►
Description
Meeting Call to Order - 00:00:03
Roll Call - 00:00:05
Approval of previous minutes - 00:01:08
Acknowledgment of New Committee Membership and Co-chairs - 00:01:37
Noting that LOIC staff sent 12 finding sheets w/ recs to the cabinet and DJJ for feedback - 00:02:06
Introduction of the new Graduate Fellow - 00:02:42
Update from The Kentucky Department of Juvenile Justice - 00:03:08
Adjournment - 01:54:50
C
A
A
B
A
D
A
E
Thank
you,
Senator
storm,
and
it's
good
to
be
here
today
appreciate
everybody
who
came
out
to
listen
to
the
testimony
today.
I
would
like
to
acknowledge
some
new
members
myself,
as
co-chair
Senator
Julie
Rocky
Adams
is
new
to
this
committee.
This
year,
Senator
Donald
Douglas
is
new
as
well.
Senator
Gerald,
Neal,
representative
Lindsey
Burke
is
new
to
the
committee
good
to
see
you
Lindsay
representative
Matt,
Lockett
and
representative
Pamela
Stevenson,
and
there
she
is
so
it's
great
to
have
you
all
and
look
forward
to
working
with
you
before
we
get
started.
E
A
I'd
also
like
to
introduce
price
Terry,
which
is
our
graduate
fellow.
Are
you
in
the
room?
Oh
okay?
Yes,
right
back
here
and
she's
a
first
year
law
student
at
UK's,
College
of
Law
and
is
doing
a
great
job
for
us.
We
appreciate
your
service
at
this
time,
we'd
like
to
have
an
update
from
the
Kentucky
Department
of
Juvenile
Justice
and
those
individuals
at
the
table.
If
you
could
introduce
yourselves
for
the
record
and
the
floor
is
yours.
F
And
what
we
propose
to
do
is
is
to
Simply
give
you
a
fairly
comprehensive
presentation
about
where
we've
been
and
the
steps
that
we've
taken
over
almost
the
last
year.
Now,
where
we
are
specifically
with
some
of
the
new
legislation
that
was
passed
in
the
last
session,
this
will
take
a
while.
If,
if
at
some
point
you
all
want
to
interrupt
the
process,
of
course,
it's
your
your
process
and
we'll
we'll
bounce
back
and
forth
a
little
bit.
But
before
we
get
started,
I
I
do
want
to
Echo
what
the
co-chair
said
and
I
know.
F
We
met
back
in
January,
discussing
this
process
and
since
then
an
enormous
amount
of
work
has
been
done
and
I
want
to
acknowledge.
Mr
hotman
and
his
staff,
who
have
conducted
I
think
as
thorough
an
investigation
and
review
that
you
could
ever
want
to
have.
It's
all
always
been
professional
and
I.
Think
our
folks
have
developed
a
very
good
working
relationship
with
committee
staff
and
I
also
want
to
acknowledge
the
DJJ
and
Justice
cabinet
staff.
F
F
These
sort
of
reviews
and
the
importance
that
it
be
done
transparently,
so
I
just
want
to
say
that
I
think
it's
been
a
good
process
and
and
that
we
appreciate
the
professionalism
and
courtesy
of
committee
staff
throughout
this
process
and
I
think
our
respective
staffs
have
done
some
great
work
here
and
now.
You
know
it's
up
to
all
of
us
to
take
that
and
and
make
improvements
based
on
the
work
they've
done
and
with
that
I
would
turn
it
over
to
commissioner
Reed
to
begin
our
presentation.
G
Thank
you,
I'm,
just
going
to
give
a
brief
overview
of
the
department.
I
know
some
of
you
know
more
about
us
than
others.
We
operate
as
you
see
there.
Eight
secure
juvenile
detention
centers,
and
these
are
primarily
for
youth,
who
are
awaiting
Court.
Still
they
haven't
been
found
guilty
or
pled
guilty
to
anything.
It's
really.
Basically,
the
best
way
to
describe
it
is
a
jail
for
kids.
We
have
seven
Youth
Development
Centers,
and
these
are
for
our
post
disposition.
Youth.
G
The
youth
have
been
committed
or
sentenced
to
us
for
a
term
of
treatment
or
sentenced
as
useful
offender,
as
you
know
days
that
they
have
to
or
time
until
they
have
to
be
released
by
parole
or
whatever
else.
Those
are
fairly
small
facilities.
We
have
them
spread
throughout
the
state,
there's
117
youth.
As
of
two
days
ago,
we
have
group
homes
that
we
operate
in
addition
to
the
ones
that
you
see
there
with
our
DJJ
operated.
G
We
also
contract
for
18
others
and
we're
in
the
process
of
adding
another
one
in
in
Todd
County
for
the
next
school
year,
and
that's
a
that's
a
large
number
of
you
last
year
or
the
year
before
that
we
did.
We
had
over
1200
something
unduplicated
Youth,
and
that
was
during
the
pandemic,
when
there
was
still
kids
that
were
not
in
school.
So
we
expect
when
this
year's
tabulation
comes
out
in
the
fall
that
we'll
see
those
numbers
be
a
lot
higher.
G
Kids
and
kids
that
didn't
need,
secured
attention
out
and
that
has
been
I,
don't
think,
there's
any
other
state
in
the
nation
that
has
the
system
that
we
have
statewide
and
the
number
of
kids,
and
without
that
you
know,
you
can
see
there
for
the
facilities
that
we
had
in
detention.
I
think
only
two
more
kids
than
we
had
in
all
alternatives
to
detention,
update,
220
kids,
so
if
most
of
our
facilities
are
40
beds,
so
do
the
math.
G
If,
if
we
had
we'd,
have
to
build
five,
more
detention,
centers
and
the
national
number
I've
seen
for
that
for
construction
is
35
million
a
pop
and
that's
not
counting
to
run
it.
That's
just
that's
just
to
build
it.
So
it's
a
very
cost.
Saving
it's
home
home
incarceration
with
or
without
electronic
monitoring.
We
can
do
it
with
an
ankle
monitor.
We
can
also
do
it
with
a
smartphone
which
is
kind
of
nice.
Kids
might
cut
off
their
ankle
monitors,
but
they
never
leave
their
phones.
G
So
that's
that's
a
better
way
to
sometimes
keep
track
of
them.
We
also
use
foster
care,
we
use
emergency
shelter
and
we've
converted
some
of
our
own
programs
and
Facilities.
We
had
to
serve
this
population
as
we
saw
the
growing
need
for
that
and
I
also
just
want
to
mention
too,
that
we
have
community
staff.
We
have
712
kids
on
some
sort
of
Community
Supervision.
It
could
be
probation
parole,
which
we
call
Aftercare
predispositional
reports
for
the
court,
and
they
are
there
as
an
arm
of
the
court
to
help
the
judges
whatever
they
might
do.
G
We
also
have
a
lot
of
Youth
that
we
have
with
our
interstate
compact.
We
are
the
busiest
one
in
the
nation.
We've
returned
more
kids
last
year
than
anybody
else.
This
is
partly
because
we're
surrounded
by
seven
other
states,
so
whenever
they
cross
over
or
go
back,
we
have
to
be
involved
with
those
and
because
we're
on
75.
G
So
you
get
a
lot
of
runaways
coming
down
from
the
northern
states
and
heading
to
Florida
I
over
the
past
decade
and
time,
we've
really
seen
our
population
change,
and
those
of
you
who
understand
about
Senate
Bill
200,
which
was
a
major
piece
of
legislative
reform,
and
the
purpose
of
that
was
to
divert
low-level
kids
out
of
the
system
and
I
believe
that
that
did
work.
Our
total
felonies
in
2012
were
43
percent
of
our
population
and
our
detention
centers
in
2023
at
72
percent.
G
So,
yes,
we
still
have
kids,
who
skip
school
shoplift
a
bottle
of
perfume,
getting
a
fist
fight
with
somebody
at
school.
So
we
have.
We
still
have
those
lower
level,
kids
somewhat,
but
it's
now
the
minority
and
the
majority
of
our
kids
we
see
are
involved
with
oftentimes
very
serious
offenses,
including
Capital
ones,
Staffing.
G
G
We've
limited,
Staffing
degrades
our
security
programming
and,
let
me
just
say
Staffing
is
everything
we
can
have
a
great
building.
We
can
have
a
wonderful
School
in
there.
We
have
wonderful
programs,
but
if
you
don't
have
adequate
Staffing
numbers
of
adults
in
the
building
and
your
Safety
and
Security
is
not
assured
everything
else
really
doesn't
matter.
So
it's,
it
is
our
most
important
thing
and
also,
if
you
have
staff
who
are
overworked,
who
get
tired
and
exhausted,
they
make
mistakes,
and
even
a
minor
mistake
in
the
sort
of
facilities
can
have
major
consequences.
G
So
it's
a
it's
an
important
thing:
they've
long
had
poor
compensation,
as
recently
as
two
years
ago,
it
was
30,
000
and
I'm
going
to
back
up
a
little
before
that.
That
was
actually
an
increase
that
had
happened
because
a
couple
of
years
before
that
they
were
down
in
like
I,
think
26.
So
the
fact
that
we
have
now
been
able
to
upgrade
that
has
helped
a
lot.
G
G
Superintendents
tell
me
that
they'll
know
and
they're
in
their
cell
who's,
coming
on
duty
by
the
sound
of
their
footsteps,
and
they
know
that
you
know
it's
easier
to
create
a
diversion.
It's
easier
to.
They
know
the
staff
are
going
to
be
slower
to
respond,
but
it
also
affects
behavior
in
other
ways.
G
If
our
kids
are
like
attention,
starved
and
if
they
they
can't
get
it
in
positive
ways,
they'll
go
from
negative,
but
having
somebody
there
to
talk
to
you
and
ask
you
how
it
went
in
court
to
talk
about
that
bad
phone
call,
you
got
from
home
to
just
ask
how
your
day
is
going,
helps
keep
those
Behavior
incidents
down.
So
it
really
is
a
ripple
effect
that
goes
through
our
entire
system
and,
at
this
point,
I'll
turn
it
back
over.
Thank.
F
You
I
would
just
as
we
get
into
the
things
that
the
different
improvements
that
are
in
process
I
would
just
Echo
what
commissioner
Reed
said,
and
that
is
Staffing
is
the
Bedrock
issue.
It's
not
the
only
issue,
but
I
think
we,
as
we
would
have
General
agreement
on
this
absent
an
adequate
number
of
well-trained
Staff.
F
You
cannot
design
a
program,
that's
going
to
succeed,
that's
where
it
it
has
to
start,
and,
as
the
commissioner
said,
if
we
just
go
back
two
or
three
years,
the
starting
pay
for
Frontline
workers
in
these
facilities
was
thirty
thousand
dollars
a
year.
