►
Description
Learn more about how DeFi is evolving around the world: Jocelyn and Maria (Community Leads in APAC and Europe at Maker Foundation) hosted a panel with two interesting guests working in the DeFi space, living in two different countries and managing diverse communities: Sai Teja (Smart Contract developer at Nuo and Founder of Just DeFi) and Harith Kamarul (Community & Education at Etherscan and Organizer of ETHKL).
They shared their knowledge, experiences, and visions with us!
A
B
A
C
D
A
I
think
we
can
start
so
we
are
going
through
a
very
I
mean
easy
to
follow,
interview
and
panel
and
the
the
interview
will
be
divided
as
last
time.
In
basically
two
parts,
the
the
first
part
will
be
which
will
be
about
personal
personal
background,
and
I
will
give
make
you
guys
some
personal
questions
and
then
the
second
part
we
will
go
through
the
the
topic
with
a
bit
more
focused
questions.
So
the
first
question
for
you
guys,
is
this:
what
is
your
favorite
motivational
quote?.
C
Yeah
yeah,
so
my
favorite
quote
is
like
from
abdul
kalam,
so
he
he
he
used
to
say
that
like
keep
constantly
acquiring
knowledge,
okay,
so
this
is
also
applicable
in
the
d5
space.
So
you
need
to
be
very
constantly
acquiring
knowledge
what
happening
in
this
space
completely.
So
now,
if
you
can
see
at
the
scenario
of
informing,
so
you
need
to
be
in
very
keen
to
know
knowledge
about.
What's
it
farming
and
daily,
there
are
new
updates
on
the
d5
space.
D
For
me,
I
think
I'll,
just
quote,
or
paraphrase
my
dad
basically
saying
you
know
just
focus
on
giving
or
contributing
and
the
world
will
find
a
way
to
give
back
to
you,
especially
as
a
community
organizer.
Sometimes
it
can
be
a
bit
tough
to
keep
on
giving,
but
you
do
that
and
you'll
find
new
doors
open
for
you
over
time.
A
C
So
our
our
next
goal,
so
I
run
a
d5
community
called
just
d5
so
now
like
d5
space,
is
very
naive
and
it's
very
restricted.
So
I
want
to
take
this
space
to
centralized
finance
space
and
get
introduced
d5
to
the
centralized
finance
users,
so
that
like
they
will
also
be
very
much
knowledgeable
about
what
is
defined.
They
get
hands-on
in
this
space
and
my
second
aim
would
be
for
the
long
term,
so
I
recently
got
a
grant
from
away
protocol
for
building
a
decentralized
limit
order
platform.
D
And
yeah
for
me
I
guess
I'll
share
more
on
like
on
the
community
side,
so
for
the
ethereum
military
committee.
I
think
I'd
like
to
get
more
young
people
more
students
onto
the
blue
pill
of
cryptocurrency
and
g5
and
be
able
to
create
community
use
cases
or
build
community
products
that
actually
add
value
to
the
space.
A
A
C
C
D
Thanks
and
on
my
end,
I'll
guess
I'll
not
make
it
too
long,
but
so
I
came
from
the
sort
of
traditional
finance
space.
I
worked
in
a
corporate
insurance
company
and
like
within
a
very
short
time.
I
realized
you
just
see
from
the
inside
that
you
know
it's
not
it's
not
designed
to
help
the
most
people.
It's
designed
to
help
the
people
who
already
have
money,
and
so
I
started
looking
for
a
way
out.
I
joined
a
fintech
company
that
wanted
to
serve.
D
You
know,
bank,
the
unbanked,
and
so
they
were
building
with
a
blockchain
back
end.
Eventually
they
got
caught
in
the
ico
high.
So
I
was
one
of
the
people
that
worked
on
an
ico
for
that
company,
so
I
went
through
the
both
the
highs
and
the
lows
of
being
part
of
an
ico
project
and
I
started
creating
the
ethereum
malaysia
group
in
2018,
and
the
idea
was
at
that
time.
It
was
at
the
peak
of
the
bubble.
D
You'd
have
like
a
couple
meet-ups
at
least
a
week
in
malaysia,
but
the
vast
majority
of
them
or
pretty
much
all
of
them
were
just
about.
