Koha-US SIG - Cataloging Special Interest Group, 7 Oct 2021

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From YouTube: Cataloging Special Interest Group - 10/7/2021

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Chat logs:

00:10:48 Heather Hernandez (she/her): https://www.youtube.com/user/alctsce/featured
00:11:29 Heather Hernandez (she/her): https://youtu.be/KD48Q9gNg5w
00:27:01 Barbara Johnson: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17485
00:27:13 Heather Hernandez (she/her): https://librarycarpentry.org
00:31:04 Tasha: That would be amazing.
00:31:14 melentm: That would be great!
00:31:29 Heather Hernandez (she/her): https://bywatersolutions.com/education/koha-upgrade-for-fall-2021
00:32:03 Heather Hernandez (she/her): Technical Services https://bywatersolutions.com/education/20-11-technical-services
00:34:07 George Williams: SELECT marc_modification_templates.name, marc_modification_template_actions.from_field, marc_modification_template_actions.from_subfield, If(marc_modification_template_actions.field_value = "", '-space-', marc_modification_template_actions.field_value) AS field_valueFROM marc_modification_templates JOIN marc_modification_template_actions ON marc_modification_template_actions.template_id = marc_modification_templates.template_idWHERE If(marc_modification_template_actions.field_value = "", '-space-', marc_modification_template_actions.field_value) = "-space-"
00:36:17 Barbara Johnson: Yikes. Just ran that report and found 63 actions with spaces!
00:36:32 George Williams: It might be looking for a space on purpose.
00:38:04 Heather Hernandez (she/her): https://koha-community.org/manual/20.05/en/html/administration.html?highlight=marc%20framework%20subfield#edit-framework-fields-and-subfields
00:38:31 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: oooo
00:38:36 Jason V (Round Rock Public Library): interesting
00:41:29 Jason: https://training.seknfind.org/docs/projects/additemhelper
00:43:53 Heather Hernandez (she/her): I like "Required Required!!"
00:44:11 Tasha: Great, thank you.
00:46:35 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: Yes!
00:52:49 Jason: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=12141
00:57:16 Heather Hernandez (she/her): I have a public list, "Cartographic treasures," of items that I page and put on display frequently--I find lists are a neat way to create a handy pull list/virtual "display:" https://keys.bywatersolutions.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-shelves.pl?op=view&shelfnumber=108
00:59:38 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: Aspen Discovery? for your OPAC?
01:00:50 Jason V (Round Rock Public Library): yes
01:02:26 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: lol
01:02:28 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: Yes
01:02:31 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: do it
01:03:34 Heather Hernandez (she/her): Sorry about that, folks--my work laptop crashed rather spectacularly!
01:03:56 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: Oh I love that
01:05:07 melentm: Thank you ALL very much for sharing your experience and all the links! It was my first meeting with you, I really appreciate it. Sorry, need to leave, have another meeting in 5 in :) See you soon and thanks again!!!
01:05:25 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: Thank you Jason
01:05:36 George Williams: Our texts are all being monitored.
01:05:37 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: yay!
01:05:43 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: lol noooooo
01:06:00 Liz Dukelow Central Kansas Library System: if it works it works
01:08:03 Aly Rattler, Technical Services Librarian: Nice to see everyone! Thanks! Have another meeting.

A

Welcome to the october cataloging special interest group- everyone- uh I don't have anything specific to talk about, but I did find a really neat resource that I just happen to stumble across that I want to share with everybody and it's so cool that I'm going to share it this month and I'm going to share it next month. I might like just keep sharing um I'm putting a link in the chat. It's the and I'm going to go, read it so I don't muff it up it. Let's see.

A

Oh wait, let me find it. Let me find it here: we go the association for library, collections and technical services, continuing education, youtube channel, a l, c t s c e, and we had been talking specifically last month about cataloging maps and other cartographic resources, and they have a really neat video that I'm going to put a link to in the chat here that I started watching as an absolutely wonderful refresher.

A

It's entitled 2019102.

A

They have them all their videos organized by date, so it's from 2019 special collections, cataloging maps, um a presentation by carolyn hansen, independent librarian and historian, and it's fantastic it's. I think it would be a great introduction to anyone, cataloging maps charts any cartographic resources even atlases, even though the title says special collections.

A

It has great uh it's a great walk through on cataloging those materials and I'd say be prepared. If you don't have access to tools like cataloger's desktop rd. That sort of thing be prepared to make some screenshots really helpful things that she shares, including a nice slide with images of like these are hatchers and and soundings, and all all sorts of neat things so totally check it out.