That
simply
was
insufficient
to
attract
the
the
workforce
that
we
needed
and
I.
Don't
think
anybody
would
be
would
be
surprised
by
that.
So,
in
December
of
2021
Governor
Bashir
announced
a
10
raise
for
all
security
positions
at
DJJ,
as
we
started
working
on
this
problem,
that
was
actually
it's.
F
A
long-standing
problem
was
publicly
acknowledged,
at
least
as
early
as
2017
and
probably
earlier
frankly,
those
2021
races.
We
did
not
see
that
that
moved
the
needle,
very
much
I
think
we
might
have
had
some
improvement
in
retention,
but
it
certainly
didn't
help
us
a
lot
in
recruiting
new
staff
in
July
of
2022.
The
enacted
budget
provided
an
eight
percent
increase
for
all
employees,
including
DJJ
workers,
and
we
acknowledge
again
here
today
our
deep
appreciation
to
the
legislative
body
for
appropriating
those
necessary
funds
for
our
staff.
Thank
you
for
that
again.
F
Unfortunately,
our
staffing
issue
remained
stubborn
and
didn't
move
very
much
even
after
those
significant
races.
So
in
October
2022
we
were
able
to
engineer
increases
of
starting
salaries
up
to
about
forty
four
thousand
dollars
a
year
for
our
front
line
workers.
We
did
that
by
reprogramming
some
dollars
by
taking
by
making
a
decision
which
was
kind
of
a
tough
decision
to
take
a
funded
vacant
positions
that
we've
certainly
hoped
to
fill
and
needed
to
fill
but
had
been
unable
to
fill.
F
So
we
cannibalized
the
money
that
was
in
those
positions
to
increase
the
pay
for
our
existing
staff
and
use
as
a
recruitment
tool
and
I
would
certainly
acknowledge,
Miss,
Norton
and
and
her
staff
for
helping
us
to
do
that.
As
I've
just
said
to
Senator,
Thomas
you've
got
the
best
budget
person
in
the
state
sitting
here
before
you,
except
for
John
Hicks,
of
course.
F
And
it's
you
know,
the
numbers
having
increased
numbers
is
necessary,
but
it's
also
nice
to
have
increased
interest
because
all
of
you
all
know
I'm
sure
in
your
own
lines
of
work,
that
if
you,
if
you
have
five
people,
that
you're
interviewing
for
a
job
as
opposed
to
one
person,
who's
interviewing
for
a
job,
you're,
probably
going
to
get
a
better
outcome.
So
we're
encouraged
by
what
we're.
Seeing
and
again
we
appreciate
the
general
assembly
for
For
assistance
with
those
races.
F
The
next
slide
you
can,
you
can
is
a
graphic
presentation
of
the
improvements
that
have
been
made
since
the
first
of
the
year,
we've
gone
from
313
field
positions
to
350,
which
is
is
significant.
Our
facilities
are
small
facilities
and
so
they're
acutely
sensitive
to
even
Minor
Adjustments
in
Staffing,
either
way,
and
that
doesn't
tell
the
whole
story,
because
we
do
have
a
lot
more
applications
in
the
pipeline
now
and
we're
hiring
people
as
as
fast
as
we
can
and
I
can
tell
you
that
was
has
not
been
the
case.
I
J
I
Past
I
want
to
go
back
to
the
initiatives
incentives.
If
you
will
at
one
time
there
was
a
a
a
pay
difference
that
was
being
made
in
order
to
recruit
and
it
was
being
based
on
location
and
so
forth.
And
if
you
come
from
certain
areas
where
there
was
a
need,
we
were
paying
more
than
in
some
areas
where
we
didn't
have
that
great
of
a
demand
and
and
looking
at
these
increases
of
things
has
that
been
resolved.
Now
to
where
we
have
everybody
back
on
that
same
page,
it.
F
I
J
J
I
F
So
so
in
in
terms
of
of
Staffing,
in
addition
to
what
we've
done
with
the
compensation
we've
also
conducted,
what
I
would
call
a
bottom-up
review,
because
you
know
we
had
our
staffing
complement
on
paper.
That
said,
this
facility
gets
so
many
people.
This
facility
gets
so
many
people,
but
frankly,
I,
don't
really
know
where
those
numbers
came
from.
They
probably
existed
for
a
long
time.
Some
of
it
probably
comes
from
some
of
these
National
ratios,
but
what
we
wanted
to
know
is
forget
all
of
that.
F
How
many
people
does
it
really
take
to
run
a
safe
and
secure
facility?
So
we
went
out
and
we
talked
to
our
superintendents.
We
talked
to
people
on
the
ground
and
we
got
a
better
idea
about
that
and
based
on
that
review,
We
determined
that
we
needed
to
increase
the
allotment
working
in
these
detention
centers
and
at
Governor
bashir's
request
and
with
the
general
assemblies
cooperation.
F
We've
received
an
appropriation
of
a
9.7
million
dollars
in
this
last
session
to
hire
an
additional
146
Department
of
Juvenile
Justice
detention,
staff
and,
again
that's
based
what
we
learned
on
what
we
learned
from
talking
to
the
people
running
these
facilities,
because,
in
my
judgment,
everything
with
these
juvenile
starts
with
having
safe
and
secure
facilities.
We,
in
my
judgment,
I'm
speaking
just
for
me,
but
we
can
have.
We
can
have
Cadillac
programming.
F
We
can
have
everything
in
the
world,
but
if
we
don't
have
a
safe
and
secure
facility,
it's
just
never
going
to
get
delivered
because
you're
always
dealing
with
with
other
problems,
so
I
think
on
Staffing,
which
is
the
Bedrock
problem.
The
trend
line
is
good.
We're
improving
we're
now
at
compensation
levels
that
are
competitive
for
the
moment.
I
think
we
all
need
to
remind
ourselves
that
labor
markets
are
not
static,
that
they
always
move
and
what
is
a,
perhaps
a
competitive
starting
salary
today
may
or
may
not
be
in
a
couple
of
years.
K
F
I,
don't
have
the
exact
numbers
we
could
get
that
for
you,
I
can
tell
you
that
they're
not
evenly
distributed.
I
can
tell
you
that
that
at
every
one
of
our
detention
centers,
we
have
been
able
to
improve
our
staffing
and
we're
seeing
increased
interest.
But
you
know
all
labor
markets
are
local
and
they're
all
different.
So,
for
example,
we've
seen
we've
had
better
success
at
recruitment
in
Adair
County
and
then
probably
we
breathit
County.
F
Although
we
already
had
pretty
good
Staffing
there
than
we
have
in
Campbell
County
in
Jefferson
County,
it
would
I,
don't
think
it'd.
Surprise
anybody
that
Campbell,
County
and
Jefferson
County
are
the
toughest
markets
and
even
though
we've
seen
improvements
in
those
markets,
it
lags
behind
and
probably
really
all
the
rest
of
the
state
because
of
local
economic
factors.
I
suspect,
I
know,
as
I
talked
to
law
enforcement
officers
in
particularly
in
Northern
Kentucky.
F
They
tell
me
all
the
time
that
they're
having
a
heck
of
a
Time
recruiting
people,
it's
just
it's
and
it's
good
news.
Bad
news
I
mean
I
have
to
believe
that's
because
the
economic
conditions
there
are
very
good
for
employment,
which
is
great,
but
if
you're
a
competitor
in
the
labor
market,
which
we
are
you
know
it's.
It's
tough
you're
just
dealing
with
the
the
free
market
forces.
K
E
You
Mr
chair
and
my
question
is
on
Staffing.
You
provided
the
information
starting
January
1st
of
23
and
then
March
29th
of
23
and
then
the
June
update
as
well.
Can
we
see
Back
to
December
of
2021?
Could
I
get
that
information
just
so
we
can
see
because
I
think
that's.
When
the
governor
first
identified,
like
we're.
E
F
Will
we
get
to
a
hundred
percent
I
doubt
if
we'll
get
to
a
hundred
percent
and-
and
let
me
just
be
clear
what
this
slide
shows-
it
shows
filled
positions
and
it
probably
we've
actually
hired
more
than
that
would
suggest,
because
we've
probably
had
some
people
leave
during
that
time
as
well.
But
will
we
ever
get
to
a
hundred
percent
I,
don't
think
so,
I
think
in
many
of
our
areas,
where
we
have
detention
centers,
we
probably
will
but
again
we're
going
to
have
certain
areas
and
and
I've
got
to
say.
L
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman,
real
quickly,
I
know
that
you
said
that
Jefferson
and
Campbell
were
a
struggle
for
hiring,
so
that
would
translate
into
a
capacity
problem
then
for
Jefferson
and
Campbell.
So
if
we,
if
we
don't
have,
if
we
have
a
Workforce
shortage
and
then
we
have
a
capacity
issue,
where
will
those
kids
be
sent
well.
F
F
F
They
had
operated
the
downtown
facility
and
turned
over
the
detention
business
to
the
state
which
made
the
decision
at
that
point
to
repurpose
a
building
that
it
owned
in
Linden,
which
was
not
built
to
be
a
detention
center
and
was
not
built
to
detention
Cent
standards.
But
it
chose
to
reopen
that
facility
in
Linden,
which
I
think
had
about
30
beds,
capacity
for
and
and
so
it's
important
to
understand
that
when
that
decision
was
made,
everybody
would
have
known
at
that
point
that
Linda
never
had
the
capacity
to
keep
all
of
the
Jefferson
kids.
F
So
at
that
point
everybody
knew
there
were
going
to
be
a
lot
of
Jefferson
kids
housed
outside
of
Jefferson
County.
Wouldn't
that
be
right,
commissioner,
just
because
the
it
had
a
lower
capacity
so
where
we
are
now,
we've
had
to
go
in
and
we're
in
the
process
of
making
a
lot
of
improvements
to
that
facility,
because
it
just
it
was
not
built
to
be
a
Detention
Facility
which
has
caused
us
significant
problems.
F
That's
something
there's
two
components
to
operating
a
Detention
Facility
one
is
the
building,
but
the
other
is
the
people,
and
we
all
have
to
be
thinking
about
how
we're
going
to
recruit
a
sufficient
staff
to
operate
that
downtown
Jefferson
facility,
because
that
will
be
a
challenge.
You're
talking
about
a
lot
of
people,
yeah.
F
So
again,
Staffing
not
where
we
need
to
be,
but
certainly
much
better
than
than
we've
seen
in
the
past.
We
do
have
some
additional
Staffing
initiatives
underway
and,
and
some
of
this
as
it
is
at
the
behest
of
the
legislature,
through
Senate
Bill
162.,
we
were
directed
to
begin
a
program,
a
correctional
officer,
our
program,
which
is,
we
are
modeling
off
of
the
State
Police,
our
program
representative,
Blanton's,
very
familiar
with
that
we're
getting
that
underway.