You
know
price.
Go
up
or
buy
into
the
next
ico
and
we
wanted
to
create
like
a
space
for
people
to
either
focus
on
building
or
learning
or
just
like
understanding
things
like
governance,
crypto
economics,
so
just
learning
more
about
how
the
things
work
and
how
we
can
apply
that
to
the
real
world.
A
We
can
start
with
like
to
focus
a
bit
more
about
about
this.
So
the
first
question
I
would
like
to
to
ask
to
both
of
you
is
this,
so
how
is
to
give
a
little
bit
of
background?
How
is
the
the
current
financial
situation
in
your
region
and
what
is
the
defy
situation
and
if
the
defy
would
be
helpful
there?
So
if
you
can
start
a
psy,
it's
interesting
to
yes,.
C
Yeah,
so
the
current
financial
system
is
is
good
when
it
comes
to
india,
but
you
know
around
2017.
There
was
a
ban
on
cryptocurrencies
in
india,
but
recently
supreme
court
of
india,
like
made
a
statement
that
you
can
now
trade
cryptocurrencies
and
it's
completely
illegal
to
to
have
cryptocurrencies
and
trade
cryptocurrencies.
C
B
Tell
something
yeah
I
I
actually
want
to
add
to
to
what
psy
was
saying,
because
I
also
remember
vaguely
there
was
one
point
of
time
right
where
india
started
sort
of,
like
you
know,
phase
out
their
old
currency,
and
then
people
were
like
queuing.
You
know
all
outside
the
banks
trying
to
withdraw
all
the
cash
and
then,
at
one
point
of
time
there
were
no
enough
cash
and
stuff
like
that.
B
I
guess
that
sort
of,
like
you
know,
pushed
you
know
the
the
the
whole
hard
cash
issues
into
digital
currency
adoption
as
well
in
india.
So
I
okay.
I
know
that
this
is
not
part
of
the
list
of
the
questions.
So
how
do
you
see?
You
know
like
india
itself
as
a
nation
adopting
digital
currency
like?
Are
they
already?
I
mean
I
see
a
lot
of
digital
payments
out
there
in
india
is.
This?
C
Yeah
so
like
yes,
governments
are
working
on
like
there
are
many
drafts
going
on
in
terms
of
like
bringing
a
digital
currency.
There
are
many,
you
know,
lawyers
working
on
it,
but
I
still
don't
feel
that
it's
still
in
early
stages,
so
there
must
be
a
lot
of
regulations
coming
out
in
the
initial
stages,
then,
like,
let's
see
like
what
happens,
moving
forward.
D
Actually,
I
was
going
to
ask
sai
as
well
while
we're
on
the
topic,
so
I've
heard
a
lot
about
how
in
india
there's
this
aadhar
identity,
I'm
not
sure
if
I'm
pronouncing
it
right,
but
like
a
identity
card
and
how,
because
it
has
biometrics,
it
can
be
useful
for
digitization
of
finance.
Is
that
real
or
is
it
hype.
C
Yeah,
so
at
this
point
there
is
no
such
product
like
we,
where
you
can
just
use
other
and
get
started
with
investing
into
d5
but
yeah.
So
there
are
many
technical
terms
that
you
need
to
understand
before
getting
started
into
d5.
So
there
are
there.
There
should
be
a
lot
of
education
among
the
users
to
get
started
with
d5.
As
of
now.
B
A
D
Yeah,
so
in
malaysia
in
general,
I
think
there
is,
I
guess
it
probably
applies
in
a
lot
of
other
countries
as
like
the
people
who
are
in
the
middle
and
upper
class
and
people
in
the
lower
income
group.
So
for
the
middle
class
work,
I
think,
there's
a
lot
more
adoption
of
fintech
in
general.
So
when
I
was
working
on
detecting
maybe
about
four
years
ago,
there
was
a
lot
less
sort
of
awareness
of
your
options
to
buy
like
a
robo
advisor
or,
basically
anything
technology
related
with
finance.
D
In
the
last
couple
years,
we've
seen
a
lot
more,
so
we
even
have
three
fully
licensed
exchanges
now
to
buy
cryptocurrency
and
a
number
of
robot
advisors
and
equity
crowdfunding.
