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A
Good
morning
and
welcome
to
the
corporate
governance
and
audit
committee
we
have
received
here,
you
go
just
wait
for
this
pass.
A
Sorry
about
that
so
good
morning
and
welcome.
Unfortunately,
the
chair
of
corporate
governance
and
audit
committee
has
sent
her
apologies
but
has
nominated
counselor
a
to
be
elected
to
the
chair
in
her
absence.
Could
I
ask
you.
Four
members
are
agreeable
to
this.
B
Good
morning,
everyone
just
they
owe
me
two
seconds
well,
I'll
just
get
the
papers
that
I
need.
B
I
can
remember
the
password
to
my
computer
that
always
helps
right
so
good
morning.
Everyone
and
welcome
to
this
meeting
of
the
corporate
governance
and
Order
committee.
My
name
is
councilor
Paul,
Ray
and
I
will
be
chairing
today's
meeting.
Today's
meeting
is
being
live
streamed
on
the
council's
website
so
that
the
public
can
observe
the
meeting
without
needing
to
be
present.
I'll
now
invite
members
and
officers
to
introduce
themselves.
Please
remember
to
turn
off
your
microphone
once
you
have
introduced
yourself
and
I
will
go
in
this
direction.
K
B
Thank
you
for
that.
Everyone,
and
just
before
we
move
on
to
the
agenda
family,
just
for
Clarity
I
do
I,
am
the
deputy
exec
member
for
supporting
councilor,
Cooper
and
strategy
and
resources,
so
just
to
be
clear,
I
will
be
looking
at
these
conversations
impartially
and
from
a
non-political
perspective,
and,
let's
remind
members
particularly
for
those
subbing
are
renewed
to
the
committee.
We
don't
do
politics
with
a
big
p
here.
This
is
about
the
procedure
and
the
structure
of
the
council
and
our
scrutiny
of
how
that
operates.
A
Thank
you
chair.
It's
actually
a
gender
item
number
two.
So
there
are
no
appeals
against
the
refusal.
Inspection
of
documents,
agenda
item
three:
there's
no
exempt
items
a
gender
item:
four:
there
are
no
formal
late
items.
However,
there
has
been
supplementary
information
which
all
members
should
have
received
and
I
have
provided
some
paper
copies
as
well.
A
B
Thank
you
very
much
for
that.
So
moving
on
to
the
minutes
of
the
last
meeting,
first
of
all
are
the
minutes
of
the
last
meeting.
A
correct
record
for
the
meeting
held
on
the
26th
of
June
I
will
take
silence
as
a
yes,
fantastic.
Any
matters
arising.
C
Okay,
so
matters
arising,
there
were
a
couple
of
items
from
the
internal
audit
update
report,
so
a
question
from
councilor
bithel
around
key
decisions
and
also
some
questions
around
the
County
Ford
Arrangement.
So
an
update
was
circulated
in
respect
of
those
on
Friday
last
week
in
terms
of
actions
from
previous
meetings.
I
think
there
was
a
query
from
councilor
Dalton
on
ir35
that
has
now
been
completed
and
responded
to
there's
one
outstanding
item
around
privileged
user
access.
C
That
is
at
the
very
final
stages
now
in
terms
of
agreeing
the
response
there,
alongside
actually
the
internal
audit
report
into
that.
So
we
expect
to
be
in
a
position
to
circulate
that
imminently.
E
Thank
you,
chair,
I,
wonder
based
on
the
minutes
it.
It
came
from
my
attention
just
how
much
we
spoke
about
sort
of
the
I.T
IDs
based
digitalization,
stuff
I.
Imagine
based
on
the
remit
of
this
committee
that
it
isn't
appropriate
to
invite
them
here,
but
I
wonder
whether
it's
appropriate
to
contact
the
relevant
scrutiny
and
ask
and
explain
the
interest
that
we've
got
and
it's
coming
up
regularly
in
the
committee
and
ask
for
Direct
Communications
from
that
scrutiny
around.
E
What's
going
on,
so
we
can
be
kept
abreast
of
it.
I.
D
D
I
forget
when
it's
due,
but
it's
a
I,
think
January
February
time
on
the
work
program.
So
there
will
be
that
direct
opportunity
to
ask
those
questions
at
that
point.
B
I
think
it's
also
a
valid
point
that
the
the
chair
of
this
committee
and
the
scrutiny
shows
do
engage
on
a
regular
basis
because
there
will
be
work
that
crosses
both
kind
of
areas
of
oversight.
So
I
think
it's
a
valid
point
in
itself,
but
cases
that
they
will
be
bringing
report
any
other
Council
Flynn.
F
Doing
what
Hannah
said
they
they
really
turn
up
for
these
kind
of
meetings
and
I
I.
In
my
view,
it's
essential
that
they
do
given
the
fundamental
reforms
that
they're
putting
in
across
the
Council.
Okay.
Thank
you.
I.
B
Think
that
points
know
it
and
and
we'll
speak
to
the
churches
so
that
she
can
have
that
conversation
with
officers
and
also
the
relevant
scrutiny
chairs
just
to
make
sure
that's
on
their
agenda
as
well.
Any
other
questions
our
comments,
our
matters
arising
from
that.
No
thank
you
very
much
so
item
agenda.
It
will
be
eight
in
your
practice
actually
number
nine,
because
the
election
of
ehl
is
number
one.
The
internal
audit
annual
report
and
opinion.
C
Thank
you
chair,
so
the
public
sector
internal
audit
standards
required
a
head
of
audit
to
deliver
an
annual
internal
audit
opinion
and
Report.
That's
used
to
support
the
council's
annual
governance
statement
and
you'll
notice
that
the
interim
AGS
is
on
the
agenda
later
on
so
going
back
to
our
annual
report
and
opinion.
So
this
summarizes
the
work
that's
been
undertaken
over
this
year
and
it
provides
the
committee
with
our
annual
opinion
on
the
control
environment.
C
So
in
doing
so,
it
details
the
totality
of
the
work
that
we've
undertaken,
and
that
includes
audit
reports
that
have
been
issued.
The
various
other
sources
of
assurance
that
we
draw
on
during
the
year
and
the
work
that's
substantially
complete
as
well,
so
details
of
that
can
be
found
in
appendix
C
to
the
report.
C
So
last
month
when
I
gave
the
update
report,
I
did
allude
to
the
fact
that
it's
been
quite
a
challenging
year
this
year
with
with
restructuring
and
some
Key
Staffing
changes
and
members
will
be
aware,
obviously
that
I've
recently
taken
up
the
post
of
senior
head
of
audit
corporate
governance
and
insurance.
So
for
the
purpose
of
this
report.
C
C
So
appendix
B
to
this
report
summarizes
the
information
in
respect
of
our
own
resourcing
position
and
the
activities
that
are
underway.
If
you
like
to
support
the
continual
Improvement
of
our
own
section-
and
this
does
provide
the
committee
with
the
Assurance
on
the
arrangements
that
we
have
in
place
to
deliver
our
work
in
accordance
with
the
appropriate
standards.
C
So
we
have
a
very
rigorous
quality
assurance
process
which
is
well
established
within
this
text
within
the
section,
and
we
do
invite
an
annual
external
inspection
of
this
and
that
certification
that
we've
heard
has
actually
been
successful
since
1998,
which
I
think
again
reflects
very
positively
on
our
quality
management
system
and
our
ability
to
to
deliver
the
product
in
line
with
the
standards
that
we're
required
to.
So
we
have
continued
to
receive
some
excellent
feedback
through
the
questionnaires
that
have
been
raised
at
the
conclusion
of
each
audit.
C
C
I
did
discuss
at
the
last
meeting
that
we
are
looking
at
ways
of
streamlining
and
simplifying
feedback
to
encourage
greater
feedback
in
the
future
and
obviously
take
on
board
the
comments
that
members
raised
at
the
last
meeting
to
help
us
in
doing
so,
I
would
say
as
well
that
we've
also
had
excellent
feedback
informally
through
the
audit
process,
not
all
of
which
can
make
its
way
into
this
report,
but
it
does
give
me
the
confidence
in
saying
that
we
are
very
well
respected
and
valued
Across
The
Authority
for
the
positive
and
constructive
challenge
that
we
offer
as
a
section
and
the
role
that
we
play
in
helping
the
council
to
improve
its
control
environment.
C
So,
finally,
I
would
like
to
take
this
opportunity
to
thank
both
the
new
chair
of
the
committee
and
the
previous
chair
and
all
of
the
members
who
sat
on
this
committee
during
the
year.
For
that
constructive
challenge
that's
been
offered.
We
do
welcome
the
positive
challenge.