We
were
also
sent
Bill.
F
162
includes
a
limited
duration
program
that
allows
us
to
go
out
and
re-recruit
people
who
worked
at
the
department
but
left,
probably
because
of
compensation,
and
we
can
re-recruit
them
and
not
have
to
have
them
go
through
the
normal
chapter
18
process
and
at
the
at
the
moment
we
have
had
about
15
people
through
that
program
that
have
expressed
interest
and
I
think
we've
hired
seven.
We
have
more
in
the
pipeline
and
that
may
not
sound
like
a
lot
of
people.
F
F
We
had
some
significant
events
and
occurrences
that
are
were
just
very
unfortunate
and
unacceptable,
and
so
we've
taken
a
look
at
everything
from
top
to
bottom,
to
try
to
make
improvements
and
and
I
know
that
we
have
made
improvements
at
Governor
bashir's
directive,
we've
initiated
very
significant
changes
to
the
structure
of
the
detention
system
and
I
think
that
our
facilities
are
safer
and
more
secure
today
than
they
were
a
year
ago.
That's
certainly
not
to
say
they're
perfect,
but
we've
made
a
lot
of
progress
in
December
of
22.
F
F
Prior
to
this,
we
had
boys
and
girls
who
were
housed
in
the
same
facility
and
in
the
same
pod,
and
we
had
offenders
that
were
mixed
together.
You
could
have
a
school
truant
house
next
to
some
young
person
charged
with
murder,
and
that
led
that
there
were
a
couple
of
things
about
that.
That's
the
most
efficient
way
you
can
use
your
beds
because
you
can
put
a
kid
in
any
bed,
that's
open,
and
we
can't
do
that
now
and
that's
a
system
that
was
designed
long
ago
when
the
detention
system
was
started.
F
25
years
ago
that
you
see
today
at
least
the
the
number
of
of
these
severe
issues
and
so
I.
Think
generally,
as
we've
operated
that
program,
that's
been
an
improvement,
it's
led
to
say
more
secure,
safer
facilities.
Again,
it's
not
perfect
and
and
I
say,
as
I
always
do
we'll
never
have
Perfection.
If
you've
defined
Perfection
has
no
incidents.
That
won't
be
the
case
in
a
Juvenile
Detention
Facility.
It
won't
be
the
case
in
a
jail.
F
It
won't
be
the
case
in
a
prison
anytime,
you're
keeping
people
in
significant
numbers
in
places
where
they
don't
want
to
be
you're
going
to
have
incidents.
The
measure
is:
are
you
doing
everything
you
can
to
to
minimize
the
number
of
incidents
and
are
you
responding
appropriately
to
them
when,
when
they
happen
and
we've
made
great
strides
in
that
area,
we
are
and
I
do
want
to
tell
you
about
develop
development
in
Campbell
County,
where
we've
been
keeping
the
girls
and
we
have
a
plan
to
make
some
changes
in
the
immediate
future.
F
That
is
based
largely
on
the
difficulty
in
Staffing
Campbell
County.
We
have
more
staff
there
now
than
we
did,
but
we
still
are
struggling
to
staff
Campbell
County
we've
been
holding
it
together
by
sending
DJJ
employees
from
other
detention
centers
to
work
shifts
there.
The
Department
of
Corrections
has
pitched
in
and
we've
used
doc
Personnel
a
lot
of
probation
officers,
those
sort
of
people
to
to
fill
in
shifts
there,
but
that's
not
sustainable
over
the
Long
Haul.
As
you
would
imagine,
and
so
we've
had
some
difficulties
with
Staffing.
F
We,
we
have
not
had
the
leadership
team
in
place
there
that
we
need-
and
this
causes
a
concern
about
whether
or
not
these
girls
are
being
kept
in
in
the
kind
of
facility
we
want
them
to
be
in
so
we've
made
a
decision
on
a
temporary
basis.
We
think
this
will
run
about
90
days,
no
way
to
notice
sure
for
sure,
but
we're
going
to
use
Campbell
County
has
a
short-term
holdover
and
a
a
drop-off
point
will
continue
to
recruit
staff
there
and
train
staff.
F
We're
going
to
move
the
girls
temporarily
to
Boyd
County,
move
the
Boyd
County
boys
to
breathic
County
until
we
can
get
Campbell
County
in
the
shape
that
we
want
it.
That's
not
something
that
that
we
want
to
do,
but
I
think
we
it's
the
kind
of
thing
that
from
time
to
time,
we're
going
to
have
to
do
as
you
manage
these
populations
you're
going
to
have
to
call
an
audible
every
once
in
a
while
to
to
meet
the
changing
circumstances.
And
that's
what
we're
doing
here.
The
positive
thing
about
this.
In
my
opinion.
F
First
of
all,
it
shows
that
the
reorganization
that
I'll
talk
about
out
in
a
little
bit
is
working
because
we've
been
able
to
have
a
management
group
who
is
focused
only
on
these
detention
centers,
to
focus
like
a
laser
beam
on.
What's
going
on
in
this
facility
to
help
us
understand
what
we
need
to
do
and
we're
trying
to
do
it
proactively
to
get
in
front
of
the
problems
as
as
best
we
can.
This
move
will
be
made
I
think
in
an
orderly
fashion,
and
we
are
absolutely
committed.
F
This
is
not
going
to
cause
any
additional
Transportation
burden
to
our
local
law
enforcement
agencies.
We
know
that's
a
concern.
We
know,
that's
a
concern
that
all
of
you
all
hear
about
from
time
to
time.
I
expect
and
we're
not
going
to
further
burden
our
law
enforcement
agencies
because
of
this
move
so
I
wanted
you
to
know
that
that
this
is
will
be
going
on
in
the
near
future.
You
know
another
issue
we
have
in
Campbell
County.
F
We
have
actually
in
a
lot
of
places,
but
we're
also
dealing
with
a
significant
number
of
juveniles
who
have
really
serious
mental
health
problems
and
obviously
those
juveniles
need
a
lot
of
care.
Sometimes
they
need
more
care
than
it's
possible
to
deliver
in
a
Detention
Facility,
and
when
you
have
that
situation,
I
mean
that
those
situations
are
staff
intensive,
they
s,
they
soak
up
staff
resources
like
a
sponge
in
water,
and
so
we've
seen
a
just
the
need
to
make
this
move
in
Campbell
County.
F
Another
change
we
made
that
I
believe
has
been
positive
and
has
been
made
necessary
because
of
of
an
increasingly
aggressive
population,
as
we
have
for
the
first
time
equipped
our
security
staff
with
non-lethal
defensive
equipment,
which
comes
down
for
the
most
part
to
pepper
spray
to
Shields
and
face
masks
there.
There
are
also
tasers
at
the
facilities,
although
the
tasers
are
locked
away
in
a
in
a
secure
area
and
would
only
be
used
in
the
event
of
a
of
a
general
disturbance
not
in
order
to
to
get
control
of
a
smaller
situation.
F
This
equipment
was
distributed
to
fill
facilities,
starting
in
February
of
2023.
it
all
of
our
staff.
Security
staff
has
now
been
trained
and
certified
on
sea
spray,
and,
of
course
this
is
a
requirement
that
was
included
in
Senate,
Bill
162
and
that's
with
many
items
we're
grateful
to
our
colleagues
in
the
Department
of
Corrections,
who
have
been
very
helpful
with
with
training
and
again
I
think
this
has
been
a
step
forward
and
I
think
most
of
our
people
believe
that
and
the
absent
think
of
it.
F
This
way,
in
the
absence
of
absence
of
any
kind
of
defensive
equipment,
if,
if
you
have
a
youth
who
becomes
aggressive
or
violent,
the
only
alternative
at
that
point
is
some
sort
of
physical
altercation,
and
if
you
can
bring
a
situation
under
control
using
OC
spray
seems
to
me
that's
a
better
result
than
a
physical
altercation.
Now
the
the
first
option
in
every
case
is
to
try
to
de-escalate
the
situation
through
talking,
but
sometimes
that's
not
possible
and
sometimes
attacks
occur
with
no
warning.
F
In
fact,
all
too
often
that
happens,
so
that's
a
change
that
we've
implemented
that
that
I
think
will
be
an
improvement
we
also
beginning
in.
In
December,
we
started
providing
training
to
our
security
staff
concerning
security
threat
groups,
and
we
recently
have
instituted
a
program
where
every
Detention
Center
will
have
a
security
threat
group
coordinator
again.
This
is
something
that
Department
of
Corrections
has
a
lot
of
expertise
on
and
they've
been
very
helpful
in
training,
but
it's
it.
This
is.
F
This
is
a
program
where
we're
better
able
to
identify
juveniles
that
come
into
our
facility.
That
may
be
affiliated
with
groups
who
may
have
as
a
purpose,
to
cause
disturbances
or
to
engage
in
some
sort
of
violent
or
disruptive
activity.
If
we
can
identify
that
on
the
front
end,
then
we
have
the
possibility
of
maybe
separating
those
use
and
maybe
preventing
incidents
before
they
ever
happen,
which
is
is
certainly
our
goal.
F
That's
something
that
you
hope
is
never
needed,
but
if
we
had
some
sort
of
General
disturbance
we
would.
We
would
have
this
core
of
people
who
have
heightened
training
to
be
able
to
to
deal
with
those
issues.
We
are
also
developing
agreements
with
local
law
enforcement
agency.
These
every
place
we
have
a
facility
so
that
we're
better
coordinated
with
those
agencies
in
terms
of
how
they
will
assist
in
responding
to
various
situations
that
that
may
arise
in
the
facility
before.
I
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman
Mr
secretary
speaking
about
intelligence,
information
and
Department
of
Corrections,
any
it
is
there
any
ongoing
or
consideration
on
intelligence
sharing
of
information,
not
just
with
the
Department
of
Corrections,
but
I
could
see
this
been
an
opportunity
of
of
sorts
for
Juvenile,
Justice,
Corrections
and
law
enforcement
in
General
on
oksp,
I'm,
sure,
Louisville,
I'm,
sure
Lexington.
They
have
their
own
intelligence
branches.
J
I
It
I've
I've
walked
in
those
shoes,
but
it
could
help
you
all
from
knowing.
If
there
could
be
some
type
of
agreement
and
sharing
of
intelligence,
it
could
help
you
all
and
in
the
Juvenile
Justice
it
could
help
you
in
corrections,
but
it
could
also
help
law
enforcement
out
on
the
street
as
well.
If
there
was
some
collaboration
there
and
until
especially
when
we're
talking
about
these
security
threat
groups
that
it
could
be
beneficial
for
all
involved,
is
any
of
that
going
on
or
is
any
of
that
being
considered
or
no.
