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From YouTube: House Standing Committee on Elections, Constitutional Amendments, & Intergovernmental Affairs-1/5/22
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A
A
Here
in
the
room,
okay,
I'd
like
to
remind
the
members
that
to
turn
off
turn
on
your
microphones
when
you're
speaking
and
turn
them
off
when
you're,
not
speaking,
silence
your
cell
phones
and
does
any
member
here
have
a
special
guest
they'd
like
to
recognize.
H
A
Okay!
We
will
attack
house
bill
2
first,
sponsored
by
representative
jerry
miller,
an
act
relating
to
redistricting
and
declaring
an
emergency
representative
miller.
The
floor
is
yours,.
F
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
thank
you
for
this.
Getting
this
committee
rolling
for
our
busy
week.
It's
been
a
week.
I've
looked
forward
to
for
many
months.
A
Motion
made
for
house
committee
sub
three
and
we
have
it
and
it
will
be
distributed
right.
A
Mr
chairman,
just
I
want
to
make
sure
everybody
has
all
right.
A
That's:
okay!
That's!
Okay!
All
right
does
everybody
have
one
all
right
motion
made
by
representative
miller?
Is
there
a
second
to
okay?
The
committee
sub
is
in
front
of
us
now.
A
Let's
do
a
roll
call.
What
this
is,
yes
means
that
committee
substitute
three
will
be
before
us
and
no
means
you
don't
want
that.
So.
A
C
E
D
C
G
F
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
The
house
bill
hb2
is
a
result
of
months
of
discussions,
work
and
listening
to
stakeholders.
I
want
to
recognize
the
commitment
of
everyone
to
the
redistricting
process
to
make
sure
it
meets
all
our
obligations
to
the
people
of
this
state,
as
well
as
the
lrc
staff.
I
want
to
thank
both
partisan
and
nonpartisan
that
helped
I'm
joined
at
the
table
by
tommy
druin
to
my
left,
who's
going
to
be
assisting
me
on
the
maps
and
representative
joe
fisher
as
everyone
in
the
room
is
aware.
F
The
kentucky
constitution
requires
the
legislature
to
redraw
district
boundaries
to
reflect
population
shifts
since
the
last
census.
It's
tedious
detailed
work
and
requires
a
thorough
understanding
of
often
conflicting
legal
and
constitutional
considerations.
Due
to
covid.
We
started
almost
six
months
late
then.
Otherwise
we
would
have
started
one
person,
one
vote,
that
is
the
rule.
The
kentucky
constitution
supreme
court
requirements
are
that
state
legislative
districts
be
quote
as
nearly
equal
to
population.
As
may
be
close
quote.
F
Our
supreme
court
has
interpreted
this
to
mean
the
state
legislative
districts
again
must
divide
the
fewest
number
of
counties
possible,
taking
into
account
the
plus
or
minus
five
percent
deviation
in
our
map.
Every
district
is
within
the
five
percent
going
from
a
low
of
4.39
to
a
high
of
4.8
areas
experiencing
high
growth
are
on
the
low
side
in
order
to
meet
the
needs
of
a
growing
district.
F
To
understand
why
this
is
important,
please
consider
that
representative
santoro
and
I
each
represent
over
56
000
people
versus
the
average,
the
new
average
of
45
058
people.
While
we
have
six
districts
that
have
fewer
than
forty
thousand
under
this
proposal,
hopkins
henderson
and
barron
counties
would
become
single
county
districts.
F
F
F
To
meet
all
legal
considerations
while
respecting
trying
to
keep
neighborhoods
and
communities
together,
in
fact,
using
two
recognized
standards
of
measuring
compactness
jefferson
county
is
30
percent,
more
compact
in
its
districts,
another
consideration
was
preserving
integrity
of
political
subdivisions
such
as
counties
and
precinct
lines.
Previous
maps
submitted
to
the
legislature
have
divided
as
many
as
153
precincts.
We
divide
none.
F
What
that
does
is.
There
are
some
very
large
and
very
strange
looking
precincts,
but
we
preserve
those
lines.
Continuity.
Another
consideration
was
preserving
the
continuity
of
representation.
That
is
allowing
voters
where
possible
the
opportunity
to
choose
to
continue
being
represented
by
the
representative.
They
elected
drafting
this
plan
included
several
very
difficult
realizations,
including
the
fact
that
districts
would
have
to
be
combined.
F
This
plan
places
four
pairs
of
incumbents
together,
including
two
democrats
and
two
republicans
for
perspective.
The
map
created
by
the
league.
That's
actually
four
democrats
in
two
districts
and
four
republicans
in
two
districts
for
perspective.
The
map
created
by
the
league
of
women
voters
pitted
at
least
11
sets
of
incumbents
against
each
other.
What
including
three
incumbents
in
one
district,
their
consideration.
Primary
consideration
was
compactness,
which
ours
was
not.
F
The
districts
in
question
include
one
in
far
western
kentucky
two
in
louisville
and
one
in
eastern
kentucky
doing
so
addressed
both
population
shifts
and
help
preserve
communities
of
interest.
The
voting
rights
act
kentucky
must,
like
all
states,
abide
by
the
voting
rights
act.
The
act
expressly
prohibits
discrimination
based
on
race
and
color.
We
did
not
use
race
as
a
factor
in
drawing
the
map
or
any
district,
but
we
did
analyze
the
result
to
ensure
that
it
complies
with
the
voting
rights
act
and
we
believe
it
fully
does
this.
F
We
create
four
minority,
heavily
minority
influence,
districts,
district
40,
42,
43
and
44,
and
district
30
increased
its
minority
influence
and
district
77
maintained
its
minority
influence.
F
I
am
very
happy
with
this
map.
I
mean
it
was
a
hard
hard
slog.
I
knew
people
would
not
be
happy
at
both
ends
of
the
state
and
both
ends
of
the
political
spectrum,
but
this
is
a
legal
map,
one
that
will
withstand
scrutiny
and,
mr
chairman,
I
ask
for
any
questions
of
the
members.