It
does
help
us
to
focus
our
attention
in
the
right
areas
and
keep
that
focus
on
that
continual
Improvement
of
the
control
environment.
C
I
would
also
like
to
take
the
opportunity
to
thank
officers
across
the
whole
Authority
for
engaging
in
the
internal
audit
process,
not
easy
at
a
time
when
resources
are
stretched,
but
I
do
feel.
We've
had
positive
engagement
there
to
help
us
in
completing
the
planned
work
that
we
have,
which
supports
this
opinion,
and
obviously
lastly,
I
want
to
extend
a
massive
thank
you
to
to
our
team,
our
Audits
and
and
corporate
governance
teams.
So
obviously
I've
only
LED.
C
This
team
towards
the
very
end
of
the
audit
year
yeah,
but
I
have
been
a
part
of
that
team
throughout
the
year.
So
I
am
acutely
aware
of
how
hard
everybody
has
worked
to
enable
us
to
get
into
the
position
to
deliver
this
opinion.
It
hasn't
been
easy,
but
I
feel
really
proud
of
the
efforts
that
everybody
has
undertaken.
I
think
it's
a
fantastic
reflection
on
the
T
on
the
team
that
we
are
able
to
be
here
delivering
this
the
opinion
today.
So
that
concludes
the
presentation
there.
B
Thank
you,
and
just
before
I
open
up
to
questions,
I.
Think
just
to
note.
From
the
community's
perspective
and
from
my
perspective
last
year
has
been
chair,
the
amount
of
huge
work
that
everyone
across
the
piece
is
doing
in
extremely
stressful
and
difficult
situation,
where
there's
a
lot
of
Demands,
so
I'm
going
to
open
it
up
to
members
of
all
questions
and
comments.
Any
questions
or
comments
on
that
from
anyone.
E
Thank
you,
yeah,
just
on
the
table,
I
just
wondered
if
there
was
any
more
information
we
could
have
on
the
overdue
that
aren't
progressed.
It
feels
like
overdue,
with
progress
feels
more
acceptable
to
me,
whereas
over
G,
but
not
doing
out
about
it,
feels
pretty
unacceptable.
Thank
you.
C
Okay,
yeah
I'm,
aware
that
the
recommendation
tracking
position
there
is
mixed,
so
I
think
that's
a
fair
question
and
without
going
into
specific
details
of
individual
areas,
there's
a
real
mixture
of
reasoning
for
that,
some
of
which
I
think
we
can
reflect
on
ourselves
in
the
process
that
we
have
for
chasing
the
recommendations
which
hasn't
been
perfect
by
my
own
admission
and
it's
something
that
we're
looking
to
improve.
Obviously,
the
illness.
C
There
are
recommendations
in
there
where
no
progress
has
been
entered,
but
we
are
aware,
for
example,
that
in
certain
areas
there
is
restructuring
of
that
service,
which
is
very
much
kind
of
dependent
on
being
able
to
take
the
action.
So
it
may
not
appear
to
be
in
progress,
but
it's
dependent
on
actions
that
have
been
undertaken
and
a
real
awareness
there
amongst
officers
in
those
areas
who
have
discussed
that
with
us.
C
But
we've
tried
to
be
just
fair
and
impartial
and
accurate
in
the
way
that
we've
reported
that
in
terms
of
what
the
trackers
actually
represent.
Similarly,
I
would
say
that
when
I've
looked
at
it
again
in
detail
over
the
weekend
in
preparation
for
this
meeting,
there
are
also
some
actions,
for
example,
in
financial
services,
where
we
agreed
to
a
recommendation
around
presentation
of
publishing
card
information
at
dashboard
level.
C
Whilst
we
haven't
got
the
update
on
there,
which
again
I
think
we
reflect
on
that
for
our
own
process,
I'm
very
much
aware
that
that
has
been
implemented
so
there
there
is
a
challenge
for
us,
I.
Think
continuing
here,
councilor
before
to
increase
the
engagement
there.
So
I
think
your
question
is
completely
Fair.
C
It's
something
we're
very
aware
of
to
increase
that
and
we
are-
and
we
have
given
the
committee
Assurance
previously,
that
we
want
to
introduce
a
sample
check-in
process,
mentioning
the
fact
that
this
last
year
hasn't
been
easy
for
us
to
implement,
say
some
of
the
new
measures
to
bolster
this.
That's
something
that
I
think
we're
wanting
to
bring
in
over
the
coming
year.
So
it
will
also
give
us
that
route
to
really
challenge
back
systematically,
if
you
like
in
the
areas
where
the
progress
hasn't
been
recorded.
So,
it's
a
mixture
of
reasons
there
yeah.
E
Sorry
I
think
I
might
have
just
misunderstood
and
I
just
want
to
make
sure
I
didn't.
You
just
spoke
about
a
specific
one
in
finance,
which
is
great,
so
it
sounded
like
that's
still
in
the
not
progressed,
but
actually
it's
been
implemented.
So
in
that
case,
what's
this,
what's
the
tables
it's
got
an
implemented
column
I,
don't
understand
why
it's
not
been
moved
across
or
is
it
just
a
timing
thing.
C
It's
a
timing
thing
if
you
like,
but
a
procedural
thing
as
well,
so
so
we
we
are
not
the
owners
of
the
control
environment
and
the
recommendations.
Once
we've
issued
those
recommendations.
The
illness
is
very
much
shared
across
the
council
for
implementation
there
and
we
felt
the
right
thing
in
the
way
that
we
introduced.
The
tracking
process
was
to
put
the
owners
there
on
the
services
for
updating
that.
C
But
but
I
will
say,
we
haven't
been
perfect
in
the
way
that
we
have
promoted
that
at
the
points
that
we
are
required
to
so,
for
example,
with
the
one
there
we
have
not
updated
it,
so
it
doesn't
show
as
implemented.
In
actual
fact
it
is
that
that's
that's
one
one
particular
example
there
so
the
implemented
column
is
for
recording
that,
and
you
could
say
it
is
a
time
and
this
difference
but
I'm
going
to
reflect
on
that
for
ourselves
in
our
promotion
and
chasing
process
and
what
we
can
do
better.
B
I
think
to
prefer
England
I
think
it's
point
to
maybe
raise
around
something
via
the
senior
leadership
team
that
it's
all
well
and
good
that
they
are,
if
you
will
feeling
it
in
themselves.
But
if
it
ain't
marked
it
ain't
there
and
I
think
from
a
from
a
transparency
point
of
view
and
a
scrutiny
kind
of
point
of
view
per
se
get
the
point
that's
been
made.
But
that
message
needs
to
be
re-reinforced,
that
it's
not
a
nice
city
for
us
to
conduct
the
function
of
this
committee
properly.
B
We
need
to
know
that
they're
filling
in
what
they
need
to
filling
in,
and
maybe
it's
a
conversation
to
people
with
Council
Francis
mayor
when
she's
back
to
pick
that
up
with
the
relevant
senior
leaders,
link.
L
Thank
you.
Yeah
I've
got
a
couple
of
questions,
so
I'll
do
them
all
in
one
go
and
then
so.
I'll
go
on
to
the
actions,
ones
first
and
then
I'll
go
back.
I
absolutely
agree.
It's
important
that
we
as
a
committee
receive
the
right
information
to
to
be
able
to
take
assurance
that
actions
are
being
implemented.
I,
I,
love
this
table
I
think
it's
great
that
you've
brought
this
to
us.
It's
it's
a
step
forward.
L
I
think
I
mentioned
at
one
of
the
previous
sessions
that
we
had
about
monitoring
and
Reporting
back
on
higher
medium
priority
actions.
What
what
I'm
still
left
wanting
here
is.
Are
there
any
risks
that
remain
unmitigated
as
a
result
of
these
actions
not
being
implemented?
And
that's
what
I'm
left
wanting?
L
If,
if
he
could
satisfy
me
and
hopefully
the
rest
of
the
committee
by
assuring
us
that
high
priority
actions
are
indeed
being
implemented,
because
that's
that's
the
main
concern
for
me,
but
thank
you
for
the
table.
I,
don't
think
it's
a
step
forward.
So
that's
my
point
on
actions.
L
If
I
can
just
jump
back
to
page
28
and
you
refer
to
a
cyber
security
audit,
a
follow-up
audit
on
paragraph
4.24
I
appreciate
you've
not
issued
the
report
yet
so
we
won't
have
seen
the
outcome
of
that
in
any
detail.
But
could
again,
could
you
give
us
any
Assurance
is?
Is
there
anything
on
toward
our
worrying
on
that
piece
of
work?
Cyber
security
is
clearly
a
significant
risk
and
I'd
just
be
sat
Keen
to
know
what
what
the
findings
were
from
that
audit.