F
I
think
some
of
that
is
going
on
and
I
agree
with
you
and
and
I
would
say
at
this
point:
it's
primarily
between
doc,
be
and
and
DJJ,
but
I
I
think
there's
also
room
to
have
those
kind
of
relationships
with
local
law
enforcement.
You
know
we
have
to
be
sensitive
and
we
always
will
be
that
we're
dealing
with
juveniles
and
we're
dealing
in
detention
with
the
population
of
people
that
you
know
they've
not
been
adjudicated
at
that
point
of
being
guilty
of
anything.
So
we
will
certainly
be
sensitive
to
that.
F
F
We
thought
that
that
would
just
create
one
way
to
create
a
little
more
of
a
professional
atmosphere.
We
now
I
think
have
have
distributed
uniforms.
I
was
in
one
of
our
detention
facilities,
Monday
and
I.
Think
they
look
pretty
good,
so
I
think
that's
again
a
little
bit
of
a
step
forward
that
we
were
happy
to
make.
F
The
next
area
that
I'll
briefly
discuss
is
is
training
of
our
people
and
we
are
having
monthly
emergency
response
training
for
all
of
our
facilities.
We're
looking
to
begin
that
really
right
away.
We
are
in
accordance
with
Senate
Bill
162,
we're
going
to
provide
Management
training
for
all
of
our
people
that
are
interested
in
leadership
and
and
positions
in
the
department,
and
we
have
a
couple
of
lines
on
them.
F
Don't
know
if
that'll
mean
big
changes
or
very
little
changes
or
no
changes,
but
we're
going
to
take
a
fresh
look
at
all
of
that,
because
times
change
and
again,
this
population
has
changed
greatly
in
the
last
10
15
20
years,
and
we
we
need
to
make
sure
that
our
training
has
has
kept
up
with
that,
because
that
will
keep
our
people
safer,
it'll,
keep
our
juveniles
safer
and
it
will
allow
them
to
better
take
care.
Take
advantage
of
of
the
programming
that
we
offer.
F
F
It
splits
out
the
detention
centers
the
eight
detention
centers
and
puts
those
detention
centers
under
a
separate
management
line,
because
the
issues
that
you
encounter
in
a
Detention
Center
are
not
the
same
issues
that
you
encounter
in
a
group
home
or
a
Youth,
Development
Center,
and
so
by
realigning
those
to
have
a
separate
management
team.
I
think
we're
able
to
get
better
focus
on
the
things
we
need
to
do
to
have
secure
facilities.
F
The
reorganization,
also
com,
create
created
a
compliance
division
that
reports
directly
to
commissioner
Reed
this
Builds
on
the
quality
assurance
work
that
was
going
on
before,
but
it
expands
that
work.
The
compliance
division
is
going
to
have
carte
blanche
in
a
lot
of
ways.
The
compliance
division
is
making
unannounced
visits
to
our
department
facilities.
They
can
walk
in
the
door
of
a
facility
and
they
can
talk
to
anybody
there,
any
staff
member
they
can
privately.
They
can
talk
to
the
juveniles
and
it's
just
a
good
way
to
to
kind
of
see.
F
F
He
has
a
wealth
of
experience
in
the
Department
of
Corrections,
he's
been
awarded
at
adult
facilities,
and
he
also
has
experience
working
at
the
Department
of
Juvenile
Justice
Mr
Chandler
also
has
an
enormous
amount
of
experience
in
the
corrections
area
and
and
I
I.
It's
not
an
overstatement
to
say
that
he's
really
a
legend
in
the
in
the
Department
of
Corrections
in
Kentucky.
He
probably
trained
most
of
our
wardens,
so
between
them,
these
Two
Fellas
have
probably
70
or
80
years
experience
in
running
secure
facilities
and
so
I
think
that's
going
to
be
a
help.
F
F
There's
been
a
lot
of
things
that
have
happened
in
technology
since
then,
and
and
I'll
be
very
Frank
with
you
as
we
encountered
some
of
these
issues,
it
was.
It
was
very
difficult
to
access
in
a
timely
way,
the
kind
of
historical
information
we
needed
to
manage
these
problems.
They
the
way
they
needed
to
be
managed.
F
So
we
decided
we
had
to
address
that
and
we
I
think
we
made
this
decision
in
in
December
and
in
January
DJJ
was
added
to
the
Kentucky
offender
management
system.
We
call
it
comms
to
that
Master
agreement.
This
is
the
data
system
that
the
Department
of
Corrections
uses
to
to
track
20,
000
plus
inmates
we
have
in
Kentucky.
It's
a
system,
therefore,
that
we
know
a
lot
about.
We
have
a
good
relationship
with
the
vendor
and
the
vendor
has
a
module
that
is
built
for
Juvenile
Justice
facilities.
F
So
we
are
in
the
process
of
implementing
that
com
system,
which
I
think
will
be
a
Quantum
Leap
Forward
for
the
Department
I.
Think
the
management
of
the
department
will
have
tools
available
to
help
get
in
front
of
issues
instead
of
chasing
them
that
just
have
not
been
available
in
the
past.
This
is
going
to
take
a
while.
We
are
currently
working
on
phase
one.
We
expect
that
it
will
finally
be
completed
in
early
2025,
but
as
I
suspect.
All
of
you
know
this
is
this
is
a
long
process.
F
We
also
are
making
critical
improvements
to
our
facilities.
We've
had
a
lot
of
work
underway
at
Jefferson,
Warren
and
brethrit.
As
you
all
probably
know,
these
detention
facilities
were
built
for
the
most
part,
probably
25
or
30
years
ago,
some
of
them
longer
than
that
and
and
frankly,
I.
Don't
think
A
lot's
been
done
to
them
in
that
period
of
time.
In
terms
of
of
truly
major
enhancements,
some
of
the
shortcomings
in
these
physical
facilities
were
were
significant,
contributing
causes
to
some
of
the
issues
that
we
encountered
last
summer
and
fall.
F
One
is
Mr
Chandler's
first
job
I
talked
about
Larry
Chandler
was
to
go
inspect
every
DJJ
detention
center
and
Youth
Development
Center,
and
look
at
it
through
the
his
security
eyes
and
to
give
us
advice
on
what
we
what
security
holes
we
had
in
in
those
facilities,
and
he's
done
that
we
also
contracted
with
the
American
Correctional
Association
to
to
do
similar
work
to
inspect
our
facilities
and
identify
necessary
improvements
that
this
is,
of
course
the
ACA
does
regular
audits
of
our
facilities.
But
this
was
a
different
kind
of
work.
F
This
was
focused
on
looking
at
these
aging
facilities
and
helping
us
understand
what
kind
of
improvements
needed
to
be
made.
We've
also
been
able
again
to
Leverage
The
expertise
that
exist
at
the
department
of
corrections
to
help
us
move
forward
in
these
areas,
and
so
we're
making
a
lot
of
facility
upgrades
at
all
of
our
detention
centers.
This
includes
modifying
doors
in
some
places.
The
doors
were
just
completely
insufficient
for
the
job.
Better
locks,
cameras,
control
panels,
upgrading
the
technology
in
the
control
rooms,
where
it's
necessary,
exterior
fencing
where
that
might
be
necessary.
G
You
can
you
can
see
from
the
slide
just
a
reminder
of
what
was
passed
in
the
recent
legislation.
The
first
was
that
we
enter
into
sufficient
contracts
that
we
have
available
institutional
treatment
for
kids
with
severe
mental
illness,
and
we
also
need
to
provide
them
access
to
mental
health
professionals
and
1.5
million
for
us
to
establish
a
diversionary
program
to
identify
and
provide
treatment
for
any
youth
suffering
from
serious
mental
illness.
G
This
is
also
being
done
in
conjunction
with
ciac,
for
those
of
you
who
are
familiar
with
that,
and
so
we've
been
meeting
and
developing
that
and-
and
they
as
well
of
us,
are
excited
about
that
Prospect
House,
Bill,
3,
we've
talked
a
lot
about
162,
but
House
Bill
3
requires
automatic
Detention
of
Youth
accused
of
certain
offenses
for
up
to
to
their
detention.
Hearing.
G
As
you
know,
kids
aren't
available,
aren't
allowed
bail,
so
they
have
a
detention
hearing,
that's
their
legal
safeguard
for
that
or
you
know
what
the
equivalent
would
be,
so
they
would
remain
detained
from
the
time
of
arrest
until
their
detention
hearing
the
delay
on
that
has
been
put
off
until
July,
1st
2024.
I.
Think.
G
That's
mainly
in
I
think
we'll
be
just
addressing
this
in
a
minute
of
bed
capacity
issues,
because
we
expect
a
significant
new
number
of
Youth
to
come
into
a
system
to
see
whether
we
actually
have
spaces
for
those
and
then
House
Bill
3
allows
for
use
to
have
detention,
to
have
visitation
from
non-profit
groups
and
faith-based
organizations,
and-
and
that's
very
welcome-
we've
always
welcome
anybody
into
our
facility.
That
has
a
legitimate
reason
to
be
there
and
and
I
will
mention.
G
The
other
thing
on
here
is
just
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
what
we
face
in
detention
and
it's
it's
very
different
when,
when
we
have
a
kid
who's
going
to
one
of
our
post
disposition
facilities,
one
of
our
Youth
Development
Centers
or
our
group
homes,
we
know
all
about
that
kid.
We've
they've
been
in
detention.
Probably
for
weeks
or
months
we
are
done.
A
complete
classification.
Packet
talked
to
parents,
gotten
the
school
information.
G
You
know
the
kid
is
knows:
they're
going
to
placement,
they
arrive
during
the
daytime
when
staff
are
expecting
them.
They've
been
fed,
nobody's
coming
in
hungry,
they've
been
seen
by
medical
staff
they're
on
their
medications.
They
aren't
high
on
drugs.
We
know
that
kid
was
in
foster
care
at
eight
that
he's
a
special
ed
student
that
he's
allergic
to
peanuts
and
that
last
year
he
tried
to
commit
suicide.
So
we
know
all
that
coming
in
the
door,
we're
ready
now
switch
over
to
detention.
G
So
you
can
imagine
when
they
come
in
and
present
at
all
hours
and
all
days
and
it's
and
it's
not
like
our
post
disposition
that
one
kid
I
just
talked
about.
He
may
be
the
only
kid
that's
there
that
week
or
for
two
weeks
to
be
admitted
in
detention,
it's
in
and
out
out
the
court
out,
the
detention
hearing-
and
you
know
released
once
if
somebody
comes
and
gets
them
new
kids
brought
in
all
day,
24
7..
