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From YouTube: 5/26/2022 - Joint Interim Standing Committee on Revenue
Description
This is the fifth meeting in calendar year 2022. Please see agenda for details.
For agenda and additional meeting information: https://www.leg.state.nv.us/App/Calendar/A/
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A
Okay,
so
good
afternoon,
everyone,
I
hope
your
week
has
been
going
well,
been
an
interesting
one,
to
say
the
least.
I
would
like
to
call
this
meeting
to
order
for
the
joint
interim
standing
committee
on
revenue
welcome
and
thank
you
for
everyone
who
is
joining
us
online,
and
I
will
ask
our
committee
fiscal
staff,
mr
real,
to
call
the
role.
C
A
First
of
all,
the
meeting
material
can
be
accessed
on
the
committee's
web
page
located
on
nevada's
legislative
website,
but
I
also
want
to
make
sure
that,
for
the
chat
feature
that
you
guys
make
sure
that
you
do
not
post
inside
of
the
chat
that
you
actually
use,
it's
only
going
to
be
used
for
it
and
technical
assistance.
So
if
you
have
questions
to
the
actual
presenters,
probably
going
to
have
to
use
that
hand
feature,
because
I
am
not
using
my
legislative
laptop
today,
so
you
can
post
your
hand
or
wave
your
hand.
A
In
addition,
I
wanted
to
mention
that,
if
anyone
is
interested
in
receiving
an
electronic
notification
regarding
the
committee's
agenda
minutes
and
final
report,
you
can
do
so
by
signing
up
on
the
legislative
website.
Any
votes
that
are
taken
today
will
be
done
by
show
of
hands.
A
A
A
If
there
are
any
links
that
or
information
that
a
presenter
would
like
to
share,
make
sure
that
those
things
are
included
in
your
slide
deck.
I
think
we
have
all
of
them,
and
so
we
will,
if
we
have
any
technical
difficulties,
we'll
get
a
chance
to
potentially
pause
and
try
to
make
sure
your
presentation
is
appropriately
seen
by
the
public
and
that
everyone
is
viewed
in
the
best
light.
A
A
A
Second?
Is
that
assembly
woman
kasama?
It
is
all
right,
thank
you,
and
so
I
will
take
a
vote
for
show
of
hands
in
favor
of
approving
the
minutes
from
march
23rd
2022.
A
Okay,
thank
you
any
opposed
to
approval
of
the
minutes.
Seeing
none
the
motion
passes.
We
have
approved
the
minutes
for
march
23rd
and
now
we
will
move
into
agenda
item
number
five
here.
I'm
sorry.
B
A
Hearing
okay,
so
we
will
take
the
abstention,
make
sure
committee
secretary,
if
you
could
document
that
we
have
one
abstention
from
the
vote,
that
for
the
minutes
from
vice
chair,
cohen,.
A
Okay,
next,
we
have
agenda
item
number
five.
I'm
super
excited
about
our
presentation.
Today
we
were
able
to
get
the
federal
reserve
bank
of
san
francisco
to
talk
about
cryptocurrency,
and
then
we
also
have
a
presentation
from
the
gaming
control
board
and
commission,
which
I'm
super
excited
about,
because
I
think
well.
A
I
know
that
there
are
some
pdrs
that
I'm
interested
in,
which
is
why
we're
having
this
conversation
and
cryptocurrency
is
the
new
thing
happening
in
the
space
around
revenue,
and
so
I
wanted
to
have
this
presentation
and
super
grateful
that
we
could
get
the
federal
reserve
bank
to
come
on
and
present,
and
so
I
will
open
it
up
to
miss
lee
and
miss
english
or
or
is
there
a
third
presenter
with
you
guys?
Yes,
presenters.
A
F
Let
me
share
my
screen
and
while
we
are
pulling
up
the
slide
a
little
brief
introduction
of
ourselves
so
aaron
and
myself,
we
are
senior
fintech
policy
and
race
advisors.
Here
at
the
san
francisco
fed
we
belong
to
a
team,
probably
the
first
subject
matter:
expert
team
within
the
federal
reserve
system
that
is
fully
dedicated
to
fintech
activities.
F
F
So
a
little
bit
about
our
team,
so
yeah.
F
Okay,
here
we
are,
we
are
part
of
this
federal
reserve
system,
so
we
are
central
bankers
or
we
also
share
the
responsibilities
as
a
bank
regulators,
together
with
the
occ
fdic
and
the
state
regulators.
F
We
spend
most
of
our
time
doing
research
and
analysis.
We
try
to
identify
issues
that
are
both
important
and
relevant,
where
financial
regulators
may
want
to
act
upon
in
the
future,
and
we
also
connect
to
banking
and
fintech
community
on
emerging
issues,
impacting
the
financial
system
so
located
on
the
west
coast.
F
We
have
the
advantage
of
interacting
with
the
local
community
where
a
lot
of
interesting
and
challenging
fintech
activities
are
happening,
and
that
also
allows
us
to
dig
a
little
deeper
into
emerging
trends
and
add
some
forward-looking
abuse
by
analysis,
so
emerging
fintech
activities,
it's
a
one
focus
of
our
team.
We
have
two
broad
areas
right
so
for
emerging
fintech
activities
that
includes
bank
fintech,
fintech
partnership,
where
we
try
to
be
limbo,
and
we
will
try
to
move
quickly
to
capture
the
latest
development
in
the
fintech
industry,
so
for
emerging
fintech
activities.
F
That
coverage
evolves
over
time.
We
review
every
year,
cryptocurrency
that
is
actually
a
longer
term
commitment
of
our
team.
So
we
anticipate
that
mainstream
financial
institutions.
Adoption
of
the
digital
assets
were
just
increased
over
time.
That
trends
is
not
transitional,
even
though
we
are
seeing
a
lot
of
volatility
in
the
marketplace
and
also
you
know,
high
level
of
policy
and
regulatory
uncertainties
that
may
change
the
business
model.
F
So
that's
why
aaron
and
myself,
we
are,
you
know,
spending
a
hundred
percent
of
our
time
on
crypto,
related
activities.
Just
researching
industry
trends
make
sure
that
we
have
good
input
into
our
federal
reserve
colleagues
to
support
the
commission
and
also
one
provide
input.
We
look
into
policy
outcomes.
F
So
last
but
not
least,
our
fintech
team
has
a
mission
to
advance
general
understanding
of
financial
inclusion
and
financial
health
issues
which,
as
you
know,
is
a
core
value
proposition
by
many
fintech
firms,
so
how
to
conceptualize.
You
know
these
issues
and
how
to
assess
those
those
those
are.
You
know
just
the
research
topics,
but
it's
also
something
we
spend
a
lot
of
time,
thinking
and
thinking
about
how
to
incorporate
those
sort
of
culture
and
thinking
into
our
day-to-day
work.
F
So
I
was,
I
think,
today,
aaron
and
I
are
going
to
leave
this.
The
presentation
we
and
aaron
will
give
like
a
brief
overview
of
what
we
mean
by
crypto
and
some
of
the
common
issues.
These
days
related
to
cryptocurrencies.
F
I
was
just
looking
at
my
team's
channel
with
with
my
chat
with
aaron,
and
I
know
he's
restarting
his
computer.
I
actually
cannot
see
you
know
the
video
cams
when
I'm
presenting
so
aaron.
Are
you
have
you
logged
back
in.
F
Right
so,
while
we
wait
for
him,
maybe.
F
A
Got
it
members,
do
you
have
any
early
questions
while
we
wait
for
aaron
to
get
on
since
they
were
lost,
assemblywoman
anderson.
B
Thank
you
and
thank
you
for
the
introduction.
I
thank
you
chair.
You
miss
miss
lee
and
I
hope
I'm
saying
your
name
last
name
correctly.
You
had
mentioned
inclusion.
What
do
you
mean
by
inclusion?
Is
that
by
age?
Is
that
by
economic
background?
Is
that
even
possibly
by
by
different
ethnic
diversity?
F
Yeah,
thank
you
for
that
question
and
thanks
for
this
opportunity
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
inclusion
in
general,
and
you
are
right,
it's
a
it
is
a
topic.
That's
so
very
widely
thrown
out
as
a
concept,
but
I'm
glad
that
we
are
talking
a
little
bit
about
what
really
entails.
So
in
my
mind,
actually
inclusion
is
a
first
step,
but
we
think
about
the
common
opportunity
for
accessing
financial
services
and
economic
opportunities
and
many
of
the
metrics
we
mentioned.
F
Then
I
also
one
thing
that
I
feel
in
my
research
is
that
inclusion
is
just
a
first
step.
It's
a
it's
a
it's
a
matrix,
it's
a
number
but
really
matters.
It's
not
stand.
Staying
on
that
entry
level,
understanding
about
just
the
percentage
of
people
we
are
accessing
or
who
have
access
to
basic
bank
account,
then
what's
really
important
is
that
when
people
have
a
bank
account,
do
they
use
it
in
the
reasonable
er?
Do
they
use
it
in
like?
Do
they
have
the
support
to
be
able
to
tie?
F
You
know
their
financial
activities
to
improve
their
overall
financial
health?
So
it's
going
to
be
a
combination
of
financial
education,
which
is
a
part
of
the
you
know
like
a
public
mission
over
any.
You
know,
regulators,
but
also
ties
into
some
of
the
consumer
compliance
functions.
You
know,
as
bank
regulators,
we
want
to
make
sure
that
consumers
are
well
supported
and
banks
are
doing
their
job
to
do.