So
I
think,
within
that
group,
there's
more
adoption.
There's
definitely
still
a
lot
of
space
to
for
cryptocurrency
to
be
widely
adopted.
I
think,
and
d5
is
an
even
smaller
space
from
that,
so
that
it's
still
definitely
like
a
niche
group.
D
One
issue
that
we
have
in
malaysia
is
that
there
is
this.
I
mean
I,
I
don't
really
like
saying
it,
but
it's
a
real
perception
that
there
are
a
lot
of
scams
going
on,
which
is
one
of
the
reasons
we
wanted
to
start
a
education
based
group
in
the
first
place,
who
sort
of
combat
that
miseducation
that's
going
on.
So
there
are
a
number
of
people
who
would
associate
bitcoin
or
cryptocurrency
with
scams,
so
that
needs
to
be
solved
but
yeah.
D
So
I
think
over
even
the
last
few
months
we've
been
getting
there
the
head
of
our
largest
licensed
exchange
luno.
They
does
that
in
the
last
few
months
since
the
whole
lockdown
started
in
malaysia,
there's
actually
been
a
lot
of
registrations
on
their
exchange
that
they
haven't
been
able
to
catch
up
like
the
amount
of
signups
of
people
like
trying
to
do
their
submitting
their
kyc
documents
are
coming
in
much
faster
than
they
can
sort
of
go
through
and
improve.
D
So
that's
a
good
sign
and
probably
g5
will
come
after
people
are
familiar
with
crypto
for
the
lower
income
group.
There
is
this.
Our
central
bank
came
up
with
this
statistic
in
the
last
couple
years
that
75
percent
of
malaysians
can't
come
up
with
a
thousand
ringgit,
which
is
about
200
plus
usd
in
the
event
of
an
emergency.
So
there's
still
that
group,
which
I
think
neither
crypto
or
defy
or
even
fintech
in
general,
are
addressing
their
problems
yet.
C
D
D
They
just
say
you
know,
put
it
with
me
and
I'll,
give
you
10
a
month
or
a
week
or
or
something
like
that,
whereas
when
you
want
to
go
as
a
community
and
tell
people
that
you
know
what
is
a
wallet
and
how
you
know,
your
wallet
is
different
than
an
exchange
and
people
need
to
like
sit
down
and
go
through
all
that
stuff
and
understand.
You
know
what
money
is
and
how
decentralized
money
is
different
than
fiat
money.
It's.
D
It
takes
a
little
a
bit
more
work,
so
the
incentives
are
for
people
to
kind
of
like
go
for
the
quick
win
yeah.
So
so
we
we
try
and
do
at
least
monthly
meetups.
I
try
and
go
into
universities
or
like
offices
of
corporate
or
government
agencies
and
just
try
and
kind
of
share
some
basic
blockchain
one-on-one
as
much
as
possible,
but
yeah
there's
still
a
lot
a
long
way
to
go.
C
But
when
it
comes
to
centralized
finances,
then
you
are
trusting
the
centralized
authority
to
to
withhold
your
funds
and
yeah
everything
in
in
that
scenario,
but
yeah.
So
the
centralized
finance
actually
is
providing
a
sophisticated
way
to
you
know,
store
their
funds
and
providing
like
much
like
weight.
Double
then
leverage
what
decentralized
finance
platform
provides
and
yeah.
So
this
might
be
the
reason
like
why
users
are
you
know,
trying
to
leverage,
centralized
exchanges
or
the
decentralized
finance
space
protocols.
D
D
D
Then
the
people
who
are
you
know
a
lot
of
them
are
just
like
leaving
their
own
exchange.
There
is
within
that
smaller
subset,
though
a
bunch
of
people
who
are
very
knowledgeable
about
define.
For
example,
we
have
the
coin
gecko
people
who
are
based
here,
and
they
are
some
of
the
most
flued
in
on
defy,
even
I
think
in
the
whole
world
with
the
whole
yield
farming
thing
that
happened
in
the
last
few
weeks.
D
D
Of
people
who
responded
said
that
they're
they
either
do
it
all
the
time
or
they've
at
least
transacted
on
d5,
maybe
once
every
few
weeks
or
months,
30
said
that
they're
either
not
sure
what
nephi
is
or
just
not
interested.