J
J
Okay-
and
I
do
have
a
question
from
someone
in
jessamine
county-
they
wanted
to
know
because
there's
so
much
dissatisfaction
in
their
county
with
the
maps
if
there
can
be
a
change
to
the
proposal
for
district
39,
so
that
jasmine
still
maintains
its
strong
representation
for
the
county.
So
I
told
them.
I
would
ask
that
question
on
their
behalf,
because
they
weren't
aware
of
what
any
kind
of
community
engagement
process
was
leading
up
to
today,
where
they
could
have
provided
that
feedback
in
person
rather
than
in
a
committee
meeting.
F
Right
and
their
representative
expressed
that
feedback
as
well.
Most
most
emphatically,
when
you
do
maps
you
have
to
look
at
how
they
fit
in
the
entirety
of
a
hundred
districts
from
monkey's
eyebrow
to
the
elkhorn
city
area,
and
you
can't
just
say:
oh,
I
could
have
done
this
district
or
this
county
better.
You
have
to
look
in
totality.
F
There
are
four
districts
that
come
into
jessamine
56
comes
into
the
wilmore
area,
and
it
has
it
just
needed
more
population,
so
it's
math
that
drove
that
55.
Similarly,
it's
math
that
drove
it
rural
areas
along
the
kentucky
river
45
is
math
plus
we
preserve
the
harrisburg
corridor
in
district
45
and
then
jasmine
county
has
most
all
the
people
of
jessamine
of
nicholasville,
but
does
go
up
into
the
nic.
The
fayette
mall
area
of
fayette.
J
Yes,
thank
you
chairman.
The
second
part
of
my
question
was
what
was
the
community
engagement
process,
because
I
know
no
one.
I've
spoken
to
in
the
west
end
of
district
41
was
aware
that
41
would
be
taken
out
of
the
west
end
altogether.
So
what
did
it
look
like
leading
up
to
today
to
get
community
input
and
engagement
in
this
process?.
F
Well,
since
you've
raised
the
issue
of
west
louisville
districts,
I
think
it's
fair
to
stay
say
that
41
historically
has
been
the
most.
It
looked
most
like
a
string
in
jefferson
county.
It
was
mathematically
according
to
the
pulse
b,
popper
and
riak
measurements,
the
least
compact
district
in
jefferson
county.
F
So
I
want
to
make
that
point
first,
the,
but
who
was
cons
consulted.
I
spoke
twice
with
the
head
of
the
naacp
in
person
and
three
times
at
least
on
the
phone,
so
he
was
clearly
aware
of
that.
G
Thank
you
chairman
and
thank
you
representative.
It's.
This
is
a
very
long
and
tedious
process.
We
we're
all
aware
of
that
and
it's
inherently
you
know
partisan,
and
it
is
because
things
change
and
there's
two-party
system
in
this
state,
and
I
don't
like
to
speak
in
terms
of
this
party
or
that
party,
but
there
there
is
some
concerns
there.
G
Of
course,
when,
when
things
change-
and
it
can
look,
can
have
the
appearance
of
one
thing
when
it
might
perhaps
be
purely
numbers
and
switches
and
precincts
and
and
meeting
the
constitutional
requirements,
so
you
talked
about
some
of
the
criteria
that
was
used
amongst
the
the
map,
drawers
and
you
have
mentioned
political
subdivisions
and
that
typically
is
counties
and
cities.
G
G
I'm
going
to
ask
a
few
questions
about
my
district,
but
they
kind
of
pertain
to
a
few
others.
So
political
subdivisions
include
cities,
and
the
city
that
I
primarily
represent
has
been
represented
by
a
covington
centric
legislator
for
almost
200
years
and
that
changes
with
these
maps.
So
that's
covington,
understand
the
same
thing
has
happened
in
hopkinsville.
The
similar
things
have
happened
with
bowling
green
richmond.
G
Can
you
just
give
a
basic
rationale
for
the
the
amount
of
splits
that
happened
in
covington
and
other
cities
in
the
same
way,
political
subdivisions
that
you
emphasized
several
times?
How
important
it
was
that
those
considerations
be
there.
F
Thank
you
for
that,
and,
and
the
primary
consideration
of
course
is
counties
which
we
we
sought
to
preserve
and
did
a
good
job
in
terms
of
total
county
splitting
to
to
answer
the
question
you
really
have
to
say
the
constitution
dictates
the
math,
the
math
dictates
the
map.
The
map
has
to
follow.
Population
shifts,
compactness
is
good,
but
it's
not
required.
F
F
F
Jeffersontown,
for
example,
which
is
one
of
the
largest
cities
in
the
state.
That
few
realize
has
been
split
three
or
four
times
traditionally,
and
so
just
because
something
has
been
in
the
past
doesn't
mean
it
happens
in
the
future.
Thank
you.
G
If
I
can
follow
up
with
with
another
question,
thank
you
and
thank
you
for
that,
and
I
and
you
know
saying
that
the
maps
and
the
populations
in
the
law
dictate
things
can
be
the
answer
really
to
every
every
question.
F
The
south
end
of
your
county
grew
astronomically
in
population
and
it
it's
covington.
Population
wise
is
very
spread
out
now
it's
people
that
used
to
live
in
covington
don't
live
in
covington.
They
live
south
of
the
city
limits
so
in
terms
of
a
socio-economic
community
of
interest,
it's
different.
So
it's
a
lot
of
judgment.
G
Well
and
you're
right
about
that,
I
can,
I
could
argue
that
very
vehemently.
The
other
way
it's
it's
not
changed.
The
the
annex
that
happened
that
annexed
south
covington
was
in
1980
and
that's
why
that
part
of
the
that
district
has
been
in
the
64th
district
for
a
long
time,
and
that
makes
complete
sense
because
that's
a
community
of
interest.