L
Then,
on
page
34,
where
we
talk
about
fraud
referrals,
let
me
just
get
to
page
34.
L
yeah,
there's
an
increase
in
referrals
this
year
compared
to
last.
Is
there
any
director,
that's
more
impacted
than
the
other
or
is
it
a
general
spread?
I'm
I'm?
It
might
be
obvious
in
the
report,
but
I've
missed
that.
If
that's,
if
that's
something
you
can
just
help
me
out
on
and
finally
you'll
be
pleased
to
hear
at
page
40,
where
we
talk
about
money
laundering
in
paragraph
5.18,
and
you
talk
about
money
laundering
and
fraud.
Training.
L
C
No
thank
you
thank
you
for
the
questions
there,
so
just
taking
them
in
turn,
and
some
of
which
I
will
draw
on
other
colleagues
as
well.
C
So
in
terms
of
the
recommendations
and
I
am
aware
that
you
had
raised
wanting
I,
guess
more
intuitive
information
to
start
to
come
through
around
the
actions
that
have
been
taken,
I
will
say:
The
Trackers
themselves,
Focus,
specifically
on
high
and
medium
priority
actions.
The
low
ones
are
not
part
of
the
tracking
process,
so
we've
tried
to
be
risk-based
in
the
way
that
we
approach
that
now.
C
I
think
that
there
were
areas
of
the
presentation
of
the
information
itself,
which
we
agreed
that
we
would
reflect
on.
We
haven't
had
the
opportunity
to
do
that
as
yet
so
I
think
in
terms
of
I
guess
giving
a
bit
more
about
those
that
are
outstanding
and
the
implications
of
that
I
think
that's
something
that
we
will
reflect
on
again.
C
Just
going
back
to
the
previous
answer
that
I
gave
there
and
to
reassure
I
am
having
looked
at
some
of
those
that
are
outstanding
and
not
implemented
in
many
of
those
areas.
They
are
resting
on
as
well.
Follow-Up
audits
that
we
undertake
there
so,
where
we've
given
an
opinion
in
full
or
part
of
limited
assurance
that
has
led
to
those
recommendations.
So
there
are
issues
of
particular
risk.
We
do
also
programming
a
follow-up
audit
in
those
areas,
so
we've
actually
got
another
thing
to
kind
of
reflect
on
I.
C
Think
in
the
recommendation
tracking
data,
where
the
issue,
the
recommendations
that
we
issue
at
a
point
in
time
and
then
follow
up
at
the
moment-
they're
not
necessarily
dropping
off
the
trackers,
but
they
are
then
being
replaced
by
other
actions
as
well.
But
we
do
have,
though,
that
process
in
place
for
the
particularly
high
risk
areas
where
there's
been
a
limited
opinion
where
we
don't
simply
rest
on
The
Trackers
to
give
the
Assurance.
C
I'll
take
a
couple
of
ones
that
I
can
answer
first,
so
just
going
out
or
off
step
here
so
on
the
four
training
element
of
it.
So
the
training
itself
is
not
mandatory
yeah.
We
have
discussed
the
potential
to
do
it,
but
at
the
moment
we
we've
We've
determined
that
we
think
it's
appropriate
for
it
to
not
be
a
mandatory
training,
but
on
a
risk
basis.
C
We
do
then
go
into
and
communicate
with
particular
areas
where
we
feel
that
there
is
a
particular
need
to
do
that
and
I
think
we
do
reference
in
the
report
as
well:
around
Bank
mandate,
fraud,
for
example,
those
areas
that
are
particularly
susceptible
to
fraud
risk
through
our
links
in
today's
areas.
We
do
then
actively
promote
the
training
and
monitor
the
figures
in
those
sort
of
areas
and
I.
Think
figures
on
take-up
would
be
a
valuable
thing
for
us
to
bring
back
in
the
next
counter
forward
report.
C
So
we
can
show
that
by
area
as
well,
the
the
question
around
the
increase
in
fraud,
referrals
and
I
guess
whether
that
is
more
specific
to
a
particular
director
or
service
area.
That's
something
I,
think
I
will
discuss
with
our
principal
counterform
manager
and
come
back
with
I
know.
Kate
might
have
an
update
on
this,
which
I
will
come
to
now.
D
Just
a
very
quick
update
from
our
fraud
manager
is
that
the
increase
is
spread
across
all
directorates.
Can't
tell
you
any
more
than
that.
C
Should
get
my
microphone
back
on
and
on
the
cyber
security
audit
issue,
specifically
I'm
just
now
passed
up
to
to
Angela
who
looks
after
that
particular
audit.
I
So,
in
relation
to
cyber
security,
there
isn't
anything,
that's
coming
up
that
would
need
to
be
highlighted.
We
haven't,
as
I
said,
we
haven't,
issued
the
report,
but
there
are
no
significant
weaknesses
coming
out
of
that
review.
At
the
moment
we
have
looked
at
it
more
from
the
risk
angle,
but
at
said,
there's
nothing
of
concern
for
the
committee
coming
out
of
it
at
the
moment.
B
Just
one
quick
point
I'd
make
just
on
the
the
the
day
coming
from
the
fraud
is
numbers
is
one
thing,
but
quality
is
another,
because
actually
you
can
have
a
lot
of
referrals
that
actually
aren't
very
good
quality
and
therefore
take
up
staff
time.
So
there
might
be
a
bit
of
work
around
actually
quality
of
understanding
of
what
to
refer,
because
there's
no
point
in
people
referring
hundreds
of
things
and
actually
99
of
them
actually
not
actually
even
warranting
being
looked
at,
because
it's
just
maybe
something
to
reflect
on.
F
Thanks
Paul
Jonathan
may
not
have
the
level
of
detail
I'm
after
here,
but
it's
the
adult
Health
debt
recovery
process,
not
exactly
ringing
endorsement
from
you
regarding
it,
there's
not
a
huge
amount
of
detail,
at
least
that
I
could
find
in
the
report
about
what
that
actually
means.
Could
you
tell
us
what
what
the
debt
process?
Actually
you
know,
what
kind
of
debt
are
we
looking
at
here
and
why
was
there
a
less
than
ringing
endorsement
of
the
process.
C
I
know
Angela
has
led
on
that
audit.
She
may
not
have
figures
at
this
particular
meeting,
but
any
update
on
the
particular
details
of
that
audit.
I
So
it's
in
relation
to
the
invoices
that
we
raise
to
collect
service
users
contributions
to
their
care,
so
it's
people
who
are
either
receiving
home
care
or
nursing
residents.
It.
F
Just
is
this
the
Mac
at
the
241
and
Mac
cap
sort
of
liver
store
introduced
two
years
ago?
Is
it
specifically
to
do
with
that.
I
I
F
Okay,
I
I
thought
that
that's
what
it
might
have
been
and
I
I
it's
it's
not
a
matter
for
internal
auditor.
No,
but
it's
a
much
of
a
concern
to
me
that
I
think
we're
looking
for
about
a
four
million
pound
clawback
in
terms
of
those
two
particular
sort
of
items
that
adults
and
health-
and
we
I
think
we've
achieved
about
three
million
at
the
moment,
I'm
more
interested
really
in
the
impact
it's
had
on
the
Family's
concerned.
F
Who've
had
to
find
the
money
to
pay
for
their
the
care
that
they
got
previously
a
lot
cheaper
than
it
is
actually
now
but
I,
don't
think!
That's
a
matter
for
internal
audit,
but
it
may
be
a
matter
for
adults
or
health
scrutiny
board.
B
And
that's
I
think
we
can
maybe
ask
Council
Francis
mayor
to
pick
up
with
a
relevant
scrutiny
chair
if
that's
an
area
that
they
want
to
looking
I
think
there
is
obviously
a
question
over
the
the
debt
collection
procedures
and
whether
they're
working
as
intended,
which
is
obviously
on
something
by
the
sound
of
it.
B
The
order
is
looking
at,
but
perhaps
maybe
the
next
time
that
this
is
reported,
maybe
a
breakdown
between
the
impact
of
policy
change
without
looking
at
the
policy
and
actually,
if
you
will
the
Mainstay
of
actually,
because
that
then
leads
into
other
areas
that
then
scrutiny
may
wish
to
take
up
separately.
With
conversations
between
the
scrutiny
chairs
and
the
chair
of
this
committee,
councilor
Biffle.
E
Thank
you.
A
couple
of
questions
from
me
around
the
initial
and
a
lot
of
these
are
just
from
a
lack
of
experience
on
this
committee.
I
have
to
be
honest,
so
in
terms
of
the
first
Cent,
the
first
sort
of
block
where
it
talks
about
the
order,
exec
officer
not
being
impart
being
impartial.