A

Does anybody have anything they'd like to bring to the they like to bring to the group this month.

B

Well, the day after the conference, my wife went in for hip replacement surgery, which I think is okay to say, even if we're being recorded um so I haven't been doing much other than service animal.

A

I hope she's recovering, while in healing.

B

Oh, yes, and then our cat has a bad ear.

C

B

So I've been giving the cat medications, uh which, uh let's see.

D

B

Yeah, I think that one's new.

A

Yeah they're, just not understanding when we're.

B

Okay, now I know I'm known in the co archives as service animal and cat wrangler. Okay, oh well,.

E

You're still known as that.

A

Among your many talents.

B

B

I think I'll mute myself because I made those off.

A

It's okay, you can catch up on the recording later.

F

I have something to sh I can uh I can bring forward. uh I actually I mentioned this at uh on thursday at kawaha us about uh struggling with a mark modification template and trying to get it to actually work.

F

um So if it, if y'all, are okay, I'd I'd like to just share my screen and you can see what I'm seeing. Yes, please sure. Okay, let me uh do this one! Yes sure all right, you can, you see, see now: okay, yes, okay! My catalog record here.

A

Yes, comey can't communicate yes,.

F

So let me jump over really quick to my mark modification templates here. I just downloaded this batch of records from oclc. Once you come, you can't communicate a bunch of drifting dragons.

F

um Let me go to my tools, mark modification templates uh and then so I had set up this uh graphic novels template um and I, what I did was I I basically copied the non-fiction template, but so in the graphic novels template. So we don't use fast. We don't use the bizarre or, however you pronounce it, um and so I and sears, so we don't use any of these. So this is what I had had had had pulled in and initially the uh each. Not.

F

I don't know if the bizax one did, but the fast ones. Initially they had this regex m fast and that wasn't working so that well, maybe if I remove the regex, which I don't really understand a whole lot about regular expressions. Well, almost nothing about regular expressions to to be honest, um but so I I removed it. You know kind of toggled it on toggled it off and it didn't really seem to do anything, but so I'll just uh update that.

F

But so then, if we look at uh oh, so it's not just the um you know the these ones, but so I've also done one uh down at the bottom of line. 24, we don't use the juvenile fiction.

F

Subheading, uh subfield v we just used fiction, so I wanted to replace that and so now, if we look at this, comey can't communicate that I just downloaded using that template.

F

You know in the 650s we have all our juvenile fiction. We have uh some fasts in here, so I'm not really sure. If there's something else that I'm there's some step, that I'm missing or or if the the issue is with the the template actions themselves, I don't know any any thoughts.

F

uh I can stop sharing now, unless you want me to share again, I can.

A

I'm not, I am not seeing any reason why that shouldn't work.

B

So what part of it is not working? All of it.

F

uh Let me share again uh so oops there. We are there's that um so say like this delete uh field 650, if 650 subfield 2 matches fast right line, 12 right.

F

So if we go in here oops, oh sorry, let me do a 655 instead, so delete field 655 if 65 subfield 2. Oh, I have this.

A

That's in there.

F

That's weird: let's remove that.

A

And I haven't seen that straight: that's.

F

Yeah, I feel the limiter there's something yeah. That's that's really weird, because I don't have just delete every field 6055., I don't have any. You know I don't have any choice. Other choices to you know remove this box, which I think is what's populating that what's making that that dollar sign.

C

Is there a space in that box and maybe.

E

C

E

Just going to ask: is there any de yeah I think.

F

There's a space in that box. No there's not there's not. I.

E

Think there was oh.

F

Oh, oh, okay! Let me let me update it then maybe that's where is that ah so there? Oh, so that has changed interesting, interesting, okay,.

E

Yeah, I would uh that that would be. My concern is: is there any data at all in that box? Does it just look? Does it look blank, or is there actually a space right? Okay,.

F

Well: okay, thanks thanks, that's very helpful, but unfortunately I mean there are I mean this is not. Let me try one of these drifting dragons ones here and see if maybe um because I've had that same issue with sears headings and other records, but there's no. You know that that that is not the case. You know, there's no um dollars, you know no mystery dollar sign in there, so, but so, at any rate, it's thank you for for help for helping me to see that that's that's very useful.

F

uh Let me try drifting dragons here and just see sorry. I didn't I came from another meeting, and so I didn't have time to actually get all my culprits in a line.

A

F

B

F

Yeah, okay! Well, there's there's no there's nothing in there. If I find other things and maybe I'll just I'll submit them to the listserv, and um you know and then if if uh if people have other suggestions, then.