B
F
You're
not
alone.
I
think
this
is
a
evolving
topic.
I
I
just
feel
I
should
emphasize
that
because
that's
one
thing
that
sort
of
where
we
keep
going
coming
back
to
when
we
evaluate
you,
know
technology
advancement.
F
So
will
we.
F
B
F
The
presentation
is
no
longer
being
shared,
so
if
you
can
go
ahead
and
share
it
again,
we
stopped
the
sharing
while
it
was
well.
There
was
back
and
forth
among
members.
Okay,.
C
G
So
generally,
there
are
three
types
of
crypto
or
digital
currencies:
unbacked
cryptocurrencies
such
as
bitcoin
and
ethereum
stable
coins
which
seek
to
peg
their
asset
value
to
a
fiat
currency
such
as
the
us
dollar
and
finally,
central
bank,
digital
currencies
or
cbdc,
which
are
digital
currencies
issued
by
a
central
bank.
G
So
bitcoin
is
the
oldest
most
valuable
digital
assets,
still
preeminent
in
payments
and
trading
ethereum,
whose
native
eth
token
is
the
second
most
valuable,
is
the
most
popular
platform
for
smart
contract
software
development
building.
On
top
of
that
network,
and
today,
actually
ethereum
handles
about
more
than
a
million
transactions
daily
there.
G
Because
of
that
peer-to-peer
network
in
a
fairly
robust
market.
There
is
a
a
fair.
The
price
volatility
of
both
bitcoin
and
ethereum
can
be
pretty
intense
at
sometimes
which
leads
to
the
intent
and
the
creation.
Several
years
ago,
of
the
second
category,
cryptocurrencies
or
stable
coins,
so
stable
coins
are
digital
assets
that
are
designed
to
maintain
a
stable
value
relative
to
a
national
currency
or
other
reference
assets.
G
G
The
usd
team
I'd
say
centralized
because
the
issuers
and
operators
of
these
stable
coins
maintain
reserves
of
a
high
quality
liquid
assets,
usually
and
the
backing
for
the
stable
point,
and
they
have
fairly,
depending
on
the
issue
or
fairly
robust,
usually
governance
protocols,
and
so
both
of
these
two
types
of
cryptocurrencies
in
the
last
few
years
have
actually
motivated
this
third
category,
and
that
is
the
the
central
bank.
Digital
currencies
or
cbdc's
central
bank's
globally
are
really
interested
in
this.
G
Just
recently,
the
bank
of
international
settlements
really
released
its
annual
survey
of
central
banks
on
cbdc,
and
so
this
year.
I
think
it
was
about
90
percent
of
the
the
surveyed.
Central
banks
are
in
some
aspect
of
exploring
it
now.
Last
year's
figure
was
about
87,
but
what
changed
in
this
year
is
that
about
half
of
that
90
aren't
just
exploring
they're
actually
in
the
development
phase
of
the
cbdc
and
the
motivate.
G
There
are
multiple
motivations,
but
there
is
some
attraction
to
the
underlying
technology
or
how
some
of
the
technologies
about
stable
coins
and
ethereum
bitcoin
operate
not
always,
and
but
they
are
another
concern
among
different
central
banks
across
the
world,
is
that
they
are
depending
on
the
market
of
the
jurisdiction,
some
competition
for
some
of
these
cryptocurrencies,
and
so
that
is
one
of
many
motivations
for
why
they
are
exploring
this
before
moving
into
the
next
slide
and
sort
of
looking
at
some
of
the
demographics
I
just
want
to
underscore
is
that
a
common
thread
among
all
of
these
risk
is
that
they
are
software
based
and
so
tried
and
true
cyber
security
practices
that
you
know,
if
you
think
about
the
chief
information
security
officers
for
small
businesses
in
your
state
banks,
casinos,
all
those
good
cyber
security
practices
that
they
operate
for
their
network
infrastructures
should
apply
in
fact,
must
apply
for
how
they,
if
they
were
to
think
about
using
these
types
of
different
currencies.
G
Same
goes
for
licensed
money,
service
providers
or
money
service
businesses
with
respect
to
aml
transit.
G
Now,
despite
this
growth,
there
is
still
a
fair
amount
of
uncertainty
as
far
as
how
how
it
operates-
and
you
know
just
generally
a
certain
amount
of
fair
amount
of
questions
about
it.
So
to
help
illustrate
this
point,
there
was
another
survey
from
april
this
year
by
payments.com,
and
so
they
noticed
that
56
percent
of
consumers
who
do
not
own
a
cryptocurrency,
feel
they
do
not
feel
comfortable
yet
purchasing
it
and
30
percent.
Actually,
doom
venue
had
questions
about
how
to
purchase
it.
G
G
Now,
if
you
were
to
break
down
we'll
cover
this
in
the
next
slide,
but
if
you
were
to
break
down
that
24
you'll
notice
that
a
lot
of
the
the
concerns
we're
seeing
a
lot
of
the
growth
is
actually
in
gen,
z
and
millennials,
who
essentially
kind
of
grew
up
as
digital
natives,
and
they
almost
see
these
as
a
lot
of
those
inhibitions
that
others
might
see
for
them.
It's
fairly
as
you'll
notice.
In
this
slide,
it's
fairly
popular
among
this
particular
demographic.
G
I
would
notice
that
when
we
talk
about,
you
know
what
are
they
buying
about?
90
of
them
are
buying
bitcoins,
actually
at
about
80
87,
and
then,
while
this
slide
does
show
who
is
buying
or
actually
who
actually
has
bought
the
surveyors.
You
know
they
noticed
that
there
was
another
category
of
individuals
which
they
called
as
the
crypto
current
the
cryptocurious,
and
so
they
define
those
as
who
do
not
currently
own
cryptocurrency,
but
indicate
in
either
a
wanting
or
a
learn
or
planning
to
buy
more
soon.
G
G
Women
account
for
more
than
half
of
that
53
of
those
getting
into
or
crypto
soon,
probably
that
crypto
curious,
and
were
that
to
happen.
That
could
indicate
a
fairly
significant
introduction
next
line.
G
So,
regardless
of
age,
demographic,
something
that
seems
to
be
remaining
the
same
is
that
most
people
who
buy
crypto
assets,
cryptocurrencies
see
it
as
a
long-term
investment
and
that
kind
of
relates
into
the
the
next
category,
which
is
active
trading.
So,
despite
bitcoin
being
used
as
a
support
of
digital
money,
it's
actually
because
of
that
volatility
and
as
a
store
of
value.
This
is
probably
why
you,
you
see
only
a
12
actually
use
it
into
for
purchases.
G
That
said,
I
mean
there's
a
growing
number
of
businesses
within
the
united
states
and
actually
globally,
that
are
we'll
accept
a
cryptocurrency
bitcoin
for
payment,
but
still
again,
most
users
still
see
it
as
an
investment.
I
just
before
passing
it
off
to
cindy.
G
What
isn't
captured
is
necessarily
like
aaron,
english.
You
know
I
made
a
bitcoin
transaction
point.
You
know
from
person
to
person,
but
there
is
a
unique
identifier.
That's
associated
you
know.
Computer
technology
would
call
that
your
cryptographic
cache
and
that
will
always
be
associated
and
so,
which
makes
inherently
you
know,
privacy
somewhat
challenging
with
some
of
these
technologies
and
as
you
reflected
here,
interestingly,
most
users
would
probably
agree
with
that.
So
with
that
I'll
pass
it
to.
F
Cindy,
thank
you.
Thank
you
aaron.
So
I
will.
I
will
pick
up
where
everyone
left
and
just
want
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
some
of
the
you
know,
driving
factors
that
will
affect.
You
know
banks,
adoption
of
cryptos,
as
you
know,
you
can
probably
see
if
you
follow
this
closely
on
on
the
news
media
there
are,
you
know.
Increasingly,
we
are
seeing
financial
institutions
started
to
dip
their
toes
into
crypto
related
activities
right.
F
So
we
think
this
is
going
to
be
a
trend
for
here
to
stay.
Then
the
critical
adoption
notwithstanding
you
know
the
recent
market
activity.
It's
just
a
matter
of
why
not
a
matter
of
you
know
if
this
will
happen.
So
two
one
observation
I
have
just.
I
was
just
reading
a
wall
street
journal
article
a
couple
weeks
ago.
I
wish
I
had
a
slide
for
that,
which
is
you
know,
money
managers
and
hedge
funds.
They
are
really
pushing
their.
F
You
know
primary
banks
to
offer
them
with
the
crypto
services
because
they
are
actually
uncomfortable
with
some
of
the
crypto
startups.
They
don't
want
to
rely
on
them
to
get
into
trading
cryptos
for
their
clients.
F
On
the
other
hand,
they
also
wanted
to
be
able
to
offer
you
know
those
services
to
their
clients
and
they
do
not
want
to
lose
out
to
their
rivals.
Who
may
be
thinking
about
the
same
thing?
So
that's
a
new
development,
that's
on
the
institutional
side,
but
that
kind
of
incites
with
some
of
the
retail
trends
we
have
observed
for
the
past
couple
of
years,
which
is
and
when
I
first
saw
this
members
I
was
like
this
is
interesting.
F
But
then
there
are
a
number
of
surveys
that
tell
the
similar
story,
which
is
the
customers
actually
want
to
get
their
crypto
activities
from
their
primary
banks
right,
but
he
has
71
percent
of
bitcoin
holders
would
want
to
switch
their
primary
banks
to
events
and
over
bitcoin
related
products.