So
I
would
say
within
the
subset
of
people
who
are
familiar
with
how
crypto
actually
works.
There's
there's
been
quite
a
lot
of
interest
in
two
different.
A
A
Is
sorry
from
the
public,
which
is
exactly
what
I
just
mentioned
so
they
asked.
Can
we
talk
about
the
ux
side
of
defy
it's
perhaps
the
biggest
challenge
to
adoption
of
the
crypto?
It's
it's
exactly
what
I
just
I
just
said
so
I
mean
I
don't
know
how
much
you
guys
know
about
ux,
but
you
you
would
agree
that
this
is
the
main
barrier
now
to
to
entry,
if
especially
for
for
for
people
who
are
already
in
crypto
space,
but
they
prefer
cfi
because
it's
easier
to
use
in
the
end.
C
And
yeah,
so
I
want
to
just
add
a
few
points
on
the
ux
side.
So
very
last,
you
know
from
past
six
to
seven
months,
so
there
are
a
lot
of
protocols.
You
know
coming
into
this
d5
space
trying
to
improve
the
ux.
So
let's,
let's
take
the
example
of
a
few
protocols
that
came
into
existence
recently,
like
formatic
formatting
wallet
for
these,
so
these
guys
are
trying
to
solve.
You
know
where
user
name
not
to
you
know
create
any
wallet.
You
can
just.
B
C
B
Yeah
yeah,
I
mean
like
there's
already
a
very
user
friendly,
all
in
one
d5
wallet
that
I
usually
recommend
to
beginners
it's
arjun
yeah.
I
mean
they
have
very
slick
user
interface
where
you
know
which
is
almost
similar
to
whatever
banking
apps
that
you
use
out
there.
So
you
know
I
mean
it
gives
you
that
familiarity
when
you
actually
sign
up
register
for
an
account
and
then
so
I
think
that
helps
a
lot
too
yeah,
I'm
busy
you
know
like.
B
A
Yeah,
I
think
that
from
the
the
year
I
I
joined
the
space
two
years
ago,
and
I
mean
I
saw
a
lot
of
improvement
and
very
fast
improvement
in
ux,
because
when
I
joined
it
was
completely
I
mean
I
didn't
understand
anything
basically
about
the
d5
pro.
There
were
a
few
different
projects,
but-
and
now
argent
I
mean
also
wallets-
are
super
user
friendly
there's
a
a
very
similar
as
justin
say
it's
very.
They
are
very
you
know
similar
to,
for
example,
revolut
or
paper.
A
C
Important
thing
is
so:
the
meta
transactions
are
playing
very
keen
role
when
it
comes
to
onboarding
the
users
right.
So
each
and
every
time
when
you
need
to
deposit
some
funds
or
like
borrow
some
funds,
you
need
to
pay
gas
fee
on
the
ethereum
network,
but
meta
transactions
help
you
a
lot
to
make
the
user
experience
very
easy,
so
protocol
will
take
the
risk
of
you
know,
providing
the
meta
transactions
for
the
users.
So
protocols
will
just
pay
like
whatever
the
gas
associated
with
that
particular
transactions
to
the
us.
So.
C
B
Yeah
because
yeah
I
mean,
I
think
the
last
thing
that
we
want
is
that
we
onboard
new
users
and
they'll
be
like
trying
to
figure
out.
Oh
how
come
this
transaction
doesn't
go
through.
Oh
actu,
because
I
do
not
have
in
my
wallet
and
then
and
then
they
need
to
actually
go
to
the
exchanges
and
then
buy
if
they
are
just
way
too
many
barriers
of
entry,
yeah
yeah.
A
D
Of
the
yeah,
I
just
wanted
to
add
a
bit
more,
so
we
were
talking
about
ease
of
use.
There
was
actually
so
in
the
same
poll
there's
also
a
similar
number
of
people.
That
said
that
basically
complained
about
fees,
especially
over
the
last
couple
months
yeah.
So
I
think,
with
layer,
two
solutions
that
a
bunch
of
them
have
also
just
been
launched.
If
d5
projects
can
start
moving
to
them.
That
would
definitely
help
a
lot.