B

My suggestion would be give up on this and use market.

B

C

B

You can do pretty much everything in mark edit that you're trying to do here.

F

Yeah, oh so, to just to just import them into mark edit.

B

Export to mark import the mark files.

E

That's that's. The big advantage of the mark. Modification templates, though, is, if you're doing a bunch of staged records. You can say bring them in put them in here and then apply this modification template, and so then you don't have to import them and then put them out and mark edit and bring them back in yeah.

A

If there's some reason why it's not working that might reveal a bug, that's helpful to the whole community, too sure.

F

I mean it's not it's not something that I deal with or let me rephrase that it's not something that takes so much time to deal with manually. I just delete those fields. I just think well shouldn't this be working properly, so I don't have to do that extra step. So it's just it's a little thing, but it's you know. I guess it piles up after a while it.

A

Does pile up and it's something.

F

A

Of us are doing, I I do that I'm manually deleting- and I would like not to.

F

It's the itch: I just can't quite reach to scratch yeah. Well, please.

A

F

A

F

Thanks thanks for your help and suggestions and do submit.

A

It to the listserv, because.

F

You know people who can't.

A

Make the meetings might have ideas that we right.

F

F

Oh so can I uh can we look at the other the? um What do you call it uh hang on a second. Let me share one more time here sure the the juvenile fiction replaced with fiction.

F

I'm not sure, because I just did that one the other day, because I got really tired of having to whoops or you're, really tired of having to um change juvenile fiction to fiction right.

B

Yeah that that looks horrible, yeah.

F

It's it's it's a nuisance, um but so I have this so line. 24 update existing or add new I'll go to edit 650 subfield v with value fiction. So that's the new one. I want to add. If the existing field 650 subfield v, matches juvenile fiction and I'm not sure.

C

I think it's backwards, you want to match juvenile fiction right and then.

F

C

Because the top line is saying, update or add the field with the value of juvenile fiction, and then you want to replace that with fiction right.

F

Well, no, because in my line 17, which does work very well, I have so in the top line. This is the line that I want to add, update existing or add new 942, subfield c, with value comics. If the existing field 942c doesn't exist,.

C

F

I mean it seems like it would be consistent.

A

I think it's designed reversed from the way one might usually think about it, because I think about it to I. I also think about it in that way. It's like, if you, if the system finds this, then please do that, but the way the uh the menu has it. It's please do this. If this condition's met.

F

Right, it would other reverse to it, be update something something or like if you know something something then would be to if then, but it's yeah, it's the way. It's it's set up is kind of weird yeah.

A

It's set up for me, then, if.

D

A

D

A loose space after juvenile fiction, no.

F

No, nor after fiction that would have been too easy all.

D

F

Yeah there'd be lightning striking twice.

A

Yeah, the logic seems sound to me. I don't know why it's not working okay,.

E

Well, one one reason I can think of that: the logic might not work is if juvenile fiction is in any way different, because this is an exact match. It's saying that there has to be an exact match right right for juvenile fiction. So if there's a space in.

C

Period there at the end of the.

E

Space, so that's where that's where you know the two ways to deal with that would be to either create a you could do um another line there that says, if wide? Actually, I don't know, if you can do it.

F

I can't I can't do another line, but.

E

A

Can do another action.

F

A

Create another action field is always the last subdivision, so set feel v should always bear the full stop. At the end.

E

Right right, so uh this is where this is. Where learning regex, though, would be helpful, because if you could learn enough regex to do if juvenile fiction uh is a part of that subfield v, then if the record you're importing doesn't have the period does have the period it has an extra space. It has a misspelling.

E

You know if you could build a regex that says where, anytime, that the 650 subfield v matches regex and then juv fic and any other characters in there. That way, you would only have one line. You would only need the one line, but you would need to learn enough regex to do that, and I am I'm good at a lot of things, but not regex. Oh.

F

Okay, well, my question was going to be: can you recommend any any sources for learning it.

E

um Are you guys you guys are a bywater customer you're a round rock yeah ask andrew for helping by water andrew they they had something going on at bywater where they needed a regex expert, and so they made andrew take a class in regex. So, oh boy, okay, so he's he's had like official honest-to-god schooling on the subject. Wow all.

F

Right so he'd probably be a.

E

Good person to ask for for what's a good resource, and you know how can I learn this, and can you help me do this.

A

And please share with us too for folks who are not supported by bywater. I'm gonna put a link in the chat. um I had some exposure through taking workshops, free workshops with library, carpentry and I'm going to brush up again now that so many parts of koha are incorporating rejects.

