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A
Hello
and
welcome
everybody
to
this
meeting,
and
this
is
the
development
plan
panel
meeting.
My
name
is
councilor
Hannah
Bethel
and
for
the
first
five
or
six
minutes,
I'll
be
sharing
just
for
councilor
Caroline
green,
who
is
our
regular
chair
and
manages
to
make
it
in
today's
meetings
being
live
streamed
on
the
city
council,
YouTube
channel,
so
that
the
public
can
observe
the
meeting
without
needing
to
be
present?
Could
I
now
invite
members
and
officers
to
introduce
themselves
if
we
could
start
from
my
left.
H
Thank
you,
chair
under
agenda
item
number
one.
There
are
no
appeals
against
the
refusal
of
inspection
of
documents
under
item
number
two.
There
are
no
items
which
require
the
exclusion
of
the
press
and
the
public
under
item
number.
Three.
There
are
no
items
late.
There
are
no
late
items.
Noted
under
item
number.
Four
can
ask
members
to
declare
any
interest.
They
may
have.
H
A
Thanks
very
much
so
we'll
move
to
item
number
six,
which
is
the
minutes
from
the
previous
meeting
held
on
the
4th
of
April
2023.
Do
members
accept
these
minutes
are
a
true
and
correct
record
yeah.
Thank
you,
Council,
Anderson
and
seconded.
Thank
you
I'll
assume
those
are
correct.
A
B
Might
be
to
defer
to
councilor
Anderson
if
he
wishes
to
come
in.
G
G
I
just
want
to
get
it
on
the
agenda
so
that
we
can
then
follow
it
up
because
we've,
a
number
of
us,
have
been
asking
for
this
information
for
some
time
and
it's
just
to
preach
it
formally
there
it's
not
to
make
a
issue
of
it
in
order
to
debate
it
like
we
did
the
last
time
either,
but
just
to
make
the
point
so
it's
recorded
for
so
that
we
can
keep
following
it
up
as
to
why
we've
got
it
or
not
got.
It
is
the
case.
Maybe.
B
Thank
you
chair.
Just
in
terms
of
the
the
co-living
item
that
was
discussed
at
the
last
DPP
members
did
raise
quite
a
lot
of
detailed
points
about
that
which
you
can
see
are
reflected
in
the
minutes.
What
officers
have
done
is
they've
revised
that
note
and
members
were
clear
at
DPP
that
they
wanted
to
see
that
note
again.
B
So
it's
the
intention
to
circulate
that
note
to
to
DPP
members
and
invite
comment
back
so
expect
an
email
to
come
from
me
and
I'd
be
grateful
for
any
comments
received
and
I'll
set
out
clear
time
frames
in
the
email
when
I
send
it.
Thank
you.
A
B
Thank
you,
chair,
I'll
I'll
kick
off,
but
we
have
Vicky
hinchliff,
Walker
group
manager
for
environment
and
Design
Group,
and
we
also
have
Richard
Marsh
who's,
our
senior
nature
conservation
officer
who
can
can
field
any
detailed
questions
or
or
questions
of
clarity,
so
biodiversity
and
and
nature
recovery.
B
We
felt
it
was
timely
to
to
bring
an
update
to
this
panel,
because
quite
a
lot
has
changed
around
these
topics
in
recent
years,
stimulated
largely
by
the
environment
act
which
was
enacted
in
2021
and
which
will
kick
in
a
requirement.
A
mandatory
requirement
for
what's
called
biodiversity
net
gain
from
November
this
year,
but
we
also
have
as
a
result
of
that
act,
something
called
local
nature
recovery
strategies
which
are
now
active
or
or
or
starting
to
be
in
process
within
West
Yorkshire.
B
So,
just
turning
to
the
report,
there's
there's
a
bit
at
the
beginning,
Powers
one
through
two
five,
which
just
sets
out
the
context
really
for
why
biodiversity
and
protection
of
biodiversity
is
important.
It.
It
supports
much
of
the
districts,
but
not
only
in
terms
of
sort
of
plants
and
animals,
but
also
humans
by
providing
what's
known
as
ecosystems
services,
and
it's
also
important
for
us
as
we
consider
the
impact
of
climate
change,
because
climate
change
adaptation
isn't
just
about
how
humans
will
adapt
to
the
climate.
B
It's
about
how
different
species
of
animals
and
plants
adapt
as
well.
So
it
is
significant
and
and
really
important
that
we
understand
the
the
the
need
to
recover
biodiversity
because,
as
the
report
sets
out,
it
has
suffered
quite
considerably
against
a
number
of
measures,
not
just
within
leads,
but
but
nationally
over
recent
years,
and
that
in
Paris.
B
Six
really
is
is
why
the
government's
25-year
environment
plan
and
the
consequent
environment
act
that
emerged
from
that
plan
are
really
important,
because
that's
the
government's
response
to
how
to
restore
nature
within
the
country
in
Powers.
Seven
and
eight
we've
set
out
what
the
current
planning
policies
are
around
biodiversity,
and
there
are
two
that
are
significant.
B
The
first
is
around
protection
of
habitats
and
species
which
helps
guide
development
away
from
those
areas
where
which
which
are
most
precious
in
in
in
terms
of
the
natural
environment,
but
also
policy
G9,
which
already
seeks
an
overall
net
gain
for
biodiversity.
B
And
that
means
that
where
development
is
is
inevitable
on
a
piece
of
land
and
it
does
impact
upon
biodiversity,
there
will
be
a
calculation
made
so
that
the
resulting
either
development
or
any
off-site
Works
will
leave
that
biodiversity
in
no
worser
condition
and
indeed
a
marginal
net
Improvement
than
before
development
started.
Now
the
the
biodiversity
net
gain
contained
within
the
environment
act
goes
further
than
that,
and
it
says
that
that
biodiversity
net
gain
should
be
equal
to
10,
10
percent.
B
The
Power
8
sets
out
that
the
emerging
local
Plan
update
of
which
members
will
be
aware,
has
the
theme
of
biodiversity
running
through
it,
under
its
green
and
blue
infrastructure
section,
and
that's
looking
to
strengthen
the
policies
that
we
have
in
the
plan
and
take
account
of
the
changes
emerging
through
the
environment.
Act
Powers
9
through
to
11,
set
out
the
existing
work
that's
carried
out
within
leads
and
on
biodiversity
and
through
the
sort
of
the
the
quite
long
in
the
tooth
biodiversity
action
plan.
B
And
it's
that
off-site
contribution.
That
is
generating
the
council.
Thinking
about
how
it
can
sell
biodiversity
units
to
developers
and
what
that
means
for
improvement
of
biodiversity
more
widely,
because
on
selling
those
units,
the
council
would
obviously
get
some
income
to
be
spent
on
biodiversity.
Improvement
and
the
rest
of
the
paper
sets
out
how
that
would
work
in
thinking
about
how
to
implement
the
environment
act.
B
The
the
the
the
the
the
detailed
calculations
that
will
occur
at
the
planning
application
stage
are
important
because
they
will
decide
what
type
of
units
are
being
sought.
They
will
use
a
government
metric,
so
it
won't
be
possible
to
affect
one
type
of
biodiversity,
for
example
grassland
and
one
type
of
habitat,
and
replace
that
with
a
completely
different
type
of
biodiversity,
which
might
be
Woodland
cover.
For
example,
you'd
have
to
be
replacing
like
for
like
in
terms
of
what
was
affected
on
the
development
site,
with
what
is
going
to
be
provided.
B
The
approach
which
is
set
out
in
some
in
in
Paris
19,
through
to
23
and
in
more
detail
in
appendix
in
in
appendix
3.,
requires
the
matchmaking
map
engagement,
that
a
pre-application
stage
with
the
planning
department
about
the
likely
impacts
of
the
development
and
understanding
as
to
whether
or
not
the
developer
is
choosing
to
use
the
council
as
a
habitat
bank
and
as
a
habitat
broker,
because
there's
no
obligation
on
developers
to
do
so.
B
There
will
be
a
market
out
there
where
other
environment
Banks
can
actually
sell
biodiversity
units
to
Developers,
and
then
once
the
council
has
determined
whether
or
not
it
will
be
active
in
terms
of
managing
those
biodiversity
units,
then
there
will
be
a
habitat
delivery
partner
identified
within
the
council.
Now
that
could
be
climate,
energy
and
green
spaces.
The
department
formerly
known
as
partisan
Countryside
in
terms
of
the
management
of
the
land
that
they
own
and
operate
it
could
be
Asset
Management.
It
could
be
flood
risk
management.
B
It
could
be
highways
depending
on
the
sorts
of
biodiversity.
What
sorts
of
improvements
are
being
sought
and
the
land
to
be
improved.
B
They're
then
follows
quite
a
detailed
and
Technical
approach
to
monitoring,
managing
and
Reporting
on
that
biodiversity
Improvement,
which
is
set
out
in
appendix
three
and
and
these
are
responsibilities
that
the
council
has
their
responsibilities,
that
the
council
will
take
a
proportion
of
any
biodiversity
monies
for
in
order
to
support
and
fund
those
activities
and
and
those
activities
will
last
for
a
period
of
30
years
from
the
delivery
of
the
the
biodiversity.
B
So
in
some
that
biodiversity
net
gain
and
happy
to
take
questions
on
that.
But
but
members
will
will
clearly
appreciate
I
think
the
impact
that's
going
to
have
on
planning
decision
taking
within
the
council.
B
The
second
part
of
the
paper
just
sets
out
in
some
Powers
24
to
26
the
local
nature
recovery
strategies-
and
this
was
another
aspect
of
the
environment
Bill,
where
the
government
committed
to
a
nature
recovery
Network
across
England,
which
was
important
to
not
only
reflect
the
state
of
the
the
the
key
designations
that
we
have
within
the
country,
but
also
to
reflect
on
what
that
means.
B
Now
we're
in
a
post-brexit
world
and
various
bits
of
European
legislation
now
no
longer
apply
to
Nature
conservation,
so
defra
require
lnrs's
and
defra
have
declared
responsible
authorities
across
the
country
for
the
the
50,
odd
local
nature,
recovery
strategies
and
our
responsible
Authority
is
the
West
Yorkshire
combined
Authority.