G
G
We
try
to
do
as
much
as
we
can,
but
we
are
somewhat
limited
on
our
formal
evidence
base
that
we
do
in
our
long-term
facilities
again
that
constant,
chaotic,
coming
and
going
youth
may
not
be
guilty
of
the
offense
of
which
they're
detained
their
parents
and
the
youth
have
the
right
to
refuse
treatment
because
you
haven't
found
guilty
of
anything.
So
you
can't
order
somebody
to
do
something
if
they
don't
want
to
be
involved
and
look
we're
Contracting
with
one
group
and
one
of
the
big
holdups
has
been.
G
Is
they
won't
come
in
and
do
anything
until
they
know
they
have
a
parent
consent
form
every
time
before
they
see
the
kid
and
then
again
the
duration
of
how
long
the
kid's
going
to
be.
There
is
very
different.
We
may
have
a
kid
come
in
at
two
in
the
morning.
He
goes
out
to
court
at
seven.
We
never
see
him
again
may
have
a
youth
there
six
days,
six
weeks,
six
months
and
we
have
some
kids
who've
been
there
up
to
three
years.
G
A
C
G
You
probably
heard
me
anyway,
right
loud,
so
you
know
we
look
at
all
of
those.
You
know
contact
the
school
system
find
out
what
information
and
we'll
flag
those
we'll
we'll
our
counselors
will
notify
the
mental
health
folks
that
we
have
a
special
youth
in
there
that
may
need
some
additional
services
and
so
forth.
C
G
I
appreciate
that,
because
I'm,
a
parent
of
an
autistic
child
and
I,
know
for
the
issue
too,
that
if
he
had
ever
ended
up
in
such
a
place,
I
know
the
Extreme
Measures.
We
know
we
know
what
he
what
sets
him
off
and
what
didn't
set
him
off
and
those
sorts
of
things
so
I
I
can
well
understand
the
concerns
on
that
and,
quite
frankly,
you
know.
G
I
Unless
you
know
I,
don't
mean
to
be
very
blunt
but
I'm
going
to
be
very
blunt:
is
parents
not
able
to
maybe
control
them
in
a
manner
and
they're
pushing
them
off
on
you
guys
to
try
to
do
that,
but
I
don't
see
any
reason
why
somebody
with
either
of
those
and
I'm
sure
there's
other
disabilities
out
there
as
well,
that
you
probably
see
that
you
scratch
your
head
of?
Why
are
these
people
here.
G
Yeah
we,
you
know
that
that's
the
one
thing
I'm
glad
you
brought
that
up.
You
know
we
can't
control
who
comes
to
our
door
if
they
come
and
they
have
a
court
order,
no
matter
how
much
meet
might
question
whether
this
is
appropriate
or
not.
But
the
other
thing
is
that
we
we're
often
the
only
game
in
town.
G
You
know,
if
you
have
some
kid
who's
stealing,
because
he's
hungry,
then
mental
health
treatment
may
not
be
what
he
needs.
What
he
needs
is
that
somebody
goes
and
helps
mom
sign
up
for
food
stamps
and
other
things
so
that
that
he's
no
longer
doing
those
types
of
things.
So
we
we
get
it.
People
I
think,
would
be
amazed
at
the
range
they
picture.
When
you
hear
a
juvenile
offender,
I
think
one
thing,
but
we
get
very
broad.
G
G
So
we
mentioned
the
fact
that
we
were
charged
with
developing
contracts
for
our
severe
mental
health
Youth
and
we
did
Issue
an
RFP
for
that
this
closed
and
we
did
not
get
any
responses
and
I'm
just
going
to
say.
I
wasn't
really
surprised
by
that,
because,
historically,
what
we
found
is
that
the
hospitals
and
so
forth
that
are
out
there
are
private
and
they're
not
required
to
accept
our
youth.
They
they
choose
who
they
want
to
serve,
and
our
kids
are,
to
be
quite
honest,
often
very,
very
difficult,
very
violent.
G
Sometimes
if
sex
sexual
acting
out
issues
and
so
forth,
and
if
they
choose
not
to
serve
them,
then
you
know
that
that
is
their
choice.
So
again,
we've
kind
of
become
the
custodian
of
Last,
Resort
oftentimes
and
some
of
those
kids.
You
know,
as
as
the
secretary
mentioned,
it's
just
detention
is
not
really
an
appropriate
place.
For
you
know,
full-time
Medical,
Care
and
so
forth,
with
the
extreme,
like
hospitalization
needs
that
some
of
these
kids
have
commission.
K
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman
commissioner,
could
you
I
guess
explain
to
me
the
procurement
process
you
went
through
and
what
prohibited
those
individuals
to
not
submit
a
a
response
other
than
what
you
mentioned?
You
said
that
they
choose
to
do
this
or
not,
but
I
also,
look
at
there's
a
higher
calling
a
higher
obligation.
The
private
sector
needs
to
provide
the
community
regardless,
if
it's
detention
or
regardless
of
whatever
particularly
comes
to
Mental
Health,
could
you
expand
on
that.
G
You
know
I
can't
totally
speak
for
those
folks,
too.
I
do
know
that
they
have
had
many
of
the
same
staffing
issues
we
have
and
that
beds
have
become
unavailable
because
they
don't
have
enough
staff.
You
know
we
had
one
facility,
sometimes
that
we
referred
one
for
the
acute
hospitalization.
It
was
40
beds
and
they
could
only
take
eight.
G
That's
all
they
had
to
staff
it
and
they,
so
they
grapple
with
some
of
the
same
issues
but
again
they're
private
and
they
get
a
whole
lot
of
kids
referred
to
them,
and
so
it
may
be
that
you
know
whether
the
choice
between
one
of
our
really
difficult
kid
or
some
kid
in
the
community
who's
threatening
suicide,
that
they
may
tap.
That
youth
instead
of
ours
is
that
the
best
way.
F
To
yeah
and
I
think
in
just
in
terms
of
the
procurement
process,
probably
miss
Norton
of
the
three
of
us.
I
bet
understands
that
process
better
than
any
of
us,
but
I
will
give
you
an
example,
because
I
think
this
is
a
really
really
important
topic.
What
the
commissioner
says
is
exactly
right:
there
are
kids
that
are
in
these
detention
facilities
that
shouldn't
be
in
a
Juvenile,
Detention
Facility,
but
there's
no
place
else
for
them,
and
so
one
way
to
help
us
solve
our.
F
The
DJJ
problems
is
to
solve
these
other
problems
and
have
these
kids
in
places
where
they
should
be
and
where
they're
getting
what
they
need
and
just
an
example
and
I've
I've
talked
about
this
before
so
I'll
apologize.
If
some
of
you
have
heard
this
before,
but
there
was
a
young
person,
we
had
in
detention
that
a
lot
was
written
about
last
fall
and
about
the
issues
with
this
young
person
down
in
Adair
County.
This
was
a
young
person
who
had
a
severe
mental
illness.
There
was
no
question
about
that.
F
The
department
tried
I
think
over
the
course
of
a
year
ago,
a
year
or
so
nine
different
placements
in
treatment
facilities
for
this
person,
because
that's
where
this
juvenile
needed
to
be
was
some
place
where
treatment
for
mental
illness
was
available,
not
in
what
the
commissioner
described
as
a
jail
every
those
nine
efforts,
none
of
those
facilities
would
take
this
person.
There
was
a
facility
that
agreed
to
take
her.
In
fact,
this
happened
twice.
I
think
that
they
said,
okay,
we'll
treat
this
person
and
when
she
got
there,
the
as
I
understand
it.
F
She
immediately
assaulted
the
admissions
staff
in
a
very
serious
Manner
and
injured
them,
because
she
was
uncontrollably
violent
because
she
was
mentally
ill
well,
the
management
of
these
private
facilities
said
we
can't
deal
with
that.
We're
we're
not
going
to
admit
that
so
one
of
them
was
actually
an
out
of
state,
an
out-of-state
provider
so
that
that's
a
situation.
I
I
think
it's
fair
to
say,
commissioner,.
G
F
H
For
the
RF
's
question
that
you
had
asked
so
in
this
case
an
RFP
would
be
developed
by
the
department
as
far
as
providing
what
it
is
that
they're
looking
for,
in
this
case
institutional
mental
health
treatment
for
youth.
So
it
would
have
some
details
in
there
as
to
what
they're
hoping
to
receive
from
somebody
that
would
be
bidding
on
this.
H
H
K
And
I
assume
you'll
go
through
sorry,
Mr
chairman,
bearing
ahead
I
assume
you
would
go
through
some
type
of
evaluation
on
the
procurement
when
they
submit
something
you
go
through,
like
maybe
a
weighted
scale
in
terms
of
what
the
quality
is
from
equipment
to
the
facility
to
personnel
and
costs
should
not
be.
The
only
Factor
should
be
actually
a
minor
Factor
correct.
H
So
in
the
rfps
there
will
be
that
that
are
published
by
a
finance
cabinet.
There
will
be
a
chart
within
them
that
kind
of
outlines
how
their
responses
would
be
scored
when
they
come
in
so
kind
of
the
things
that
we
would
consider
to
be.
The
most
important
within
those
responses
may
have
a
higher
weight
and
then
it
so
whoever
is
responding
understands.
You
know
what
things
are
being
evaluated
when
the
the
RFP
committee
is
reviewing
those
and.
K
I
appreciate
that
there's
some
departments
in
the
administration-
and
it's
been
this
like
for
a
long
time
that
don't
go
through
that
process,
so
it's
more
of
a
quality
based
selection
and
I-
appreciate
that
and
and
I've
sort
of
come
from
that
background,
but
I
want
to
bridge
on
why
why
these
organizations
aren't
being
more
receptive,
I
understand
your
explanation,
but
part
of
me
is
also
thinking
of.
Where
can
we?
K
What
can
we
do
from
a
public-private
partnership
in
order
to
give
some
incentives
in
terms
of
providing
this
outlet
for
people
not
to
returning
but
really
being
misplaced
or
re
not
being
allocated
properly
and
should
be
going
to
if
another
facility,
so
I
want
to
see
hit
your
thoughts
about
that?
Have
y'all
considered
doing
that
and
so
forth?
And
the
other
question
is:
are
some
of
these
individuals
I'm?
Sorry
for
pointing
my
pen?
That's
all
right!
There's
do
some
of
these.
Should
they
be
in
a
hospital.
F
Well,
there's
a
there's
a
lot
to
unpack
in
that
question
there.
Yes,
we
I
think
we
are.
We
are
open
to
any
solution
that
will
work
for
these
juveniles
and
get
them
where
they
need
to
be
and
really
long
before
this
procurement
process,
which
was
part
of
one
Senate
Bill
162.,
we've
worked
with
chfs
and
secretary
friedlander
and
I've
discussed
this
many
times.