D
A
C
D
Ransom
attack
by
a
hacker
on
an
exchange,
but,
but
I
just
wanna
make
sure
I
do
address
daniel's
question
about
how
to
make
it
sort
of
easy
for
people
to
to
learn
what
I
think-
and
this
is
I'm
not
backing
this
by
any
data.
But
what
I
strongly
believe
in
is
that,
if
we
can
as
a
community
local
communities,
if
we
can
create
like
really
back
products
that
came
within
the
community,
then
there
are
more
reasons
for
people
to
keep
participating
and
learning.
D
So
if
you
can
get
your
own
pools
within
the
your
local
space,
then
you
can
people
can
already
see
you
know,
okay,
this
is
how
I
can
potentially
win
and
never
lose
and
from
there
when
they
started
winning
or
they
see
other
people
winning.
Then
there
is
naturally
an
interest
to
learn
more
about.
Oh,
so
maybe
I
can
learn
how
to
do
this
or
how
to
play
around
with
that
application.
C
Unique
steps
when
it
comes
to
education
for
our
users
in
the
d5
space,
so
we
just
create
different
events.
So,
let's
say
like
we
recently
had
a
partnership
with
rv
so
where
we
encourage
users
to
you
know,
come
to
our
way
and
deposit
some
funds
into
our
way.
Then
you
know
help
us
to
like
help
a
group
of
users
to
know
what
what
you
did
in
that
particular
transaction.
So,
let's
say
if
you
want
to
deposit.
C
So
what
are
the
steps
that
you
have
taken
in
a
very
layman
terms
to
all
the
users
so
based
upon
the
understanding
of
the
fellow
users?
So
we
reward
all
the
user,
like
whatever
the
user
task,
based
upon
the
like
user
steps,
what
he
did
and
how
they
did
for
for
achieving
deposit
into
our
product.
So
this
is.
This
is
kind
of
like
very
interesting
initiative
that
we
have
took
at
just
if
I
so
yeah.
C
So
if
you,
if
you
feel
like
educating
users,
then
I
think
these
these
kind
of
initiatives
will
play
a
major
role
so
every
time
because
every
user
needs
to
be
technical
guy.
So
we
have
to
be.
You
know
very,
very
enthused
in
terms
of
like
creating
events
in
a
particular
way
that,
like
you
know,
users
will
be
understanding
what
they
are
doing
in
a
very
simple
steps.
B
Yeah
that
that's
a
very
fair
comment,
yeah
at
making
sure
that
you
know
men
understand
what
the
protocol
is
doing.
You
know
making
it
easier
for
them
to
understand.
I
think
that
due
to
you
know
ensuring
that
laymen
would
start
using
all
these
d5
tools
as
well.
So
I
think
next
up,
I
have
a
question
more
for
I
think
psy,
but
I
think
we
probably
actually
mentioned
about
the
key
d5
challenge
in
india.
D
B
D
Yeah
so
from
malaysia,
so
we
don't
really
have
many
projects
legitimate
projects,
but
for
some
reason
we
do
have
coin
gekko
and
itascan,
who
are
sources
of
information
for
essentially
the
whole
world.
So
it's
not
necessarily
a
d5
product
itself,
but
giving
information
into
d5.
For
example.
I
think
fine
gecko
just
released
this
like
a
a
defy
list
where
it
easily
shows
you
the
defy
tokens
and
different
metrics
that
are
related
to
them.
D
B
C
C
So
these
are
the
two
major
protocols
from
india
yeah.
So
one
one
thing
that
I
like
most
on
movies,
so
we
actually
you
know
on
board
users
by
by
introducing
meta
transactions
for
you
for
all
users,
so
users
no
need
to
pay
any
gas
fee
from
their
end.
So
if
you,
if
you
don't
have
ether
in
your
wallet
still,
the
transaction
will
go
on
and
still
like,
you
can
face
the
margin
rate
and
you
can
you
can.
You
know,
end
the
margin
at
right
time.
C
So,
let's,
let's
take
the
example.
So
once
once
you
know,
I
place
the
margin
trade
on
on
dividends,
but
I
I
got
some
five
to
ten
dollars:
profit
longing
on
ether,
okay.
So
now
I
don't
have
either
in
my
wallet
to
execute
the
transaction
at
that
particular
time
when
I
made
profits
right.