B
So
we
are
working
quite
closely
with
the
combined
authority
to
draw
up
the
late,
the
local
nature,
recovery
strategy,
which
will
set
out
a
map
around
the
importance
of
of
biodiversity
across
the
the
five
West
Yorkshire
authorities,
but
also
a
statement
of
key
biodiversity
priorities.
B
That
will
be
important
not
only
for
West
Yorkshire,
but
also
for
the
council
as
well
you'll
see
in
power
25
the
makeup
of
the
Steering
group.
That's
currently
steering
that
production
of
the
lnrs's
and
under
land
use
planning,
you'll,
see
Leeds
city
council
there
and
that's
actually
myself.
I
sit
on
that.
Steering
group
and
I
I
represent
the
the
the
planning
process
within
that
Steering
group,
but
Richard
Marsh
also
feeds
in
through
the
local
government
ecologists
to
that
Steering
group
as
well.
B
So
quite
a
bit
to
go
out
there
I'm
happy
to
to
take
questions
from
members.
L
Okay
good
afternoon
everybody
and
thank
you
for
bearing
with
me
being
late.
It
has
enabled
me
to
attend
the
funeral
of
a
very
long-standing
resident
in
my
ward,
which
I'm
sure
you'll
agree
is
a
councilor's
duty.
So
thank
you
for
that
and
I
will
take
the
chair
over.
Although
I
haven't,
of
course
heard
Martin's
presentation,
I
have
had
a
briefing
and,
of
course,
I've
read
the
papers.
So
can
we
invite
questions
and
comments?
Please
count
around
us
and
I
saw
first
cut
councilor,
Carl
and
then
councilor
Brooks.
G
Yeah
I'll
try
and
be
quick
right.
Obviously,
the
preferred
option
is
that
we
get
it
done
on
site
fine,
but
if
we
do
have
to
start
going
down
getting
selling
units
Etc,
who
decides
the
price,
the
pound
Shilling
in
Pence,
in
old
language
as
far
as
I'm
concerned?
Who
actually
decides
you
know
what
the
value
of
each
unit
is
and
how
the?
How
do
they
pay?
Is
it
on
our
sliding
scale?
So,
for
example,
certain
areas
of
the
city
will
attract
a
higher
rate
and
who
calculates
that?
G
G
You
know
if,
in
other
words,
if
someone's
a
major
developer,
can
they
can
we
get
any
of
that
money
back
from
them.
And
can
you
expand
upon
the
role
of
wika,
because
I
understood
that
the
government
were
trying
not
to
have
a
lot
of
planning
issues
being
dealt
with
by
waika
but
leaving
it
with
the
local
planning
authorities
to
have
responsibility,
because
getting
political
is
working
together?
G
G
I
L
Right,
thank
you.
Barry,
we'll
take
one
issue
at
a
time
and
if
Martin
does
overlook
any
I'm
sure
you'll
come
in.
Thank
you.
C
Okay,
thank
you
for
those
questions.
Councilor
Anderson,
the
first
one
was
around
the
cost
of
the
biodiversity
unit.
Well,
the
way
BNG
is
going
to
operate.
Is
it's
up
to
the
private
Market
to
determine
what
the
cost
is.
So
we're
not
aware
of
what
cost
the
environment
Banker
charging
and
whether
that
will
differ
across
the
district
I
doubt
it
or
we
would
be
under
control
of
is,
if,
as
the
council,
we're
selling
biodiversity
units,
we
determine
then
what
that
level
is.
C
But
we
have
to
be
very
mindful
if
we
set
the
level
too
high
as
a
cost,
the
developers
would
normally
go
elsewhere,
wouldn't
they
to
the
private
market,
and
we
don't
know
yet
at
what
level
the
private
Market
is
operating.
Well,
no
more
after
November.
No
doubt
the
way
we're
choosing
to
operate.
It
is
one
standard
cost
across
the
whole
of
the
district.
C
Just
answer
the
first
question:
move
on
to
the
second
one:
I'll
try
and
answer
that
one
that
was
to
do
with
economies
of
scale
working
at
a
West,
Yorkshire
level,
there's
different
elements
of
BNG.
If
we're
talking
about
the
scrutiny
of
planning
applications
like
the
role
I,
do
the
other
four
districts
in
West
Yorkshire
do
employ
planning
ecologists
themselves,
there's
only
Wakefield
a
thing
that
didn't
have
any
in
place
near
it
recently
I
think
going
to
appoint
two
more.
C
So
it
would
be
difficult
to
do
that
and
development
management
officers
quite
like
having
a
local
person
to
talk
to
on
a
regular
basis
and
I'm
sure.
As
members
you
do
as
well
so
I
don't
think
it
would
work
for
the
planning
scrutiny
role,
whether
it
would
work
for
being
a
habitat
bank
and
maybe
selling
biodiversity
units.
That's
something
we'll
have
to
keep
an
eye
on,
and
maybe
over
time
that
is
on
the
back
burner,
really
we'll
keep
on
investigating
that
over
time.
B
Just
also
to
add
in
as
well
we've
been
looking
for
these
opportunities
to
add
value,
councilor
Anderson.
So,
for
example,
some
of
our
staff
in
planning
have
been
providing
mapping
for
the
other,
where
short
authorities
and
and
we're
looking
to
maybe
do
that
at
cost.
As
we
move
forward,
there's
also
going
to
be
an
issue
around
calculating
River
units,
because
that
requires
a
bit
of
an
even
more
of
a
specialty
in
terms
of
ecologists.
C
And
to
continue,
then,
on
to
your
third
question,
that
was
about
the
the
costs
that
we
may
be
liable
to
the
burdens
for
us
to
implement
BNG.
Can
we
pass
any
of
those
costs
onto
the
developer?
I
think
is
what
you
were
asking
it's,
it's
very
difficult
to
do
that.
The
one
thing
we
can
do
is
and
what
we
are
proposing
to
do
is
set
ourselves
up
as
the
BNG
monitoring
and
Reporting
body.
That's
often
how
I'm,
referring
to
myself
now
as
the
nature
team
within
the
planning
function.
C
If
we
are
providing
that
BNG
monitoring
and
Reporting
body
role
I.E,
we
as
accounts
are
saying
we
really
care
about
what
units
are
being
delivered
on
site
and
what's
being
delivered
off-site,
regardless
of
who
it's
by.
We
do
have
to
try
and
think
if
we
can
make
a
charge
for
that
and
that's
what
we
are
proposing
in
the
way
we're
implementing
this.
So
we're
saying,
wherever
there's
off-site
BNG
units
being
delivered,
we
will
put
a
charge
in
place
through
a
section
106
to
partly
cover
that
BNG
monitoring
and
Reporting
body
role.
C
So
we'll
do
that
if
the
private
habitat,
Banks
or
developers
are
doing
it
on
their
own
land,
we
can
use
the
section
106
as
a
model
there,
where
we're
actually
selling
units
ourselves
as
the
council.
We're
also
factoring
into
that
a
cost
to
try
and
cover
that
BNG
monitoring
and
Reporting
and
body
role.
So
we
are
trying
to
do
that
and
there
are
ways.
So
thank
you
for
that.
One.
C
The
the
fourth
question
was
about
the
role
of
waika,
the
West
Yorkshire
combined,
Authority
I.
Think
sometimes
we
get
BNG
and
local
nature
recovery
strategies
a
little
bit
mixed
up.
They
are
really
separate,
but
there
are
areas
of
overlap.
Bng
is
a
planning
related
function
that
is
purely
down
to
us
as
the
LPA.
C
If
the
lnrs
has
got
a
spatial
map
showing
these
areas,
we
should
try
and
accommodate
it
within
the
local
plan,
but
Meanwhile
we're
also
doing
an
awful
lot
of
work
on
that.
We've
got
a
Leeds
habitat
Network
through
the
lpu
one,
and
we've
got
our
designated
site
so
in
reality,
we'll
probably
be
influencing
the
lnrs.
C
So
we
should
be
ahead
of
the
game.
Is
what
I'm
saying
there?
The
last
question
was
about
risks
and
financial
monitoring.
I
think!
Wasn't
it
if
yeah
I'll
be
I'll,
let
Marty.
B
So
so,
just
to
come
in
on
that
one
counselor,
that's
a
bit
of
a
live
issue
at
the
moment.
So
so
we
intend
to
go
to
Executive
Board
in
September
with
a
more
detailed
version
of
this
report.
That
will
be
accompanied
by
an
understanding
of
how
we
expect
the
governance
around
this
to
work
and
that
will
that
will
look
at
what
groups
and
bodies
might
need
to
be
set
up
within
the
council
in
order
to
scrutinize.
That
role
have
scrutiny
over
it,
but
also
report
back
in
terms
of
how
the
money's
being
spent.
L
D
Thank
you
jet
a
few
questions
really
some
of
them
I
think
you
alluded
to
a
little
bit
in
the
presentation
on
the
answers,
but
I
just
want
to
get
it
100
clear
in
my
mind,
so
I
guess
I've
got
a
few
questions.
D
I'll
go
through
so
first
just
a
bit
of
reassurance,
I
guess
on
how
we
ensure
biodiversity
and
not
not
monoculture
out
of
what
we're
creating
so
that
what
is
delivered
is
actually
a
diversity
of
habitats
rather
than
a
selection
of
similar
habitats,
all
the
way
through
and
I
guess
in
tandem
with
that.
How?
D
How
does
this
policy
look
to
replace
what
is
lost
both
historically,
possibly
as
well
as
what
may
be
lost
from
an
individual
development
on
a
site,
because
there
may
be
lots
of
different
types
of
habitats
that
are
at
risk
and
have
been
lost
over
decades
and
hundreds
of
years
that
that
no
longer
are
on
existing
sites?
I
guess
that
developers
might
take
over
and
I
guess
the
loss
of
biodiversity
across
the
district
will
be
certainly
different
amounts
over
history.
D
So
areas
of
the
city
center,
you
would
imagine,
have
lost
a
great
deal
of
the
biodiversity
in
that
area
before
it
was
developed
at
all,
whereas
there
will
be
areas
where
a
large
number
of
the
habitats
still
exist.