Sorry,
not
not
being
impartial,
I
just
wanted
how
we
know,
because
surely,
in
a
situation
where
an
officer
wasn't
impartial,
they'd
still
give
the
statement.
So
what
is
the?
B
B
I
know
Jonathan
come
in
and
probably
give
a
bit
more
kind
of
framing
around
that,
but
ultimately
us
as
a
committee
to
challenge
actually
whether
or
not
our
processes
are
working
and
that
actually
they're
working
independent
way,
I
mean
one
of
the
functions
of
this
to
me
is
to
make
sure
that
audit
is
strong
and
independent
and
can
go
into
where
it
needs
to
go
into
the
council
to
have
those
conversations
but
I'll,
let
Jonathan
add
a
bit
more
context.
C
Entirely
correct,
though,
around
the
function
of
this
committee,
but
also
around
my
reporting
lines
and
direct
access
to
those
that
I
would
need,
for
example,
right
up
to
Chief
exec
level
and
then
into
this
committee
as
well,
and
also
at
the
more
basic
side
of
that,
the
Declaration
of
my
own
independence,
in
line
with
my
Professional
Standards.
So
obviously,
I
am
a
professionally
qualified
Charter
chartered
accountant.
I
am
Bound
by
my
own
code
of
ethics
there.
C
E
Thank
you,
and
there
was
there
was
no
suggestion
that
it
wasn't
the
case.
I
just
didn't
understand
how
it
just
seemed
like
a
sort
of
a
tick
box
exercise
I'm
glad
there
is
something
behind
it
can
I
also
ask
in
a
lot
of
the
tables
it
talks
about
compliance
versus
control
environments
can
I
just
check
that
I'm
right
that
control
environments
is
sort
of
the
the
rules
that
are
in
each
director
and
then
compliance
is
how
much
the
people
actually
do
them.
C
Correct
yeah
I
mean
a
control
is
not
necessarily
just
a
rule;
it
may
be
a
function,
a
process.
It
may
refer
to
guidance.
All
sorts
of
different
areas
of
a
control
environment,
but
you're
right
really
in
terms
of
our
control
environment,
will
be
around
the
arrangements
in
place
to
kind
of
support,
an
outcome
from
happening.
Compliance
will
be
where
we
have
tested
in
accordance
with
those
controls.
C
Are
they
working
and
then
are
there
issues
to
reflect
on
within
that
control
environment
so
has
it
been
complied
with,
but
we
always
then
go
back
in
the
cycle
and
to
look
at
the
control
in
the
first
place,
because
I
think,
if
a
control,
if
there
are
compliance
issues,
it's
not
good
enough
really
to
just
say
you
should
have
complied
with
it
done
it.
Do
it
I
think
that
is
an
opportunity
to
then
reflect
on
how
do
we
wrap
around
the
strength
of
that
control
environment
with
the
other
areas
as
well?
E
Thank
you
and
then
just
one
final,
one
shot
yeah,
so
that
links
for
me
to
my
next
point,
which
is
around
schools
because
they
seem
to
have
really
effective
plans,
but
then
relatively
limited
compliance,
so
I
wondered
if
you
could
elaborate
a
bit
on
what's
going
on
with
that,
and
then
I'd
also
really
like
to
hear
more
I
thought.
E
The
page
39
5.13
was
really
interesting
around
the
purchasing
cards
because
having
worked
in
schools
that
are
soft
power
of
the,
whose
authorizing
what
is
really
palpable,
I
guess
so
I'd
be
interested
to
hear
a
little
bit
more
around
that.
Thank
you.
C
Okay,
so
on
the
schools
in
general,
I
think
you're
right
to
obviously
query
that
in
respect
of
the
fact
that
there
are
the
compliance
issues
that
are
very
clear
there
in
the
table
with
the
school
audits
that
we've
done
now.
A
couple
of
points
to
to
know
here
and
I
think
perhaps
to
mention
this
at
a
last
meeting
as
well
to
a
degree.
This
is
a
a
reflection
of
the
success
of
our
audit
planning
process
so
work.
C
There
are
obviously
a
number
of
maintained
schools
within
the
authority
and
we
have
a
limited
amount
of
audit
time.
So
various
information
comes
to
us
from
both
self-assessments
that
the
schools
complete
around
their
financial
position
from
intelligence
that
we
get
through
the
school's
Finance
team
around
areas
where
there
may
be
a
particular
concern
and
issues
that
come
to
light
over
the
course
of
time.
So
we
do
specifically
focus
our
attention
on
the
schools
where
we're
aware
that
there
may
be
some
areas
of
weakness
to
pick
up
now
with
those
schools.
C
Those
issues
in
the
control
environment
have
led
to
the
poor
compliance
opinions.
There
have
tended
to
be
around
some
of
the
Creditor
payment
processes,
score
voluntary
formed
issues,
not
necessarily
huge
issues
in
terms
of
value
and
items.
Sorry
value
in
terms
of
the
amount
of
money
involved
there,
but
compliance
issues.
Nonetheless,
that
do
need
to
be
addressed
and
again,
when
we
talk
about
addressing
those
in
in
the
realm,
we
then
have
the
route
back
to
the
school's
Finance
team,
in
terms
of
being
able
to
promote
good
practice
and
actions
across
the
piece.
C
So
it's
not
just
those
scores
that
we've
looked
at
that
benefit
from
the
learning
there.
We
also
have
a
route
into
the
schools
for
them,
where
we
have
the
opportunity
to
share
good
practice
and
again
key
messages
across
the
schools,
so
that,
where
we
have
picked
up
those
issues
which
again
our
risk
assessment
directs
us
to.
We
have
the
ability
to
share
the
learning
across
the
different
schools
there.
So,
ultimately,
I
do
feel
that,
despite
the
fact
that
it,
it
does
stand
out.
C
E
Yeah
it
does
and
I
guess
it's
also
worth
minuteing
the
fact
that
the
follow-up
shows
the
impact
that
you
guys
are
having,
because
it
then
becomes
good
and
acceptable.
Thank
you.
C
Sorry
microphone
again
on
the
purchasing
card
issue,
specifically
I
think
that's
one
I'll
just
have
a
look
into
and
then
cut
back
to
members
of
the
committee
separately,
Council
Dobson.
M
Just
quickly
on
one
of
councilor
bethel's
previous
points
as
counselors,
we
have
our
interests
recorded
and
we
have
to
declare
personal
and
prejudicial
interests,
and
it's
publicly
available
on
the
website.
Our
interests
I'm
wondering
if
you
could
just
tell
us
what
offices,
because,
obviously
for
transparency
and
again
we're
not
suggesting
that
you're
not
transparent
in
any
way,
but
just
for
for
the
general
public.
Do
officers
have
to
declare
personal
and
prejudicial
interests,
and
does
the
council
hold
any
kind
of
register
about
interest
for
officers.
C
The
council
does
have
its
own
registry
of
Interest
processes
as
well,
so
officers
in
what
are
deemed
to
be
the
higher
risk
posts,
whether
that
is
seniority
or
potential
positions
of
influence,
are
required
to
at
least
annually
make
that
declaration
in
respect
of
any
outside
interests.
That
could
influence
that
position.
I
myself
actually
completed
mine
just
last
week
for
for
the
last
year,
so
we
have
very
similar
Arrangements
in
place
in
that
respect
through
which
our
own
interests
are
declared.
B
Any
other
questions
or
comments
are
we
okay
to
move
on
to
the
recommendation,
then
this
is
where
he
reads
it
out
so
make
sure
I've
gone
to
the
right
page.
That
always
helps
as
well.
So
does
the
committee
agree
to
the
recommendation
set
out
in
the
report
to
know
that,
based
on
the
audio
work
undertaken
for
2223,
the
internal
audit
control
environment,
including
the
key
financial
systems,
risk
and
governance,
is
well
established
and
operating
effectively
in
practice?
I'll
take
silence
as
an
acceptance
of
that
first
point.
B
F
Thanks
Paul
just
a
clarification
on
satisfactory
and
where
that
sits
in
the
there's,
usually
four
I
think
markets
or
whatever
you
know.
F
C
On
this
occasion
we
have
either
satisfactory
or
a
unsatisfactory
iea
conditional
opinion.
So
it's
it's
one
or
the
other
really
there
there
isn't
the
sliding
scale
in
this
context,
where
we
would
give
a
good
horror,
substantial.
B
Just
the
clarity
was
saying:
are
we
satisfied
basically
they're
doing
the
work
and
they're
not
that?
Actually
everything
within
there
is
perfect,
so
just
to
read
that
recommendation
again,
a
satisfactory
overall
opinions
provided
for
2022
23,
based
on
the
audit
work
detailed
within
the
report
again
I'll
take
silence
as
a
yes.