So
when,
like
I,
I
just
want
to
you
know,
take
some
either
from
other
wallet
and
just
transfer
it
to
the
current
wallet
and
then
I
should
execute
the
transaction
within
the
time
duration.
C
C
B
Yeah
awesome,
so
I
mean,
like
you
know:
d5
space
is
growing
really
fast.
I
just
had
a
session
yesterday
about
you
know
d5,
giving
an
overview
about
d5,
and
then
I
was
looking
at
the
chart.
You
know
like
when
d5
first
started
in
early
2018
and
then
today
it's
after
two
point
two
and
a
half
years.
It
actually
grows
so
fast
that
it
actually
grew
like
32
times.
So
how
do
you
see
how?
What
do
you
hope
to
see?
B
C
Yeah
so
so
now
like,
if
you
compare
the
last
year's
d5
protocols
to
the
current
scenario,
they
have
improved
a
lot
and
you
know
total
value
locked
in
the
protocols
have
been
enormously
raised
right.
So
now,
if
you
look
at
d5
pearls.com,
so
if
you
can
see
that
there
are
1.5
million
dollar
worth
crypto
locked
in
the
d5
protocols,
which
is
insane
right
so
now
you
can
see
the
interest
that
is
coming
out
of
from
the
users
to
explore
the
d5
space.
Very,
very
you
know
fastly
right.
C
So
if
you
take
this
an
example
for
the
future,
so
I
I
would
also
say
that,
like
this
is
going
to
be
huge
because
you
know
there
are
a
lot
of
protocols.
A
lot
of
developers
developing
something
new
in
this
space
and
and
ux
is
improved
a
lot
from
from
last
one
year,
and
you
can
also
imagine
how
the
ux
is
going
to
be
like
long
term
or
like
the
mid
term
right
yeah.
C
So
I
think
there
will
be
a
competition
between
e5
and
c5
when,
when,
like
users
into
the
you
know,
introducing
crypto
and
one
more
interesting
thing
is
so
on.
D5
so
you'll
have
your
access
to
the
funds
and
you
know
no
centralized
authority.
You
have
access
like
to
stop
your
funds
or
like
to
stop
your
trace
or
something
like
that
right.
So
I
think
this
this
space
is
going
to
be
like
very
crazy,
like
moving
forward.
D
Yes,
for
me,
I
think
I'd
like
to
see
a
lot
more
like
real
use
cases
I
mean
where
the
sort
of
average
non-crypto
user
can
benefit.
I
already
think
that
there
are
potential
that
someone
can
currently
already
build
using
what
technology
we
already
have.
So,
for
example,
even
just
doing
remittance
using
die,
let's
say
to
any
other
parts
of
the
world
if
you
can
just
build
like
a
easy
ui.
D
You
can
get
the
funds
much
faster
and
even
cheaper
than
something
like
transferwise,
for
example.
The
use
case
is
again
pool
together
and
I
think
sai
might
be
familiar
with
this
as
well
like
in
india.
I'm
sure
you
guys
have
these
things
called
a
cheat
fund.
We
call
it
here
and
I
honestly
believe
that
there
is
something
that,
if
someone
can
build
an
easy
ux
form,
that's
something
that
blockchain
provides
a
real
use
case
and
to
give
some
context
for
people
who
are
not
familiar.
D
It's
this
idea
of
like
a
lending
circle,
so
you
can
have
like
a
circle
of
20
people.
You
chip
into
this
pool,
and
maybe
once
a
month
you
draw
out
and
the
people
who
may
be
in
need
within
that
smaller
circle
can
withdraw
it
earlier
and
maybe
a
slight
penalty
to
the
full
amount.
But
you
are
essentially
banking,
each
other,
providing
you
know
interest-free
loans
for
each
other.
So
I
think
for
sure,
if
pull
together
can
something
like
that
can
grow.
D
That
could
be
a
very
big
use
case
in
this
part
of
the
world
and,
lastly,
in
malaysia,
we're
supposed
to
be
known
for
islamic
finance
because
we're
a
majority
muslim
and
the
whole
idea
of
islamic
finance
is
where
it's
based
on
ethical
finance.