The
current
map
splits
the
communities
of
interest
significantly,
but
that's
really
not.
My
second
question
I
was
getting
to
was
my
second
question
was
related
to
the
heavily
influenced
minority
districts.
F
Again
there
are,
there
are
four
districts:
40
42,
43
and
44,
which
are
minority
majority
districts.
30
is
very
heavily
influenced,
77
is
very
heavily
influenced,
I
think
their
population.
I
think
it's
right
around
51
52
minority
in
district
77,
for
example,
when
you
get
down
to
the
very
very
small
numbers
in
20
percent
or
10
percent,
less
so,
but
again,
you're
talking
minority
population
so
voting
rights.
Real
act
really
doesn't
cover
that
level.
G
Okay-
and
that
does
answer
it,
so
there
wasn't
much
consideration
once
it
was
below
a
certain
number,
and
I
know
that
all
this
matters,
how
close
we
get
to
certain
percentages.
H
G
There
are
coalitions
that
happen
with,
say:
30
percent
black
communities,
with
included
with
a
15
hispanic
community
included
with
a
10
asian
community
that
voted
as
a
coalition
that
there
could
have
been
changes
and
those
are
very
much
a
part
of
the
the
vra
consideration.
H
Thank
you.
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
I
have
a
couple
of
questions.
The
first
one
I'll
ask
is
about
fayette
county
and
of
course,
you
and
I
representative
miller
from
louisville.
So
you
know
I'm
over
here.
Sorry,
I
don't
know
how
much
you'll
know
about
this,
but
my
understanding
from
the
past
couple
days
is
that
the
population
of
fayette
county
grew
overall,
just
as
most
urban
centers
did.
F
F
That's
probably
true,
because
there
were
a
lot
of
fingers
that
came
into
fayette
county,
but
I
I
will
say
you've
you've
raised
an
interesting
point
which
is
counter
to
representative
wheatley's
point,
which
is
sometimes
having
more
representatives
arguing.
Your
case
is
better.
So
thank
you
for
bringing
that
point
up.
H
The
other
thing
I'll
talk
about
is
the
area
that
I'm
more
familiar
with,
which
is
my
area.
I
listened
to
what
you
said
in
prefacing.
You
know
the
entire
map
on
your
comments
and
you
talked
about
continuity
of
representation
and
preserving
communities
of
interest,
and
I
would
say,
that's
probably
not
true
in
my
area.
Obviously,
I've
got
I'm
one
of
the
ones
who's
gotten
looped
in
with
another
incumbent
and
I've
counted
four
neighborhoods
that
are
split,
the
south
side,
neighborhood,
the
beechmont
neighborhood,
the
iroquois
neighborhood
and
the
kenwood
hill
area.
H
F
Actually,
you
border
district
40,
your
old,
your
you
did
you
border
heavily
district
40.
We
had
to
move
district
40
quite
a
bit
to
make
sure
that
we
maximize
minority
representation,
it
it
rippled.
Out
and
again,
this
map
is
30
more
compact
for
jefferson,
county
yeah.
H
H
F
And
forth
a
little
bit
go
ahead.
Sure
and
again
it's
math
dictates
the
map.
It's
got
to
move
with
the
population
shifts,
but
at
some
point
in
time
there
is
a
judgment
call
and
the
map
speaks
for
itself
as
to
compactness.
Thank
you.
E
Chairman,
I
want
to
thank
you,
chairman
miller,
for
doing
this
work,
and
I
want
to
thank
you
on
behalf
of
louisville,
for
the
work
communities
of
interest
were
put
in
shambles
10
years
ago
in
louisville,
in
other
words,
other
places
in
the
state.
I
want
to
talk
about
my
friend,
representative
cantrell's
district
and
those
around
there.
E
E
E
The
democrat
districts
in
louisville
were
the
smallest
in
the
state
that
is
representative
cantrell's
district
as
it
exists
today
that
the
democrats
drew
in
2010.
They
didn't
care
about
communities
of
interest,
they
didn't
care
about.
Neighborhoods
you've
got
indian
hills
with
the
river
all
the
way
down
to
the
river
west
of
shawnee.
E
There's
no
respect
for
community
of
interest
10
years
ago.
It
was
about
clinging
to
power
and
because
we
don't
have
to
cling
to
power,
because
we
have
super
majorities,
we
didn't
do
that.
We
did
right.
If
you
look
at
each
of
these
districts.
Let
me
address
specifically
my
friend
mackenzie
cantrell's
district.
If
you
move
her
precinct
back
to
the
38th,
our
maps
become
unconstitutional,
the
30th
becomes
too
big
and
the
35th
becomes
too
small.
E
These
are
pop.
These
are,
this
is
math
and
southern
parkway.
For
those
of
my
friends
in
south
louisville.
I
grew
up
in
that
district
is
a
dividing
line.
My
friend
miss
cantrell
lives
on
the
other
side
of
southern
parkway,
where
most
of
the
38th
lives
on
the
other
side
is
on
the
other
side
of
southern
park.
It's
a
natural
dividing
line
and
again,
if
you
flip
it
back,
you
have
to
make
major
changes
or
the
district
is
unconstitutional.
E
E
All
I
would
ask
for
the
citizens
to
do
is
to
simply
look
at
the
maps
and
you'll
see
that
they're
much
more
compact,
the
math
says
they're
much
more
compact,
the
national,
the
national
programs
that
we
that
we're
asked
to
use
are
much
more
compact,
so
I'm
going
to
get
into
the
broad
point
real
quickly
and
that's
the
that's
the
the
my
new
point
now
and
I
can
do
this
for
every
single
district
in
the
state,
every
single
one
of
them.
Okay,
let's
go
abroad.
E
There
are
three
rules
that
we
have
to
follow
in
the
in
the
constitutional
rules.
Voting
rights
act,
voting
rights
act
in
kentucky
is
not
implicated
because
in
2017,
the
united
states
supreme
court
had
an
opinion
that
derived
the
the
draft
from
north
carolina
and
they
said
unless
a
three
element
test
is
met.