F

All right, thank you.

B

Yeah mark addict uses ridgex a lot too.

F

B

I have no idea how to do that.

G

So I have a um if we're doing a template to change like the 260 fields to 264.

G

um It would just be like copy the 260 field to 264 if 260 exists, so to get rid of that 260. I would have to do a new action to delete the 260.

A

You would need that well, my first, my first reaction is why? Because um 260s are perfectly valid in eight cr2 records, but then, if you decide yes, you want to do it. You do need to you, can't have a 260 field and a 264 field, and also you're gonna, have to check your indicators also because the indicators have vastly different meaning, yep yeah, okay,.

H

I put a link to a bug in the chat because it sort of relates to the mark modification templates in that this one is it'd, be nice to be able to use a mark modification template and apply it when you're doing a single z39 record. So instead of the batch we're bringing records in via z39- and we don't want all those different things that jason just talked about, but there's no way to apply a mark modification template at that point.

H

Now I've been talking to catalyst and I think it's the lady, it's name I think her name is anne from wheelers. That's been okay, yeah ann is at wheelers and she is a whiz with murder. Apparently, catalyst did some work for them. um Regarding that and I'm trying to talk to them about you know, is this something we can. You know move forward on, um because I think it would benefit a lot of people.

A

Yeah, that would be great.

A

Does anybody have anything else they'd like to bring to the group.

D

Yes, I had a long list, but I was I had to go to wisconsin to bring home another load of books last week and didn't have time to set it up next month for sure we'll be here next month.

A

um I'm looking forward to a feature coming in uh a future upgrade we're on, I believe 20.05, but there's going to be one of the bywater announcements and they do a page on the upgrades. I should try to find that in the chat um is the ability to set up a default order of subfields in the mark frameworks, so that they'd actually be in the correct order, not alphabetic order.

D

Sounds fun but I have to relearn.

B

Yeah, that's excuse me.

B

Maybe that would solve my current problem, um which is I with um some written house, r2 books, you get three uses and then you can't use it anymore. So I put in 856 z, saying that.

B

Except if it goes above, the eight, if it's above that line is above the 856u.

B

You get the message and then the link and I'd really have like to have the link and then the message.

B

Would that do it.

A

Yes, you could change your mark modification or change your mark framework, so that your subfield z in the 856 is always first like, for example, we use a subfield 3 or a subfield I to indicate the location of the link. The 856 link like this is at the internet archive. This is the library of congress, so.

C

A

Going to change our 856 field in our mark framework to always have the subfield three, and I first before the set field, a.

C

D

I'd be happy if I could just delete the subfields from the the editor view that I'm not using. I.

A

Think you can, I think you can suppress them from viewing the staff client.

D

Yeah, no won't do it.

D

You want me to share screen and uh let you walk me through. It seems to waste a waste of our time, though.

B

Is that field that you need, but you just don't, want to look at or do you just.

D

Get rid of it block the fields that I'm not using at all.

A

hmm Let me talks amongst yourselves. Let me.

F

So hey bruce, can you can you plea? Can you please restate what your what the issue is? I I gapped out for a moment.

D

But let me uh pull that up and show you sure.

D

One of these one of these.

D

E

While everybody else is doing their thing and getting stuff ready um jason, uh let me put this in the chat box.

E

Report will um identify uh places in the mark modification tool where there's a space, oh cool, where there's a space in the um in the um action updater existing in the from field nice for.

F

E

For the first part of the action, so we'll show you where those where you're telling it to look for space instead of looking for a blank.

F

Okay, thanks thanks.

D

George sure, I'm I'm ready to to give a show here. If you you ready.

F

D

Okay, can you see that.

A

D

Oh dear, how does one share screens click on that.

F

There's a green share screen button at the bottom of the like down by the chat and record and everything.

B

And it disappears after a few seconds.

F

Yeah you gotta hover down there along the bottom of the zoom screen.

C

I think we may have crashed bruce.

B

C

He's not moving no.

A

He looks frozen, you can give him a minute to come back.

F

He's just blacked out on my screen.

A

I'm scrolling through the manual looking for the information yeah poor, bruce, hopefully he'll come back.

F

Heather, what can you can you restate and at all what what it was that the issue was? I think he.

A

Was either looking for a way in the editor he used the bibliographic editor he used, and I I didn't hear yet whether he's using the basic editor or the advanced bibliographic editor to not see a particular mark said field here he comes back. Oh barbara's found that report useful already.