So
you're,
not
just
you
know,
printing
your
money
to
thin
air
or
or
providing
loans
that
are
crazy,
high
interests.
B
Yeah
so,
but
do
you
see
you
know
like
d5
merging
with
c5,
or
you
know
like
it
would
d5
will
basically
conquer
the
entire
whole
financial
space.
You
know
it
take
over
like
it
has
never.
Before
I
mean
yeah,
I
mean
I
think
this
is
something
that
people
always
are
debating.
Right
like
hey,
you
know,
like
is
defy
going
to
be.
You
know
like
doing
something
greater
than
the
existing
financial
ecos
financial
infrastructure.
D
C
So,
basically,
you
know
defy
space
is
really
getting
interesting.
So
now
you
can,
you
know,
put
your
invoices
and
mortgage
slips
and
the
pedo
slips,
and
now
you
can
start
investing
into
different
protocols
in
the
d5
space.
I
think
this
is
going
to
be.
You
know
very
interesting
to
onboard.
You
know:
lower
income
people
into
the
d5
space.
B
Yeah
they're
tokenizing
real
world
assets,
so
maker
is
actually
working
with
them.
Yeah
just
creating
real
world
use
cases
as
highway.
For
saying
right,
you
know
plugging
into
the
legacy
financial
system.
In
order
to
make
you
know
the
protocol
scalable
right
now
or
d5
protocols
are
only
limited
to
whatever
market
cap
that
you
see
within
crypto
space
itself
yeah.
I
think
we
are
kind
of
like
running
out
of
time.
B
Maria
has
been
pinging
me,
so
I'm
just
gonna
go
into
like
I
mean
like
before
we
wrap
up
the
whole
session
you
know
like.
Could
you
two
actually
give
a
piece
of
advice
for
people
who
are
curious
about
you
know
dfi
or
wanting
to
be.
You
know
community
builders
in
the
space
I
mean
like
what
you
have
to
say
to
people
who
wants
to
be
a
community
builder
or
you
know,
entering
the
d5
space.
C
It's
for
me,
yeah,
yeah,
okay,
so
yeah,
so
basically
to
be
community
builders.
So
first
you,
you
must
be
aware
of
like
what's
happening
in
the
d5
space,
and
you
must
explore
different
things
that
are
happening
in
the
d5
space
force.
Then
only
like
you
will
be
able
to.
You
know,
communicate
like
what
are
the
things
happening
in
the
d5
space
to
your
users
right.
So
I
think
community
builders
should
be
very
aware
of
like
what
are
the
things
happening
in
the
d5
space.
D
So
that's
the
first
step
once
you
have
that,
then
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
communities,
whether
like
in
your
geographical
location
or
online
with
telegram
and
discord
groups,
so
can
join
them,
and
I
think
one
thing
that
the
ethereum
space
has
is
that
every
a
lot
of
people
are
very
open
and
I'm
willing
to
share.
Even
if
they're
you
know,
rich
or
famous.
So
that's
something
that
that
I
think
really
just
helps.
You
just
need
to
sort
of
step
out
of
your
own
shell
and
for
community
builders.
D
I
think
the
first
question
is
just
to
ask
yourself
like:
what's
your
intention
behind
it?
If
you
want
to
like
sell
something
or
if
you
want
to
like
making
a
name
for
yourself,
is
fine,
but
not
at
the
expense
of
bringing
the
community,
because
people
can
eventually
they
can
tell
if
you're
doing
it
like
for
the
money
or
for
for
growing
the
space,
and
you
will
also
find,
especially
if
it's
coming
down
from
a
bubble,
that
it
takes
up
a
lot
of
your
time
and
maybe
there's
less
people
showing
up.
D
So
you
get
this
feeling
of
like.
Why
would
I
want
to
do
this?
So
if
you
put
it
as
your
honest
intention,
is
to
grow
the
community
of
of
real
users,
then
even
when
stuff,
like
that
happens,
you
can
still
soldier
on
and
the
second
big
one,
I
guess
there's
a
long
list,
but
the
second
big
one
is
just
to
know
who
you
are,
who
the
people
are
within
your
local
space.