You
can't
take
race
into
into
account.
The
three
element
test
is
not
met
in
kentucky,
so
we
did
not
draw
maps
based
on
race.
E
We
have
the
happy
consequence
of
having
four
minority
majority
districts
and
six
four
african-american
majority
districts
and
six
minority
majority
districts.
That's
a
happy
consequence
of
drawing
these
lines,
but
we
did
not
draw
them
for
race
as
we're
not
allowed
to
do
under
the
united
states
supreme
court
precedent
from
the
2017
case.
E
That's
rule
number
one
rule
number
two:
is
you
have
to
split
the
minimum
amount
of
counties
in
the
house?
That's
23.!
We've
split
23
maps
in
2010.
The
democrats
didn't
care
about
that.
They
split
more.
I
represented
the
house
of
representatives
when
I
wasn't
a
representative.
We
took
him
to
court
in
the
supreme
court
in
the
only
time
I
know
of
I
used
to
be
the
general
counsel
for
the
kentucky
supreme
court.
I've
never
known
of
this,
except
for
this
one
case.
E
The
supreme
court
ruled
from
the
bench
that
the
maps
were
unconstitutional
because
they
split
too
many
counties.
We
adhered
to
that
constitutional
principle
from
fisher
one
fisher,
two
fisher,
three
fisher,
four
and
jensen.
That's
five
kentucky
supreme
court
cases
dealing
with
redistricting.
We
honored
it
to
a
t.
We
honored
it
so
much
that
we
have
to
put
four
majority
members
running
against
each
other.
Anybody
that's
ever
done.
Redistricting
knows
that
is
taboo.
E
Speaker
osborne
said
I
don't
care.
What
taboos
are
we're
going
to
follow
the
law.
We
follow
the
law
and
it
hurt.
Four
of
our
members
have
to
run
against
each
other
in
the
majority
that
never
happened
with
the
democrats.
They
just
split
counties
willy-nilly,
which
is
why,
in
the
90s
and
in
2010
their
2012,
their
maps
were
thrown
out.
We
split
the
minimum
majority
counties,
that's
23!
That's
rule
number.
Two
constitutional
requirement:
number
two
constitutional
requirement:
number
three
is
population.
E
Ever
since
reynolds
versus
sims
in
in
the
map
case,
matt
versus
ohio
from
the
united
states
supreme
court,
there's
a
one-man
one-vote
requirement
for
congressional
districts
that
is
very
strictly
adhered
to
for
more
for
state
and
local
districts.
The
united
states
supreme
court
has
said
you
have
a
little
bit
more
leave
because
we
want
to.
We
want
to
give
you
the
authority
to
respect
county
districts,
county
lines,
other
other
political
jurisdiction
alliance,
so
we'll
allow
you
to
go
a
little
bit
more.
E
The
kentucky
supreme
court
has
said
you
can
go
more,
but
you
can't
go
outside
the
minus
five
percent
or
plus
five
percent.
So
in
the
house,
what
that
means
is
you
take
the
total
population
of
kentucky
divided
by
100
and
it
gives
you
a
number
and
you
can
go
down
or
up
five
percent
in
the
90s
and
in
2010.
The
democrats
said
not
gonna
do
that
because
they
were
trying
to
do
with
what
I've
talked
about
before
and
many
other
things,
so
they
were
thrown
out
of
court.
E
We
stay
within
the
lines
of
up
or
down
five
percent.
We
don't
get
the
five
percent,
I
don't
know
the
numbers,
I
think
they're
4.8
percent
or
something
is
the
most
out
of
line
which
is
required
to
get
to
the
minimum
amount
of
county
splits.
So
we
have
followed
the
constitution
to
a
t,
even
so
far
as
hurting
our
own
majority
members.
E
E
A
A
Excuse
me,
I
hear
motion
on
the
sub.
The
you
mean
the
house
bill
2,
as
amended
by
the
committee
sub
3.,
so
we
will
be
voting
now
on
the
house
bill
2,
as
amended
by
ph
3.
F
C
F
F
C
A
J
I
I
just
want
to
say
that
my
issue
in
part,
is
that,
as
often
happens
in
this
legislative
body,
the
people
that
I
represent
were
not
included
in
this
decision
making.
That
is
the
problem
that
I
have
with
this
map.
One
person
does
not
speak
for
literally
tens
of
thousands
in
the
west
end
of
louisville
and
in
district
41..
So
for
that
reason,
I'm
voting
no.
C
G
And
briefly
explain
my
my
no
vote
is
related
closely
to
my
friend
from
jefferson
33's
comments,
community
of
interest
and
what
was
decried
as
so
horrible
that
happened
in
jefferson.
County
happens
in
bowling
green
covington,
hopkinsville
richmond
and
several
other
cities,
important
cities
in
this
state,
and
for
that
reason
I'm
voting
no.
A
A
I
I
Thank
you
very
much.
My
name
is
dee
progliasco
and
I'm
vice
president
of
the
kentucky
league
of
women
voters
and
also
redistricting
chair.
This
is
our
testimony
this
day
and
we
appreciate
the
opportunity
to
testify
and
I'm
sorry
there
were
sound
glitches
at
the
beginning
that
we
could
not
testify
before
the
vote.
I
I
I
We
seek
districts
drawn
without
attention
to
the
impact
on
incumbent
office
holders
in
alignment
with
the
position
of
the
league
of
women
voters
of
the
united
states.
There's
been
some
comment
that
well
we
changed
things
so
that
11
legislators
would
have
to
have
to
run
against
each
other.
That
again
supports
our
position
of
not
favoring
incumbents.
I
We
feel
that
this
map
proposed
map
explicitly
was
designed
to
protect
incumbents
from
our
2017
redistricting
study
through
all
of
our
work
over
the
last
four
years.