F
I
know
chfs
is
working
hard
and
has
been
for
some
time
to
try
to
find
a
provider
and
to
craft
some
sort
of
arrangement
to
to
to
take
these
kids
and
and
I'm.
Talking
about
you
know
the
population
at
any
given
time
is
not
that
great
I'm
talking
about
kids,
who
are
severely
mentally
ill
and
and
consequently
also
very
violent
and
very
aggressive.
That's
the
you
know
again.
F
Thankfully,
we
don't
have
a
hundred
of
those,
but
every
one
of
those
cases
is
a
tragedy
and
every
one
of
those
juveniles
deserves
appropriate
treatment
and
and
I've
also
got
to
say
from
from
the
standpoint
of
the
tent
trying
to
run
detention
facilities.
It's
hard
to
imagine
how
difficult
it
is
to
maintain
someone
like
that
in
a
Detention
Facility
environment.
It's
just
it
is
it's
incredibly
difficult
for
our
staff.
We've
had
in
some
of
these
detention
centers
where
they
face
these
issues.
F
We've
had
a
lot
of
Staff
members
quit
just
because
of
of
these
issues,
so
their
has
been
a
lot
of
discussion
and
work
going
on
to
try
to
find
a
provider
that
will
deal
with
these
situations.
We
had
a
meeting
secretary,
friedlander
and
I
and
others
there
was
a
provider
represented
in
Senator
Carroll's
office
near
the
end
of
the
legislative
session
and
had
a
discussion
about
this.
But
unfortunately,
at
this
point
you
know
nothing
has
come
to
fruition
because,
again
and
I
understand
it,
I'm
not
condemning
anyone
from
from
the
provider
standpoint
it
is.
F
K
I,
encourage
you
and
I'd
be
more
happy
to
help
facilitate
or
participate
in
the
process.
It
seems
like
you
said,
you
mentioned
what
one
provider
I
would
encourage
you
to
have,
maybe
as
many
providers
as
you
can
to
have
a
brainstorming
a
session
in
order
to
try
to
resolve
this.
You
know
issue
because
you
know
by
I
mean
just
obviously
they're
not
being
properly
placed,
and
it
just
unfortunately,
there's
a
flaw
in
the
system,
and
we
need
to
try
to
find
a
fix
with
that.
K
F
D
Thank
you
chairman
storm.
First
of
all,
I
just
want
to
say
thank
you
for
for
the
presentation
that
that
you're
giving
it's
a
lot
of
really
good
information,
but
I
want
to
follow
up
on
what
was
what
was
just
said.
I
mean
there's
no
doubt
that
that
we
would
love
to
have
fewer
people
in
the
juvenile
detention
centers
that
have
either
mental
or
Behavioral
Health
disabilities.
Two
quick
questions
and
and
just
short
answers,
please
just
short
answers
and
I'll
ask
both
of
them.
If
I
can
Mr
chair
and
then
let
them
answer.
D
D
Are
there
due
to
mental
or
Behavioral
or,
let's
just
say,
mental
health
issues
versus
those
who
are
determined
to
have
a
lack
of
structure,
discipline
and
accountability
at
home?
We
for
some
reason
we
don't
like
to
talk
about
those
things
for
fear
of,
and,
and
you
know
this
is
true
for
fear
of
hurting
someone's
feelings,
but
we're
dealing
with
our
future
population,
our
future
adult
population.
Second
question:
has
there
been
any
comparisons
of
the
records
when
these
kids
are
evaluated?
D
G
Well,
two
I'll
start
with
your
latter
one.
We
we
have
a
screening
tool
that
we
use
for
every
youth
that
comes
into
detention,
our
Maisie,
which
is
the
nationally
recognized,
and
it's
broken
down
into
all
sorts
of
categories
of
functions.
We're
able
to
use
it
try
to
flag
which
kids
might
be
suicidal,
which
kids
might
be
depressed,
which
kids
have
you
know
long-standing.
G
A
lot
of
our
kids
are
dual
diagnosis
and
the
other
thing
to
realize,
along
with
the
mental
health,
is
substance
abuse,
and
now
we
we
are
actually
having
kids
who
have
substance
induced
substance,
induced
psychosis,
because
yeah
you're
nodding
your
head.
You
know
that
the
Nash,
the
national
figure
for
youth
in
the
juvenile
justice
system-
this
isn't
just
attention
this
would
be
across.
The
whole
thing
is
anywhere
from
like
60
to
80
percent
of
Youth
have
a
diagnosis.
You
know
it
may
be
just
ADHD.
It
may
be
something
else.
G
You
know
minor
all
the
way
up
to
schizophrenia
and
others.
So
it's
very
prevalent
in
in
the
juvenile
population-
and
sometimes
those
kids
are
both
they're,
also
the
kids
that
that
don't
have
the
parent
accountability
and
so
forth
and
I'll
speak
back
to
the
fact
that,
as
a
person
who
has
a
child
with
autism
and
my
husband
and
I,
being
college
educated
and
having
funds
and
so
forth,
we
were
able
to
buy
and
get
a
lot
of
services
for
our
child.
G
That
may
be
a
single
mother
of
three
in
a
poverty
area
might
not
be
able
to
access.
So
you
you
get
into
some
multiple.
It's
a
lot
of
our
kids.
It's
really
hard
to
to
pin
down
you
know,
and
we
do
have
some
kids
who
just
come
in,
who
do
I
call
stupid,
age-appropriate
thing
and
for
any
of
you
all
who
are
like
you
know,
remember
when
you
were
14
15
and
16..
Oh
representative,
Bryant
and
smiling
may
have
done
something
that
was
maybe
not
your
finest
moment.
G
So
we
do
get
some
kids
in
that
do
those
sorts
of
things
and
don't
need
any
kind
of
long-term
and
we
get
some
that
are
you
know.
Just
you
know
in
in
poverty-stricken
neighborhoods
and
don't
have
the
access
to
a
lot
of
services
and
have
gotten
involved
in
things
that
they
shouldn't
with
kids
that
they
shouldn't
and
they
just
really
have
gotten
into
that
lifestyle.
So
we
we
do.
Look
at
all.
We,
like
I,
said
we
kind
of
have
a
mixture
of
everything.
If
that
answers
your
question
adequately,
it.
C
G
G
We
have
kids
that
may
come
in
who
have
stolen
a
car
or
done
a
robbery
who
have
a
mental
health
issue
and
we
sort
of
feel
like
those
kids
are
still
appropriate,
and
then
we
have
those
kids
who
come
to
us
because
of
their
mental
health
issue
they're
having
a
an
episode,
the
police
are
called,
they
slug
the
police,
they
slug,
the
the
ambulance
driver
we've
had
all
of
that,
and
they
end
up
in
our
system.
For
that
we
had
one
youth.
G
That
was
there
because
he
went
to
kill
himself
and
he
took
his
father's
handgun
and
the
police
were
able
to
be
called
talked
him
out
of
doing
that.
Well,
but
then
he
was
charged
with
minor
in
possession
of
a
handgun
which
is
a
felony
and
detained,
and
in
this
case
the
court
didn't
want
to
let
him
go
because
he'd
made
it
clear.
His
number
one
goal
in
life
was
to
kill
himself.
So
you
you
get
into
that
sort
of
different
types
of
kids.
If
that.
G
G
We
may
have
two
or
three
kids
in
the
system
at
one
time
with
that
in
our
detention
centers,
and
so
it's
not
a
real
high
population
compared
to
the
kids
that
have
the
the
you
know:
conduct
disorder
and
OCD
and
some
of
those
other
types
of
things.
And
of
course
you
get
our
kids
with
trauma.
History
I
mean
we.
We
had
one
child
who
came
to
us
that
had
64
prior
placements
before
they
came
to
us
and
obviously
they
had
trust
issues.
G
I
mean
we've
done
everything
from
buy
weighted
blankets
if
you're
familiar
with
those
which
are
going
to
be
soothing
for
for
kids
and
to
you
know,
softer
furniture
and
just
anything
we
can
can
do
to
you
know
as
far
as
our
trauma-informed
care
and
that's
another
big
area
for
training
that
we're
looking
at,
is
being
able
to
do
that
and
again
those
all
go
back
to
Staffing
when
you're
adequately
staffed.
You
can
do
a
lot
more
of
those
things
than
you
can.
If
you
are
not.
M
Thank
you
chairman
to
try
and
tie
together
what
we've
been
discussing
over
the
last
few
minutes.
Would
you
say
that
it's
accurate
that
if
we
prioritized
funding
for
community-based
waivers,
Medicaid
waivers
to
try
and
address
young
people
who
have
medical
issues
but
need
support
at
home
from
paid
caregivers
and
also
foster
care
youth,
if
we
prioritize
those
things
with
funding,
would
some
of
the
problems
that
DJJ
be
rectified.
G
That's
another
big
resource
into
us,
so
certainly
all
of
those
Services
help
and
I
do
know.
The
state
has
really
looked
at
that.
I
know
that
you
know
we
want
to
be
like
the
best
state
in
the
nation
on
on
dealing
with
mental
health
issues
and
ciac
hasn't
been
very
involved
at
lieutenant
governor.
That's
one
of
her
her
pet
projects.
I
think
that
she
is
very
involved
in,
has
been
very
useful
and
helpful
on
that.
So
yes,
anything.
That
would
help
we're.
Certainly,
certainly
looking
at
that.
F
Well,
I
think
you
can,
you
can
see
the
sort
of
challenges
and
and
I
I
would
just
bring
that
back
to
what
that
means.
For
the
people
trying
to
run
these
facilities,
I
mean
they.
They
are
keeping
young
people
who
have
these
mental
health
issues,
who
have
all
sorts
of
issues,
issues
and
they're.
Also
keeping
young
people
who
are
very
dangerous
I
mean
unless
I
looked
I,
think
we've
out
of
our
detention
population
we've
probably
had
between
20
and
25
that
are
charged
with
murder,
which
to
me
is
yeah.
F
That's
that's
shocking
statistic
so
running
these.
These
facilities
is,
is
very
challenging
and-
and
we
appreciate
the
work
that
our
staff
does
every
day
to
to
do
that,
just
to
finish
up
Senate
Bill
162
codified,
a
number
of
Investments
that
the
Bashir
Administration
has
made
over
the
last
couple
of
years,
and
the
legislature
also
provided
additional
statutory
language
to
increase
our
staffing
and
to
improve
our
security.
F
Senate
Bill
162
also
requires
that
the
Justice
cabinet
and
DJJ
develop
and
Implement
a
plan
to
create
what
would
be
a
new
model
of
Regional
Detention
is
and
the
languages
as
soon
as
practicable.
While
safely
segregating,
males
and
females
and
separating
violent
and
non-violent
offenders,
so
that
is
is
a
new
system.