E

One thing I would say is it might be looking for a space on purpose.

E

You know that that might be. The purpose of that function is to find the things where there's just a space as opposed to a blank, but uh but if you don't realize it's a space and you're thinking it's blank, that could be a problem.

B

Welcome back bruce.

D

Thanks, I hit the share screen in the whole and you all froze.

D

I'm gonna try again, if I may please and if I disappear, that's why.

D

Okay, I click on share screen and nothing's happening.

F

Oh there there may be when you click on share screen. There should be some, do you have multiple tabs or windows or anything open.

D

F

There should be something else that pops up uh that, where you.

C

F

To choose which screen or which you know which tab you want to share yeah, I'm not getting that! Oh! Okay! That's that's! Not good! That's that's! The extent of my troubleshooting knowledge.

F

Oh okay, yeah, that's weird!.

E

Well, I think, he's gone again. Oh.

A

Well, I'm gonna put this section of the manual for the 20.05 manual in the chat.

A

That's where it describes the different options in editing the framework to see to say whether a subfield in a mark field will display within a cataloging editor, and you can also select to have it hidden when the field is collapsed, but displayed if the field label is clicked and expanded.

E

For a second there I had two bruises yeah. Now I see just one and he's moving again, though.

B

Oh almost got a screenshot of it, uh bruce you're, using linux right right. That may have something to do with it, because I tried using linux um presume for something else and a few weird little things happened.

A

Well, I don't know if you were here to see it bruce, but I found the section in the 20.05 manual that explains how um to control the visibility of subfields frameworks and.

D

I can do that for a lot of things, but it won't do it for all of the uh subfields. um For the item record.

A

Oh, the item record yeah, that's different.

C

That's what I figured so you're you're trying to I'm sorry, I'm here you're trying to hide specific fields on the item.

D

Record entry right because there's a bunch like withdrawn that I just don't use that makes the page longer.

B

D

I could drop enough of them. I can stop scrolling.

B

I know that's possible because I I added one there's some place where you can go to there.

E

B

This one and this one.

E

Yeah, it's in the you have to go to the 952 uh in the framework yep. That's why.

D

I'm looking at it.

E

And one of the issues is um like if you have uh two different frameworks and you make them uh if you make like the 952 uh damaged field um invisible in the framework invisible in one framework, uh then it if you're editing a record that uses that framework it shouldn't appear, but it will still appear in the batch editors, um because the batch editors always assume that you're using the default framework.

E

So I don't know if that might be your issue. That.

D

Explains a few things.

E

Yeah the default, when you do the batch editing, it always assumes that you're using the default framework, and so it loads the fields that are visible in the default.

D

That explains why I can't do a batch edit on my subfield k that I uh shanghaied for a non-standard purpose.

A

D

It's got to be.

A

The default framework and back up your framework before you mess with it.

D

Yeah good I'll fix that.

C

And I was just going to say: if you want to brute force it with jquery, that's something that I've done on my site. So there's a little write-up on how I've um done some modifications to the item. Entry form to clean it up and hide some things and rearrange some things.

E

That's something I've done too is I've, got all of ours rearranged on the uh edit item page.

E

And I can actually show that if anybody wants to see it, oh yes, please let me, hopefully I won't freeze. If we do this, so you guys see koha right. Yes,.

E

So I've got you know all of the instead of being in normally they sort like in uh order of the, I think they sort in the order of the subfield uh uh code.

E

But you know we wanted all the things about finding the item up here, all the acquisition data in one block and all the status data and all the notes. So um this is just some jquery. I wrote that puts those all in those blocks.

E

At one point I had them all set so that they could be collapsed and expanded, but um that wasn't that was hard to maintain because things kept changing through upgrades, so I don't have them set to collapse anymore, but this way they're in the order that people actually enter the data instead of in alphabetical order. That's.

F

Incredible is that jquery available.

E

uh I don't know, but I can make it available. I can make a note of it make this available.

D

Why are some things required required.

F

That's awesome.

E

That's because uh they didn't used to be required in the framework, and I me- and so I but I I wanted to fool people into thinking. They were required, and so I wrote some jquery that made them look like they were required and then eventually I actually did make them required.

E

And so uh and that's because it took me a while to get all the frameworks updated. um So I just haven't, removed the the jquery that.

D

Puts the second.

E

Required there, historical artifact understood um what I'll do is um I'll. I made a note that I should add this to the to the jquery wiki and that christopher and I should do a video about it for some thursday, so I can walk through all the steps of what it does.