So
that's
just
the
one
example
that
illustrate
you
know
the
retail
demand
basic
customer
demand
driving
banks
into
considering
some
of
these
services,
sometimes
even
reluctantly,
and
that's
the
trend
overall
trend.
F
We
are
observing
at
this
moment
and
we
anticipate
that
as
long
as
this
trend
will
continue
and
as
the
previous
slide
erin
presented
show
to
be
extended.
Many
of
these
secret
active
users
are
planning
to
hold
crypto
for
a
long
term.
You
know
being
in
hope,
also
price
and
value
appreciation.
F
That
demand
will
be,
I
think,
the
biggest
factor
that
will
drive
some
of
your
banking
sector
adoption
so
which
means
regulators.
Then
this
should
be
very
high
on
regulatory
data
when
we
think
about
some
of
regulatory
and
supervision
issues
from
the
industry's
perspective.
It's
probably
you
know.
Policy
and
the
regulatory
uncertainties
might
be
the
biggest
headwind
that
they
are
facing
at
this
moment.
F
So
I'm
going
to
mention
several.
You
know.
Pieces
of
regulations
currently
underway
are
being
considered
and
developed.
Just
as
the
example
of
what
are
some
of
these,
you
know
challenges
for
that,
may
eventually
become.
You
know,
impactful
for
crypto
businesses,
business
model,
so
right
now
there
are,
you
know,
interagency
work
being
done,
then
we
do
not
know
one
exactly,
but
sometime
this
year
in
2022,
we
anticipate
to
see
you
know:
inter-agency
guidances,
related
to
custody
trading.
F
Lending
of
crypto
stable
coins
holding
crypto
on
balance
sheets
so
relates
to
permissibility
related
to
this
assessment.
Having
been
at
the
federal
reserve
for
a
while.
I
know
there
are
always
present
terms
in
this
interagency
process.
One
thing
is
certain,
which
is
evaluating
crypto
risk
that
is
high
on
every
banking,
regular
regulatory
agency's
priority.
For
this
also
last
year,
the
basel
committee
on
banking
supervision,
which
tackles
you,
know,
capital
treatment
for
banks.
You
know
various
assets.
F
They
came
up
with
a
conservative
document
that
is
a
premium
preliminary
plan
for
how
to
think
about
capital
treatment
for
critical
assets.
F
The
puzzle
committee
is
still
in
the
process
of
coming
up
with
the
second
version
of
this
document,
which
we
will
see
sometime
this
year,
and
I
imagine
the
risk
volatility
of
the
critical
market
will
have
some
impact
in
how
they
think
about.
You
know
risk
ratings
so
also
for
important
topics
for
banks.
F
Last
but
not
least,
I
wanted
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
crypto
accounting,
so
at
this
moment,
there's
no
specific
accounting
disclosure
rules
on
companies,
crypto
holdings,
so
currently
public
companies
account
for
crypto
as
the
intangible
assets,
with
them
with
an
indefinite
life
and
their
gap.
So
companies
basically
can
record
unrealized
losses,
but
not
gains
over
time.
There
have
been
approached
by
some
publicly
listed
companies
to
say:
hey.
F
Therefore,
crypto
custodians
and
cc
staff
accounting
bulletin
121,
a
document
that
came
out
at
the
end
of
march
actually
had
pretty
significant
impacts
on
supervised
institutions
like
public
invested
banks,
as
well
as
the
crypto
firms
that
are
providing
crypto
custody
services.
F
So
what
this
continues
says
is
that
an
issuer
that
holds
digital
assets
for
others
that
has
not
been
chosen
all
need
to
recognize
a
liability
for
this
obligation
to
safeguard
the
digital
assets
and
the
corresponding
corresponding
asset.
So
this
is
not
the
case
for
traditional
hypo
financial
assets,
but
this
will
have
implications
for
any
crypto
firms,
publicly
listed
critical
firms
and
public
visit
banks
that
are
thinking
about
the
custodial
services,
because
that
factor
into
their
cost
of
doing
business
and
also
potential
capital
treatment.
F
So
as
the
bank
regulators
and
thanks
supervisors
at
this
moment,
we
recognize
you
know
there
are
a
lot
of
moving
pieces
in
the
policy
and
regulatory
environment.
F
Meanwhile,
as
the
banks
start
to
think
about,
you
know
proposals,
we
really
want
to
focus
on
how
to
evaluate
safety
and
standards
of
these
proposals,
as
well
as
consumer
protection
implications.
So
some
of
the
considerations
we
have
you
know:
strategy,
governance
and
controls
I.t
risk
cyber
security,
bsaml
third-party
vendor
management,
consumer
compliances.
Those
are
some
of
the
supervisory
focuses
at
this
moment
as
we
think
through
these
activities.
F
B
Thank
you
sharon.
Thank
you
for
the
presentation,
so
a
few
slides
back.
You
have
the
slide
about
the
one
in
four
american.
B
Having
crypto
now
and
you
have
the
slides
about
who
owns
it
and
but
talk
a
little
more
about
like
how
much
we're
seeing
or
people
reporting,
I
know
it's
self-reporting,
but
how
much?
What
are
people
owning?
I
mean
yeah.
What
how
much
are
we
seeing?
I
know
some
people
are
jumping
just
all
in
and
just
buying
a
ton
and
then
are
most
people
just
really
dipping
their
toes
in
and
not
getting
much
what?
What
are
the
trends
that
we're
seeing
that
that
we
could
expect
for
most
of
our
constituents.
G
All
right
quite
sure,
a
great
question
I'll.
You
know
some
of
those
stats
didn't
have
that.
G
So
all
this
kind
of
comment,
what
I've
noticed
anecdotally
and
that
cindy
can
weigh
in
if
she
you
know
anything
that
she's
seen
it
is
you
see
a
fair,
I
mean
there's
two
categories
of
who's:
giving
there
are
retail
investors
that
are
you
know,
as
you
can
probably
imagine
you
know,
as
the
some
of
the
stats
imply
interested
as
you,
you
know,
as
you
met
you're
correct
in
your
notion,
about
tipping
dipping
your
toes
in
a
little
bit
to
varying
degrees,
and
then
you
know
there
is
kind
of
a
growing
interest
within
the
investment
community.
G
To
some
degree
I
mean,
I
think
you
know,
I
think
it's
starting.
I
would
I
couldn't
put
a
ratio
on
it,
but
it's
you
know.
Bitcoin
has
always
been
a
retail
focused
asset,
but
there
is
a
growing
interest
within
investor
community.
You
know
down
the
line.
F
Yeah,
I
think
erin
you're
right
and
I
already
mentioned
you
know
I
think
you
mentioned
90
percent-
are
holding
a
bitcoin.
I
didn't
know
so
I
think
in
terms
of
household
wealth.
We
do
not
have
that
statistics
anecdotally,
I
think
all
over
the
place,
I've
heard
a
mover
that
helped
me
move
a
young
guy
in
his
early
20s
said
he
put
all
his
savings
discretionary
savings
into
a
bitcoin,
to
which
I
was
like.
Are
you
thinking
about
being
the
regulator?
F
I
started
to
talk
about.
You
know
financial
health
and
everything.
No,
he
wanted
to
send
me
a
reference,
a
referral
link
to
buy
more
digital
assets.
Then
others
start
to
think
about
this
as
a
part
of
their
portfolio,
just
as
a
diversifier,
and
also
there
is
the
engineer
community.
If
you
look
at
many
of
the
crypto
projects,
d5
projects,
so
some
of
the
developers
own
a
large
portion
of
you,
know
the
coins
tokens
from
the
beginning
of
the
project,
so
they
hold
those
long
term
and
they
they
do
not
necessarily
trade
right.
F
F
A
D
Thank
you,
chair,
going
back
to
one
of
the
the
the
first
pages
where
it's
the
crypto
versus
stable
coin
is
there
who
who
makes
that
determination
and
the
reason
I'm
asking
is.
I
think
there
was
one
called
tara
that
was
supposed
to
be
tethered
to
the
dollar,
but
then,
when
the
the
the
worst
of
the
coins
started
going
back,
they
they
separated
themselves
from
it.
So
the
way
I
read
that
is,
they
considered
themselves
a
stable
coin,
but
then,
when
it
got
rough,
they
became
not
a
stable
coin.
D
G
Assemblyman,
that's
a
great
question,
the
so
the
tara,
stable
coin
and
it's
there
are
most
of
the
stable
coins
all
this
by
way
of
description,
so
most
of
the
stable
coins
which
are
in
the
market
today
are
you
know,
as
I
mentioned
sort
of
collateral.
So
if
you
take
the
example
of
cons
the
center
consortium,
so
this
is
circle
and
coinbase
came
together
to
create
the
usdc
coin.
They
have
a
separate
account.
So
for
as
many
you
know,
the
concept
is
that
for
as
many
as.
G
Usdc's
are
in
circulation
in
a
depository
institution.
They
have
that
equivalent
amount
in
very
liquid
assets,
mostly
cash.
You
know
again
or
some
very
highly
liquid
securities
tariff,
which
is
that
it's
an
ecosystem
which
is
comprised,
which
is
the
ust
stable
coin,
is
something
which
another
category
which
I
didn't
mention
is
called
algorithmic.
G
It
doesn't
have
that
collateral,
it's
back
the.
What
it's
a
little.