F
That
is
something
different
than
we're
doing
now
and
it's
something
different
than
the
system
that
was
put
into
place.
Some
25
or
30
years
ago,
and
I'll
talk
just
to
to
end
up
in
just
a
couple
of
minutes.
Some
of
the
challenges
that
that
we
may
face
in
implementing
that
that
system,
but
first
I,
want
to
ask
Miss
Norton
to
just
quickly
go
through
some
of
the
Appropriations
that
we
were
provided
in
in
the
last
legislative
session
and
what
we're
doing
with
that
money
and
where
we
stand
with
that.
H
And
we're
certainly
very
appreciative
for
all
of
this
additional
funding.
That's
going
to
help
us
to
accomplish
these
goals,
and
some
of
these
we've
talked
about
already
in
the
presentation.
So
I
won't
spend
too
long
on
any
of
them.
But
3.2
million
to
maintain
the
salary
increases
for
the
DJJ
youth
workers
that
were
discussed
previously.
H
9.7
million
for
146
additional
DJJ
youth
workers,
200
000
for
the
operating
expenses
that
are
associated
with
that
DJJ
youth
offender
management
system,
4
million
to
provide
security
upgrades
within
the
DJJ
detention
centers
and
those
facilities.
1.5
million
for
DJJ
to
establish
a
diversionary
program
to
identify
and
provide
treatment
for
youth
with
serious
mental
illness.
H
1.75
million
to
retain
design
experts
to
determine
what
facility
changes
are
needed
to
return
to
that
Regional
model
that
we
just
discussed
and
250
000
for
the
transportation
costs
for
our
female
youth
to
be
used
until
there
is
a
return
back
to
that
Regional
model.
So
that
is
reimbursing
law
enforcement
that
may
be
transporting
female
youth
to
a
facility
that
they
would
not
normally
or
previously
I
should
say
transport
female
youth
to
and
then
in
House
Bill
3.
H
It
provided
appropriation
to
reopen
the
Louisville
Detention
Facility,
the
downtown
facility,
as
well
as
the
facility
that
we
currently
have
in
Jefferson
County
as
well.
So
it's
13.4
million
to
design
and
construct
the
first
phase
of
renovating
the
downtown
Louisville
Youth
Detention
Center,
two
million
dollars
in
operating
costs
for
that
same
facility
and
then
4.5
million
for
the
renovation
of
the
Jefferson
Regional
Juvenile
Detention
Facility
at
Linden.
So
the
facility
that
we
currently
have
youth
in
within
Jefferson
County.
F
And
and
then
finally,
before
we
finish
and
I
appreciate
your
patience,
I
know
this
has
been
a
long
presentation,
but
there's
a
lot.
There's
a
lot
to
cover
I
do
want
to
talk
for
a
few
minutes
about
the
challenges
that
that
we
face
has,
as
we
are
implementing
Senate
Bill,
162
and
House
Bill
3
has.
It
relates
to
capacity
issues
House
Bill
3
has
we've
discussed
requires
that
any
juvenile
charge
with
a
violent
crime
must
be
detained
until
a
detention
hearing
is
held.
F
That's
not
currently
the
law
according
to
AOC
data,
and
of
course
we
have
we're
reliant
on
AOC
for
this
information.
We
wouldn't
otherwise
know
this.
The
this
automatic
detention
provision
will
result
in
the
Detention
of
more
than
400
juveniles
a
year.
Then
we
are
detaining
under
current
law,
and
some
of
them
will
be
released
at
the
detention
hearing
within
48
Hours.
Some
of
them
will
be
kept
for
a
much
longer
period
of
time.
F
So
that's
we're
going
to
be
detaining
under
House
Bill
3
more
juveniles
than
we're
detaining
now
Senate
Bill
162
requires
that
we
detained
juveniles
at
the
detention
center
that
is
closest
to
them.
Essentially
their
Regional
Detention
Center,
but
that
we
also
separate
the
juveniles
within
that
Detention
Center,
four
ways
that
we
separate
males
and
females
and
we
separate
violent
offenders
from
non-violent
offenders,
so
we're
going
to
have
within
every
facility,
potentially
a
population
of
females
charged
with
violent
offenses.
F
A
population
of
females
charged
with
non-violent
offenses
males
charged
with
violent
offenses
male
starts
with
non-violent
offenses.
So
I
think
you
can
see
and
again
we're
talking
about
small
facilities.
We've
got
about.
Most
of
our
facilities
are
around
40
beds,
and
so
we're
going
to
have
these
four
populations
that
we're
going
to
have
to
dedicate
beds
to
which
means
that
there's
going
to
be
a
more
inefficient
use
of
those
beds
because
of
facility
in
a
lot
of
our
regions
may
go
for
a
long
period
of
time
without
having
any
girls.
F
But
you
never
know
tonight
at
midnight
a
police
cruiser
May
roll
up
with
four
girls,
so
you've
got
to
have
those
beds
available
when
they
show
up.
You
know,
there's
no,
you
know
you
can't
send
them
to
the
Holiday
Inn
down
the
street.
You
got
to
have
those
beds
available,
so
we're
gonna
necessarily
be
having
a
lot
of
our
beds.
That'll
be
vacant
at
any
given
time.
F
F
They
they
have
to
go
to
school
separately.
They
have
to
eat
separately,
they
have
to
go
to
Recreation
separately.
They
have
to
take
visits
separately,
so
I
think
you
can
see
that
this
is
within
the
current
physical
constraints
of
our
facilities.
This
is
just
going
to
be
a
challenge
both
in
terms
of
having
enough
beds
to
to
house
them
all
and
in
terms
of
just
being
able
to
to
to
reconfigure
these
facilities,
to
create
the
separation
that
the
law
requires,
and
it
requires
it
for
good
reason,
I
mean
believe
me.
F
We
don't
want
to
go
back
to
mixing
boys
and
girls
and
mixing
high
level
offenders
and
low-level
offenders,
but
but
when
we,
when
we
go
away
from
what
we're
doing
now
and
go
back
to
these
Regional
centers,
it's
going
to
be
a
challenge.
And
so
what
we
are
doing
and
I
say
this
just
because
I
want
to
be
transparent
with
you
all
as
we
encounter
these
challenges,
because
I
think
we're
going
to
have
to
work
together
to
figure
out
the
best
way.
To
do
this.
F
Now,
I
think
we
have
our
RFP
out
for
our
Consultants
now
that'll
be
closing
soon
and
our
plan
is
to
sit
down
and
try
to
figure
out
how
to
do
this
with
what
we've
got
and
if
we
can't
figure
it
out
we'll
be
coming
back
to
you,
you
all
to
the
legislature
and
what
we
want
to
do
is
work
collaboratively
to
find
the
best
solution.
So
I
just
want
to
mention
those
issues.
F
There
was
and
I
want
to
say
that
through
this
last
legislative
session,
I
think
in
regard
to
Juvenile
Justice,
the
process
really
worked
the
way
it
should
work.
We
were
able
I
think
to
have
a
really
good
collaboration
with
the
authors
of
some
of
the
legislation
we
were,
we
were
able
to
have
a
good
exchange
of
ideas
in
the
legislation.
Changed
that
we
didn't.
We
didn't
agree
on
everything
you
know
it
didn't
change
in
some
ways
that
we
wanted
it
to.
But
that's
you
know.
F
These
are
complex
problems,
there's
nothing
wrong
with
having
good
faith
disagreements,
so
I
hope
we
can.
We
can
continue
that
kind
of
collaboration
as
we
go
forward,
because
I
think
we
can
all
see
that
these
are
complicated
problems
that
deal
with
a
very
vulnerable
situation
and
that
also
affects
the
the
Public
Safety
in
Kentucky.
It
affects
the
safety
of
all
of
our
citizens,
so
I
look
forward
to
working
cooperatively
with
the
general
assembly
and
with
all
of
the
stakeholders
to
to
continue
this
process.
F
I'll
sort
of
end,
where
I
begin,
I
think
that
our
detention
system
is
very
much
improved
over
the
last
year.
I
think
our
facilities
are
safer,
they're,
more
secure,
I,
think
I
know
our
staffing
is
improved.
We've
got
a
lot
of
things
that
are
in
in
process,
but
we're
not
where
we
want
to
be
this.
This
is
a
journey
and
I
think
we've
made
good
progress,
but
I
would
be
the
first
to
acknowledge
that
we
have
a
long
way
to
go
again.
I
appreciate
your
patience.
I
That
I'll
upgrade
on
I'm,
just
not
I'm
wavering
up
here
back
and
forth
right,
so
I
break
that
down.
You
know
if
we
spread
that
out
evenly,
which
is
not
it'd,
be
about
33
and
a
third
per
month,
that's
under
pristine
conditions
right
and
spread
out
evenly
across
the
state,
but
I
guess.
My
question
is:
would
of
those
400
with
the
majority
of
those
were
gonna?
We
would
see
be
in
Fayette
and
Jefferson
and
I
say
that,
because
they
have
a
bigger
population,
concentration.
F
They
just
gave
us
the
wrong
numbers
or
no,
they
gave
us
the
right
numbers,
but
they
gave
us
the
numbers
for
the
whole
system
and
we've
gone
back
to
them
and
said
well,
we've
and
I
think
they've
provided
this
to
us
now,
but
but
we've
got
to
have
the
numbers,
for
we
got
to
break
it
down
by
catchment
area
because
and
I
think
that's
where
you're
going.
This
will
affect
every
region
differently
and
there
may
be.
There
may
be
a
region
where
this
would.
F
We
could
handle
this
and
there
may
be
a
region
that
we
couldn't
and
in
that
regard,
I
would
say.
The
footprint
of
our
facilities
is
is
is
different,
I
mean
we
have
some
facilities
where,
if
we
needed
to
we
could
we
could
expand.
We
have
some
facilities
where
we
just
don't
have
any
there's.
No
there's
no
land
to
expand,
but
yeah
it'll
there'd
be
more
from
Fayette
and
Jefferson
than
anywhere
else
for
sure.
Okay,.
K
You
Mr
chairman,
wanted
to
I,
guess
outline
and
correct
me
if
I'm
incorrect
about
75
million
dollars
has
been
allocated
during
this
session
between
Jefferson
County
and
the
overall
system.
That's
why
I
went
through
the
calculation,
so
it
leads
me
to
say,
or
thank
all
right.
You've
got
the
process,
or
at
least
getting
things
going
in
terms
of
a
salary
and
then
also
looking
at
the
facility
in
Jefferson
County.
What
what
is
your?
What
is
your
time
frame
because
you
mentioned
RFP,
is
about
ready
to
close.
K
H
This
facility
needs
an
additional
two
pods.