B
The
work
undertaken
to
support
the
opinion
has
been
conducted
in
accordance
with
the
established
methodology
that
promotes
quality
and
conformance
with
the
inter
International
standards
of
the
professional
practice
of
internal
audit
ippf
again
I'll
take
silence
as
a
yes,
I
love
a
good
acronym,
and
there
has
been
no
limitations
in
scope
and
nothing
has
arisen
to
compromise
the
independence
of
internal
audit
during
the
reporting
period.
Again,
I'll
take
silence
as
a
yes.
B
So
silence
is
yes,
fantastic,
so
moving
on
to
what
would
be
item
agenda
number
nine,
you
practice
actually
item
agenda
number
ten.
The
draft
statement
of
accounts.
J
Thank
you
chair,
so
the
report
presents
the
draft
statements
of
accounts
for
2223,
which,
at
this
stage
in
the
process,
come
to
the
committee
for
information
rather
than
for
approval,
so
I
can
confirm
that
the
draft
accounts
were
approved
by
Victoria
in
her
capacity
as
a
responsible
financial
officer
on
Friday
and
as
of
this
morning,
they're
published
on
the
council's
website
for
the
public
deposit
period.
J
As
you'll
be
aware
from
the
report,
the
government
had
brought
forward
the
statutory
date
for
approving
draft
accounts
this
year
by
two
months
to
31st
of
May.
So
obviously
we
haven't
met
that
as
far
as
I'm
aware,
that's
the
first
time
this
Council
hasn't
met
that
statutory
date
for
draft
accounts
approval.
J
J
It's
at
that
stage.
This
committee
would
be
asked
to
approve
the
final
audited
accounts
on
behalf
of
the
council,
so
in
advance
of
that
meeting,
what
we
will
do
is
hold
an
informal
briefing
session
for
members
to
go
into
the
accounts
in
more
detail,
sort
of
explain
how
the
technicalities
of
the
accounts
relate
to
the
reported
out
term
position,
and
that
will
give
members
a
bit
more
of
an
opportunity
to
ask
more
detailed
questions
on
the
accounts
at
that
stage.
J
If
I
could
just
divert
briefly
into
the
2122
audit
process,
where
you'll
have
a
report
from
Grant
Thornton
later
on
in
this
agenda
on
that
at
the
moment,
we're
expecting
the
final
audience
reports
to
be
brought
back
to
this
committee
at
the
September
meeting
of
the
committee.
So
we
will
hold
an
informal
briefing
session
for
members
earlier
in
September
on
the
2122
accounts
to
go
through
those,
so
the
members
have
a
full
picture
of
them
before
they're
asked
to
approve
those
accounts
on
behalf
of
the
council.
J
Turning
back
to
the
2223
accounts
themselves,
then
so
the
biggest
impact
on
the
statements
this
year
has
been
the
pensions
position.
So
because
of
the
way
the
pensions
liabilities
are
measured.
They're
discounted
based
on
Corp
Bond
rates,
because
the
yields
on
those
Bond
rates
have
increased
significantly
during
the
year.
That
means
that
the
present
value
of
our
liabilities,
as
recorded
in
the
accounts,
have
increased
significantly.
J
In
fact,
we've
actually
got
a
net
pensions
liability
as
regards
our
wish
structure,
pension
fund
pensions,
which
has
never
happened
before
since
this
form
of
Pensions
accounting,
was
brought
in.
So
it's
very
unusual
I
think.
The
thing
to
stress
there,
though,
is
that
the
impact
of
that
is
on
unspendable
reserves.
J
So
it
doesn't,
although,
although
it
appears
to
have
massively
increased
council's
net
worth,
it
doesn't
for
practical
purposes,
have
any
impact
on
our
available
funding
and
it
doesn't
affect
our
pension
contributions
going
forward,
because
those
will
be
based
on
the
triennial
reviews
which
the
pension
fund
actors
carry
out
beyond
that,
our
spendable
reserves
have
reduced
during
the
year.
Obviously,
one
element
of
that
was
the
12.4
million
overspend
that
happened
during
the
22
23
year.
J
Beyond
that,
though,
there
are
quite
a
few
time
issues
where,
quite
often
we
get
government
grants
and
funding
from
NHS
bodies
in
advance
of
spending
them.
So
some
of
the
increase
in
usable
reserves
is
purely
timing.
Issues
where
we
got
the
money
in
and
have
spent
it
as
planned
during
22-23.
J
F
B
Any
other
questions
or
comments
from
members,
no
okay,
quicker
agenda
and
then
so,
let's
go
on
to
the
recommendation
recommendation
members
are
asked
to
note
the
unaudited
statement
of
accounts
for
2022-23,
which
is
to
be
certified
by
the
chief
officer
I,
will
take
silence
as
acceptance
as
normal.
There
we
go
so
moving
on
to
item
number
10
in
your
pack,
which
is
actually
item
number
11
for
this
meeting.
The
internal
audit
governance
statement,
okay,.
C
So
we're
back
to
me
again
and
I've
got
the
microphone
on
this
time,
so
this
report
informs
members
of
the
annual
review
of
internal
control,
which
has
been
undertaken
and
sets
out
our
interim
on
your
governance
statement.
So
essentially,
there's
two
key
reasons
for
us
bringing
this
report.
So
the
first
one
is
to
present
the
corporate
governance
framework
and
Assurance
map.
C
So
the
local
code
of
corporate
governance,
which
was
adopted
by
this
Committee
in
March
22
states
that
this
committee
is
responsible
for
oversight
of
corporate
governance
arrangements
and
will
receive
annual
reports
setting
out
the
framework
of
internal
control
and
mapping
out
the
Assurance
available
prior
to
approval
of
the
councils
and
the
or
governance
statement.
So
the
framework
that
you'll
see
in
the
park
there
sets
out
what
we
do
when
the
Assurance
map
sets
out
how
we
know
that
we
do
it.
So
we
have
three
lines
of
assurance
there.
C
Firstly,
the
operational
Assurance,
so
that's
the
Assurance
from
those
with
the
day-to-day
management
and
operational
responsibility
within
the
control
framework.
So
this
is
derived
largely
through
the
survey
of
internal
control
and
in
this
year
we've
had
quite
an
outstanding
response
rate
there
with
93
of
respondents,
and
we
also
get
assurances
there
from
reports
that
go
to
committees,
specialist
Assurance,
so
that's
assurance
and
there
was
a
specialized
specialist
oversight
in
control
and
responsibility
and
accountability
for
delivery
of
the
control
environment.
C
So
this
again
is
derived
through
inquiries
of
those
Specialists
and
again
through
reports
that
come
to
the
Committees
and
then
the
independent
Assurance.
So
that's
provided
by
those
with
no
direct
responsibility
for
delivery
of
the
control
environment
and
examples
would
include
internal
audit
ourselves
and
the
external
Auditors
ofsted
the
peer
review
and
challenge
that
we
get
in
any
other
external
inspections.
C
C
So
the
first
stage
in
the
process
here
is
the
interim
statement
agreed
and
signed
off
by
the
chief
finance
officer,
which
goes
out
to
public
consultation
alongside
the
account
so
there's
an
opportunity
there
to
ask
questions
and,
alongside
that
public
consultation,
there's
the
opportunity
to
consider
the
outcome
of
the
review
of
internal
control
and
to
develop
the
action
plan
for
the
next
year.
Where
It's
Our
intention
there
to
focus
on
the
big
governance
items
so
not
repeating
other
action
plans
that
are
already
subject
to
proportionate
arrangements
for
oversight
and
review.
C
So
in
terms
of
the
next
steps,
now
we'll
bring
back
the
final
annual
government
statement
in
the
Autumn
and
ask
the
committee
to
review
that,
and
then
at
that
point
we
will
close
off
22-23,
and
that
gives
us
the
opportunity
then
to
focus
on
23,
24
governance
Arrangements.
Thank
you.
B
E
Yeah
I
just
wanted
to
I
can
be
challenging,
but
actually
I
think
this
is
really
really
brilliant
piece
of
work
and
I
just
wanted.
It
noted
that,
in
terms
of
help
for
members
to
be
able
to
see
the
specifics,
it's
really
good
and
I
love
that
it's
got
sort
of
the
links
in
there
and
everything,
so
we
can
utilize
it
as
sort
of
a
working
document.
So
thank
you.
B
Fantastic,
so
moving
on
to
the
recommendations,
there
are
questions
or
comments,
make
sure
I
don't
miss
it
this
time.
No,
there
we
go
so
I've
lost
where
I
am
now.
Does
the
committee
agree?
The
recommendation
set
out
in
the
report
to
note
that
the
content
of
the
internal
audit
governance
statement
I'll
take
silence
as
a
yes,
we
have
a
yes,
that's
great.