I
don't
want
to
over,
complicate
it
and
we
could
spend
too
much
time
on
it,
but
essentially
what
it
was
is
that
the
the
peg
was
being
was
dependent
upon
another
cryptocurrency
called
luna,
and
so
basically
you
know
it
was
stable
in
so
far
that
everything
worked
in
this
category.
You
know
as
long
as
there
was
demand
when
there
was
a
you
know,
there's
still
a
lot.
We
don't
know
because
it
was
a
fairly
amount
of
what
happened
was
fairly
recent.
G
G
What
is
a
stable
coin?
What
isn't
there
is?
As
you
know,
you
probably
know
that,
within
within
washington
dc
the
there's
a
presidential
working
group
which
is
actually
working
on
this
issue
right
now,
the
pwg,
it's
an
interagency
group
there
is,
and
a
lot
of
these
most
of
that
focus
rightly
was
focused
on
the
collateralized
version.
I
think
the,
but
I
think
we
will
you
know
policymakers
will
kind
of
make
that
determination.
You
know
at
a
federal
level.
G
You
know
some
of
those
classifications,
it's
a
very
good
question:
tara,
which
is
domiciled
outside
the
united
states.
G
F
F
That
stablecoin
is
not
like
a
generally
accepted
concept
right,
so
let's
say
if
a
firm
issues,
what
we
call
tokenized
deposits,
but
do
not
cause
unstable
coins,
but
it's
bad
by
deposit
is
that
stable
coin,
so
it
gets
technical
and
I
think
aaron
gave
a
great
summary.
Basically,
if
it's
you
know
a
cryptocurrency
fully
backed
by
a
fair
reserve
financial
assets
or
even
algorithm,
they
pack
their
values
to
the
us
dollar.
They
can
do
that
to
euro
or
japanese
union
as
well.
F
But
let's
say
they
pack
their
value
to
fiat
currencies
and,
in
general,
that's
a
stable
coin
and
then
all
sorts
of
other
cryptocurrencies.
When
we
talk
about
that,
just
the
this
is
just
industry
speak.
We
refer
to
cryptocurrencies
that
are
not
tied
or
packed
to
fiat
currency.
D
Let's
get
a
quick
follow-up
chair,
yeah,
okay,
so
if
someone
is
buying
what
they
think
is
a
stable
coin
from
the
entity
itself,
I'm
assuming
that
there's
sort
of
a
website
or
some
information
that
tells
them
whether
or
not
it's
pegged
to
something,
but
if
it
if,
if
some
of
these
coins
are
being
traded
on
a
platform,
is
there
any
consumer
protection
or
information
requirements
for
that
consumer
to
understand
what
they're
buying
or
is
it
sort
of
like
a
a
wild
west
of
opportunity?.
F
Okay,
all
right,
I
think
you
just
really
hit
up
something,
that's
the
center
of
who
regulates
stable
coin
and
how
it
should
be
regulated
right.
So
for
every
stable
point,
there
are
white
papers,
there
are
protocols,
the
conceptually
is
very
open
source.
You
can
stick
to
the
you
know
the
details
of
you
know
the
protocol,
the
software,
because
they
are
essentially
just
software.
F
On
the
other
hand,
we
don't
see,
you
know
we
don't
have
common
standards
for,
for
example,
for
example,
even
for
a
fiat-back
currency,
let's
say
if
a
stablecoin
claim
is
a
hundred
percent
backed
by
u.s
charity
notes,
then,
and
if
this
stable
coin
is
incorporated
outside
the
united
states
and
many
there
have
been
customers
that
you
know
international
customers,
they
may
not
be
yeah.
They
are
in
general,
not
audited
by
a.
F
So
a
lot
of
this
you
know
voluntary
disclosure,
which
I
personally
feel
you
know
is
a
is
a
direction
of
the
current
regulatory
debate
or
discussion
at
this
point.
B
Thank
you
I
and
thank
you
again
for
the
presentation.
Oh
thank
you
chair.
I
have
two
questions.
One
of
them
is
about
a
very
specific
slide
and
the
other
is
in
general,
so
I'm
just
gonna
ask
first
the
specific
slide
if
you're,
okay
with
that,
I
believe
it
was
mr
english's
slide
on
slide.
Six
when
there
was
a
discussion
about
crypto
curious
is,
is
that
just
people
that
are
looking
into
it
or
I
just
need
that
defined
a
little
bit
further,
if
possible,.
G
Yeah
so
great
assembly,
women,
it's
a
great
question.
So
cryptocurious
are
those
people
who
haven't
in
defined
by
the
surveyors
who
ran
that
survey.
These
are
individuals
who
haven't
yet
bought
a
cryptocurrency,
but
our
fairly
edu
have
are
in
the
process
of
learning
a
lot
about
it
and
there's
an
expectation
that
they
will
buy
soon.
Okay,.
B
I
thank
you
that
clarifies
a
little
bit
because
then
I
think
in
the
same
slide
or
the
following
slide.
You
had
mentioned
that
there
are
some
businesses
that
are
starting
to
dip
their
toes
for
for
lack
of
a
better
term.
How
do
they
report
that,
on
their
on
their
profits
reports,
whether
it
is
at
the
at
the
federal
level
or
or
even
the
state
level?
How
is
that
being
reported,
since,
at
this
time
there
are
no
regulations
that
are
very
clearly
defined?
It
sounds
like.
F
So
I
will
let
me
try
to
answer
that.
Oh
I
I,
this
is
not
going
to
be
a
perfect
answer,
because
I'm
not
an
accounting
expert,
but
just
knowing
that
you
know,
there's
no
crypto
specific
accounting
rules
in
the
u.s
and
they're
getting
internationally
the
same
thing
right.
So
let's
say
I
mentioned
you
know
counting
crypto
as
an
intangible
asset.
That's
basically
means
if
you
hold
it
on
your
balance
sheet
and
it
was
a
three
thousand
and
two
at
cost,
but
now
it's
a
thirty
thousand.
F
You
still
cannot
recognize
those
as
gains
right.
So
that's
why
I
guess
at
least
as
far
as
I
can
hear
that
some
of
the
driving
forces
for
some
publicly
listed
companies
will
say:
hey
we're
successful
in
holding
crypto
companies
or
our
companies
should
be
bigger
than
they
really
look
like.
So
can
we
change
their
continue
to
accommodate
that
then
the
flip
side?
Of
that,
let's
say:
if
it's
a
supervised
bank,
then
obviously
fair
counting
create
a
lot
of
issues.
F
In
terms
of
you
know
what
should
go
on
balance
sheet?
Do
they
need
to
reserve
capital?
You
know
against
those
risky
assets
like
what
is
the
risk
rating,
so
I
keep
going
back
to
you
know,
bank
supervision,
because
that's
what
we
do,
but
that's
how
it
applies.
Some
of
the
practical
issues
I
mean
I
mean
I,
I
feel
I've
read
more
about
our
country
rules
than
what
I've
read
in
competition
for
the
past
five
years.
Also.
B
Okay,
thank
you
and
I
guess
my
last
question
because
it
does
clarify
a
little
bit,
but
it
it's
not
still
there
and
it's
going
to
again
show
my
lack
of
knowledge
about
this.
B
Listening
to
this
information,
it's
very
interesting
and
I
look
forward
to
learning
more,
but
I
also
am
getting
worried
that
there's
going
to
be
a
junk
bond
type
of
thing,
where
we've
got
vulnerable
individuals
who
are
older,
who
do
have
money
which
I,
although
the
data
trends,
do
not
show
this,
who
will
then
be
preyed
upon
to
attempt
to
invest
in
it
and
the
return
of
investment
is
not
there
again.
B
I
realize
that
the
inter-agency
guidance
is
coming,
but
just
what
are
the
safeguards
to
make
sure
that
people
are
not
taken
advantage
of
in
a
pretty
risky
population
and.
F
I
I
fully
hear
you
and
thanks
for
sharing
that
observation
concern
and
and
and
I
I
feel
bad
to
say
that
interagency
guidance
won't
even
you
know,
cover
that
part.
It's
basically
just
about.
You
know
how
banks
can
just
meet
the
safety
and
some
of
his
assessment
of
different
crypto
activities
and
providing
some
you
know,
guidance
about
how
supervisors
will
evaluate
you,
know
safety
and
soundness
of
crypto
related
activities.
The
bank
is
a
small
part
of
this,
even
though
some
banks
are
starting
to
look
into
crypto
activities.
F
They
are
not
the
major
players
in
this
field.
There
are
crypto
firms,
many
of
those
have
a
different
licenses,
some
of
them
regulated
as
the
trust
companies,
but
majority
are
just
technology
companies.
So
that
is
a
space
that
I
anticipate.
That's
why
I
was
like
when
we
think
about
how
many
you
know,
crypto
firms
that,
in
this
space
and
think
about
you
know
just
we
have
what
like
a
like,
a
huge
crypto
market
with
a
huge
volatility
captures.
F
You
know
pretty
about
fifty
percent
of
their
news
feeds
every
morning,
and
so
this
is.
This
will
be
the
top
priority
list
of
many
regulators,
sec
and
cfpb
included.
B
You
have
a
follow-up.
This
was
a
thank
you
and
thank
you
for
giving
me
so
much
time.
Senator
dennis.
I
thought
I
saw
your
hand.
Yes,
thank
you,
so
I
I'm
just
kind
of
thinking
about
this.
From
a
state
perspective
I
mean
I
could
see
a
federal
perspective
also,
but
from
a
state
perspective,
what
should
we
be
concerned
about
as
cryptocurrency
becomes
more
and
more
used?