So
how
do
we
use
the
policy
I
guess
to
to
try
and
focus
on
those
areas
where
that
there
is
a
lack
of
biodiversity
at
the
moment?
D
That's
all
around
that
that
point
really
just
in
in
terms
of
how
how
the
policy
aims
at
that,
but
one
other
thought
occurs
to
me.
Obviously
there
are
these
different
types
of
habitat
that
could
be
created.
D
You
mentioned
Martin
the
the
rivers
habitat,
for
instance,
I'm,
assuming
there'll,
be
a
different
cost
per
unit
of
those
to
a
developer,
and
how
do
we
ensure
what
is
replaced
is
replaced
at
the
appropriate
cost
for
the
appropriate
amount
of
what
is
lost
rather
than
the
cheapest
habitat
possible,
to
replace
with
sorry
I'm
coming
on
to
the
end?
D
Now,
obviously,
it's
easier
to
replace
that
biodiversity
on
Council
land,
but
as
we
found
through
the
Woodland
creation
project
and
and
others,
we
don't
have
a
huge
amount
of
council
land
available
to
us,
where
a
large,
where
areas
of
Woodland,
for
instance,
might
need
to
created
on
large
pieces
of
land
and
we're
finding
that
limited
in
some
ways
can
the?
D
If,
if
we
receive
a
payment
for
biodiversity
net
gain
off-site,
could
that
be
used
to
purchase
land
to
enhance
his
biodiversity,
which
could
help
make
up
some
of
that
shortfall
in
areas
with
with
lack
of
biodiversity
and
then
improve
on
it
over
time?
Or
would
it
only
cost?
Would
it
only
be
able
to
be
used
for
improving
that
site
rather
than
the
original
purchase
of
a
site?
I
guess
and
the
last
question
is
just
around
how
this
would
be
consulted
with
local
residents.
D
D
D
So
it
might
be
easier
to
spend
money
on
broadly
nature,
reserving
my
ward,
which
exists
and
is
there
than
to
be
able
to
create
biodiversity
in
Little,
London
and
Woodhouse,
which,
as
far
as
I
remember,
doesn't
have
a
nature,
reserve
and
I'm
sure
there
will
be
many
others
Vermont
office
in
Richmond,
Hill
or
other
wards
that
are
heavily
built
up.
I
guess
that's
similar
to
the
other
lines,
but
series
of
questions
there,
apologies
for
the
time.
Hopefully
they
make
sense.
B
I
think
they're
all
really
relevant
questions
and
ones
that
we've
been
we've
been
mulling
over
as
well.
I
think
what
what's
going
to
be
important
is
that
we
are,
as
a
council
geared
up
from
November
of
this
year
to
be
able
to
engage
in
the
biodiversity
broker
Market,
because,
thus
far,
the
environment
act
has
been
in
a
transition
phase,
so
it
becomes
mandatory
from
November
and
at
that
point
all
development
and
all
developers
will
have
to
engage
in
it.
B
So
I
think
it's
important
that
the
council
has
an
opportunity
to
engage
in
that
cell
units
and
improved
sites.
Now.
B
B
Think,
subject
to
council
endorsement
of
what
that
biodiversity
strategy
might
look
like
it
could
be
around
bringing
nature
closer
to
people,
especially
within
Urban
environments,
because
obviously
we
don't
get
away
from
the
fact
that
we
are
a
metropolitan
Authority
and
and
it's
important
for
everyone
to
have
access
to
Nature
and
it's
important
for
an
age
to
thrive
and
it'll.
Do
that
in
different
ways
in
an
urban
environment
than
it
would.
B
If
you
were
delivering
biodiversity
net
gain
units
in
a
rural
environment,
so
I
think
that
strategy
and
how
we
think
about
that
is
going
to
operate
at
a
number
of
levels.
B
B
I
think
we're
just
gearing
up
and
getting
ready
for
for
for
the
mandatory
BNG
coming
in,
but
happy
to
hand
over
to
Richard.
On
the
other.
C
Yeah
thanks
Martin,
hopefully
that
covered
a
number
of
your
points.
I
think
some
of
your
questions.
We
probably
don't
have
all
the
answers
to
yet
and
I.
Don't
think
BNG
will
have
for
a
little
while
regarding
trying
to
use
money
to
buy
land,
that's
an
interesting
one.
I
wish
it
did.
C
C
Sorry,
I,
don't
think
the
camera
is
on
me
or
my
mic
then,
but
hopefully
you
heard
me
yeah
I
think
the
point
I
was
saying:
was
we
can't
technically
buy
land
with
BNG
money?
It
doesn't?
The
national
system
doesn't
allow
that
what
you'd
have
to
do
is
proactively
buy
land
at
your
own
cost
and
then
use
it
for
delivering
BNG.
C
So
we
have
difficulties
as
a
council
being
able
to
do
that.
Don't
we
with
cash
flows,
so
that's
just
a
fact
of
life.
I
think
with
it
I
mean
privates.
Habitat
Banks
may
be
able
to
do
that.
We're
going
to
have
to
think
creatively
whether
we
can
start
to
do
that,
but
it
needs
wider
discussions,
I
think
across
the
council.
C
For
now,
though,
what
we're
saying
in
paragraph
22
is
where,
if
it's
got
to
go
off-site,
we're
trying
to
identify
where
are
the
priority
areas
and
what
we're
trying
to
say
is
is
yes,
it
is
where
there
is
the
most
important
biodiversity.
That's
got
to
be
part
of
it.
It
is
biodiversity
in
that
game,
so
we're
looking
at
designated
sites
we're
looking
at
the
Leeds
habitat
Network,
which
covers
the
whole
of
leads.
Anyway.
We've
got
a
category
in
there
about.
C
It
can
be
anywhere
else
outside
of
Elites
habitat
network,
but
we're
saying
there
should
be
a
level
of
Public
Access.
If
that's
the
case
and
we're
trying
to
recognize
the
wider
societal
benefits
of
having
access
to
Nature
with
that
one.
What
we
don't
do
is
go
as
far
as
saying
we
know
where
there's
deficit
areas
for
natural
Green
Space
in
these,
we
haven't
done
that
level
of
research.
Yet
that
might
be
something
we
have
to
look
into
in
the
future.
C
It'd
be
great
to
have
that
piece
of
work,
and
maybe
it's
something
over
the
next
few
years
we
can
work
with
Leeds,
University
or
others
to
work
out,
because
there
is
something
called
the
access
to
Natural
Green
Space
standards.
So
we
could
try
and
apply
those.
Then
we
could
work
out
where
are
which
areas
have
got
good
access
for
natural
Green
Space
and
which
areas
have
got
the
least,
and
then
we
could
bind
that
into
a
strategy
to
try
and
deliver
BNG
in
those
areas.
So
yeah
it's
a
good
thought,
but
yeah.
C
We
have
to
see
how
we
can
do
that.
The
was
there
anything
else
in
your
questions.
I'm
just
think
I'm,
just
looking
down
what
I've
written
here,
there
was
one
question,
sorry
about
consultation
as
well,
I
think
with
local
communities
and
that's
a
really
important
one.
At
the
moment
we've
been
working
with
used
to
be
called
parks
and
Countryside.
Now
we're
calling
climate,
energy
and
green
spaces.
C
So
there's
an
officer
there,
who
is
the
point
of
contact
for
developers
and
they're
about
to
recruit,
well
they're
about
to
appoint,
while
they've
appointed
but
they're
about
to
recruit
the
person
who's
going
to
be
the
main
contact
going
forwards.
Now,
when
a
location
is
agreed
that
the
developer
can
deliver
them
on,
there
will
be
a
level
of
consultation
now
and
that'll,
be
down
to
the
green
spaces
service
to
talk
to
yourselves
and
the
local
community.
So
that
is
something
very
much
that
they
are
thinking
about
and
how
to
do
that
so.
K
Thank
you
chair
just
on
the
point
of
local
consultation,
also
through,
whilst
the
planning
application
is
actually
being
considered
all
the
biodiversity
proposals,
the
Baseline
measurements
for
that
particular
site
will
be
in
and
will
be
publicly
available,
so
people
will
be
able
to
scrutinize
it
at
that
point
now.
K
What
will
generally
happen
is
that
come
November
all
the
relevant
development
will
have
a
standard
condition
placed
on
it
automatically,
even
if
we
forget
to
put
it
on
the
actual
decision
notice,
it
will
still
apply,
and
that
is
what,
for
the
submission
of
a
plan
that
will
show
how
the
developers
intend
to
put
that
10
biodiversity
Net
game
in
whether
that's
on-site
or
off-site.
K
Well,
what
what
will
need
to
be
done
is
when
they
submit
the
application
in
the
first
place,
with
the
Baseline
information
for
the
current
state
of
play
on
the
site
Richard
and
his
current
team
of
one
will
be
busy
scrutinizing
that
to
make
sure
that
it
does
check
out
and
then
what
happens
is
that
they
will
then
have
to
prove
that
there
is
a
10
uplift
now
they
can
only
do
that
by
providing
additional
biodiversity,
different
habitats,
different
sort
of
niches
for
for
different
species,
and
so,
if
it
is
a
monoculture,
it
just
won't
provide
that
uplift
at
all.
K
So
so
we
will
be
able
to
sort
of
ensure
that,
but
it
will
require
a
lot
of
monitoring,
and
that
goes
on
for
30
years.
K
So
so
it's
not
an
easy
task
for
for
all
Richard
there
is
it.
Water
will
also
happen
as
well.
Obviously,
you've
got
that
sort
of
local
consultation
going
on
through
that
process
and
also
through
the
condition
stage
as
well.
You
know
people
will
have
an
opportunity
to
sort
of
input
at
that
point
as
well,
if
they,
if
they
do
wish
to.
K
You
asked
a
question
about
whether
historical
biodiversity
could
be
recreated
now
this.
This
isn't
something
I
think
we
can
can
technically
insist
on,
but
it's
certainly
something
that
sort
of
could
be
discussed
through
the
negotiations
that
are
bound
to
take
place
with
developers.
K
So
when
we
are
sort
of
trying
to
sort
of
negotiate
on
on
which
particular
type
of
habitat
goes
in,
which
particular
type
of
part
of
the
site
that
they're
looking
at,
we
might
be
able
to
sort
of
look
at
what
might
have
been
there.