F

Yes, please so george, you also use jquery, then to change like if you go back to your that screen, you use jquery. I think you talked a little bit about this in your. uh Was that basic basic, very basic jquery on that uh at quahog us, where you change like uh like like yours, uh why item type would that be like collection code? You can change that. Did you use that to change things around with that? Oh no, there's collection! Oh there's collections.

E

F

E

Yeah, I put them all. This is the you know. One one of our member libraries goes to sit down to add an item. This is kind of the order that they add things in, because you know the home library. On top, we use we use the shelving location primarily to determine if it's adult children's or young adult system wide, and so you know this.

E

This is kind of how to find a book in our system is by the library, shelving location, item, type collection code and call number what you need to zero in on it on the shelf, and so we put them in that order, and then I grouped all of the acquisition stuff together because it used to be there. There'd be and they'd be in like five different places.

E

But this way it just makes a lot more sense for the catalogers, when they're adding items to kind of put the things in in the order that they actually that they actually go in.

F

Yeah, that's pretty.

E

Awesome and I think what I think what jason's got going on is pretty similar in his system.

C

Yeah, it's it's just a little different formatting, but it's basically the same and then and the order is different for us, but the um oh. The other thing I did on ours is like we use shelving locations and collection codes a little differently, so we can generally associate a shelving location with a collection code. So whenever someone picks a shelving location, it's going to pre-populate the collection code so like if they pick adult fiction, then if it picks adult books in the collection code. um So that's that's. Helped us prevent data entry errors.

A

I think that would be a great topic for a thursday video as well.

E

That is jason. You get to do a second guest appearance, possibly I'm going to make a note of that um and.

C

F

Anytime, we're we're um round rock public library where uh a new building is being built uh right across the street from me, um and so that's something that we're going to be having a lot of discussions. uh Tech services with other departments about you know new shelving locations.

F

uh You know in quahog also in aspen, for the new building, and I know some libraries don't use shelving locations at all, it's just all in collection code, and so it would be be curious to um maybe not not today, but in the future, I'll, probably be picking people's brains about you know kind of what what the pros and cons of your different approaches are in. In that regard, I mean, obviously you know the the fewer fields we have to populate when we're cataloging item records the better on in a certain sense for us.

F

But you know in terms of the the the overall user experience you know how that's affected so I'll probably be asking about that in the future.

A

Well, actually, I was gonna say we're we're the opposite. We use shelving location, but excuse me we have our collection codes completely suppressed because we use those for staff use only for different collections and but a lot of libraries use them in a lot of different ways, and I think getting information out there about the possibilities is really.

B

Great when I was setting up koa um eight eight years ago, I was doing it myself. I didn't know what I was doing so I use item types and collection, codes and shelving location.

B

That's the same thing works for us, but we've got a really small library.

F

Yeah, ours rs2 and we could probably get away with just using collection codes for things. You know adult mystery, you know whatever you know second floor, um but then we we get into situations like say if we want to have a display right, like a theme display or something pull books from one collection to put somewhere else.

F

You know to have like a temporary code that you can use is really nice versus the permanent. So I don't know we'll see.

A

We use our, um let me take a look because we use one of the other things for items on display or items being scanned and digitized.

A

uh We use, we actually use the damaged status we have, I set, you know, there's damaged, which means it's in repair, but then I added a value for on exhibit. It works pretty well.

F

Oh, that's, that's! That's very clever. I like it.

B

And jason, sir, were you using um shelving locations? I kind of faded out for a moment, uh because.

F

Yeah, yes, we use, we use both collection codes and we use shelving location. So could you you know, especially since you can change the the display for a collection code, it would be. It would be much easier to just use that instead of adding, you know having the shelving location as well, it seems like it'd be kind of redundant, but maybe not again we're just we're kind of just kicking kicking things around and trying to to assess.

F

You know what the what the ramifications are for different decisions.

B

F

We make the decisions.

B

Here's an idea that probably won't work- uh these are the display ones are books. You can check out right. People are encouraged to check them out.

F

Yeah yeah! Yes, yes, not.

B

Behind glassing, this is no.

F

No, no, no, no! No okay, not not special collections, be, like you know, cool summer reads or whatever.

B

Okay, how about making a patron called on display or display summer 2021 check all those out all the books and put them on display? Then, if someone wants a book, that's on display um they'll say you know this book is checked out to display. Do you want to check it out to this person.

F

Right yeah just so they just check it in and then check it back check it out to the person right.

B

And then you would also have a gauge of how many people checked out books on this or how many books were checked out. That had been on display.