We
have
consistently
called
for
the
interest
of
voters,
not
the
interests
of
current
officials
to
be
the
basis
for
restricting
redistricting.
I
Our
friend
and
colleague,
representative
nemus
always
throws
out
that.
Well,
where
were
you
before,
and
representative
miller,
always
says
that
everyone
should
have
been
watching?
Everybody
should
have
been
listening.
Democrats
and
republicans
all
over
the
country
have
not
done
well
with
redistricting.
I
We
advocate
for
maps
that
divide
counties
where
needed,
but
without
slicing
the
larger
counties
to
ribbons
in
the
newly
released
house
map.
However,
a
number
of
major
counties
have
been
divided
in
quite
destructive
ways.
Parts
of
laurel
county,
for
example,
are
included
in
six
different
proposed
seats
without
any
districts
centered
on
london.
I
Some
claim
that
gives
laurel
county
more
power
in
the
legislature
because
it
has
more
representatives.
This
belies
reality.
Instead
of
a
unified
london
voice
in
the
legislator,
legislature,
its
population
is
represented
by
diverse
adjoining
districts
that
may
have
little
in
common
with
london.
In
our
analysis.
So
far
we
have
identified
similar
sharp
divisions
in
christian
davis,
franklin,
hardin,
jesuit
madison
pike
and
pulaski
counties.
I
Those
divisions
appear
to
have
been
designed
to
ensure
that
incumbents
those
currently
holding
office
could
continue
to
do
so
in
our
judgment,
districts
could
have
been
drawn
more
constructively
if
voters
rather
than
office
holders,
had
been
the
priority.
We
are
struggling
to
understand
the
proposals
for
the
state's
very
largest
counties,
jefferson,
fayette
and
kenton.
The
release
maps
do
not
come
with
data
on
the
population
of
the
districts
are
with
precinct
our
street
boundaries.
That
would
let
us
analyze
those
elements
again.
It
appears
that
the
emphasis
is
on
incumbents.
I
I
This
process
should
take
weeks
not
hours
and
include
many
participants,
not
just
a
few
drafters
behind
closed
doors.
One
final
point:
we'd
like
to
emphasize
at
thursday's
press
event
representative
jerry
miller,
offered
the
view
that
the
league's
recommended
maps,
if
enacted
into
law,
would
violate
the
voting
rights
act.
We
reject
that
claim.
We
work
zealously
to
propose
maps
that
fulfill
the
full
legal
requirements
for
american
legislative
districts.
I
The
districts
in
our
maps
have
total
populations,
as
enumerated
in
the
2020
census
that
comply
with
the
one
person,
one
vote,
requirements
of
the
u.s
constitution
and
the
rulings
of
the
united
states
supreme
court
and
the
kentucky
supreme
court.
The
districts
in
our
maps
also
provide
opportunities
for
non-white,
voters
to
elect
candidates
of
their
choosing,
and
we
analyzed
those
districts
of
opportunity
by
looking
at
voting
age
population
in
line
with
multiple
voting
rights,
acts,
rulings
based
on
the
same
kind
of
data.
I
The
legal
women
voters
from
kentucky
has
studied
redistricting
provided
multiple
presentation,
public
presentations.
We
even
went
to
many
of
the
meetings
provided
by
the
national
conference
of
state
legislators
that
both
representatives
nemas
went
to
you
representative,
bratcher,
representative
fisher
and
representative
miller,
and
we
in
these
public
presentations.
We
have
advocated
for
an
advisory
commission
approach
to
redistricting.
I
We
have
published
three
versions
of
ways:
legislative
seats
could
be
distributed
and
we've
conducted
a
statewide
series
of
forums
and
online
input
opportunities
to
gather
thoughts
on
our
maps
as
a
non-partisan
body.
The
league
takes
action
on
issues,
but
do
not
does
not
support
our
opposed
candidates
or
parties.
We
support
diversity,
equity
and
inclusion
and
membership
and
programming,
and
you
can
learn
more
on
our
website.
I
While
we
agree
that
this
is
hard
work,
we
appreciate
your
hard
work,
but
there
needs
to
be
time
for
public
input
and
comment
on
these
maps.
Thank
you,
representative,
bratcher,
for
allowing
us
time
and
for
our
being
able
to
submit
our
statement
to
this
committee
meeting.
Thank
you
for
making
it
part
of
the
record.
A
Thank
you,
okay,
we'll
move
on
to
the
next
bill
is
floor
leader,
mr
rudy,
here,
okay,
this
is
house
bill,
172.
D
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
chairman
bratcher,
ladies
and
gentlemen
of
the
committee,
thank
you
chairman
miller,
for
the
shout
out
to
monkey's
eyebrow
during
your
presentation.
I
am
the
proud
representative
of
the
fine
community
of
monkey's
eyebrow
house
bill
172.
That's
before
you
simply
moves
the
filing
deadline
in
the
name
of
redistricting
back
to
where
it
would
have
been
prior
to
the
action
of
the
2019
general
assembly
which
moved
it.
D
This
moves
it
back
to
where
it
was
where
all
filing
deadlines
had
been
throughout
recent
history,
and
it
just
does
it
for
one
year
just
this
year
and
it
moves
it
to
january
25th
at
4
pm
local
time
again,
it
would
undo
what
we
did
in
senate
bill
60
of
the
2019
regular
session
for
just
one
year
for
the
purpose
of
redistricting.
That's
all
this
bill
does.
A
And
this
will
be
leader
rudy.
This
will
be
this
just
this
one
time
it'll
be
january,
the
25th
at
4
pm,
and
even
if
say,
something
happens
to
these
redistricting
bills,
it
will
remain
january.
25Th.
A
C
Representative
rudy,
can
you
just
explain
why?
So
that?
Because
there
are
people
viewing
at
home
while
we're
doing
this
extension
and
why
we're
not
severing
the
local
races
from
the
rest
of
the
races
and
the
repercussions
of
not
doing
so.
