'm
not
really
sure,
but
it's
something
that
I
can
share
with
you
to
to
to
to
find
a
way
that
each
climate
dividends,
because
it
becomes
a
kind
of
of
crypto.
So
that's
a
token
yeah.
So
then
you
can.
E
You
can
use
that
as
well
as
as
something
that
you
can
directly
change
on
on
on
this
market,
but
this
part
is
more
the
vision.
It's
not
something
we're
gonna
do
now
and
I'm
not
sure
it's
it's
important
to
do
it.
That's
why
we
want
to
create
this
working
group,
because
we
need
to
be
a
lot
of
people
thinking
about
about
that
to
to
make
a
good
choice.
C
I
just
make
a
quick,
just
quick
jumping,
so
essentially,
what
you're
saying
is
in
the
long
run,
is
finding
ways
to
transform
the
climate
dividend
into
some,
something
that
replicates
a
capital
dividend,
because
the
minute
you're
making
this
you
know
available
on
exchange
for
cryptocurrencies,
which
represent
you,
know
some
sort
of
money.
This
is
becoming
a
capital,
something
like
a
capital
dividend.
C
E
E
It's
the
the
basic
of
the
system
is
here,
but
if
you,
if
you
create
an
attachment
to
your
climate
dividends,
which
is
exactly
what
happens
with
with
tokens,
then
you
can
have
something
like
a
secondary
market
or
something
like
that.
But
I
I
think
that
this
will
not
will
not
have
any
impact
on
the
principle
of
climate
evidence,
because
it's
something
else.
C
A
C
A
You
know,
credits
that
are
out
there
and
who
owns
them
into
selling
them.
It
seems
like
that
is
the
kind
of
first
part
of
the
product
requirements
that
you
described
to
me.
But
then
it
sounds
like
there's
another
component
that
kind
of
brings
in
you
know
the
the
kind
of
connects
that
to
the
the
the
ownership
of
the
different
kind
of
corporate
entities
that
that
have
they
own
the
dividends,
and
so
so
I
wanted
to.
A
E
Yeah,
we
think
that
carbon
credits
and
climate
dividends
has
to
work
together
because
it's
the
same
thing,
but
with
two
different
goals.
So
we
don't
need
to
create
something
totally
new
with
climate
dividends.
That's
why
we,
we
can
only
trust
carbon
credits
that
are
already
been
verified,
and
so
the
best
way
to
do
that
is
to
have
one
database
shared
by
all
the
companies
that
want
to
share
their
information.
E
Some
can
be
official
disclosed
and
some
can
be
private,
so
public
or
private
that
really
doesn't
really
matter
the
one
who
are
the
most
active.
We
clearly
prefer
to
be
public
because
it's
something
that
shows
what
what
they
do
for
earth.
So
I
think
everybody
wants
to
show
this
information.
Does
it
have
such
a
good
question.
A
B
Actually,
I
am
trying
to
understand
so
you
are
creating
this
as
in
addition
to
like
a
actual
carbon
credit
right
that
could
be
registered
and
traded
and
sold
so,
and
this
is
something
that
people
cannot
sell
or
cannot
trade
right.
So,
like
I,
the
somebody
asked
this
question:
can
it
be
used
as
and
counted
as
the
against
the
overall
emissions
of
a
company
like
if
they
benchmark
their
scope?
One
two:
three:
can
they
then
take
your
carbon
dividend
and
count
against
it?.
D
D
Rs
registry,
so
it's
not
accountable
for
for
that.
It's
really
an
extra
financial
information,
but
shy
from
from
a
pure
mechanism
perspective.
It
takes
the
the
the
same
elements
to
be
computed
so
from
from
the
mechanics
that
that
we
can
think
of
either
a
larger
at
a
global
scale
and
at
the
second
time,
from
the
an
implementation
standpoint,
the
mechanism
between
how
to
measure
and
how
to
measure
the
impact
and
and
taking
from
the
eye
cutting
system
the
information
from
a
co2
standpoint.
B
Okay,
I
think
yeah
I
mean
that
sounds
fine,
there's.
Obviously,
a
lot
of
concern
about
double
counting
in
the
carbon
sure
credit
markets
right.