Historically,
what
has
been
lost
for
various
reasons
and
try
to
re-implement
that?
Obviously,
it's
got
to
be
sort
of
appropriate
to
the
local
area
in
order
for
it
to
be
successful,
so
there
will
be
elements
of
sort
of
very
historical
type
things
going
through.
K
Obviously,
with
one
eye
on
climate
change,
we
may
be
looking
at
slightly
different
variations
as
well
though,
but
but
it's
not
something
we
can
necessarily
insist
on.
There
is
going
to
be
a
thing,
though,
that
will
come
in
and
that's
if,
if
there
is
a
a
sudden
clearance
of
a
site
before
the
application
is
put
in,
and
we
have
clear
evidence
that
that
has
taken
place,
we
are
then
able
to
insist
that
they
go
back
to
the
previous
state
of
the
land
and
use
that
as
their
Baseline.
D
Thank
you.
That's
really
useful,
because
I
think
I'm
what
I'm
here,
what
I'm
hearing
for
the
majority
of
those
questions
around
Martin's
answer?
First
I
guess,
is
that
for
all
apart
from
the
the
purchase
of
land
there's
a
strategy
that
we
are
able
to
put
in
place
that
the
national
guidance
around
this
would
support
us
to
have
quite
a
to
have
choice
in
in
what
is
delivered
and
where
it
is
delivered
around
the
city.
D
I
I
guess
my
one
concern
around
that
with
the
council
acting
as
a
broker
for
that
which
I
I
think
we
should
do
and
I
think
it's
the
best
place
for
us
to
be
I.
Think
we've
already
find
in
the
Woodland
creation
project
and
various
others
that
there
is
this
difficulty
with
the
amount
of
council
land
we
have
and
how
much
of
that
is
used
for
nature.
How
much
of
your
sport
how
much
for
leisure
Etc!
D
So
you
know
areas
with
a
high
level
of
development
we
may
find
their
parks
are
required
to
deliver
a
large
amount
of
biodiversity
net
gain
if
we
can't
buy
additional
land,
whereas
they
may
be
most
valuable
at
the
moment.
For
sports
and
for
other
activities
that
happen
on
them
that
that
might
preclude,
so
it's
just
looking
around
that
that
I
think
I
have
a
real
concern,
but
thank
you
yeah.
That's
useful!.
L
And
see
you
want
to
come
in
Martin,
but
I.
Just
may
I.
Add
to
that
question
because
I
may
have
the
wrong
idea
about
this
entirely.
But
my
understanding
of
creating
biodiversity
is
that
it
doesn't
necessarily
result
in
an
attractive
Green
Space.
C
Well,
councilor
grew
and
I
think
what
you're
saying
there
I
understand
as
an
ecologist,
I
suppose
you'd
expect
no
less
answer
than
me
other
than
saying
things
like
scrub.
Don't
they
look
lovely,
but
I
totally
understand
what
you're
saying
I
think
what
we've
got
to
do
here
is
raise
awareness
about
why
these
things
look
different
to
what
traditionally
we
like
to
look
at
like
pristine,
Mountain,
Green
areas
or
flower
beds.
C
We
we
have
Beauties
in
the
eye
of
Beholder,
but
I
think
to
bring
most
of
the
population
along
with
what
we're
trying
to
do.
I
think
raising
awareness
is
a
big
thing,
and
maybe
interpretation
is
a
part
of
that
so
I
think
within
our
green
spaces
service.
If
they're
going
to
be
changing
a
community
park,
that's
normally
quite
formally
managed.
C
You've
got
to
do
in
a
really
well
considered
way,
which
is
what
they
would
do
for
you
know,
for
example,
it
might
be
a
case
of
do
you
pick
one
area
of
a
formal
Park
and
have
interpretation
in
that
area
to
call
this
bit
the
Nature
Reserve
with
in
The
Wider
Park.
That
might
be
a
way
of
creating
a
nature
reserve
within
a
park
but
make
sure
you're
using
interpretive
methods,
whether
it's
panels
or
online
media,
to
explain
why
that's
important,
because
at
the
end
of
the
day
we
are
facing
a
biodiversity
emergency.
C
Aren't
we
so
we've
got
to
acknowledge
things
will
probably
look
different
and
we've
got
to
accept
it,
but
let's
raise
awareness
about
those
things
as
well.
Sorry,
what
was
the
other
part
of
the
question.
B
Come
back
yeah!
Thank
you
just
just
to
reiterate,
Council,
absolutely
right
and
what
you're
saying
and
which
is
why
I
think
when
we're
looking
through
the
local
Plan
update
our
green
and
blue
infrastructure
policies,
we're
really
looking
at
how
green
space
and
biodiversity
and
accessible
routes
and
active
travel
or
or
and
health
and
well-being
all
come
together
within
the
same
sort
of
narrative.
So
it's
it's
about
thinking
how
we
plan
for,
for,
for
natural
environments
across
leads
really
and
just
to
come
back
to
your
point
about
how
we
might
run
out
of
council
land.
B
We
have
got
quite
a
lot
already
sort
of
mapped
that
we
we
we
look
after
in
terms
of
nature
conservation
areas
as
part
of
Lee
habitat
Network,
which
does
require
significant
investment,
but
we
can
also
work
with
Partners.
So
if,
if,
if
there's
a
parcel
of
land
that
would
be
much
better
to
improve,
then
we
can
think
about
how
we
do
that
through
engaging
with
with
Council
Partners
such
as
Yorkshire
water,
the
rivers,
trust,
Yorkshire,
Wildlife
trust
who
may
be
managing
different
Parcels
of
land
within
the
city.
F
Chair
I'm
a
bit
concerned
about
what
I've
heard
to
be
honest,
because
I
am
not
clear
as
to
whether
it
is
that
we
can
make
new
green
spaces,
whether
they,
whether
the
I
mean,
obviously,
if
you're,
making
new
green
spaces,
especially
in
the
inner
area,
then
there
should
be
an
element
of
Bio
diversity
within
that
I'm
not
saying
all
of
it
should
be
scrubbed,
but
a
part
of
it
should
go
towards
increasing.
F
You
know
that
that
net
gain
in
the
inner
area,
yeah
I'm
really
baffled
as
to
as
to
what
is
that
we're
doing
with
it
like?
F
Is
it?
Is
it
possible,
for
example,
to
to
I,
don't
know
why,
without
the
option
of
council
selling
on
on
paragraph
20.,
it's
important
to
realize
this
could
result
in
BNG
being
delivered
in
locations
completely
unconnected
to
the
impact
site,
including
outside
leads,
and
yet
officers
are
saying
that
there's
going
to
be
input
from
local
people
and
I'll,
tell
you
now,
people
in
their
any
in
an
area
are
not
going
to
be
up
for
that
at
all.
So
we
as
a
priority.
F
F
When,
when
we
were
on
City
plans
last
week,
it
came
up,
as
you
know,
chair
where
all
these
people
who
are
going
to
be
in
these
blocks,
where
are
they
going
to
go
to
have
a
picnic
and
be
with
nature?
You
know
like
I'm,
I'm
incredibly
concerned.
F
Very
useful
or
yeah
useful
to
to
make
it
so
that
that
local
people
can
have
have
input
when
there's
a
marketization
process.
F
Like
surely
surely,
if
there's
a
marketization
process,
then
it's
just
going
to
the
highest
slash
lowest
bidder
rather
than
talking
to
local
people,
to
ask
what
it
is
that
you
know
they
want
what
improvements
they
can
see
really
really
concerned.
Can
can
officers.
Please
give
me
some
reassurance
and
tell
me
what
it
is
that
I
need
to
do
and
who
I
need
to
write
to.
B
B
An
off-site
Green,
Space
or
on-site
Green
Space
will
still
happen
at
some
times
that
on
or
off-site
Green
Space
may
happen
and
coincide
with
biodiversity
Improvement,
and
it
might
be
within
our
best
interest
to
lay
out
and
design
a
green
space,
which
also
has
biodiverse
biodiverse
benefits,
but
not
always
so
it
it.
This
will
not
be
at
the
expense
of
space
for
recreation
and
green
space,
as
you
know
it
with
it
within
the
city.
It's
it's
a
separate
process
to
that.
But
this
is
the
government's
chosen
model
of
delivering
biodiversity,
recovery
and
Improvement.
B
It
is
the
government's
metric,
the
government
system
and
the
government
has
set
it
up
so
that
it
can
operate
entirely
through
the
private
Market.
The
city
council
need
not
get
involved
in
BNG
and
not
sell
units
at
all
if
it
were
to
choose
to
do
that,
it
would
lose
out
on
on
investment
and
income
streams
that
would
enable
it
to
improve
nature
on
selective
Parcels
of
land.
B
So
I
think,
what's
going
to
be
really
important
to
deal
with
the
concerns
you
have
councilor
Brooks.
Is
that
we're
really
clear
about
what
our
green
spaces
strategy
is
and
what
our
nature
conservation
strategy
is,
and
there
will
be
obviously
bits
of
that
that
overlap,
but
I,
think
Clarity
in
terms
of
what
we're
trying
to
achieve
through
both
of
those
is
going
to
be
important
as
we
as
we
move
through
this
process.
J
Yeah
I
mean
just
to
give
you
a
little
bit
more
reassurance.
Council
Brooks
I
think
the
process
that
Richard,
Martin
and
Victoria
have
described.
We
are
trying
to
intervene
in
a
system
which
is
sort
of
leaving
this
issue
to
the
market,
we're
trying
to
put
in
place
a
methodology
and
the
model
which
puts
the
council
in
the
driving
seat
to
enable
us
to
be
able
to
make
the
best
use
of
council
Assets
in
terms
of
open
space,
Green
Space
nature
areas.
J
So
it
is
a
given
that
we've
been
given
in
terms
of
the
the
act
and
what
it
sets
out,
but
I
think
the
initiative
will
be
taking
we're,
trying
to
be
Innovative
and
on
the
front
foot
for
the
council
in
terms
of
being
able
to
get
the
best
outcome
for
our
city
and
and
nature,
and
also
for
that
to
feed
into
the
wider
issues
around
the
climate
emergency
as
well.