D
B
Yeah,
that's
very
well
said
because
you
know
after
the
hype
is
gone,
you
know
like
crypto,
community,
actually
sort
of
shrinks
as
well
and
then,
as
a
community
builder.
Sometimes
you
get
demotivated
because,
oh
okay,
you
know
from
30
50
people
originally
and
then
there's
like
10
people
right
now
in
this
page
you
know
coming
to
your
meet
up,
and
so
I
think
with
that
good
intention
and
knowing
what
you
want
to
do,
it's
very
important
so
yeah
and
there's
a
lot
of
resources
out
there
as
well.
B
B
A
C
D
Space
yeah
and
on
my
end
it
also
depends
what
exactly
you
want.
But
generally
a
good
thing
to
do
is
just
go
on
twitter
and
start
following
people
and
follow
the
people
that
you
feel
like
yeah
their
posts,
their
their
thoughts,
their
their
retweets
are
quality.
You
follow
the
people
that
they
follow.
D
I
guess
I
can
shield
my
own
newsletter,
so
itascan
does
a
monthly
newsletter,
so
you
can
check
that
and
it's
meant
to
be
like
very
easy
for
the
average
person,
not
not
technical,
otherwise,
there's
yeah,
there's
a
bunch
of
d5
new
studies.
There's
bankless
eth
newsletter
covers
d5
quite
a
bit
and
I
think
maria
mentioned
camilla
russo.
I
think
the
defiant
that's
also
a
good
defined
newsletter,
so
yeah
can
follow
that.
D
I
think
what
will
happen
over
time
is
that
you'll
be
following
too
much
newsletters
and
and
too
many
people
on
twitter
that
it
becomes
almost
impossible
to
catch
up,
because
there's
so
many
new
things
that
keep
happening.
I
do
it
for
a
living,
and
even
I
I
have
like,
like
hundreds
of
unopened
chrome
tabs
on
my
phone,
so
yeah
you
build
it
first,
I
guess,
and
over
time
you
can
kind
of
like
cut
it
down
to
a
few
people
that
you
really
want
to
pay
attention
to.
Otherwise
you
will.
B
B
B
Out
a
couple
of
links
right
to
everyone
join
the
session,
and
so-
and
I
think
it's
almost
time
so-
for
anyone
who
hasn't
joined
a
make
a
dial
community
any
communities.
Yet
we
are
available
on
telegram.
You
can
just
go
to
make
a
dial
official
telegram
chat
and
then
you
can
go
to
our
reddit
chat
and
we
are
also
available
on
twitter.
A
B
Yeah
so
and
one
more
thing
as
we
are
growing,
we
are
also
trying
to
recruit
very
passionate
ambassadors
all
over
the
world
so
like
in
southeast
asia.
I
have
got
like
four
ambassadors
already
and
then
same
goes
to
maria.
She
has
you
know
she's
and
she's.
Actually
leading.
Would
you
like
to
share
your
ambassadors?
I
don't
know
where
are
they
from
now
because
it
goes
over?
Is
in
france
or
like
germany,
one
ambassador.
B
B
A
A
A
That
is
this
open
position,
which
is
there
from
a
while
and
the
hr
department.
Us
ask
us
to
share
here
as
well
as
much
as
we
can.
If
you
guys
are
interested,
I
if
you
are
here,
probably
you
are
interested
in
the
blockchain,
but
if
you
want
to
check
it
out,
this
is
the
link
I
will
put
it
here
and
again.
A
I
will
send
an
email
to
all
the
attendees
and
you
will
you
could
receive
if
you
answer
to
this
email,
your
porp,
so
the
proof
of
attendance
nft
like
last
time,
if
you
want
to
to
have
it
just
reply
to
the
email,
I
will
send
the
instruction
and
I
will
send
you
the
link,
because
we
are
cooperating
with
the
porp
and
with
with
this
initiative,
which
is,
in
my
opinion,
great
and
that's
it.
I
think.
B
A
I
will
also
so
if
you
want
to
be
the
next
guest
here
or
you
know,
someone
or
you
have
some
like
suggestion
for
the
next
topic
for
the
next
month.
Please
reach
reach
us
out
and
that's
it
all
right
for
joining
everyone,
and
I
want
to
thank
you
again,
our
speakers
and
have
a
good
weekend.
Everyone
thank.