D
D
So
we
want
to
be
consistent,
but
the
fact
is
senate
bill,
60
moved
it
to
the
first
friday
for
everyone,
so
this
bill
moves
it
back
for
everyone
for
just
this
year,
just
plain
and
simple,
and-
and
that
was
the
thought
of
it-
there
has
been
some
ask
and
request
about
moving
it
just
for
counties
and
city
or
just
for
us
and
not
counties
and
cities,
but
upon
legal
counsel.
They
felt
that
that
could
be
open
to
a
court
challenge,
treating
candidates
differently.
G
Thank
you
and
represent.
Thank
you,
representative,
blant
that
you
kind
of
asked
the
question
I
was
going
to
get
to,
but
I
want
the
check
to
make
sure
that
monkey's
eyebrow
is
not
split
up
in
any
way
as
part
of
the
new
district,
not
yeah.
G
Okay
and
thank
you
in
ballard
county-
and
there
was
just
there-
was
a
mention-
I
believe
by
the
chair-
that
this
was
obviously
just
for
this
election.
D
A
C
I'm
going
to
vote
yes
to
move
this
on
in
the
process
and
also
with
the
understanding,
as
I've
had
concerns
from
some
local
officials
about
not
severing,
but
from
my
understanding,
in
speaking
with
the
legal
experts
that
if
this
were
to
be
tried
and
thrown
out,
they
could
actually
move
the
deadlines
even
farther
than
the
25th
of
january
and
include
local
as
well
as
legislative
election.
So
I
vote
yes.
A
C
Yes-
and
I
would
like
to
explain
yes,
I
want
to
echo
representative
blanton's
comments
as
well
from
the
18th
district.
I've
heard
several
concerns
of
separating
the
county,
the
deadlines,
but
just
because
of
legal
concerns,
I
do
want
to
move
the
bill
forward,
and
so
I
appreciate
the
conversation
from
the
18th
district.
C
G
C
C
I
do
understand,
after
conversations
that
it's
for
consistency
of
ballot
access
requirements-
I
guess-
and
so
I
so
I
do
understand
the
need
to
to
create
a
consistent
filing
deadline,
but
I
just
want
to
acknowledge
that
we
have
had
those
conversations
and
we
have
tried
to
work
on
that
issue.
J
G
Yes-
and
I
echo
the
comments,
also
and
reserve
the
right
to
change
on
the
floor,
thank
you.
A
E
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
section
1104
of
the
kentucky
constitution
gives
the
general
assembly
the
duties
and
the
responsibility
to
re-organize
the
appellate
courts
from
time
to
time.
When
is
necessary,
it
hasn't
been
done
for
a
number
of
decades
and
the
supreme
court
and
the
court
of
appeals
are
far
out
of
whack
just
so
everyone
knows.
I
think
this
is
nature.
E
You
know
the
nature
of
a
lawyer
that
we
know
this,
but
many
nonlawyers,
don't
we
have
seven
supreme
court
districts
and
when
we
adopted
our
judicial
article
in
1976
and
unified
the
court
system,
there
are
two
court
of
appeals.
Judges
for
every
supreme
court
in
every
supreme
court
district
and
those
districts
are
the
exact
same.
E
So
I
said
we
haven't
done
this.
In
decades.
In
2012,
the
kentucky
supreme
court
actually
submitted
a
plan
to
the
general
assembly,
which
was
enacted
in
house
bill.
1.
later
it
was
thrown
out
and
because
the
legislative
maps
were
thrown
out,
the
supreme
court
map
was
thrown
out
again
also
and
when
the
legislature
went
back
and
redid
the
legislative
maps
they
for
some
reason,
didn't
include
the
appellate
court
maps
and
so
they're
they're.
E
Very
far
out
of
whack,
for
example,
the
smallest
district
population,
wise
and
by
the
way
section,
110
4
of
the
constitution,
requires
no
counties
to
be
split
and
as
close
as
po
population
as
possible,
the
smallest
district
is
the
7th
that's
the
mountain
district
and
if
it
has
476
000
people
in
it
and
the
biggest
district,
if
you
don't
include
louisville
and
I'll
say
why
we
don't
include
louisville
in
a
second
is
the
lexington
district
and
it
has
a
number
of
counties
around
that
is
738
000.,
there's
another
area
in
northern
kentucky,
there's
722
thousand
and
so
you'll
see
that
the
one
man
one
vote
principles
are
nowhere
near
in
compliance
as
representative
wheatley's
district
is
has
almost
doubled,
the
size
of
of
the
district
in
the
far
east.
E
So
one
of
the
things
that
we
want
to
do
is
to
is
to
comply
with
the
constitution.
The
census
numbers
are
back
in
and
and
while
we're
doing
the
legislative
redistricting
it's
it's
time
to
also
do
the
appellate
districts.
So
what
we
have
is
a
map
that
is
very
compact.
I'll
talk
about
the
major
changes,
mr
chairman
and
then
maybe
answer
any
questions.
I.
E
A
A
E
It's
house
bill
179
and
we'll
get
to
that
when
it
comes
on
on
the
on
the
board,
so
the
I
wanted
to
say
that
this
will
be
effective
in
the
november
2022
elections.
Just
like
the
legislative
maps,
I
supported
pushing
that
back
to
2024..
E
Every
judge
in
the
state,
with
very
minimal
exceptions,
are
on
the
ballot
in
2022.
There
are
three
justices
that
aren't,
but
four
justices
that
are
that's
a
historical
anachronism,
because
our
highest
court
used
to
be
four
judges
and
now
at
seven.
Well,
that
was
four.
I
don't
know,
but
now
it's
seven.
So
we
have
four
justices
on
the
ballot.
All
court
of
appeals,
judges
and
trial
judges
throughout
the
state
will
be
on
the
ballot
this
next
year,
so
it
will,
it
will
go
into
effect
november
2022..
E
The
thought
is,
we
believe
it's
the
the
maps
as
they
exist
that
are
unconstitutional.