Thank
you.
L
L
Is
that
correct?
So
this
is
a
whole
new
raft
of
BNG,
albeit
green,
or
whatever
yeah
and
just
momentarily.
Returning
to
my
theme
of
how
things
look,
the
Nature
Reserve
that
that
councilor
carlill
referred
to
actually
looks
beautiful
and
it's
a
lovely
walk
around.
But
it's
a
different
sort
of
beauty
and
I.
Think
that's
what
we
need
to
kind
of
communicate.
L
I
have
to
say
that
I
I
have
difficulty
living
with
our
relaxed,
moan
reservations
in
the
middle
of
the
road,
because
I
don't
think
they
look
attractive
but
I.
Suppose
if
you,
if
you
threw
a
few
wildflower
seeds
in
them,
it
might
take
on
a
different
perspective
and
I.
Think
there's
room
for
parks
and
planning
to
work
together
and
coming
up
with
strategies
to
make
things.
Look
better.
J
F
Brooks,
thank
you
yeah.
Is
it
possible
then,
because
BNG
is
completely
separate,
but
is
it?
Is
it
still
possible
to
put
together
something
that
squashes
BNG
in
with
that
section
106
side
of
things?
F
Well,
the
the
green
spaces
contribution
side
of
things,
oh
and
also
I've,
written
down
so
much
that
I
missed
it
earlier
sorry,
in
terms
of
the
inner
area,
especially
more
built
up
areas,
if,
if
BNG
can't
be
delivered
near
to
the
site,
would
it
be
possible
to
retrofit
green
Walls
and
green
roofs
onto
existing
buildings,
or
is
that
completely
outside
of
this?
Is
this
a
sort
of
Market
decides
type
of
thing,
or
is
this.
C
Yes,
thank
you
for
those
questions
again
yeah
regarding
the
section
106
issue,
because
this
is
a
whole
new
area.
Biodiversity
net
gain
it's
separate
to
Green
Space
contributions
in
section
106.,
it's
something
that
is
legally
required
after
November,
so
the
section
106
is,
if
anything's
been
delivered
off
site,
we'll
be
stating
how
many
biodiversity
units,
what
type
of
biodiversity
units
they
are
and
where
they're
being
delivered
and
that'll
be
intersection.
C
106,
there's
differences,
whether
it's
supplied
well
delivered
by
a
private
habitat
bank
or
if
it's
delivered
by
the
council,
but
it
will
always
be
the
same
principle.
It's
numbers
of
units,
it's
a
separate,
completely
separate
to
Green
space,
but
it
will
be
a
section
106
contribution
where
we're
selling
biodiversity
units,
as
a
council
we'll
also
be
developing
supplementary
planning
guidance
at
some
point.
So
the
policy
that
you
will
have
seen
to
do
with
bngs
policy
G9
has
got
quite
a
detailed
supporting
text
as
well,
because
this
is
a
new
area
of
work.
C
So
we
thought
it
really
important
to
make
it
really
clear
to
developers
what
our
expectations
are,
but
we
still
understand
that
we'll
need
supplementary
planning
guidance
that
can
go
into
more
detail
and
we'll
be
working
on
that
over
the
next
six
months
as
well.
To
add
more
detail
to
to
the
BNG.
A
colleague
wanted
to
come
back
on
that.
I
To
just
to
add
to
the
point:
that's
been
made
by
Richard
about
them
being
two
completely
separate
legal
obligations
and
when
it
relates
to
credits
that
we're
delivering
all
the
the
developers
is
also
an
obligation
to
make
sure
that
that
30-year
period
is
completely
contractually
and
legally
bound
as
well.
So
we
in
terms
of
our
monitoring
Duty,
will
make
sure
that
that's
contractually
delivered
and
for
that
entire
period
within
the
106.
C
And
just
coming
back
to
the
last
question,
I
think
we
had,
it
was
about
green
Walls
and
retrofitting
retrofitting
is
difficult
through
BNG
I
mean
what
we
need
to
know
before.
Determination
is
exactly
what
biodiversity
units
are
being
delivered
on
site
and
what's
being
delivered
off-site.
The
biodiversity
metric,
though,
does
include
green
Walls,
green
Rubes,
yeah
I
think
it
even
differentiates
between
green
roofs
and
extensive
and
intensive
types
of
green
roofs
to
understand
the
differences
for
biodiversity.
C
So
those
things
are
in
the
biodiversity
metric,
but
it
needs
to
be
known
before
determination
now
yeah,
that's
all
I'll
say
on
that
one.
It's
all
right.
A
Thanks
very
much
I've
also
got
a
few.
If
that's
okay,
I
think
for
me,
the
beauty,
conversation
or
the
beauty
comments,
it's
about
beauty
versus
utility
and
anything
is
beautiful
as
long
as
it's
serving
a
purpose
so
actually
being
able
to
make
it
really
clear
to
the
public
what
the
utility
of
these
areas
are
and
what
you
can
use
them
for
feels
really
important.
A
scrub
land,
for
example,
is
excellent
for
geocaching.
So
actually,
there
are
some
really
effective
uses
of
these
beautiful
habitats.
A
A
I
wanted
to
come
back
on
one
of
council
Carlo
and
also
at
councilor
Brooks
has
kind
of
touched
on
as
well.
In
terms
of
the
it
we've
talked
about
the
fact
that
the
biodiverse
diversity
units
that
are
taken
are
what
can
then
be
replaced
with
BNG
and
I.
Think
when
we're
talking
about
historical
loss,
I,
don't
think
we're
necessarily
talking
about
on
on
the
site.
A
A
Well,
that's
of
no
purpose
to
my
ward
because
there's
about
three
inches
to
put
a
tree
on,
whereas
actually,
if
we
can
think
out
of
the
box
and
do
like
for
like
habitat
units,
then
we
would
be
able
to
fit
different,
smaller
things
in
that
could
provide
that
increased
benefit
in
inner
city
Awards
as
well.
A
In
terms
of
this
being
a
bit
of
a
capitalist
dream,
are
we
looking
to
sell
these
units
outside
of
our
local
Authority,
no
shaking
heads
Doom,
so
that
might
be
a
little
income
stream?
Also,
who
decides
the
number
for
a
unit?
Do
we
have
a
dream
number
for
each
area
of
the
city
and
distribution
of
which
types
of
habitats
we
want
to
see
in
each
number
like
we
mapped
that
and
then.
Finally,
this
is
great
in
that
moment.
A
But
how
are
we
looking
to
then
support
the
succession
of
the
micro
ecosystems,
because
cancer
grown
was
absolutely
right?
You
could
throw
some
flower
seeds
at
it,
but
also
there's
no
succession.
There
it'll
die
very
immediately.
So
how
are
we
supporting
that
succession
and
are
we
when
we're
picking
where
these
units
go?
Are
we
really
thinking
about
what
what
things,
what
changes
are
coming
up?
That
could
impact
future
success
and
on
that
biodiversity?
That
could
stop
it
from
reaching
full
capacity
for
one
of
a
better
word
of
what
that
biodiverse
unit
could
give
thanks.
C
I
think
we're
starting
to
enter
into
the
philosophical
side
of
biodiversity
in
that
gain,
which
is
a
shame
we
probably
can't
dig
into
too
much
I
mean
it's.
The
biodiversity
metric
is
set
up
in
a
particular
way.
That's
beyond
air
control.
C
The
way
it
works
is
if
you're
losing,
like
Martin,
said
earlier.
Certain
types
of
habitat
units
on
site
more
recently
than
what
you're
describing
there'll,
be
a
requirement
to
replace
those
types
of
habitat
units
on
site
or
off-site,
or
a
combination
of
the
two.
It's
not
quite
as
simple
as
if
you
lose
grassland.
You've
got
to
replace
grassland.
C
What
the
metric
gives
you
is
an
incentive
for
a
higher
distinctiveness
habitat,
so
you
could
lose
a
type
of
grassland
provided
you're,
replacing
it
with
a
higher
distinctiveness
type
of
habitat,
provided
the
grassland
is
only
up
to
a
certain
level
of
value
anyway.
This
distinctiveness
bands
within
the
metric,
so
the
metric
is
a
very
complex
tool,
so
it
does
dictate
what
type
of
units
have
to
be
delivered
to
a
degree.
C
C
So
it's
I
also
don't
want
to
give
the
impression
that
you
can
achieve
little
tiny
bits
here
there
and
there
like
just
tiny
pockets
of
new
bits
of
habitat,
because
you've
got
to
put
this
on
the
national
sites
to
register
and
monitor
and
report
against
it
for
a
minimum
30-year
period.
So
it
is
better
off
being
in
medium
or
large
sized
areas
wherever
possible.
That's
just
the
the
way
it
would
work.
It
get
very
complicated
if
you've
got
very
small
areas
dotted
around
everywhere,
something
that
was
a
gist
of
what
you
were
asking
me.
C
But
is
there
anything
else
in
particular,.
A
You
yeah
I,
guess
the
key
one
that
you
didn't
touch
on
was
the
how
we're
going
to
support
succession
but
I.
Guess
if
we're
only
using
bigger
areas,
then
maybe
that
in
itself
means
that
monitoring
will
make
sure
that
that
is
supported
and
then
I
guess.
My
only
comment
would
be
that
from
your
replies.
It
sounds
like.
Actually
it
won't
be
overly
useful
for
the
inner
city
Awards
as
it
stands.
Is
that
misunderstood.
C
I
think
when
you're
talking
about
scale
and
area
of
habitats,
you
can
deliver
more
units
on
a
bigger
piece
of
land,
a
more
diversity
of
habitats.
It
can
still
be
done
on
a
relatively
small
scale,
so
it
just
depends
what
hectare
Edge?
What
area
you're
talking
about,
but
I
think
if
you're
getting
down
below
a
quarter
of
a
hectare,
it
starts
to
get
a
bit
more
difficult.
So
I
can
understand
what
you're
saying
in
relation
to
in
a
certain
areas
and
it's
the
size
of
land
available.
Isn't
it
really
yeah.
L
B
But
I
I
I
think
it's
a
fair
point.
No
sorry,
smarter!
That's
fine!