F

Yeah, that's a good idea. The only issue with that is we we use a lot of self-checkout, so people would have to you know they. I don't know they would be able to to check it in there by themselves. They'd have to take it to the desk and yeah.

A

I can't remember.

G

We've been able.

A

To control I mean the I have to look, I'd have to look, I don't remember, but our damaged status doesn't prevent things from being checked out or checked in.

C

A

One reason why I like the the on exhibit status too, because it also if it if it's coming back in before shelving it's like. Oh, we could put this back on, exhibit.

B

When what happens when someone tries to check out yourself checkout to check out a book, that's already checked out.

F

They get a message, it says so like say: if it's on hold for another person, it's a it'll you'll get a message that says this title is on hold for another patron. Please, you know see the desk or something like that.

B

Okay, but how about, if it's just checked out to someone, maybe they returned it, put it on the shelf, never got.

F

Checked in I'm, I don't. I haven't encountered that myself and the that's.

F

And I don't know because it's all of our self-checkouts through tech logic- it's not through coha, so I don't know and I'm not really involved in making those two talk to each other.

F

um I would assume it would say you know. This item is checked out to another patron. Please see you know help desk or something that's my guess.

E

I think it does something like that, um because it's if it's through tech logic, you're, probably using a sip connection, I think that does uh throw a sip error.

F

Yeah I mean it's: it's yeah, there's there's some area where, where you know the our systems, people have been able to to create the message that that it displays. So it's yeah.

A

um Please take a look at the bug: everyone that jason put in the chat it's for an on display module.

C

Oh yes, this is tangentially related, but um so ed repurposed the course resource module to to handle display items. um This would the idea here is just to duplicate that into its own section, and um that's a project that we're looking at taking on soon is repurposing the course reserves for displays, because it allows you to temporarily take it out of its current shelf location and put it into like a display location, um and that makes it easy for cirque staff to manage that without having to get into the cataloging side of things.

E

When ed did that talk about how to do this, I was excited about the idea and then, like a week after that conference, uh we had an academic library that joined that wanted to use the course reserves module which kind of killed it for us. That's why I think that having a separate um module for displays would be useful, because if you do have a situation where somebody wants to use the course reserves, god forbid, as an actual course reserves module.

E

um You can have the displays module, be something separate, so we handle displays by um it's a. uh I have three libraries that do displays and, like I said, we use shelving location to differentiate, adult young, adult and children's, and so for the three libraries that do use that for displays.

E

I have like leavenworth display adult leavenworth display young, adult and leavenworth display children that they can use as a temporary location that still has adult young adult children's in it, so that when I capture that data, because that's primarily what we're using location for is to capture the data about you know. What kind of item is this for the end of year, imls and state of kansas report, so.

B

Is there a reason that the course versus course reserves couldn't be used for both? You could just create a course that says display june 2021.

E

um The way that ed described it and the way that ed arranged it, he used a bunch of jquery to change the the headings and all of that, so it probably could be used. But it's in in the opac. It's going to say this thing is on reserve um unless you change the way that it displays in the opec so and and when patrons see that at a public library they're going to go what the hell's that mean and then they're just going to ignore it. So.

B

Yeah so much for another idea.

C

Now I could see that working though you could, you could have the modifications made for public libraries where it's using the display terminology. But then, um if they're logged in as the college library they're seeing the course resource terminology, um it just would be a little clunky and having a separate module would definitely be better.

B

Now, could you just duplicate the ads course reserve.

C

I think that's kind of the the that's what christopher suggested was just duplicate the module, and then you have a second and change place to relabel all that stuff yeah, um but that would be have to be done in the base code. Can't do that with jquery.

E

um Heather's idea of putting things in a public list, we do that a lot too. The the thing that the uh location of uh leavenworth adult display gets us, though, is it, gets the statistics on how many people are borrowing things from the display, that's harder to capture with the.

F

Here's a question regarding public lists like in aspen, you mean.

E

uh We're not using aspen we're just using the public lists in quahog.

F

Oh okay, okay, okay, no, that's cool! All right, never mind.

B

Yeah aspen is another thing I really need to learn more about. Instead of could that come under cataloging or it'd be another sig.

F

Well, I think it depends. I mean we just moved to aspen in may, so we're still learning it, but I mean it's it's it's it's like coha I mean there are. There are different aspects that would fall under the all the existing cigs. I think.

B

And heather who seems to have frozen and dropped off um says everything has to do with cataloging.

D

Ultimately, true.

B

So jason, I think you're going to give a presentation on aspen in a few months.