The
goal
would
be
to
have
that
architectural
consulting
firm,
be
able
to
give
us
a
cost
estimate
for
what
that
would
be,
hopefully
by
mid-september,
so
that
we
can
include
that
in
the
biennial
budget
request
and
have
that
information
to
you
in
a
timely
manner,
so
that
we
can
kind
of
give
a
projection
of
what
this
would
cost
and
what
the
options
might
be
to
accomplish.
It.
H
Not
at
the
moment
no
I
mean
I
think
we
know
how
expensive
some
of
the
Capital
Construction
has
been
just
the
renovation
of
the
Linden
facility
is
estimated
at
four
and
a
half
million
dollars,
and
that
is
just
to
upgrade
the
the
cells
that
we
currently
have
to
be
wet
cells,
so
you
can
kind
of
Imagine
from
that
point.
What
something
might
look
like
to
add
actual
additional
square
footage
to
some
of
these
facilities.
Okay,.
K
Across
the
board,
we
talked
about
mental
health.
We
talked
about
you
know,
bringing
in
new
individuals
with
hopefully
expertise
to
address,
whatever
it
might
dress
in
Louisville.
We've
got
an
issue
in
terms
of
of
getting
a
more
involved
with
the
gang
violence
and
bringing
in
somebody
to
make
it
a
little
more
forceful
initiative
to
basically
go
after
those
gang
leaders
as
an
incentive
to
have
them
crack
down
all
those
sorts
of
things.
Yeah.
That's
the
correlation
to
all
that
to
Laureen,
actually
lowering
the
juvenile
crime.
G
I
mean
I
think
it's
definitely
related
and
you're.
Looking
at
an
entire
Spectrum
I
mean
I
think
it
starts
with.
We
know
the
research
shows
us.
The
kids
are
treated
best
outside
of
the
juvenile
justice
system
when
they've
done
studies
on
the
what's
the
number
one
thing
that
makes
the
all
the
factors
are
used
to
be
involved
later
with
the
adult
system.
They
looked
at
substance,
abuse
of
the
child,
substance,
abuse
of
the
parents.
All
these
different
factors.
G
It
was
going
behind
the
door
of
a
Detention
Center,
because
once
you
kick
that
in
so
many
other
ripples
happen,
it's
like
knocking
over
the
first
Domino
and
there's
sort
of
a
ripple
effect.
So
we
know
that
we
want
to
keep
as
many
kids
and
Senate
Bill.
200
was
good
at
doing
that.
So
we
want
to
have
those
those
systems
out
there
at
the
school
level
a
lot
of
things
we're
doing,
and
we
do
a
lot
of
that
with
our
day
treatment.
G
Centers
our
day,
alternative
schools
are
described
as
a
school
with
a
counseling
component,
our
day
treatment,
centers
our
treatment
they're
supposed
to
be
treatment
facilities
with
an
educational
component.
So
we
really
looked
at
expanding
our
resources
there.
You
know
hooking
up
kids
with
Services
we
put
washers
and
dryer
in
all
of
them,
so
kids
will
have
a
clean
clothes
when
they
come
when
they
come
in
and
wash
their
clothes
we
send
backpacks.
Just
like
schools
do
a
food.
G
We
have
really
broadened
our
community
we're
looking
at
multi-systemic
therapy,
which
is
an
evidence-based
program,
and
this
is
with
private
providers
and
it's
something
we're
going
to
do
with
this
diversionary
money
where
people
are
caseworkers,
get
a
very
small
group
of
kids
and
they
they
work
on
all
the
issues
that
kind
of
like
I,
described
with
the
Yap
program,
about
that
those
issues
that
involve
with
them.
So
you
know
you're
going
to
knock
some
kids
out
at
that
level.
G
You're
still
going
to
have
some
kids
come
in
our
program
that
have
to
be
for
Community
safety
in
our
facilities
and,
yes,
I,
do
think
programming
and
one
of
the
things
I'm
most
proud
of
for
we've
talked
so
much
about
detention
is
Our
Youth,
Development
Centers,
which
it's
I.
Guess
it's
good
news.
You
haven't
heard
anything
about
them
because
they've
trucked
on
doing
what
they
need
to
do,
but
we
have
some
excellent
vocational
program.
We
have
kids
who've,
gotten
tons
of
certificates.
G
We
have
some
youth
that
you
know
they're
on
the
way
to
a
welding
job
as
soon
as
they
leave
our
facility.
We
had
one
youth
I
was
just
recently
at
our
Woods
Bend
facility
and
the
vocational
coordinator.
There
said
they
have
one
of
his
youth.
He
still
calls
back
to
them.
He
went
through
the
building
and
trades
where
they
build.
G
I.
Don't
know
how
many
of
you
all
have
heard
of
aggression,
replacement,
training,
art
it's
called,
and
we
do
that
at
our
like
Lake
Cumberland
is
one
of
our
Prime.
Examples
have
done
that
and
they
they
have
just
our
clinical
person.
There
has
said
it
has
been
a
game
changer
that
those
kids
go
through.
That
and
I
went.
K
Good
well,
thank
you
for
the
detailed
explanation.
I
do
appreciate
all
the
efforts
I've
gone
through
I
encourage
you
to
communicate
with
this
committee
or
in
either
chamber
into
the
judicial
committee
as
well
as
a
r,
because
once
you
come
to
a
conclusion,
what
you're
trying
to
figure
out
in
September,
hopefully
the
communications
and
transparency,
is
going
to
be
prominent
in
your
mind
to
talk
to
the
to
this
side
of
government.
K
A
A
D
D
We
we
shouldn't
have
to
meet
to
see
how
we
need
to
put
more
money
into
a
system
that
we
know
is
continuing
to
grow
in
a
direction
that
we
don't
want
it
to
grow,
which
means
we
have
to
be
more
active
and
I'm
talking
about
in
the
legislature
and
in
some
of
our
other
social
services,
to
treat
this
problem
Upstream
Because.
Unless
we
treat
the
problem
Upstream,
it
won't
help
you
all
at
all.
You
will
continue
to
grow,
and
so
you
know
I'll
make
this
commitment
that
I
will
help
work
with
people
Upstream.
D
N
So
so
to
me,
the
most
important
consideration
is
getting
enough
Staffing
in
place
so
that
you
can
deal
with
all
kind
of
disciplinary
issues
and
and
other
similar
related
issues
that
arise
there.
So
so
I
would
ask
and
I
would
appreciate
your
response
to
give
some
thought
to.
If
we
can't
get
an
adequate
numbers,
people
staff
in
Campbell,
County
or
in
Jefferson
County,
then
let's
look
at
suggesting
an
increase
in
salary,
so
we
can
be
competitive
in
those
areas,
so
we
can
have
enough
Staffing.
N
K
F
First
of
all,
we're
so
pleased
and
grateful
to
everyone.
The
governors
LED
on
this,
the
general
assembly,
has
provided
resources
on
this
to
be
able
to
go
from
a
starting
pay
of
thirty
thousand
dollars
a
year
to
fifty
thousand
dollars
a
year
in
two
or
three
years.
The
way
state
government
often
works
is
you
know,
that's
that's
I'm,
proud
of
that.
F
But
I'd
also
say
this,
and
if
any
of
you
have
seen
the
work
that
our
people
are
doing
ain't,
nobody
going
to
say
that
they're
overpaid
at
fifty
thousand
dollars
a
year
nobody's
going
to
say
that
so
I
I
agree
with
you.
Senator
Thomas
I
would
just
say
that
that
if
we're
going
to
have
these
detention
facilities,
I
think
all
of
us
in
government
have
to
be
committed.
I
would
say
the
same
thing
about
our
correctional
facilities.
F
We
have
to
be
committed
to
whatever
the
funding
level.
It
is
to
operate
these
facilities
in
a
safe
and
secure
manner.
If
we
don't
do
that,
it's
self-defeating.
What
we're
doing
is
self-defeating
and
we're
gonna
we're
gonna
continue
to
have
problems
and
we're
going
to
turn
out
people
who
are
not
better
people
coming
out
than
going
in,
which
is
the
opposite
of
what
we
want
to
do
and-
and
you
are
these
labor
markets-
are
different.
F
I
I,
don't
know
how
you
approach
that
in
the
context
of
state
government
because
they're
you
know,
the
compensation
system
is
what
it
is
in
state
government,
but
I
suspect.
We've
got
a
lot
of
people
in
here
that
believe
in
in
free
markets,
and
you
know
you
can't
you
can't
go
into
a
BMW
dealership
with
the
Volkswagen
money
and
drive
away
with
a
car
and
we
sort
of
operate
on
in
the
same
constraints
here
we've.
F
What
I
would
say
is
that
we
just
need
to
be
committed
to
constantly
review
this
because
again,
I'm
appreciative
and
I
am
so
proud
of
what
we've
been
able
to
accomplish
on
the
compensation
side.
But
this
is
a
river,
not
a
lake.
It
constantly
moves
and
what
might
be
an
appropriate
compensation
level
to
be
competitive
today,
two
years
from
now,
we
may
be
out
of
the
market.
J
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman
I,
really
don't
have
a
question.
I
I
just
want
to
commend
each
of
you
on
this
presentation.
I
remember
starting
back
Mr
chairman
on
this
journey
as
part
of
a
task
force.
Looking
into
this
particular
piece
and
I'm
going
to
tell
you
could
look
left
and
you
could
look
right,
but
it
didn't
seem
like
it
didn't
seem
like
there's
a
way
out,
but
this
this
presentation
and
the
response
of
the
legislature
as
well,
but
the
work
that
your
people
are
doing
and
your
insights
gained
from
this
presentation
I
think,
are
extraordinary.
J
I.
Think
it's
a
good
response,
but
I
also
think
is
a
long
way
to
go
and
you
receive
these
kids
a
number
of
them
and
you
have
no
choice
but
to
receive
them,
but
as
a
whole
society
out
there
that's
producing
what
comes
to
your
door.
It's
going
to
be
a
lot
to
deal
with
that
going
forward
so
but
I
I
have
to
say
this
is
an
excellent
presentation
and
it
gives
me
hope
that
we
are
at
least
going
in
the
right
direction.
G
I
want
to
thank
you,
and
actually,
if
you
don't
mind,
indulging
me
just
because
I
know
a
lot
of
Staff
watch.
This
hearing
and
I
just
want
to
state
that
I
am
very
proud
of
our
dedicated
DJJ
staff
out
there.
They
do
an
extremely
difficult
job.
They
get
very
little
public
recognition
for
the
work
they
do.
You
know
they
they
were
there
during
covid
being
exposed
and
exposing
their
family
in
a
congregate
care
setting.
We
had
staff
when
the
tornado
hit
our
Mayfield
facility,
who
stayed
with
the
kids
when
their
own
homes
were
blown
away.