This
is
something
they
even
talked
about
last
couple
weeks
at
cop26
is
how
to
avoid
double
counting
of
carbon
credits.
So
if
it's
not
being
counted
against
any
kind
of
an
emissions
total
of
a
company
or
its
investors
or
whoever,
then
I
guess
that's
not
an
issue.
B
E
So
we
we
have
done
the
first
presentation
public
on
the
climate
dividends
and
it
was
one
month
ago-
and
we
invented
invited
european
companies
to
to
to
this
to
this
presentation,
and
we
had
clearly
a
hundred
percent
of
the
the
people
who
were
here,
who
were
very
interested
and
wanted
to
to
to
to
know
more,
so
we've
got
now
specific
presentations
to
each
each
member.
So
what
we
want
to
do
is
to
find
two
two
things.
E
C
Yeah,
I
I
just
reiterate,
I
think,
having
someone
from
the
the
tcfd
on
that
working
group
will
be
really
useful
for
you
guys,
because
I
think,
if
again
I'll
just
reiterate,
if,
if
they
can
back
this
as
a
recommendation,
that
will
motivate
the
second
group,
which
is
the
actual
companies
to
use
it.
Because
again,
a
lot
of
companies
are
just
following
what
the
tts
the
tcfd
recommends
because
of
the
sort
of
reputation
they
have,
including
you
know,
people
like
bloomberg
and
other
you
know
big.
You
know.
E
To
answer
to
the
to
the
question:
a
little
bit
more:
we've
got
in
time
for
the
planet,
so
it's
it's
the
the
the
action
of
time
prevalent.
We
have
two
companies
who
have
invested
more
than
one
million
only
for
climate
dividends,
which
means
that
they
have
that
when
they
they
they
put
money
in
the
project.
They
know
that
way.
D
Just
to
precise
time
for
the
planet
is
non-profit
fund.
So
that's
why
there's
none
none
non-profit,
so
this
was
also
a
way
to
give
back
to
to
to
shareholders
yeah,
but
by
giving
back,
basically
it's
another
institution
to
finance
small
projects.
So
I
was
the
first
company
to
be
financed
by
by
time
for
the
planet,
but
the
idea
is
to
create
much
more
much
more
of
those
companies
and
to
invest
more
money
into
that.
So
it's
a
virtual
circle.
E
D
The
question
of
elizabeth
was
why,
measuring
in
in
years
rather
than
weeks
or
decades,
the
the
measure
of
years
is
is
is
basically
very
specific
to
time
for
the
planet,
because
it's
a
quartz
of
project
in
a
in
a
year,
but
in
fact
the
measurement
is
is
of
course
done
like
any
type
of
project,
depending
on
the
on
the
regularity
of
the
of
those
measures.
It
could
be
a
real
time
or
it
could
be
every
every
year
at
minimum.
E
Yeah-
and
we
we
say
one
year
for
the
moment,
because
dividends,
financial
dividends
are
distributed
each
year,
so
it
can
be
the
same
with
climate
dividends
because
we
think
that
it's
exactly
the
same
mechanism
and
with
that's
why
we
use
the
term
dividends,
because
we
know
that
everybody
knows
the
evidence.
Everybody
knows
how
it
works.
So
it's
easier
to
have
this
this
in
mind.
So
one
year
is
one
distribution.
D
A
All
right:
well,
I
could
just
come
up
at
the
end
of
the
hour.
I
don't
see
any
further
questions.
This
has
been
really
interesting.
You
know
I
we
can.
I
can
follow
up
you
guys
offline
as
well,
now
that
we
have
a
better
understanding
of
what
you're
working
on
to
talk
to
a
little
bit
about
some
of
the
kind
of
tools
that
you
have
available
to
you.
A
D
Okay,
I
think
that
the
most
important
thing,
the
the
call
to
action,
is
that
we
are.
We
are
looking
forward
for
collaboration
and
in
order
to
push
forward
this
concept.
That
is,
that
has
received
really
a
lot
of
attention
in
europe
and
you
guys
are
based
all
over
the
world.
So
we
thought
it
was
a
good
idea
so
to
invite
you
guys
in
in
this
collaboration.