So
moving
on
to
it'll,
be
item
number
11,
you
pack,
but
it's
actually
item
number
12,
which
is
the
grand
Fortune
interim
audit
findings
report
2021
2022.
B
K
You
very
much
chair,
I'll,
just
draw
out
some
key
messages
from
this
report
and
perminda
can
take
the
committee
through
some
of
the
points
of
detail.
So
this
is
the
we've
budgeted
as
a
working
draft
version
of
the
iso
260
in
respect
of
our
work
on
the
2122
accounts
of
the
council
and
our
finalized
version
of
this
document
is
planned
to
come
to
this
committee
at
the
end
of
September.
K
We
commenced
the
audit
of
2122's
accounts
back
in
March,
so
members,
some
certain
members
will
recall.
We
signed
off
the
2021
accounts
in
February
and
then
we'll
move
straight
into
the
to
the
delivery
of
the
2122
accounts
in
in
March.
K
I
would
say
that
the
audit
is
approximately
70
complete
at
the
moment,
just
to
update
that
first
paragraph
on
the
right
there
and
as
I
say,
an
updated
version
of
this
report
will
come
to
this
Committee
in
September
and
I.
Think
we've
printed
offer
an
updated
version
of
the
first
page
for
members
just
to
just
to
highlight
that
I
think
a
couple
of
things
to
say
so
far.
K
I
think
we've
made
good
progress
on
most
of
the
balance
sheet
areas
of
the
accounts
and
I
think
the
focus
Now
is
really
on
the
income
and
expenditure
areas
of
the
audit.
K
We
are
probably
a
bit
behind
where
we
wanted
to
be
towards
the
end
of
July,
but
we
were
aware
obviously
Finance
colleagues
were
busy
with
the
22-23
draft
accounts
chair,
which
Mary's
just
just
presented
so
I
think
there's
quite
a
bit
of
work
on
on
both
sides
during
August
and
September
to
get
us
where
we
all
want
to
be
in
terms
of
concluding
these,
these
accounts
and
and
the
audit
process
by
the
end
of
September.
K
There
has
been
in
addition
to
that
a
national
issue,
yet
another
national
issue
impacting
on
on
local
government
accounts,
which
is
in
respect
of
the
triennial
valuation
of
Pension
funds,
and
that's
updated
information
which
needs
to
be
taken
into
account
for
those
21
22
accounts
that
still
remain
open.
So
that's
impacting
leads
and
a
significant
number
of
other
local
authorities
across
the
country
and
you
I
know
you
chair
will
be
familiar
with
the
with
the
backlog.
K
I
guess
nationally
that
that's
out
there
in
terms
of
old
year
audits
that
still
to
be
concluded.
So
that's
another
issue
that
myself
and
pamindra
and
our
team
are
working
through
with
with
Richard
Victoria
and
Marion
Finance.
Colleagues,
so
as
I
say,
we're
aiming
to
conclude
the
audit
by
the
end
of
September
bring
an
updated
version
of
this
report
to
this
committee
at
the
next
meeting
in
September.
K
I
think
it
is
worth
just
highlighting
as
well,
though
over
the
page
chair
on
page
six
of
the
pack
that
the
value
for
money
work.
We
are
very
keen
that
that
keeps
up
to
date.
Chair
so
obviously,
you'll
be
aware
that
we
reported
our
2122
value
for
money.
K
Findings
to
this
committee
back
in
March
and
and
quite
often
that
work
is
seen
as
I
suppose
more
impactful,
more
relevant,
more
interesting,
I
guess
for
for
members
talking
around
the
the
value
for
money
Arrangements
in
place
at
a
local,
Authority
and
and
the
plan
very
much
is
to
keep
that
that
audit
up
to
date,
so
we're
planning
to
con
commence
that
audit
during
the
summer
with
a
view
to
presenting
the
22-23
vfm
report
to
this
Committee
in
November
and
as
Mary's
mentioned
in
her
summary
I
think
the
the
2223
accounts
order
is
going
to
commence
later
this
year
with
a
view
to
concluding
that
in
sort
of
March
Easter
time
for
next
year.
K
G
Thanks
Gareth
just
to
add
to
gareth's
summary
there
there's,
not.
No
matters
have
come
out
so
far.
That
would
impact
on
our
proposed
audit
opinion,
which
is
at
the
moment
of
proposed
unqualified
audit
opinion.
G
As
Garris
mentioned,
there
are
a
number
of
areas
that
set
out
on
slide
page
five
of
the
pack
that
we
are
still
concluding
on
including
elements
of
our
work
on
property,
plant
and
Equipment,
payroll,
payables,
receivables
and
so
on,
and
also
getting
a
draft
updated
version
of
the
2122
draft
financial
statements
which
incorporate
the
adjustments
from
the
2021
audited
financial
statements
that
we
need
to
obviously
go
through
and
conclude
on.
G
Just
drawing
out
some
particular
points.
Moving
to
page
eight
of
the
pack
required
to
bring
to
your
attention
the
materiality
for
the
audit,
which
is
set
out
on
the
slide
there,
26.898
million
maternity
levels
remain
the
same
as
were
reported
in
our
audit,
planned
from
September
of
last
year.
Trivial
matters
just
want
to
draw
out
is
one
million
three
hundred
and
forty
five
thousand.
So
what
that
means
is
if
we
identify
any
issues
above
that
amount.
G
There
are
a
number
of
significant
risks
that
we
have
identified,
undertaking
our
work
to
our
presumed
significant
risks
I'm
on
page
nine
of
the
pack.
Now
one
is
the
management
override
of
control
which
cannot
be
rebutted.
This
picks
up
on
where
management
may
be
put
under
pressure
to
amend
the
outcome
position
due
to
reporting
pressures
that
they
may
have,
and
we
undertake
a
range
of
work
in
that
area
around
looking
at
the
the
effectiveness
of
management
controls
over
journals
in
particular,
and
we
actually
identify
unusual
journals
for
testing.
G
We
also
look
at
accounting
estimates
and
critical
judgments
that
management
have
formed
to
look
at
those
to
ensure
that
there
is
nothing
that
looks
untoward
in
those
particular
areas
as
well
as
looking
to
any
changes
in
accounting
policies,
estimates
or
unusual
transactions.
No
issues
have
come
out
from
our
work
so
far
in
those
particular
areas
over
the
page.
The
other
area
that
we
are
required
to
look
out
for
all
audits
is
around
Revenue
recognition
and
expenditure
recognition.
G
This
is
a
rebuttable
risk
and
in
our
audit
plan
we
had
rebutted
this
on
the
basis
that
there's
little
incentive
for
management
to
manipulate
Revenue
recognition.
The
culture
and
ethical
Frameworks
within
the
council
and
more
widely
within
local
government
are
quite
strong,
meaning
that
all
forms
of
fraud
are
seen
as
unacceptable.
So
we
Revisited
that
rebuttal
and
we
concluded
that
was
still
appropriate,
but
that
doesn't
mean
we
haven't
undertaken
any
work
in
that
particular
area.
The
work
that
we've
undertaken
is
set
out
on
that
slide.
G
No
particular
issues
have
come
out
from
our
work
other
than
one
that
we've
raised
in
previous
years,
which
is
around
the
valuation
date
for
the
valuation
process,
which
has
moved
to
the
1st
of
January
each
year,
whereas
the
year
ended
the
31st
of
March.
So
we
have
raised
a
recommendation
again
this
year
that
the
valuation
date
should
be
moved
to
the
31st
of
March,
so
you're,
not
in
the
position
where
you
have
to
undertake
work
to
support
the
valuation
from
the
1st
of
January
to
the
31st
of
March
the
three-month
period.
G
The
next
area,
which
we
identified
as
a
significant
risk,
is
around
the
pension
fund
net
liability
again
a
very
significant
amount
within
the
council's
balance
sheet
and,
of
course,
is
very
sensitive
to
the
changes
in
any
key
assumptions.
Again,
the
work
that
we've
undertaken
or
proposed
to
undertake
is
set
out
on
slide,
12
and,
of
course,
the
point
that
Gareth
main
around
the
triennial
valuation
coming
through
at
the
31st
of
March
has
meant
that
the
work
we
had
undertaken.
We
need
to
re-perform
now
with
the
revised
numbers.
G
We've
undertaken
work
around
the
recognition
and
presentation
of
Grant
income
and
obviously
there
were
remnants
of
covid
grants
in
that
regard.
No
issues
have
come
out
from
that
work
to
date
on
it,
General
controls
our
work.
We
reported
this
separately
to
you
back
in
December
and
that
was
presented
to
this
committee
in
March
earlier
this
year.