I
mean.
Is
this
something
that's
gonna
impact
our
revenue?
B
Is
there
something
I
mean?
Are
there
things
that
we
need
to
be
looking
at
and
perhaps
looking
to.
F
So
I,
what
we
can
share
is
some
of
the
observations
of
what
other
states
have
been
doing.
New
york,
for
example,
new
york,
has
been
the
new
york
dfs
department
of
financial
services
have
been
regulating
stable
coins
and
stablecoin
issuers
for
a
long
time.
Wyoming
has
a
special
purpose,
a
depository
institution
charter.
So
in
those
days
we
are
seeing
some,
I
think
policy
drives
to
say
you
know,
let's
normalize
this
regulation
and
let
crypto
companies
operate
in
our
space.
F
Other
states
can
have
a
different
initiatives,
but
even
new
york
state,
for
example,
recently
came
up
with
a
like.
A
different
part
of
the
state
government
came
up
with
the
momentum
on
a
bitcoin
mining,
so
basically
considering
the
environmental
impact
and
so
wanted
to
run
in
that
activity.
F
California
state
came
up
with
the
executive
order.
I
think,
just
a
couple
of
weeks
ago,
looking
at
digital
assets
related
activities,
I
understand
the
focus
will
be
on
consumer
protection.
F
So
those
are
some
of
the
observations
we
have
seen
from
state
governments,
but
I
think
a
lot
of
you
know
policy
initiatives
depending
on
priorities.
G
Yeah-
and
I
can
I'll
just
underscore
my
my
colleague's
comments,
so
what
I
would
say
is
forum
like
like
this,
where
there's
a
public
comment
period,
there's
a
fair
amount
of
new
technology
and
new
use
cases
and
new
activities,
and
you
know
whether
it's
bringing
something
up
for
public
comment,
bringing
you
know
again,
sort
of
informational,
testimonial
sessions
such
as
this
are,
I
can't
stress
the
importance
of
those
enough.
B
Thank
you.
You
know.
My
concern
is
that
you
know
we
tend
to
so
well.
Sometimes
we
tend
to
be
behind
when.
G
B
G
To
help
us
to
stay
up
with
this,
so
that
we're
not
you
know
talking
about
after
the
fact:
how
do
we,
you
know?
How
do
we
fix.
F
So
if
this
sort
of
our
conversation
helps,
you
know
it's
part
of
our
job
to
be
for
looking
in
our
job
and
to
capture
some
of
these
trends.
We
have
been
monitoring.
You
know,
what's
going
on
in
fintech
for
more
than
five
years
crypto
in
more
than
three
years.
So
any
first
thing
we
can,
we
can
do
to
you
know
just
the
knowledge,
sharing
and
information
sharing.
We
are
happy
to
hear
more
suggestions
from
you
and
I'm
also
biased,
as
a
regular
testing
regulatory
community
will
always
be.
F
You
know
more
than
once
that
lacking
you
know
the
industry
development
that,
especially
so
for
crypto
and
fintech
community.
So
it's
just
like
this
innovations
powered
by
technology.
The
pace
we're
seeing
in
business
models.
If
you
have
firms
bad
banks,
collaboration
with
them
is
not
the
same
pace
anymore.
From
what
we
used
to
see.
You
know
the
notification,
notifying
your
supervisors,
getting
feedback
right
so
right
now,
it's
almost
like
some
banks
are
thinking
about
launching
new
products
in
a
very
short
period
of
time.
So
definitely
a
challenge
for
bank
regulators
as
well.
F
A
Okay,
any
additional
questions.
A
Okay,
so
I
have
a
couple:
I
need
to
fire
these
right
off
the
bow.
Okay,
this
I
don't
know
if
the
nerd
in
you
allows
me
to
do
the
crossover
into
tax
land,
but
if
you
say
no,
it
doesn't.
I
will
keep.
I
will
keep
my
crossover
question
to
myself
and
then
I
will
just
continue
to
research
in
the
space.
A
A
I
feel
like
a
lot
of
the
young
people
in
the
data
that
you
presented.
Number
one
shows
that
a
lot
of
young
people
or
millennials
see
this
as
their
way
to
wealth,
probably
the
fast
way
to
wealth
if
they
go
into
currency
cryptocurrency.
But
what
I,
what
I'm
super
confused
about
is.
A
I
know
that
it's
determined
off
of
a
fair
market
value,
but
what
I
don't
understand
is
how
that
fair
market
value
is
determined
when
we
know
the
market
is
volatile
right.
I
know
that
there
is
a
point
in
time
in
which
we
determine
the
receipt,
but
talk
to
me
about
how
fair
market
value
was
calculated
in
a
hourly
to
hourly
volatile
market.
G
It's
a
matter
what
I
would
say
I
I
can
say
is
I
mean
I'm
not
that
well
versed
on
it,
but
it
is
the
fair
market.
It's
it's
a
it's,
a
fairly
fluid
supply
and
demand
market
and,
as
far
as
what
we
would
probably
conventionally
think
of,
as
you
know
some
entity
providing
that
it's
you
know
it.
I
would
have
to
say
it's
pretty
much.
You
know
acknowledge,
for
you
know
that
volatility
for
what
it
is
and
it's
it's
a
source.
There's
an
entire
industry.
That
kind
of
goes
along.
G
But
it's
it's
a
it's
a
source
of
constant
attention,
but
it's,
but
we
do
when
you're
talking
about
a
sort
of
a
borderless
open
source
infrastructure
and
trying
to
establish
some
of
those.
You
know
that
level
of
insight.
It's
it
can
be
difficult.
G
So
when
you
have
a
market
when
that
doesn't
have
a
trading
closing
day
and
the
entities
settle
in
about
not
at
the
you
know,
at
the
end
of
the
day,
but
in
10
minutes
and
something
that
happens
in
asia
can
affect
the
price
in
another
area
it
makes
it
makes
trying
to
and
again
I
don't
want
to
not
an
expert
on
bitcoin
pricing,
but
it
does
make
kind
of
lend
that
volatility
and
kind
of
makes
that
aspect
difficult.
F
So
let
me
if
I
could
chime
in
here
and
if
you
think
about
how
much
cap
is
calculated,
it's
actually
even
for
traditional
financial
asset.
It's
not
a
hundred
percent
straightforward.
Let's
think
about
the
case
when
one
asset
is
listed
on
two
different
markets
and
there
is
arbitrage
opportunity
between
the
two,
then
all,
let's
think
about
a
case
where
there's
otc
market
as
well
right.
F
So
it's
the
any
market
cap
estimate,
even
in
the
traditional
finance
sense,
is
the
estimate
and
which
is
why
actually,
it's
very
important
to
cite
our
sources
when
we,
when
we
try
to
talk
about
market
cap
in
general,
then
of
in
crypto's
case
it's
more
complicated
because
exchanges
are
fragmented,
so
there
are
there.
So,
first
of
all,
there's
no
official
statistics.
There's
no
country
borderline
is
right.
That's
different
from
traditional
financial
market
statistics.
F
There
are
some
statistics
that
come
from
say,
coin
metrics
coin
market
cap.
That
industry
basically
collectively
recognizes
more
reputable
than
some
of
the
other
sources.
Then
they
verify
some
of
the
holdings
at
different
exchanges
and
do
a
bottom
up
sort
of
estimate.
But
still
that
is
something
that
probably
just
captures
part
of
the
market
and
not
being
paramount.
F
Now
on
the
because
it's
software
and
sorry
I'm
sorry
because
it's
software,
it
actually
makes
it
easier
to
capture
this
on
a
you
know:
24
7
basis.
So
if
the
extent
they
can
verify
technically,
you
know
what's
on
the
blockchain,
they
can
attach
a
price
tag
to
that.
That
is
actually
that
part
of
being
able
to
update
in
a
more
instant
fashion.
I
think
crypto
is
doing
a
better
job
than
traditional
financial
assets.
So
sorry,.
A
That's
a
lot,
none!
No!
It's
fine!
So
I'm
going
to
ask
a
theoretical
question
because
I
know
that
banks,
banks
are
trying
to
have
this
conversation
about
accepting
cryptocurrency.
Our
our
financial
division
institution
is
just
waiting
for
what
the
feds
are
going
to
do
in
this
space.
But
just
theoretically,
let's
say
banks
in
our
state
start
to
accept
this
as
income.
A
What
are
the
conversations
that
they're
having
around
the
conflicts
of
accepting
this
is
income,
because
there
is
there's
no
delivery,
location,
there's
no
billing
location.
So
there
are
banking
rules
which
you
have
to
identify
yourself
more
than
the
identifier
number,
and
you
actually,
you
know
we
have
wire
fraud.
We
have
all
of
these
things
that
say
how
you
move
money,
but
it
makes
it.
What
makes
this
super
super
interesting
is
that
I
found
out
that
the
irs
sees
cryptocurrency
as
property
and
they
treat
it
as
if
it
is
a
property
transaction.
A
So
you
know
if
we're
going
old
school
with
bartering
goods.
Okay,
that
makes
sense,
but
if
it's
property
and
not
truly
a
foreign
currency
or
being
treated
as
something
equivalent
to
a
foreign
currency,
but
actually
being
seen
as
a
property,
how
does
that
work
like
I?
I
don't
see
it
working,
but
maybe
there
are
federal
conversations
in
you
know
in
the
in
the
in
the
land
of
fairy
bitcoin
that
I'm
gonna
learn
today.