So
if
we
don't
make
it
effective
in
november
2022
effectively
we're
we're
giving
our
imprimatur
to
an
unconstitutional
appellate
court
map
for
almost
another
decade,
which
we
we
the
decision
was
we
didn't
want
to
do
so,
we'll
be
effective.
This
coming
this
coming
year,
major
changes
on
the
counties
I'm
going
to
talk
about
the
most
populous
counties,
we'll
be
happy
to
talk
about
any
county.
In
particular
davis
county
will
be
going
to
the
first
district.
E
Currently,
the
first
district
has
525
thousand
people
in
it.
The
sweet
spot
is
about
625
000,
so
they
needed
to
pick
up
some
population
davis
county
is
the
most
reasonable
place
to
pick
up
that
population,
as
it
has
a
hundred
and
three
thousand
312
people
there.
E
According
to
the
most
recent
census,
we
did
a
couple
other
county
shifts
in
the
first
and
the
second,
because
if
you
look
at
the
map,
it
had
a
co,
it
went
under
warren
county
had
a
claw
and
we
wanted
to
make
it
as
compact
as
possible,
and
so
we
have.
We
fixed
that
so
davis
county
is
one
in
the
third
district,
which
is
the
southeast
mountain
district.
That
area
picks
up
harlan
county.
E
It
goes
as
far
as
bell
county
representative,
blanton
and
it'll
pick
up
harlan
county
and
it
picks
up
boyle,
mercer
and
anderson
county,
and
the
reason
for
that
is
because
the
fifth
is
so
big.
E
That's
the
fayette
county,
centric
district
that
it
had
to
lose
some
population,
so
one
of
the
counties
that
it
lost
was
was
anderson
county
and
the
third
district
has
has
picked
that
up
the
also
the
seventh
in
the
in
the
fifth
or
seventh
and
the
sixth,
the
sixth
district
represented
wheatley
is
the
northern
kentucky
district,
and
so
it
had
to
lose
a
great
deal
of
population
and
the
seventh
had
to
pick
up
population,
so
it
picked
up
population
from
the
eastern
side
of
justice
keller's
district.
E
I
wanted
to
note
that
there's
been
some
thought
that
we
were
picking
and
choosing
counties
based
on
pop
politics.
I
want
to
say
that
our
map
for
northern
kentucky
is
very
similar
to
the
map
that
the
supreme
court
submitted
to
the
general
assembly
in
2012,
where
they
also
took
the
eastern
kentucky
counties.
They
took
five
of
them,
then
we
take
nine
of
them
now,
just
because
of
population
differences,
and
so
that
is
the
reason
that
those
those
counties
were
chosen.
E
You
can't
choose
the
western
side,
because
that's
odum
county
and
shelby
county
and
they're
too
big
for
the
fifth
to
take
and
obviously
louisville
can't
take
that.
I
said
I
was
gonna
talk
about
louisville.
Let
me
address
that
real
quickly,
because
louisville,
because
no
counties
can
be
split
in
the
appellate
maps
and
one-man
one-vote
principles,
don't
apply
as
tightly
to
the
judicial
maps
as
they
do
to
legislative
maps.
We
can't
split
jefferson
county.
From
my
perspective.
E
I
would
love
to
do
that
because
it
would
give
my
my
constituents
in
jefferson
county,
more
ability,
more
authority,
we'd
have
a
full
seat
and
then
some
of
another.
So
it's
against
my
self-interest
in
the
interest
of
jefferson
county
that
we
have
to
stay
whole.
I
wish
it
weren't
like
that,
but
it
is,
and
so
you
put
jefferson
county
to
the
side
and
you
take
the
remaining
six
districts
and
make
them
as
close
in
population
as
you
can.
So
that's
that's
the
broad
strokes,
mr
chairman,
I'd
be
happy
to
answer
any
particular
question.
E
G
E
179.
yeah
right
there.
Yes,
sir
okay,
I
think
it's
coming
up
right
now.
I
would
I
do
need
to
note
there
will
be
a
floor.
Amendment
judge
judge
jeff
taylor,
who
has
been
in
the
second
district
for
a
long
time.
He
lives
in
ohio,
county
judge,
taylor.
Anybody
who
has
practiced
before
the
court
of
appeals
knows
that
he's
one
of
the
best
judges
that
we
have
he's.
E
A
tremendous
judge
he's
been
on
the
court
of
appeals
for
19
years
under
the
plan
that
we
devised
he
he
he
is
like
I
said
he's
been
on
for
19
years,
he's
the
only
judge
that
would
have
been
affected
in
this
way.
Every
other
supreme
court
justice,
a
court
of
appeals,
judge
stayed
in
their
area.
He
would
have
been
moved
from
the
second
to
the
first.
E
He
lived
in
davis
county
for
a
long
time.
I
understand
because
of
representative
scott
lewis
came
to
me
this
morning
that
he
he
lives
in
ohio
county
and
so
with
a
little
bit
of
tinkering
with
his
permission
at
his
request
and
with,
and
we
got
an
agreement
with
the
senate
on
this
as
well,
because
these
maps
were
agreed
with
the
senate.
We
have
made
three
counties
that
are
changed
and
I
want
to
make
those
highlights.
E
It
doesn't
get
the
population
out
of
whack
and
it
still
maintains
the
very
compact
nature
of
the
of
the
plan.
Hancock
county,
as
you
see
in
here
and
ohio
county,
are
in
the
far
east
side
of
the
first
district.
Those
will
be
going
to
the
second
district
and
in
return
and
just
so,
your
population
hancock
county
is
9
000,
ohio,
counties,
23
000
and
in
return
logan
county,
which
is
in
the
far
west
southwestern
side
of
the
second
district,
we'll
be
going
to
the
first
to
make
the
that
change.
There.