G
Over
the
page
on
page
14
infrastructure
assets
was
a
national
issue
last
year.
What
that
meant
was
that
the
value
of
infrastructure
Assets
in
local
government
needed
to
be
amended
slightly
and
the
statutory
override
was
provided
by
the
department
for
leveling
up
housing
and
communities
such
that
the
council
removed
the
gross
gross
cost
and
accumulated
depreciation
for
the
2021
accounts,
but
because
the
2122
accounts
had
been
prepared
prior
to
that
statutory
instrument
coming
out.
That
Amendment
obviously
needs
to
be
made
into
21
22
accounts
in
due
course.
G
We
then
look
also
at
Key
judgments
and
estimates,
and
those
are
obviously
around
the
council
dwellings
evaluation,
other
London
buildings,
evaluation,
the
net
pension
liability,
no
issues
have
come
out
so
far,
although
this
is
all
work
in
progress,
so
they've
all
been
green
rated
on
the
slides
any
changes
we
will
bring
to
your
attention
at
the
meeting
in
September,
just
particularly
also
drawing
your
attention
to
slide
19
the
minimum
Revenue
provision.
G
This
is
an
area
of
increasing
Focus
for
local
Authority,
external
Auditors
following
recent
highly
publicized
challenges
and
problems
at
certain
local
authorities
where
the
minimum
Revenue
provision
was
found
to
be
inappropriate,
so
the
year-end
MRP
charge
for
leads
for
21,
22
or
68.7
million.
This
is
a
significant
increase
of
31
million
from
the
prior
year.
G
G
Other
slide
onto
page
20
of
the
communication
requirements.
We
look
at
a
range
of
other
areas
in
relation
to
fraud
in
relation
to
related
parties,
laws
and
regulations.
No
issues
coming
out
from
that.
In
terms
of
our
review
of
the
accounts,
we
identified
a
number
of
presentational
disclosure
amendments
which
are
being
or
have
agreed
to
be
processed
by
management,
and
these
are
set
out
in
the
appendix
which
I'll
come
on
to
a
little
later
and
we've
already
talked
around
the
timing
of
the
audit.
G
I
think
it's
just
worth
drawing
out
here
that
we
raised
the
content
of
working
papers
and
the
buildup
of
the
numbers
in
the
accounts
in
previous
years
to
try
and
help
with
that.
We
ran
a
workshop
for
offices
within
the
finance
department,
very
pleased
that
over
100
Finance
officers
attended
that,
and
we
hope
that,
looking
ahead
to
the
2223
audit,
that
will
help
improve
the
quality
of
the
working
papers
going
forward.
G
Slide
23
whole
of
government
accounts.
We
require
to
undertake
specified
procedures
on
behalf
of
the
National
Audit
office
on
the
whole
of
government
accounts
that
work
can
only
be
completed
once
we've
completed
our
audit
on
the
financial
statement,
so
once
that
has
been
done,
that
work
will
be
neat
will
need
to
be
undertaken.
G
Slide:
26,
Independence
and
ethics.
There
are
no
Independence
or
ethical
issues
that
we
wish
to
bring
to
your
attention,
and
then
we
get
into
the
appendices.
There
are
two
recommendations
I
referred
to,
which
are
set
out
on
slide.
28
management
have
responded
to
those
and
their
comments
are
included
with
on
with
on
that
slide,
we
also
followed
up
our
prior
recommendations,
which
are
set
out
on
slides
29
to
30,
with
an
update
on
each
particular
area.
G
Slide.
31
are
audit
adjustments
which
set
out
the
impact
of
audited,
adjusted
misstatements.
There
are
no
adjusted
misstatements
have
been
identified
so
far
over
the
page.
There
are
misclassification
disclosure
changes,
so
what
that
means
is
these
are
in
the
notes
to
the
accounts,
as
opposed
to
the
main
financial
statements.
G
Again,
management
responses
are
included,
the
tbc's
on
the
right
hand,
side
once
we
have
got
an
updated
set
of
accounts,
we'll
be
able
to
review
and
either
put
a
tick
or
a
cross
in
there,
depending
on
the
review
and
the
changes
made
slide,
34
impacts
of
unadjusted
misstatements.
There
are
no
unregistered
misstatements,
so
we've
identified
to
date
our
fees
are
set
out
on
page
35
and
then,
following
that
we
have
the
draft
audit
opinion
and
the
draft
letter
of
representation
I'll
pause.
There
I've
talked
for
a
while,
but
I'm
happy
to
take
any
questions.
B
M
Just
just
quickly
and
I
can
feel
counselor
trust,
Wells
eyes
from
a
car
burning
down
on
me,
because
this
is
always
one
of
his
pet
subjects
and
and
that's
the
land
valuation
you've
made
a
recommendation
that
it
moves
to
March,
which
seems
to
make
perfect
sense
and
I've
seen
it
referred
to
on
page
11
and
Page
30,
and
so
on.
Does
that
mean
it
has
been
moved
to
march
in
future
years,
or
is
it
still
been
considered.
K
If
I
pick
that
up
first
gen
I,
think
Mary
probably
wants
to
comment
in
a
moment.
So
we've
talked
quite
a
bit
of
this
committee,
Council
Nelson
in
in
terms
of
the
level
of
work
required
both
on
the
council
side
and
and
the
value
aside,
and
indeed
on
our
side
to
get
to
a
position
where
we're
satisfied.
K
There's
no
material
error
in
the
closing
valuation
of
your
London
buildings
and
one
of
the
ways
that
potentially
makes
that
piece
of
work
slightly
more
straightforward
is
to
have
a
valuation
date
at
the
balance
sheet
date,
because
there's
no
debate
there
in
terms
of
what
happened
between
in
this
case,
first
of
January
and
31st
of
March.
So
it's
a
recommendation.
We've
raised
a
number
of
authorities
and
a
lot
of
those
authorities
have
moved
their
valuation
date
to
the
31st
of
March.
K
They
believe
that
the
first
of
January
is
probably
the
latest
that
they
can
go
with
a
valuation
date
in
order
to
get
the
information
completed
in
order
to
pass
over
to
finance
colleagues,
so
we've
seen
other
five
other
authorities
moved
to
the
31st
of
March
valuation
date
and
and
that
work
quite
well
but
I
think
as
things
stand
from
a
value
from
the
valueist
point
of
view,
that's
the
latest
that
they
can
go
within
in
in
Leeds.
K
J
Yes,
just
to
Echo
what
Garth
said
it's
a
practical
issue
councilor
into
in
in
order
to
do
evaluation
as
at
31st
of
March,
you
have
to
wait
sometime
after
the
31st
of
March
until
the
values
have
sufficient
data
as
to
what
economic
conditions
were
like
as
that
31st
of
March.
So
they
can't
start
the
valuations
immediately
and
due
to
the
sheer
number
of
valuations
that
need
to
be
done
for
our
accounts.
J
If
they
were
to
take
the
data
as
at
31st
of
March,
they
simply
wouldn't
be
able
to
Value
them
all
in
time
for
the
draft
accounts.
So
we
have
a
discussion
with
them
each
year
as
to
what
the
latest
possible
date
is
that
we
could
go
for,
but
for
the
past
few
years
it
has
been
first
of
January
we'll
we
will
be
having
another
discussion
with
them
in
the
Autumn
as
to
what
the
best
date
is
that
we
can
achieve
for
next
year's
draft
accounts.
M
Yeah
it
it
listening
to
you,
it
just
seemed
you'd
seem
to
be
saying
that
actually
we're
almost
doing
the
work
twice
in
so
much
as
we're
doing
it
for
January
and
then
we're
also
having
to
revalidate
that
work
in
March
anyway.
So
that
must
take
office
of
time,
but
also
it
would
be
really
nice
to
know
what
other
comparable
authorities
are
doing.
You've
already
said
that
some
have
moved
it
over.
B
Yeah,
just
before
coming
I
think
that
was
gonna,
be
the
point
I
was
going
to
raise.
How
do
we
compare
to
other
car
cities
with
similar
sized
portfolios
and
land
ownership
because,
obviously
that's
the
big
factor?
If
you
own
a
lot,
you
have
to
have
a
lot
of
information.
If
you
can
be
a
big
Authority
and
you've
outsourced
everything
and
you
don't
own
a
lot-
there's
a
lot
less
to
do,
but
yeah.
If
you
can
quickly
comment
on
that,
that
would
be
great
thanks.
K
Chair
so
so
in
essence,
Council
downson's
point
is
is
is
is
accurate
because
there's
an
awful
lot
of
workers
to
say
for
the
value
on
the
finance
team
at
the
first
of
January
position,
and
then
one
of
our
key
areas
of
focus
on
this
order
is,
is
to
be
skeptical
and
challenge
the
valuation
movement
from
then
until
31st
of
March.