F
Thanks
for
this
question,
which
obviously
is
this
is
going
to
be
a
question-
I
do
not
have
answers
about
and
I
think
I'm
going
to
add
to
my
list
of
all
of
the
things
that
I
need
to
learn
from
the
accounting
community,
but
I
I
think
I
have
a
I
I
may
know
some
of
the
institutions
you're
talking
about,
and
I
trust
that
supervisory
colleagues
on
the
federation
side
are
in
talk
with.
F
You
know
the
financial
regulators
at
norada
state,
so
the
only
thing
will
say
that
it's
very
difficult
to
discuss
this
with
the
broad
brush,
because
I
I
personally
haven't
seen
two
critical
proposals
that
look
exactly
the
same,
so
it
matters
you
know
who's
doing
what
is
a
subsidiary.
It's
a
whole
economy
level.
It's
a
bank
level
like
even
let's
say
a
bank
wants
to
do,
wants
to
offer
a
custodian
services.
Is
it
direct,
custodies
custodian
services?
Do
they
use
a
third
party
sub
custody?
F
What
does
the
protocol
look
like?
What
a
contract
look
like?
So
that's
where
we
feel
you
know,
there's
a
lot
to
drill
down
and
I'll,
be
humble
and
say:
supervisors.
We
are
trying
to
learn
from
this
process
because
there's
always
something
new
for
us
to
learn
as
we
go
through
each
case.
So
I
know
that's
not
a
satisfying
answer,
but
no
no.
A
It's
fine,
I
mean,
as
as
you
continue,
your
journey
I'll
be
looking
out
for
those
white
papers.
I'm
still
I
I
so
I
I
don't
know
if
I
should
ask
my
final
question
because
it
was
on
nft
if
I
should
just
save
that
for
a
future
white
paper
on
how
the
federal
reserve
bank
does
analysis
on
nft's,
the
non-fungible
tokens
and
how
they're
working
in
this
space,
I.
A
D
I
I
think
that
this
has
kind
of
already
been
talked
around,
but
it
was
my
understanding
that
bitcoins
cryptocurrency
block
change.
All
of
that
was
created
to
take
out
the
middlemen
to
work
around
the
entire
financial
institution
system.
So,
if
that's
like
the
basis
of
this
whole
idea,
do
you
foresee,
as
far
as
regulations
going
there
being
like
a
bifurcation
of
stable,
crisp
cryptocurrency?
D
Or
I
guess
this
is
the
best
way
to
attach
it?
That's
collateralized,
as
opposed
to
the
the
type
of
cryptocurrency
that
wants
to
stay
outside
the
entire
system.
Or
do
you
see
at
some
point
all
of
this
coming
together
and
you
know
the
borg
sort
of
swallowing
all
the
cryptocurrency
and
just
making
it
part
of
our
regular
financial
system.
G
I'll,
so
simply
when
I'll
answer
that
first
and
I'll
pass
it
to
cindy,
I
think
to
your
to
your
point.
Yes,
so
if
you,
if
you
go
back
to
it,
was
halloween
2008
when
satoshi
nakamoto
released
his
white
paper,
that
was
his
intent
and
if
within
a
very
short
period
of
in
and
that's
what
the
technology
can
enable.
G
However,
that
the
trend
has
been
among
consumers
and
we
showed
it
on
that
slide.
You
know
that
cindy
showed
where
there's
a
preference
for
a
consumer
or
a
citizen's
financial
institution,
that's
where
they
feel.
If
you
know
they're,
not
saying
I
want
to
go
to
something
called
an
unhosted
wallet
I
want
to.
If
I'm
going
to
get
into
this,
I
want
to
go
to
an
entity
that
I
trust
and-
and
I
think
that's
you
know-
opposed
to
sort
of
my
opinion
where
I
see
that
trend
happening
and
that's
sort
of
consistently
happened.
G
Ever
since
satoshi
released
his
white
papers
that
yeah
there
was
a
lot
of
peer-to-peer
exchanges
outside
of
formal
financial
structure
as
he
intended,
but
it
was
the
formal
financial
structure
that
ensured
you
know,
licensed
regulated
entities
that
provided
those
consumer
protections
and
I'll
say
just
to
your
manager.
G
When
you
made
the
point
about
nfts
today,
you
have
to
it's
a
fairly
complex
process
and
it's
a
where
you
have
to
use
in
this
thing
called
an
unhosted
wallet
and
there's
a
lot
of
risks
to
an
individual
and
that's
another
and
it
in
a
another
aspect
of
this
ecosystem
that
people
want
to
get
involved.
They
think
there's
some
value
in
non-fungible
tokens,
but
they
want
to
have
those
protections
and
they're
very
cognizant,
and-
and
so
I
think,
assemblywoman
that's
you
know,
there's
always
going
to
be.
G
You
know,
peer-to-peer
exchanges
and
you
know
operating
outside
of
that,
but
I
think
the
trend
is
that
most
people
want
to
use
it
as
a
new
technology
but
in
within
the
regulated
perimeter,
and
that
seems
to
be
the
trend.
F
I
I'll
chime
in
here.
I
want
to
be
careful,
but
I
have
a
view
on
this.
I
think
the
direction
will
be
we
will
meet
somewhere
in
the
middle,
so
as
the
crypto
community,
as
erin
mentioned,
set
out
to
be
that
alternative
to
traditional
financial
systems.
F
Once
activities
start
to
intersect
with,
say,
institutional
investors
there's
no
way
to
avoid
interacting
with
the
regulated
financial
system
and
what
we
are
seeing,
even
in
some
of
the
d5
projects,
even
though
their
philosophy
say
you
know,
cut
the
middleman
doesn't
have
a
direct.
You
know
peer-to-peer
financing,
but
they
also
put
into
infrastructure
that
actually
serve
as
sort
of
a
middleman.
F
Maybe
it's
not
a
bank,
but
that's
another
question
like
should
they
be
regulated
that
another
question,
but
that's
so
what
I
think
aaron
previously
mentioned
this
concept
of
centralized
finance
instead
of
decentralized
finance,
and
that
is
a
model
where
you
know
when
crypto
community
they
want
to
get
into
grow
into
scale,
engage
in
traditional
financial
institutions
at
their
customers.
A
Okay,
so
I
wanted
I
want
to
thank
you
for
your
presentation
today.
It
it
has
left
it's
left
with
a
lot
of
question
marks
and
how
I
view
it
that
it
is
volatile
and-
and
we
should
be
very
careful
with
it-
and
I'm
I'm
so
grateful,
mr
english,
that
you
didn't
break
into
some.
You
know
in
2008
and
halloween
once
upon
a
time
there
was.
I
was
like
where
what
I
couldn't.
A
I
couldn't
leave
that
alone
without
some
type
of
joke-
and
I
was
like,
is
this
going
to
be
a
horrible
halloween
story
so?
But,
but
with
that,
I
will.
I
will
close
this
out
and
I
thank
you
guys
so
much
for
coming
and
we
will
transition
to
gaming
control
board
presentation.
C
C
Division
is
your
staff
just
as
a
way
of
possibly
explanation
or
apology
for
the
members
of
the
committee,
as
well
as
for
commissioner
keith
kepper
and
chairman
gibson
and
mr
barbie,
that
you
just
received
their
presentation
material
this
morning
and
it
did
make
it
in
the
packet
that
went
out
and
that's
what
was
because
we
didn't
realize
it
until
this
morning,
but
lcb's
been
having
some
outlook,
email
issues
this
week
in
terms
of
emails,
possibly
going
out
or
coming
in
and
or
being
delayed,
and
so
I
just
wanted
to
put
on
the
record
for
that
for
the
members
of
the
committee
and
again
for
the
presenters
that
they
actually
the
email
that
we
got
thursday
morning
was
sent
to
us
tuesday
morning.
C
And
so
I
just
that's
the
reason
why
it
wasn't
in
the
packet
and
just
getting
it
laid.
And
so
thank
you,
madam
chair.
I
just
wanted
to
make
that
information
part
of
the
record
as
to
what
was
going
on
in
terms
of
being
able
to
get
this
information
to
the
committee
members.
E
I'm
okay,
I'm
okay!
Thank
you
for
the
record,
my
name
is
ben
kiekefer.
I
am
very
pleased
to
appear
before
you
and
your
committee
today
as
a
member
of
the
nevada
state
gaming
commission,
and
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
cryptocurrency
and
gaming.
I'm
joined
by
gaming
control
board
chairman
brent
gibson
and
rit
chief
jim
barbie,
who
are
going
to
provide
the
vast
majority
of
the
detail
and
lend
their
expertise
to
this
discussion.
E
The
first
was
senate
bill
164,
which
added
virtual
currencies
to
the
list
of
intangible
personal
property,
and
it
was
put
in
as
a
another
item
in
the
list
that
was
exempt
from
taxation
in
our
state.
It's
you
know,
bonds,
stocks
notes,
other
things
like
that.
Virtual
currency
was
added
to
that
list.
It
was
also
incorporated
through
senate
bill
44
as
property
for
the
purposes
of
the
state's
unclaimed
property
act.
E
I'm
a
believer
that
it's
our
responsibility
to
continuously
adopt
the
needs
of
our
customers
in
a
responsible
way
and
adapt
our
processes
to
reflect
the
demand
that
they're
putting
in
front
of
us,
and
I
think
it's
inevitable-
that
cryptocurrencies
will
be
a
currency
by
which
people
want
to
make
wagers.