F

Well, we'll see, I guess it depends on the topic. It's it's uh it's it's been, it's been an interesting transition, it's been good, I mean it hasn't. It hasn't really changed. Cataloging workflow at all.

F

um If anything, it's kind of just I don't know, it's opened up more possibilities for for um spotlighting our collections to uh to our users. You know they've got you know a lot of like great public, like kind of public lists features and then, like that, all the different ways you can um present.

F

You know and uh you can present, you know, search results. You know you can you know, change change. The way information displays it's. You know. So it's there are lots of possibilities. We've just we're. Just barely scratching the surface. I think but uh yeah, maybe.

B

F

B

A lot more than I have that I can do with it.

G

Right now, yeah, that's okay, okay,.

F

That's been discovery for opec, yeah,.

G

We use that as well. um It's pretty awesome. I gotta help set it up.

F

And yeah likewise.

G

It was, it was a lot of fun and our libraries love it, because we can customize it to the individual library and, like we have a rotating collection. So we can customize that rotating collection, that's specific to that library, and so every time it renews that list updates.

G

But then we also have lists that, like new fiction books or new to the library fiction books, those lists are for all of the books that have been added to the system, not just that library.

G

And so it's it's a lot of fun. It's very customizable and it's it's kind of easy to learn to a point.

B

Right right, question learning curve.

F

It's it's. It's it's not too bad. I mean I don't have a lot of personal experiences to compare it to. But you know you know it's there there's a lot that you can do with it and it's seems it's relatively intuitive a lot of it.

F

B

I'm gonna have a meeting in about 10 minutes where my boss is going to ask me about it.

F

What about aspen, oh, okay, well, you're, all ready, just say: yeah! I've heard it's pretty intuitive.

B

F

Heard it's really good uh for customizing for your user experience.

B

Me right, yeah.

B

Fortunately, uh she doesn't expect me to actually know it quite yet I've got a great boss. Let me say that for the record.

D

Opportunity to impress.

C

Looks like heather's coming back. um I can feel time here. One thing that we talked about, I think at the consortium sig was using um putting your own z target into the z39 search for duplication purposes to avoid dupes and stuff. So I've been working on that a little bit, so I can share what I've done there.

C

So I added ourselves so we're c can find as a z target and whenever you do that it doesn't actually pull the record back. It just gives you a bunch of errors.

C

So um if I search for a record that we have it's giving me um it's giving me a bunch of errors, I hit all those and put a message up here. Instead, that says please recheck the catalog and it turns the screen right so that they know that they probably just missed it.

C

And then, if I search for something, that's not in a catalog, it's business as usual, so it's just white and they can go through and pick their stuff so hoping that.

C

Prevent some duplication in our catalog is that book um fiction or non-fiction zombie hamster is very uh non-fictional to know.

D

So I figured the zombie apocalypse was going to be more threatening.

B

Well, you remember.

D

A

D

Practical question I would like to have all the links from the chat and every time I crash it dump the old ones. Is that kept somewhere? I can recover it.

A

I I was just messaging jason about that and luckily he's saving our bacon, usually at the end of a meeting I grab and copy and capture all the everyone chat and then jason delightfully adds it to the video description on youtube in the recording and luckily he's going to do that for us again. This meeting.

C

Yeah and since we recorded the cloud we get a secondary backup in our zoom account too. So it's.

A

C

A

B

I usually save after a really interesting link, so sometimes I have the entire chat.

D

Cured pork belly recovery system, excellent.

A

Melenti men tm mentioned that this was her first meeting, I'm so glad she joined us or he sorry.

B

A

A

Well, we have a couple more minutes if anybody else says anything else,.

B

Not much to do with cataloging, uh but a few days ago I was adding titles to a list, so I could delete them um and I added one title and the whole thing kind of melted down uh sort of like your laptop, but um a lot of 500 error messages and then code just completely stopped working.

B

You wouldn't have that happen.

B

I went in and updated the system. I checked that sometimes when the disk space fills up with logs, just stops working, but that wasn't the case.

A

That might be a question for the sysadmin group yeah.

B

I can't replicate it. Fortunately,.

C

That was going to be my question: can you make it happen again.

B

uh When I went back and redid the entire cart, actually, his cart, not a list.

B

No cars disappear when you reboot the system.

A

Well, if, if that's it for the cataloging stuff, we'll go ahead and stop the recording, I don't know if I even have the control to do that right now,.

C

Oh, no, I didn't make you cause again, but I will stop it right now.

A

Thank you, jason.