So
in
essence
it
is
quite
a
lot
of
work
for
for
Council
colleagues
as
a
whole
to
justify
why
that
valuation
in
January
is
still
relevant
at
31st
of
March.
I.
K
I
will
take
that
one
away
chair
in
terms
of
course,
cities
and
my
other
I
suppose
major
audits,
which
are
ones
over
500
million,
have
moved
to
a
31st
of
March
position,
but
they're,
not
core
cities,
and
we
do
do
you
know
Birmingham
Nottingham,
Bristol,
Etc,
so
I
will
I
will
check
with
colleagues
may
have
already
done
that
with
the
equivalents
at
Cost
cities,
but
I'll
take
that
one
away
chair.
Thank
you
now.
B
I
think
that's
appreciated,
I
think
it's
one
of
these
for
the
committee
that
difficult
balance
between
what
would
be
ideal
and
what
is
actually
doable
in
terms
of
resources
on
on
colleagues,
when
there's,
obviously
a
lot
of
pressure,
any
other
questions
or
comments
on
on
that
report
from
colleagues
yep.
L
Thanks
chair
still
on
the
same
subject
really:
is
there
any
opportunity
to
split
the
evaluation
to
value
a
percentage
of
properties
in
January
in
a
percentage
of
properties
in
March?
If,
if
it's
too
too
tight
time
frame
to
do
them
all
in
matter,
that
might
be
a
stupid
question?
I'm!
L
Sorry,
if
that's
the
case
and
and
my
follow-on
really
to
that-
is
and
I'm
no
expert
in
this
by
no
stretch
but
I
understand
property
values
and
a
decreasing
quite
significantly
at
the
moment,
what
impact
does
that
have
on
the
valuation
as
a
January
and
as
at
March?
Would
that
you
know
does
that?
Does
that
impact
the
work?
That's
required
to
justify
the
valuation
being
the
right
valuation
in
the
first
instance
of
the
31st
of
March,
if
that
makes
sense,.
J
I'd
have
to
go
back
to
the
accounting
code
to
double
check,
but
I
think
we
have
to
specify
a
valuation
date
in
terms
of
our
accounting
policy
as
to
what
date
we
value
properties
at
certainly
I've,
not
seen
any
other
Council
splitting
the
valuation
date
for
different
properties,
but
I
will
double
check
that.
K
And
on
on
the
second
Point
in
terms
of
just
just
re,
go
through
that
same
Point
again,
please.
L
Decreasing,
would
that
create
even
more
work
for
offices
and
for
yourselves
to
justify
that
change,
evaluation
or
not
change
evaluation.
K
So,
potentially
so
one
of
the
key
things
that
we
do
in
terms
of
our
audit
work
to
get
to
a
position
where
we're
materially
comfortable
at
31st
of
March
valuation
is
very
much
to
look
at
the
various
property
indices
for
different
types
of
assets
and
there's
different
indices
there
for
how
for
different
types
of
assets
that
are
valued
on
different
bases.
And
if
we
see
those
indices
are
moving
by
a
different
percentage.
Shall
we
say
than
what
the
leads?
K
K
You
know
reasons
why
that
might
be
justified,
but
again
there's
a
lot
of
challenge
back
and
forth
on
that,
because
it
is
such
a
a
key
area
of
focus,
particularly
from
The
Regulators,
that
that
are
reviewing
the
external
audit
working
local
government
and,
whilst
is
that
level
of
oversight
and
Challenge
on
Auditors.
Clearly,
we
will
focus
a
lot
of
our
audit
resource
and
attention
on
on
areas
such
as
such
as
property
valuations.
So
there
absolutely
will
be
a
lot
of
Challenge
on
that.
K
That
said,
there's
a
lot
of
national
discussions
going
on
at
the
moment,
Linda,
which
you
may
be
aware
of
around.
How
do
we?
K
How
do
we
as
a
sect
to
deal
with
the
backlog
of
local
Authority
audits
that
still
need
to
be
signed
off
across
the
country
and
one
of
the
areas
that
is
potentially
being
looked
into
is
how
do
we
value
fixed
Assets
in
in
old
terminology,
and
is
there
a
a
more
appropriate
way
to
do
that
that
potentially
frees
up
audit
resource
to
focus
on
areas
that
are
of
more
interest
to
council
taxpayers
to
members
that
impact
on
the
property,
proper
usable
reserves
of
a
council,
as
opposed
to
directing
at
present
a
lot
of
audit
resource
into
the
valuation
of
London
buildings
and
the
and
the
valuation
of
the
pension
liability?
K
G
Can
I
just
add
to
that
I
think
the
we
use
an
external
value
of
2,
which
supports
some
of
the
work
that
we
do
so
in
addition
to
looking
at
the
indices,
we
also
speak
to
our
Auditors
expert
to
get
his
guidance
in
terms
of
where
they
think
things
should
be,
which
again
then
leads
to
a
bit
more
doing
and
throwing
in
terms
of
with
management,
to
gain
Assurance
around
how
that
value
has
changed.
B
Any
other
questions
or
comments.
Okay,
if
we
can
move
on
to
the
recommendation,
then,
which
is
members,
are
asked
to
receive
the
interim
audit
finding
report
presented
by
grandfaarden
a
note
to
and
to
note
the
recommendations
made.
I'll
take
silence
as
a
yes
to
that
fantastic.
Moving
on
to
item
agenda
13,
which
is
number
12
in
your
pack,
which
is
the
corporate
governance
and
audit
work
program
for
20
23
24.
C
Thank
you
so
before
we
go
into
the
work
program,
I'll
just
add
that
we
brought
the
development
program
to
the
committee
at
the
last
meeting.
So
I
think
now
is
probably
a
good
time
for
us
to
start
booking
things
in
for
member
development,
so
there'll
be
a
series
of
briefings
and
potential
training
courses,
and
things
like
that
that
will
start
to
come
through.
C
Well
then,
coming
back
to
the
work
program,
so
this
is
obviously
set
out
within
this
report
showing
the
reports
that
are
due
to
come
to
committee
over
the
course
of
this
year
and
I
just
wanted
to
pass
over
to
my
colleague
Aaron
in
information
governance.
Just
for
an
update
in
respect
of
the
information
governance
report.
That's
due
later
in
the
year.
H
Thank
you.
No.
This
is
just
to
give
the
the
committee
and
the
heads
up
that
we've
had
contact
from
the
information.
Commissioner's
Office,
that's
the
Ico,
and
they
want
to
come
and
do
a
data
protection
order
of
the
council.
We've
not
got
all
the
details,
yet
the
next
we'll
hear
from
them
will
be
the
first
week
in
September,
which
is
when
we'll
discuss
the
scoping
of
the
audit
and
that
will
include
areas
of
information,
governance,
but
also
areas
of
the
council
that
they
want
to
look
at
from
then
and
we'll
get
the
specific
details.
H
We'll
then
have
a
few
weeks
to
gather
evidence
of
any
controls
that
we
have
in
place
in
relation
to
those
areas
on
the
actual
audit
is
due
to
be
undertaken
the
first
week
of
November.
Now
they
do
hybrid
and
audits
to
suspect
they
will
be
on
site
for
a
couple
of
days,
but
it
will
conduct
interviews
with
relevant
staff
across
that
that
week
from
when
it's
concluded,
they'll
have
two
weeks
to
turn
around
the
report
and
issue
that
to
us
and
then
we'll
have
a
similar
period
of
time
to
respond
back
to
that.
H
But
ultimately,
we'd
be
looking
to
put
together
an
action
plan
which
is
probably
a
six
to
nine
month.
Action
plan
taken
us
into
the
new
year:
So
Daniel
governance
reports,
June
February,
so
I
would
suggest
that's
the
time
in
which
we
would
like
to
bring
the
first
report
in
terms
of
the
outcome
of
the
audit
and
then
probably
looked
maybe
six
months
after
that,
to
bring
what
I
would
hope
to
be
a
closure
report.
H
B
You
any
questions
or
comments
from
members,
okay,
so
moving
to
the
recommendation,
does
the
committee
agree
to
the
recommendation
set
out
in
the
report
to
consider
and
approve
the
work
program
as
detailed
Independence
Day,
with
the
additional
information
we've
also
been
provided
about
the
other
audit?
Are
we
all
happy
with
that?
B
Okay
item
agenda
number
13,
you
pack,
the
number
14
date
and
time
of
the
next
meeting,
to
note
that
the
date
and
the
time
of
the
next
meeting
as
Monday,
the
25th
of
September
2023
at
10,
30
a.m
and
I
conclude
the
meeting
for
today.
Thank
you
for
your
time.