E
And
I
think
that
we
need
to
be
prepared
for
what
that
looks
like
from
a
regulatory
perspective,
as
well
as
a
taxation
perspective,
which
is
probably
most
relevant
to
this
commitment
and
to
ensure
that
the
state
continues
to
receive
the
tax
revenue
it
deserves
and
needs,
as
a
part
of
any
wager
is
made
using
cryptocurrency.
So,
madam
chair,
with
your
indulgence,
I'd
like
to
turn
it
over
to
bryn
gibson,
to
provide
his
presentation
and
give
you
a
little
bit
more
detail.
I
Thank
you,
madam
chair
members
of
the
committee,
I'm
brian
gibson,
chairman
of
the
gaming
control
board.
This
is
jim
barbie,
our
chief
of
the
technology
division
we've
been
invited
to
hear.
We
have
a
powerpoint
presentation
that
I
think
that
you
chief
we're
going
to
put
on.
B
I
Some
of
this
is
duplicative,
and
I
apologize
for
that.
It
was
with
the
last
presentation
there
there
are
common
elements
to
cryptocurrency
is
cryptocurrency
in
the
gaming
space.
It's
there's
some
unique
aspects
of
it,
but
there
will
be
some
crossover,
let's
see
here,
all
right.
So
we'll
start
with
some
fundamentals,
and
I
apologize
if
these
are
things
that
are
obvious
to
you.
Blockchain
is
a
blockchain.
Is
the
underlying
technology
beneath
cryptocurrencies
and
blockchain
is
a
publicly
public
distributed
ledger?
I
Recording
methodology
for
transactions
and
a
transaction
can
include
anything
of
value,
so
you
can
a
deed
can
be
transferred
or
transacted
upon
a
car
title.
Could
software
can
most
often
blockchain
transactions
are
used
to
record
transactions
involving
virtual
currency
or
cryptocurrency?
As
you
call,
blockchain
technology
keeps
an
automatically
generated
encrypted
record
or
ledger
of
all
transactions
in
which
is
it.
It
is
employed.
I
This
is
a
graphic
of
the
way
the
ledgers
work,
so
there
are
various
nodes
that
are
associated
with
a
cryptocurrency
and
ledgers
associated
with
those
nodes.
I
So
on
each
one
of
these
ledgers,
each
block
as
part
of
the
blockchain
for
a
transaction
would
record
certain
elements
of
the
transaction
for,
and
this
is
one
of
the
things
that
makes
it
so
it
makes
cryptocurrency
relatively
difficult
to
to
manipulate
so,
for
example,
with
bitcoin
you'd
have
there
are
15
000
different
nodes
and
each
and
with
each
node
there's
an
associated
ledger,
and
so
in
order
to
manipulate
bitcoin,
for
example,
you'd
have
to
you'd
have
to
go
in
and
for
with
51
percent
or
40
or
50
point.
I
I
I
It
serves
as
a
metaphorical
block
and
it's
added
to
the
existing
chain
of
similar
transactional
blocks,
and
that's
where
the
term
blockchain
comes
from,
and
so
it's
effectively
a
ledger
or
chain
of
custody
is
what
it
what
it
serves
as
an
ideal.
Blockchain
record
is
encrypted.
It
contains
redundancies,
that
is,
there
are
ledgers
associated
with
each
node,
and
there
are
many
many
nodes
associated
with
the
with
each
currency,
and
this
ensures
that
the
record
is
not
tampered
with
or
falsified
or
altered
unnecessarily
or
unjustifiably.
I
The
unbroken
record
adheres
to
strict
chain
of
custody
rules
and
is
shared
or
distributed
among
every
member
of
the
blockchain,
and
these
blockchains
are
compared
automatically
for
discrepancies.
Each
new
transaction
is
added
to
the
record.
Is
time
stamped
and
verified
by
all
this
using
the
blockchain
to
insure
validity?
I
This
is
an
example
of
a
block,
and
so
if
we
had
a
block
transaction,
a
block,
a
transaction
block
on
a
ledger
with
bitcoin,
for
example,
you'd
have
15
000
different
nodes
with
with
each
transaction
as
part
of
a
ledger,
and
it
contained
a
header,
a
hash
function
and
then
a
date
to
be
timestamped.
I
So
digital
currencies
are
one
of
the
applications
of
blockchain
technologies.
There
are,
there
are
many
of
these.
There
are.
I
think
there
are
roughly
1583
according
to
a
a
market
cap
website,
that
I
that
I
look
at
relatively
frequently
and
these
they
vary
widely
in
their
legitimacy.
Some
are
very
legitimate
bitcoin,
for
example,
and
some
are
extraordinarily
illegitimate,
depending
on
the
the
depth
of
the
market,
how
widely
they're
traded,
how
well
they're
known
what
the
underlying
system
looks
like
and
so
on.
I
Cryptocurrencies
they're
not
issued
by
a
bank
at
this
point
and
they're
or
protected
by
government
rules
in
the
same
way
that
fiat
currency
is
and
they're
not
issued
by
a
central
bank,
as
you
just
heard
from
the
san
francisco
fed-
and
this
is
where
the
term
decentralization
comes
from.
So
it's
a
decentralized
type
of
currency,
the
intersection
of
digital
currency
and
gambling
was
inevitable.
I
I
think
cryptocurrencies
do
provide
certain
transactional
benefits
and
these
are
the
we're
going
to
talk
about
the
risks
in
just
a
moment,
but
I
also
want
to
acknowledge
some
of
the
benefits.
I
First
of
all,
the
transactional
fees
associated
with
with
cryptocurrency
transactions
are
can
be
much
lower
than
a
wire
fee,
for
example,
or
going
through
account
creation.
Just
everything
associated
with
traditional
banking
transactions,
including
getting
an
actual
account
at
a
bank,
can
be
a
high
cost
for
some
people,
and
so
cryptocurrencies
do
present
lower
transactional
costs.
Generally,
the
payment
confirmation
occurs
immediately.
I
The
transactions
are
irreversible,
which
lowers
certain
fraud,
risks
relative
to
traditional
currencies,
so
they
can't
be
undone
and
certain
indicators
of
ownership
are
recorded
in
each
distributed,
ledger
block
and-
and
there
are
many
who
argue
that
this
personalized
well
identification
associated
with
someone
behind
the
the
ledger.
The
ledger
hashtag
makes
the
the
know.
Your
customer
types
of
issues
that
we
deal
with
in
the
gaming
space,
less
important
to
the
transaction.
I
The
lower
cryptocurrency
transactional
fees
may
allow
for
greater
casino.
Bonusing
advocates
would
argue
so.
The
lower
the
I
mean
the
margins
and
some
types
of
gaming
sports
wagering,
for
example,
are
extraordinarily
low
or
small,
and
so
the
greater
the
the
lower
the
additional
fees
or
transactional
costs
of
of
a
certain
kind
of
wagering.
The
greater
the
potential
bonus
thing
there
is
one
transfer,
it
occurs
outside
of
traditional
banking
systems.
I
They're
simple
advocates
would
argue,
and
individual
identities
are
not
generally
tied
to
a
transaction,
creating
greater
potential
for
a
type
of
anonymity,
and
this
is
referred
to
generally
as
pseudo-sudan
pseudo-nominee
or
pseudonymity.
The
electronic
nature
of
cryptocurrencies
may
appeal
to
a
different
demographic
group.
This
is
an
important
point.
I
This
last
point
the
san
francisco
fed
mentioned,
and
they
had
a
data
graphic
talking
to
speaking
to
the
group
that
is
most
interesting,
cryptocurrencies
and
as
nevada
attempts
to
widen
its
gaming
market,
allowing
cryptocurrencies
to
be
used
either
on
the
floor
prior
to
the
wager
itself
or
actually
in
wagering,
is
one
of
the
things
that
we
hear
most
from
the
industry
that
might
appeal
to
younger
and
different
types
of
demographic
groups.
I
There
are
risks,
and
we've
heard
a
number
of
those
risks
mentioned
already
associated
with
cryptocurrencies
in
in
the
gaming
market.
There
there's
they're,
especially
unique
so
gaming
gambling
establishments,
casinos
that
have
that
have
gross
gaming
revenues
above
a
certain
amount,
are
subject
to
title
31
or
the
bank
secrecy
act,
and
this
is
a
list
of
the
the
risks
and
we'll
just
quickly
go
through
each
one,
but
just
just
for
your
sort
of
your
your
preview.
So
you
have
this
in
mind.
I
There
are
market
risks,
shallow
market
problems,
counterparty
risks,
transactional
operational
risk,
privacy
related
risks.
There
are
legal
and
regulatory
risks,
eml
challenges,
including
the
use
of
currency
mixers,
and
there
are
some
transactions
that
allow
for
multiple
walls
to
be
used
at
the
same
time,
which
makes
it
makes
it
difficult
to
trace
back
to
an
individual,
any
particular
transaction.
I
So
the
market
risks
we
heard
from
the
san
francisco
fed
that
there's
great
volatility
in
crypto
markets,
and
this
is
the
case.
This
is
a
graphic
that
shows
trading
volume
and
trading
trading
activity
associated
with
crypto
markets
and,
depending
on
the
the
type
of
cryptocurrency
we're
talking
about.
The
volatile
volatility
can
be
considerable.
Over
the
last
few
weeks,
we've
seen
some
of
that.
I
The
shallow
market
problem
is
one
that
is
substantial
it.