All
right!
You've
promoted
me!
It's
okay!
It!
It's
I,
think
what
I'd
like
to
see.
The
the
the
the
BNG
system
be
used
for
is
is
not
just
Parcels
of
land
but
linear
elements
of
land
as
well.
B
So
if
we
can
start
to
improve
sort
of
access
and
that's
a
particular
importance
in
the
inner
city,
where
we've
got
bits
of
green
infrastructure
that
that
are
maybe
broken
up
at
the
moment
and
how
we
can
look
to
sort
of
use,
some
of
this
investment
to
actually
plug
them
together,
not
just
for
the
movement
of
plants
and
animals
and
species
which
is
healthy
for
a
plant
and
an
animal
to
be
able
to
to
move
over
over
increased
distances,
but
also
then
lends
itself
to
to
human
access
as
well.
B
So
so
I
think
it
goes
back
to
the
sort
of
the
first
answer.
I
gave
really
around.
We
need
a
strategy
in
in
order
to
really
understand
how
to
deliver
this.
L
Do
you
think
we
could
work
on
an
inner
city
strategy?
I,
don't
mean
in
isolation
from
everything
that
we're
doing
overall,
but
colleagues
have
pointed
up
some
real
difficulties
about
being
a
city,
and
we
really
do
need
some
explicit
ways
of
tackling
that.
Don't
we
as
creatively
as
we
can
and
my
mind,
is
thinking
particularly
about
there
are
quite
a
number
of
out
of
control
or
messy
Gardens
on
some
of
our
Estates,
which
might
be
better
used
for
purposes
like
that
than
just
being
left
to
be
overgrown
in
more
haphazard
way.
B
B
Think
sure
there'll
be
there'll,
be
a
number
of
opportunities
we
might
want
to
start
with
the
river
and
the
river
Corridor,
because
that
offers
us
a
really
important
sort
of
set
area
that
that
really
has
become
quite
degraded
so
actually
in
terms
of
focusing
investment
in
in
the
river
and
and
on
the
banks
of
the
river
to
facilitate
nature,
but
also,
you
know,
facilitate
people
visiting
that
and
being
able
to
use.
B
I
think
we
do
need
to
you
know
as
we
go
on
we'll
have
an
eye
to
looking
at
how
this
plays
out
in
the
inner
city
and
the
priority
neighborhoods
in
particular,
because
otherwise
I
think
there
is
a
danger
that
it
will
be
seen
as
something
that's
only
going
to
benefit
those
areas
of
the
city
that
have
already
got
quite
good
access
to
Nature.
In
any
case,.
K
K
Now
that
does
mean
that
the
inner
areas
may
be
slightly
disadvantaged
because
technically
sort
of
the
sites
there
may
not
have
as
much
on
them.
So
I
think.
It
is
therefore
really
important
that
the
council
does
have
an
overarching
strategy
that
looks
at
where
sort
of
the
priorities
are
going
to
be
and
how
money
is
going
to
be
sort
of
directed
around
the
whole
district
and
not
just
sort
of
retained,
necessarily
within
individual
Awards.
L
B
L
I've
got
two
further
speakers,
but
Council
Cullen.
If
it's
on
the
immediate.
D
Point
yeah,
it's
very
short
on
that
yeah,
because
I
think
that
was
the
point.
I
was
getting
that
if,
if
I
purchased
a
bit
of
lamb
15
years
ago,
that
was
a
lovely
area
of
scrub,
with
trees,
with
hedgerows
with
everything
and
then
I
was
able
to
get
permission
in
some
way
to
concrete
over
the
whole
thing
were
I
to
make
an
application
on
that
lab.
Now,
my
understanding
is
exactly
that
that
I
would
have
to
provide
next
to
nothing
in
terms
of
biodiversity
Net
game.
D
D
It
could
end
up
really
enhancing
I
guess
that
Injustice
of
the
green
space
and
the
wildlife
habitat,
especially
if
we
focus
on
building
on
Brownfield
sites
where
they
might
have
to
do
nothing,
although
some
of
the
best
bits
will
be
scrub
that
has
just
been
left
there.
That
has
a
value
I
assume
if
you're
just
not
maintained
an
area
for
some
years
and
has
become
scrubbed,
then
that
has
a
value.
But
thank
you.
L
All
the
more
reason
to
think
about
in
inner
city
strategy,
isn't
it
really
so
councilman
McKenna.
E
Oh,
thank
you,
chair,
I,
keep
getting
drawn
to
part
of
graph
20
and
I,
find
it
totally
unacceptable.
Bng
being
delivered
in
locations
completely
unconnected
to
the
impact
site,
including
outside
leads
I,
find
that
really
difficult
I
mean
there's
no
doubt
about
any
Inner.
City
ward
is
there's
very
little
Queen
space,
but
we
do
have
a
canal
and
we
do
have
a
river
and
that's
very
helpful.
E
But
I
I
do
think
that
if
you,
if
you're
lucky
enough
to
be
able
to
for
a
house
in
the
outdoor
areas
in
or
in
the
dinner
areas,
you
will
have
a
garden
and
that's
the
nearest
you're
going
to
get
to
a
biodiversity.
But
if
you
buy
an
apartment
in
a
high-rise
and
there's
no
place
to
sit
outside
just
sit
with
the
kids
and
we've
had
this
discussion
several
times
in
many
places
you
know
somewhere
for
the
kids
to
sit
down
and
maybe
play
maybe
a
bit
of
play.
E
Equipment
I
think
it's
really
difficult
for
a
counselor
who
represents
the
industry
award
to
allow
that
to
happen
and
I
know
the
legislation
I
understand
that,
but
at
the
end
of
the
day,
we're
there
to
represent
our
community
and
my
question
really
apart
from
that,
is
off-site
option
and
it
says
on
the
Matrix
monitoring
obligations
on
Council
for
all
options.
You've
made
it
clear
that
only
money
available
to
do
that,
but
let
me
give
you
an
example
which
I'm
sure
that's
not
enough.
E
We
are
trying.
Army
councils
are
trying
desperately
to
have
a
playground
in
new
worldly,
it's
one
of
the
most
private
areas
in
the
country,
not
just
the
city
and
we're
trying
to
put
packages
of
money
together
from
all
sorts
of
things,
and
we
may
succeed,
but
we
got
I
was
going
to
say
ultimatum,
but
we've
got
a
direction
from
Parks
and
Countryside
or
whatever.
They
call
themselves
now,
tuja
that
we
have
to
provide
10
years
maintenance
for
that
playground.
E
Forty
thousand
pounds,
which
is
four
thousand
pounds
a
year
that
adds
very
substantial
costs.
Now.
My
question
is
back
to
the
Matrix
when
we
sell
them
off
per
unit.
Are
we
considering
future
maintenance?
In
that
way?
I
mean
it
wasn't
clear
from
speakers,
but
if
we
are,
we
should
be,
and
is
it
10
years
or
is
it
30
years
we're
talking
about
nature?
A
nature
reserve
I
think
that's
really
important.
E
If,
if
we
have
to
do
it
for
the
city
council,
the
city
council,
particularly
if
it's
on
Council
land
we'll
have
the
bills
for
maintaining
that
or
Evermore
I
guess,
hopefully,
Green
Space
will
be
able
to
know,
but
I
do
understand
that
we're
in
their
problems
with
global
warming
and
the
other
thing
a
good
point
made
by
Peter
regarding
nature
reserves.
E
It
would
really
be
nice
if
we
could
get
a
new
nature
reserve
and
to
me
that
would
be
the
type
of
thing
we
might
do
on
a
Westy
Orchard
basis
and
I
understand
the
complications.
But
if
we
could
do
that
and
get
a
Nature
Park,
we
would
require
stuff
like
a
ranger
wardens
people
to
maintain
it.
Is
that
all
included
in
there?
Because
if
there
isn't,
there
really
ought
to
be
well
I'll
leave
it
at
you.
L
Very
good
question
who
would
like
to
take
it
Richard.
C
Yeah
good
questions,
definitely
Council
councilor
McKenna,
the
first
one
I
think
it
was
more
of
a
statement
with
paragraph
20
you,
you
were
saying
that
you
wouldn't
want
a
system
that
relied
purely
on
the
private
Market,
which
would
result
in
it
being
delivered
outside
of
the
district
even
somewhere
else
in
the
country
yeah.
And
that's
not
what
we're
proposing
here
that
the
main
point
of
the
policy
for
BNG-
and
you
know
this
paper-
is
about
saying
we
are
wanting
to
enter
the
market
and
sell
biodiversity
units.
C
We've
been
doing
it
already
in
a
trial
test
case
running
up
to
November
and
we're
saying
we
want
to
carry
on
doing
it
after
November
I
think
everyone
here
has
said:
it's
really
important
that
we
do
because
by
bringing
in
the
council's
own
land,
we
can
try
and
make
it
more
local
to
the
impact
might
not
always
be
perfect,
but
it'd
be
a
lot
more
local
than
not
offering
it
at
all.
That's
the
key
point,
I
think
there.
C
The
second
point
was
about
monitoring
obligations.
I
think
you
mentioned,
and
yes,
it
would
be.
We'd
be
looking
to
monitor
all
the
units
delivered
on-site
and
off-site
regardless
of
who's
delivering
them.
You
know,
as
part
of
my
role,
would
want
to
be
doing
that,
whether
it's
a
private,
Market
or
another
part
of
the
council,
like
our
green
spaces
service,
you
know,
I'll
be
just
as
Vigilant
about
what
our
own
Council
part
of
the
service
is
delivering
units,
as
I
will
do
the
private
habitat,
Banks
I,
think
that's
an
important
point.
C
The
last
one
was
regarding
new
nature,
Reserves
and
a
30-year
kind
of
period
or
I
think
30-year
period.
As
previous
question
wasn't,
I
think
he
was
saying
you're,
hoping
that
the
cost
of
charging
is
for
the
full
30-year
period.
E
Yeah
future
maintenance
after
We've,
set
it
up
and
laid
it
out
where,
where
it's
manicured
alarms
or
its
group
land
yeah.
C
So
it
will,
it
will
yeah.