E
We've
talked
with
the
representative
from
that
area,
jason,
petrie
and
others,
and
he
thought
it
important
that
that
circuit
remained
intact,
and
so
we
have
an
agreement
to
do
that,
and
that
will
be
a
floor
amendment
tomorrow.
Other
than
that,
mr
chairman,.
A
E
So
the
kentucky
constitution
says
that
you
can't
split
any
county
and
then
once
you
adhere
to
that
you
should
you,
should
you
have
to
look
to
the
population
numbers
and
try
to
make
them
as
close
as
you
can
ask,
but
but-
and
this
is
something
that
chief
justice
minton
sat
at
this
table
and
said
to
the
judiciary
this
past
year-
they
don't
apply
in
the
same
way
they
do
for
legislators
and
the
reason
for
that
is.
We
represent
people
right.
E
I
represent
the
45
000
and
change
people
that
are
in
my
district
as
it
exists
today.
It's
well
over
50
000,
but
we're
correcting
that
problem,
but
a
judge
doesn't
represent
people.
A
judge
is
elected
from
groups
in
kentucky
and
many
other
states,
but
they
they
adhere
to
the
law.
They
don't
they
don't
say
all
right.
I'm
going
to
decide
this
case
because
I
represent
mountain
folk
or
I
represent
louisville
folk.
E
They
follow
the
law,
and
so,
as
chief
justice
minton
said,
while
he
said
in
this
exact
chair,
one
man,
one
man,
one
vote
principles
are
important
and
they
need
to
be
looked
to,
but
they
don't
they're,
not
all
controlling
and
when
I
asked
him
because
I
wanted
to
make
jefferson
county
more
powerful
and
say:
look,
I
think
it's
the
people
in
jefferson
county
are
entitled
to
be
just
as
big
and
no
bigger
or
no
smaller
than
other
districts.
He
said
you
cannot
split
counties.
I
said
what
would
you
do
in
speaking
to
my
constituents?
E
C
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Just
a
quick
comment.
Thank
you,
representative
nemes,
for
your
work
you've
put
into
this.
I
just
voiced
concern
for
my
seventh
district,
we're
picking
up
a
lot
of
new
additional
counties,
and
I
understand
you're
trying
to
keep
it
based
on
population.
I
get
all
that
it
just.
It
really
spreads
our
pellets
out
across
the
seventh
district,
and
I
wish
we
could
have
found
something
that
could
have
compact
that
a
little
better
yeah.
E
I
I
want
to
say,
representative
blanton,
that's
something
that
you've
mentioned
a
number
of
times
to
me,
and
I
appreciate
that
you're
always
fighting
for
the
people,
not
only
in
your
district
but
all
around
eastern
kentucky.
I
would
note
that
one
of
the
changes
that
I
made
is
is
is,
as
a
result
of
talking
to
you
and
some
others,
and
that
is
in
our
original
maps.
E
It
had
madison
county
in
the
seventh
and
the
reason
for
that
is
madison
county
has
a
population
of
93
000,
and
that
would
enable
us
to
reduce
the
number
of
counties
that
are
in
eastern
kentucky
district,
but
it
would
destroy
the
the
culture
of
that
of
that
district.
E
Perhaps
I
think
you
would
have
another,
maybe
another
bluegrass
justice
and
two
court
of
appeals
judges,
whereas,
as
I
talked
to
the
some
judges
in
pikeville,
for
example,
the
heart
of
that
district
is
the
mountains
and,
while
madison
my
mother's
from
madison
county,
while
madison,
is
in
the
foothills,
it's
not
in
the
mountains,
and
you
didn't
want
to
change
the
shift,
the
control
of
that
district
to
madison
county.
So
we
really
it.
E
We
really
wanted
to
make
sure
that
madison
county
stayed
with
fayette
county
and
didn't
didn't
control
either
debbie
lambert's
district
in
the
third
or
justice.
Conley
is
a
district
in
the
district
in
the
seventh,
so
we
could
have
had
fewer
counties.
The
thought
that
we
wanted
to
make
sure
that
we
maintain
the
culture
of
the
mountains
overcame
the
concern
there,
because
it
would
have
required.
I
think
us
to
have
madison
county,
which
probably
would
have
dominated
one
of
those
two
districts,
which
is
the
reason
we
did
that.
Thank
you.
H
E
So
with
the
change
representative,
cantrell
of
the
ohio
county,
hancock
county
and
then
the
and
then
the
logan
county,
the
the
populations
are
in
the
first
is
623
000,
I'm
going
to
round
up
or
down
623
000,
it's
actually
622
860.,
so
623
000
in
the
second
at
611
300
in
the
third
at
610
000
in
the
fourth,
that's
louisville.
E
So
it's
going
to
be
skewed
here
at
783
000
in
the
fifth,
which
is
the
fayette
county,
centric
district
660
000
in
the
sixth,
that
is
the
northern
kentucky
district
at
617
000
and
the
seventh,
which
is
the
mountains
at
six
hundred
and
one
thousand.
A
C
Explain
my
vote.
Yes,
I'm
going
to
vote
I
to
move
through
the
process
with
my
concerns
noted.
Thank
you.
D
Out
of
an
abundance
of
caution,
I
will
abstain
from
voting
on
this.
D
Motion
under
rule
57
and
any
apparent.
F
C
E
Yes,
I
need
to
say
something
real
quickly
again.
Mr
chairman,
I
know
a
lot
of
judges
are
watching.
I
didn't
say
this
and
I
needed
to
a
judge
just
said
to
ask
the
question.
Texted
me,
the
filing
deadline
will
be
the
same
as
it
is
for
everyone
else
in
the
state.
It's
moved
back
to.
I
think
it's
january
25th,
so
it's
the
same
filing
deadline
as
it
is
for
legislators
and
county
officials.
That's
the
bill.
We
just
we
just
passed.
Yes,.
J
Representative
scott,
mr
chairman,
I'm
going
to
pass
since
there's
supposed
to
be
an
amendment
on
the
bill.
Thank
you.