Thank
you
yeah,
so
the
the
on-site
delivery
of
biodiverse
to
you
and
its
will
be
for
30
years
done
through
planning
condition,
but
where
we're
selling
biodiversity
units
to
be
delivered
on
the
council
land
certainly
we'll
be
looking
at
the
full
30
years,
and
it's
the
all
of
that
maintenance
period.
But
it's
not
just
like
the
initial
habitat
creation.
Is
it
or
the
establishments
phase
it's
got
to
be
after
that,
and
the
legislation
is
stating
a
minimum
30-year
period.
C
So
we
we're
using
that
period
of
time
and
that's
what
the
biodiversity
unit
cost
is
based
upon
over
time.
I'm
sure
we'll
need
to
review
that
cost
and
see
whether
it
needs
to
be
changed.
But
that's
going
to
be
the
starting
point
anyway,
that
we're
setting
off
with
the
last
point
was
about
nature
reserves
and
new
nature
reserves.
It's
it's
an
issue
very
close
to
my
heart.
I
mean
you
look
in
Leeds
and
how
many
nature
reserves
do
we
have
and
where
are
they
I
think?
C
C
There's
all
kinds
out
there,
East
Keswick,
Wildlife
trust.
We
could
go
on.
There's
all
number
of
organizations
there
that
have
got
nature
reserves
that
have
got
elements
of
Public,
Access
I,
think
that's
what
we're
going
to
be
looking
towards
the
local
nature,
recovery
strategy
to
help
us
with,
and
that's
part
of
our
role
to
make
sure
the
biodiversity
priorities
do
include
not
just
investing
in
existing
nature
reserves,
making
them
bigger,
as
well
as
creating
completely
new
ones
and
creating
new
ones
of
all
different
sizes.
Look
at
Saint
Aidan's!
C
That's
nearly
400
hectares
of
wonderful
Wetland
of
national
level
importance
because
of
the
birds
that
are
there
and
the
public
enjoy
it.
Don't
they
they've
got
their
own
Facebook
page
to
do
with
some
Cadence,
but
that's
a
massive
thing:
isn't
it
400
hectares
we
can't
achieve
that
everywhere,
but
in
the
inner
city
center
areas,
maybe
we
should
be
aiming
for
one
or
two
hectares:
nature
reserves.
So
it's
part
of
our
overall
priorities.
I
think
Martin's
alluded
to
we've
got
to
think
about
and
how
we
set
those.
C
C
So
it
basically
said
every
part
of
the
country
should
have
one
hectare
of
local
nature,
reserve
per
thousand
population.
You
look
at
the
population
of
Leeds,
it's
780
000,
roughly,
and
we've
got
about
780
hectares
of
local
nature
reserve.
Yet
we
know
we've
still
got
problems,
don't
we!
So,
although
we're
meeting
that
National
Target,
we
maybe
need
to
be
more
ambitious
than
that
and
also
look
at
areas
where
we
haven't
got
local
nature
reserves
that
should
have
them
I'm.
So
all
I'm
saying
is
biodiversity.
C
E
I
I
think
could
be
helpful
if
we
re-roll
paragraph
20
and
take
that
out.
It
offends
my
eye
I
think
anybody
else
who
would
read
that
would
feel
the
same
way.
I'm
sure
we
could
find
a
different
way
of
saying
that
and
I'm
glad
you
mentioned
Saint
Aidan's
I
used
to
be
chair
of
the
management
committee
there.
Many
many
years
ago
when
I
was
chair
of
planning
in
the
mid
90s
and
in
fact,
I
authorized
a
dragline
to
be
purchased
from
from
America.
E
You
know,
and
I
spent
a
lot
of
time
there
when
the
river
was
breached
and
it
flooded
and
it
became
the
deepest
lake
lake
in
England.
But
it's
it's
an
area,
that's
very
close
to
my
heart
but
and
like,
unfortunately,
it's
not
accessible
to
people
who
live
in
armley.
L
Okay,
thanks
for
that,
Jim
I'll
take
councilor
actale
next,
if
I
may.
M
Okay,
chair
so
much
has
been
said
since
I
raised
my
my
hand
and
and
all
vital
points,
especially
what
comes
to
Brooks
and
comes
from
Canada.
You
just
mentioned
about
the
section
20
of
the
of
the
report.
M
I
can
think
back
when
there
was
an
issue
in
in
our
neck
of
the
world
about
four
or
five
years
ago,
mature
trees,
piece
of
land
very
little
spaces
that
we
have
and
that
land
was
going
to
develop
for
17-story
high
building
and
that
that
is
worrying
for
local
residents
and
also
for
local
councilors
and
and
talking
about
the
Nature
Reserve.
We've
got
one
in
our
part
of
the
city
which,
which
is
a
well-kept
well
maintained
by
by
the
volunteers.
M
M
Remember
when
I
was
a
counselor
back
in
day
and
I
I
remember
going
on
onto
those
sites
and
how
attractive
it
was
for
local
residents,
and
at
that
time
the
the
council
was
trying
to
push
it
for
the
housing
and
it
was
obviously
it
was
campaigned
to
to
stop.
But
obviously
people
do
have
a
passion
about
the
Open,
Spaces
and
and
some
of
the
woodlands
that
we
are
all
proud
of.
M
You
know
going
in
any
direction
from
Central
within
three
miles
two
miles
we
see
so
many
naturally
protected
lands
which
obviously,
which
we
are
proud
of
anything
that
we
can
do
and
and
I
agree
with
cancer
McKenna.
If
you
can
revisit
the
the
the
section
20
of
the
report,
that's
something
I'll
feel
more
comfortable.
L
Thank
you.
Would
any
officers
like
to
comment
on
that
contribution?
I
think
it
was
a
very
clearly
expressed
view.
Jared
I
would
add
this
as
well
as
taking
out
the
wording
of
parrot
20
or
changing
it
that
you
might
want
to
add
in
some
more
words
of
explanation
around
some
of
the
points
that
have
come
up
this
afternoon,
just
so
that
that
you
sort
of
learn
through
these
discussions.
What
people
understand
councilor
Hayden
did
I
see
you
indicate
yeah.
N
Okay,
yeah,
no
I'm,
fine,
just
some
I
think
question
paragraph
20
I,
don't
think
we
should
take
it
out.
It's
the
truth.
I
mean
that's
what
the
government
has
set
up,
that
if
we
didn't
get
involved,
this
could
be
entirely
run
by
the
private
market
and
any
of
this
Net
game
might
not
be
in
Leeds
at
all.
That
is
that
is
the
truth.
I
think.
Maybe
it
needs
to
be
a
bit
explicit
about
what
we're
dealing
with
here,
because
I
don't
want.
N
So
it's
it's
really,
but
maybe
it
needs
that
greater
explanation
that
this
is
not
our
model.
We
are
trying
to
work
with
a
model
that
has
been
given
to
us
and
get
the
best
out
of
it
that
we
can
get
for
leads
I'm,
very
yeah.
We
need
corridors
Martin's,
absolutely
right.
N
There
is
no
point
well,
there's
very
little
Point
unless
you're
only
wanting
flying
things
to
have
pockets
of
land
given
over
divided
biodiversity,
because
animals
will
get
killed
on
roads,
and
you
know,
and
I
often
look
at
the
roundabout
near
Sainsbury's
near
the
motorway,
where
I
am
in
Colton
and
it's
in
Holton,
sorry
and
near
Colton
and
I.
Think
well,
if
any
rabbit
wanted
to
come
off
that
Island
they'd
be
squished
within
seconds.
So
we
need
corridors
and
that's
what
the
the
the
in
the
outer
Ring
Road
gives
us
and
yeah.
N
N
N
Nettles
are
fantastic
because
certain
species
of
butterflies
only
lay
their
eggs
and
their
their
caterpillars
developed
on
the
underside
of
metal
of
metal
leaves.
We
might
not
like
the
look
of
nettles
They
Might
Sting
us,
but
they
are
very,
very
good
for
biodiversity.
So
I
love
our
outer
ring.
Well,
they
are
corridors
of
it's
a
corridor
of
complete
and
we're
letting
nature
dictate
we're
not
saying
it
should
be
that
flower
there.
It
should
be
those
you
know.
It
should
be
that
tree.
N
We're
letting
nature
dictate
what
the
what
the
soil
and
will
withstand
what
the
the
light
will
will
want
and
what
actually
nature
needs
and
I'm
really.
You
know
when
an
owl
on
the
outer
Ring
Road,
nearly
in
in
Colton,
again
nearly
flew
into
our
car
and
I'm
glad.
My
sister
was
with
me
because
I
could
have
been
making
it
up
and
hallucinating.
That's
the
first
time
I've
ever
seen,
an
owl
in
East
leads
and
I
hear
them
quite
often
now,
and
that
is
down
to
the
the
relaxed
mowing
on
the
on
the
outer
Ring
Road.
N
So
we
might
not
like
the
look
of
it,
but
it
is
biodiversity.
Net
gain
and
I.
I
do
apologize
to
my
colleagues
like
along
here,
because
I
live
in
a
ward
with
incredibly
deprived
neighborhood,
but
in
running
through
the
middle
of
it
it's
got
a
nature
reserve
and
it's
walking
distance
to
one
of
our
great
city
parks,
so
we're
incredibly
Lucky
in
Temple
Newsome
and
the
Nature
Reserve.
That
goes
along
the
way
back
and
using
that
blue
infrastructure.
I
think
is
really
really
important,
especially
in
the
city
center.
N
B
So
it
was
just
to
say
really
that
I'm
really
pleased
that
we
brought
this
paper
here
today,
because
we've
got
some
really
good
initial
feedback
that
we
can
then
use
to
to
to
to
improve
the
payment
as
it
goes
through
to
exec
board.
So
when
it
comes
back
to
DPP
in
September,
hopefully
we'll
see
more
in
there
about
the
inner
city
about
the
intent
of
how
we're
going
to
use
BNG.
B
What
I
will
say
is
this
is
the
start
of
a
journey
and
we're
getting
ourselves
geared
up
to
be
able
to
engage
in
the
BNG
Market.
We
won't
have
all
the
answers
in
September
and
I
think
there's
a
wider
Council
conversation
that
we'll
need
to
be
very
closely
engaged
in
around
that
strategy
and
around
what
that
looks
like
and
I
think
the
spend
of
BNG
monies
is
going
to
help
stimulate
that
that
conversation
and
and
I
can
try
and
reflect
that
within
the
report.
That
goes
to
Executive
board.
Thank
you.
L
G
Was
going
to
come
back
in
again
on
paragraph
20
and
also
paragraph
five
on
page
23
as
well,
because
I
recently
had
a
conversation
about
a
year
ago
with
a
major
developer,
who
was
wanting
to
build
my
area
and
I
asked
them
about
work
that
they
could
do
to
improve
the
biodiversity?
Their
answer
was
well
we're
one
of
the
major
Builders
we're
doing
a
lot
of
work
down
in
the
south
of
England
and
that's
where
we're
putting
our
biodiversity
right
or
wrongly.
So
what
what's
my
solution
to
that
is?
G
Do
we
can
we
condition
that
Leeds
gets
the
first
chance
to
supply
the
biodiversity
needs,
so,
in
other
words,
the
first
Port
of
Call
is:
have
we
got
a
piece
of
land
that
we
are
using?
Can
we
condition
it
that
we
get
the
first
choice
or
any
land
that
we've
bought
some
credits?
For?
Can
we
condition
that
so
that
we
don't
end
up
with
a
developer,
claiming
that
down
in
tonbridge
Wells
to
court
case
yeah,
but
the,
but
the
part,
the
principle
that
she's
making
is
correct
that
down
in
the
south
of
the
country?
G
Maybe
where
it
goes?
It's
the
principle,
not
the
nitpicking
over
there.
So
is
there
anything
we
can
do
or
our,
or
is
this
again
something
that
we're
we've
been
gifted
by
the
government
and
we've
got
to
meet
the
best
we
can
or
do
we
have
the
flexibility
when
you
come
back
in
September
to
say
first
Port
of
Call
is
leads.
Second
Port
of
Call
is
I
asked
if
we've
we've
bought
any
credits,
because
it
worries
me
and
it's
fine
in
my
word.
Yes,
if
something's
built,
we
will
get
something.
G
I
mean,
let's
be
honest
with
that,
but
I
would
argue.
A
lot
of
my
residents
would
argue
that
even
a
10
uplift
isn't
enough
to
make
good
for
what
they
perceive
to
be
the
loss
because
trying
to
explain
to
some
residents
I'm
against
the
Hayden
just
explained
about
the
grass
that
there
is
a
perception,
it's
untidy,
it's
not
what
they
want
and
it's
how
and
our
role
is
to
get
that
message
over
and
it's
how
we
do
that.
So
that's
a
bit
longer
than
I
anticipated,
but
it
just
Richard.
C
Yeah
I
mean
the
main
point
of
the
policy
for
BNG.
It's
a
brand
new
policy
it
specifies
in
there.
If
off-site
BNG
is
going
to
be
delivered,
we
we
State
four
areas.
It
should
be
delivered.
We
don't
include
the
south
of
England.
We
include
you
know,
as
per
paragraph
22,
there's
four
points
in
there
that
policy
wise
off-site
will
have
to
comply
with
that's
all
within
the
district.
C
We
will
be
considering
whether
Watercourse
biodiversity
units
get
delivered
slightly
more
widely
because
they're
more
strategic
through
the
environment
agency,
water,
catchments
to
don't
stop
at
political
boundaries,
but
from
a
habitat
biodiversity
point
of
view.
We
do
state
in
that
policy.
Those
four
points,
so
that
is
within
the
same
district
and
it
also
says
locally
as
much
as
possible.
So
I
think
we
should
be
okay.
On
that
point,
that's
pretty
much
partly
why
we've
wrote
the
policy
the.
I
I
mean
can
I
can
I
just
come
in
as
well.
Just
during
that
interim
period,
there
might
be
a
period
of
some
fluid
application
in
relation
to
that
in
applying
a
condition,
you
know
what
the
legal
test
is.
That
still
applies.
So
as
long
as
the
policy
is
in
place,
we
can
legitimately
apply
that
condition.
There's
a
bit
of
a
gap
in
between
that
period.
We
may
have
some
difficulty
there,
but
what
I
expect
on
on
this?
I
The
conditionality
is
a
lot
of
appeals
going
through
and
case
law
arising
from
it,
because
this
has
been
government-led
and
the
legislation
is
framed
in
a
particular
way.
So
I
can
see
local
authorities
quite
rightly
challenging
this
I'm
not
advocating
this
by
any
means,
but
it
will
give
us
a
pathway
of
what's
Happening
across
the
country
and
we
can
refine
our
our
position
and
apply
those
conditions
legitimately,
but
I
think
whilst
we're
on
this
pathway
and
we're
on
this
trajectory
I
think
it's
important
to
see
what
other
authorities
are
doing
as
well.
L
D
I
can't
one
of
mine
was
on
a
similar
point,
which
was
the
risk
of
a
large
housing
developer,
saying
well,
we've
got
a
woodland
here
and
every
development
we
build
in
the
country
we're
going
to
improve
this
one
Woodlands
we've
built
in
dunbridge
Wells
chipping
Norton,
wherever
you
might
decide
to
to
put
the
other
point
thinking
about
it.
Just
a
completely
separate
point
is
then
on
this
being
a
market
and
thus
then
wanting
to
be
a
player
in
the
market.
D
What
conversations
have
we
had
around
the
other
public
services
with
significant
land
ownership
in
the
district
Yorkshire
water
CRT,
the
ones
that
come
to
mind,
Network
rail,
maybe
another
that?
Obviously
we
don't
want
to
go
in
competition
against
Yorkshire
water
selling.
D
These
points
putting
being
a
player
in
that
market
May
mean
we
have
the
most
diverse
amount
of
habitats
available
to
us
and
being
in
a
partnership
with
all
these
other
public
sector
landowners
May
mean
that
when
somebody
has
to
replace
a
likely
unit,
we
have
something
nearby
ready
to
offer
and
to
use
them.
So
what
conversations
we
had
to
ensure
that
Yorkshire
water
aren't
going
to
set
up
exactly
the
same
and
start
selling
their
bits
of
land
alongside
ours.
C
Yeah
I
suppose,
ultimately,
we've
got
no
control
over
Yorkshire
water
if
they
want
to
go
ahead
and
set
up
their
own
habitat
bank,
but
we
have
been
in
discussion
with
them.
I
mean
one
of
the
things
we're
in
the
process
of
doing
is
setting
up.
What's
called
a
matchmaking
map,
we're
trying
to
produce
an
interactive
map
that
developers
can
see
early
doors
before
they
even
submit
a
planning
application
that
shows
potential
sites
where
they
could
deliver
their
off-site
biodiversity
units.
C
That's
effectively
trying
to
start
that
conversation
really
early
between
developers
and
wherever
it
might
be
ultimately
delivered.
As
part
of
that
process,
we
have
been
talking
to
Yorkshire,
Wildlife
Trust
and
the
rspb
to
see
and
actually
Yorkshire
water
to
see
whether
they
want
to
feature
their
land
on
that
map
as
well.
So
we
have
started
some
of
those
conversations
regarding
Network,
Rail
and
Canal
Rivers
trust.
We
haven't
had
that
conversation
with
them
yet,
but
I
think
it's
very
important.
We
start
this
process
off
looking
at
our
own
land
and
immediate,
like-minded
Partners.
C
F
Thank
you,
chair
yeah,
just
going
back
to
paragraph
22,
it's
saying
the
the
units
should
be
well,
it's
it's
these
four
four
places,
but
there's
mention
of
Leeds
habitat
Network
I'm,
just
wondering
in
terms
of
the
existing
network.
But
then,
where
where's
been
identified,
to
increase
that
and
have
you
got
a
map
available
with
all
of
that
on.
C
Yep
good
point
I
mean
we've:
it's
called
the
natural
environment
map
on
one
of
our
web
pages.
It's
the
biodiversity
and
planning
web
page.
So
there's
a
natural
environment
map
hosted
on
there,
which
then
shows
the
Leeds
habitat
Network.
C
F
Yeah
so
I
mean
it's
it's
basically
that
works
on
going
with
that.
Isn't
it
because
I
mean
like
I've
managed
to
get
it
up?
I
can't
see
that
there's
that
much
to,
for
example,
connect
the
oh,
what
you
call
it
mean
we're
Trail
up
with
the
rest
of
the
city.
F
I,
don't
I'm
not
entirely
sure
how
we
go
about
doing
that,
but
there
is,
like
you
know,
a
little
stream
that
runs
through
there.
That
could
be
looked
at
so
yeah
like
it's.
Concerning
that
sites
haven't
already
been
identified,
that
can
that
can
mean
that
these
these
units
can
be
used
in
the
area
where
the
majority
of
the
development
is
coming
forward.
L
L
Okay,
so
thank
you
very
much
for
all
your
contributions
on
that
and
it
I
think
the
quality
of
debate
reflects
the
importance
of
the
content
of
this
paper.
I
think
it's
good
that
it's
come
to
DPP
at
this
point,
but
clearly
there'll
be
many
more
iterations
for
us
to
discuss.
Have
you
any
idea
Martin
when,
when
we
will
be
visiting
this
subject
again,.
B
So
so
chair,
subject
to
Toby
emailing
around
we're
looking
at
changing
the
next
DPP
date,
which
I
think
was
earmarked
in
September
after
executive
board
and
I.
Think
we
do
need
that
to
be
before
executive
board,
because
we've
got
some
executive
board
items
to
be
considered
at
DPP.
So
the
suggestion
is
we
have
that
on
Tuesday,
the
19th
of
September
for
the
exec
bot
on
Wednesday,
the
20th
of
September.
So
this
item
would
come
back
to
that
Tuesday,
19th
September
meeting.
L
That's
fine
and
hopefully
people
will
be
able
to
adjust
to
that
date.
At
this
point,
that's
good.
Thank
you
very
much
so
can
I.
Thank
you
all
for
a
really
very
good
debate
on
that
area.
Thank
you
for
your
contributions.
We'll
now
have
a
five
minute
break
and
return
for
the
workshop.
If
you're
able
to
do
that,
thank
you
very
much.
Everybody.