What
what
this
is
is
if
you
have
a
cryptocurrency
that
is
not
widely
traded,
meaning
that
it's
relatively
new
and
there
are
only
a
certain
other,
a
small
number
of
those
who
hold
the
currency
or
own
it.
It
can
be
manipulated
very
easily
by
a
large
by
trading
large
blocks
of
it.
So
this
is.
I
I
There
are
counter
party
risks.
These
are
these
vary
in
tight,
but
one
of
the
problems
with
cryptocurrencies
and
counterparty
risk
is
that
if
the
underlying
cryptocurrency
exchange
is
illegitimate
or
if
it's
seized
by
the
federal
government
or
by
a
state
agency,
the
people
who
who
are
using
the
exchange
may
lose
their
funds
and
there
there
is
no
fdic
insurance.
For
example,
the
250
000
amount
that
we
know
exists
for
insured
banks
and
and
credit
unions
does
not
exist
for
for
cryptocurrency
exchanges.
I
There
another
type
of
counterparty
risk
is
just
fraud.
You've
got,
as
you
can
see
here,
different
different
types
of
scams,
and
there
are
many
in
number
and
they
they
they're
they
different
source.
You've
got
you've,
got
ddos
attacks,
you've
got
and
you've
got
a
different.
You've
got
mining
scams
here.
I
Another
problem
that
you
see
is
that
transaction
permanency
and
is
it
can
be
a
problem
because
when
you
have
15
000
different
nodes
and
ledgers
associated
with
each
one
of
the
nodes,
if
there's
an
errant
transaction,
it's
not
reversible.
So
it's
not
easy
to
fix
a
problem
with
a
transaction.
I
Anonymity
in
the
cryptocurrency
space
is
something
that's
it's
it's
an
interesting
issue.
I
I
assemblywoman
considine
mentioned
that
cryptocurrencies
were
established
in
the
beginning
to
sort
of
circumvent
or
go
around
the
traditional
financial
markets,
and
one
of
the
reasons
one
of
the
one
of
the
elements
of
that
was
anonymity.
I
I
I
recently
had
a
discussion
with
the
a
leader
of
a
a
gaming
leader
of
a
foreign
nation,
and
we
were-
and
he
asked
me
about
cryptocurrency
use
and
gambling-
and
I
said
well,
cryptocurrency
is
you
know
something?
That's
a
hot
topic,
it's
something
on
the
front
of
our
at
the
front
of
our
minds,
and
but
we
do
have
to
know
your
customers,
something
that
adheres
in
the
gaming
space
you
have
to.
I
I
True
anonymity,
if,
if
we're
going
to
talk
about
anonymity
would
require
both
that
you
have
a
a
hashtag
associated
with
someone
and
that
it's
unlinkable
to
that
to
an
individual
person
and
for
anonymity
different
interactions
of
the
same
individual
using
different
public
key
hashes
should
be
difficult
to
link
to
the
individual.
I
Now
it's
it's
not
all
that
difficult
to
create
multiple
ident
identities
on
or
with
a
cryptocurrency.
So
you
can
generate
these
key
hashes.
The
same
person
could
create
multiple
key
hashes
and
it
could
be
very,
very
difficult
to
trace
back
to
the
individual
these
these
multiple
transactions
that
occur
through
these
different
key
hashes.
I
There
are
legal
and
regulatory
risks
that
we
deal
with
you
if
a
I
mentioned
this
already,
but
if,
if
an
exchange
is
seized
or
forced
to
stop
operating
due
to
illicit
activity
or
due
to
being
named
on
a
a
a
a
foreign
nationalist
that
to
say,
fincen
puts
out
it,
it
could
cause
for
anyone
who's
who's
involved
in
that
exchange
to
lose
their
their
investment.
I
Untraceable
digital
currencies,
they
they
they
tend
to
be
used,
or
they
are
often
used
to
facilitate
illicit
activity
such
as
tax
evasion
and
sale
of
illegal
items.
I
There's
a
website
by
the
name
of
silk
road
that
some
of
you
may
heard
of,
and
it's
that
was
one
of
the
big
biggest
examples
of
illicit
activity
and
illicit
goods
that
were
for
sale
using
cryptocurrencies.
I
One
of
the
major
anti-money
laundering
challenges
that
we
face
in
the
context
of
cryptocurrencies
is
the
use
of
mixers
and
I'll.
Show
you
a
graphic
of
a
mixer
on
the
next
page,
but
mixers
are
an
attempt
to
obfuscate
the
identity
of
the
individual,
be
behind
the
identity,
hash
and,
and
so
what
they
do.
Is
they
pull
these
these
these
identity
hashes,
and
they
then
push
that
they
then
transact
in
a
way,
that's
very
difficult
to
trace
back
to
an
individual
person
any
any
particular
transaction.
I
There
was
recently
an
action
by
fincen
and
by
the
department
of
treasury
against
a
group
by
the
name
of
the
lazarus
group.
It
was
actually
three
or
four
different
companies
out
of
north
korea
and
they
created
back
doors
into
a
cryptocurrency
and
hacked
roughly
620
million
dollars
worth
of
of
value.
I
There
are
nation
states
that
fincen
has
formally
deemed
potentially
threatening
to
national
security,
and
a
number
of
these
states
or
countries
do
have
extensive
cryptocurrency
networks.
They
have
vast
mining
networks,
net
network
cryptocurrency,
mining
networks,
iran,
russia
and
venezuela
are
examples.
I
I
There's
also
the
problem
of
multi-wallet
transactions,
and
I've
mentioned
this-
I
mentioned
this
just
a
moment
ago
that
one
one
individual
can
generate
multiple
identity,
hashes
and
they
can
be
in
multiple
wallets
and
these
these
different
wallets
or
these
different
identity
hashes,
can
be
used
in
a
single
transaction
and
I'll
show
you
a
slide
next.
That
shows
how
this
is
done.
I
This
is
an
example
of
a
multi-address
purchase
or
pooling,
and
so
in
this
case
you'd
have
you
know
a
person
who's
buying
from
a
large
box
store
it's
a
a
tea
kettle
and
you
could.
You
could
have
identity
addresses
associated
with
one
person,
but
there
could
be
three
different
different
again.
Identity
addresses
all
pooled
and
funded
to
number
eight
there
and
that
allows
the
purchase
of
the
the
capital.
I
In
march
of
2022,
president
biden,
he
published
an
executive
order.
That
is
a
very
important
document.
I
think
for
all
of
us
to
understand
and
to
be
aware
of,
and
the
name
of
it
is
ensuring
responsible
development
of
digital
assets.
I
Excuse
me:
it's
a
it's.
The
first
whole
government
approach
to
addressing
risks
and
and
harnessing
the
potential
of
digital
assets
and
discrete
distributed
ledger
technology.
There
are
six
key
priorities
that
president
biden
laid
out
in
this
document.
Consumer
and
investor
protection
is
first
and
foremost,
and
I
think
that
question
was
asked,
or
there
was
a
note.
There
was
someone
who
made
a
comment
to
that.
To
that
effect,
financial
stability
is
another
one.
Illicit
illicit
financing
is
another
key
element.
I
U.S
leadership
in
global
financing
systems
is
very
important,
and
the
government
does
play
an
important
role
as
a
regulator.
Financial
inclusion
is
another
goal
of
digital
assets
and
responsible
innovation.
That's
that's
really
the
mantra
if
you
were
to
take
one
out
and
put
it
above
all
the
rest
of
them,
it
would
be
responsible
innovation,
and
that's
that's
something
that
vincent
talks
about
regularly.
I
The
deputy
deputy
director
of
enforcement
and
compliance
for
fincen
and
as
an
aside
if
you're
not
familiar
with
vincent
vincent,
is
a
is
an
umbrella
organization
housed
in
the
department
of
department
of
treasury,
and
it
is
the
central
repository
for
financial
transactions
that
have
any
have
any
dealings
with
the
united
states.
I
These
must
occur
while
also
modernizing
the
us
and
global
payment
system,
and
this
is
what
president
biden
was
trying
to
what
he
really
is
laying
out
the
fundamental
principles
I
noted
was
responsible.
Financial
innovation
and
financial
institutions
under
the
bank.
Secrecy,
act
and
under
the
regulation
of
fincen
include
casinos,
so
we're
obligated
to
ensure
that
any
new
currency
offerings
are
executed
in
coordination
with
controls
commensurate
with
the
risk
of
the
new
payment
offering
new
financial
products
according
to
president
biden
and
according
to
fence,
and
they
have
to
they
have
to.
I
They
have
to
be
built
with
compliance
in
mind.
So
it
can't
be
the
case.
According
to
president
biden,
vincent,
that
a
virtual
asset
service
provider
builds
a
a
new
cryptocurrency
and
then
goes
back
and
attempts
to
create
compliance
or
build
compliance
into
the
asset
after
it's
already
out
there
on
the
market.
That's
that's!
That's
the
that's!
That's!
That's!
That's
a
backwards
approach
in
the
mind
of
president
biden
and
I
think,
he's
right,
fencing
guidance
in
the
context
of
casino
operations.
It's
it's
fairly
simple
and
very
clear.
I
Aml
and
cash
transaction
reporting
requirements
apply
to
financial
institutions
and
including
gaming,
licensees
dealing
with
cryptocurrencies
and
all
other
digital
assets.
The
same
way
they
do
to
financial
institutions
dealing
in
fiat
currency,
so
cash
transaction
reports,
suspicious
activity
reporting.
I
I
H
Yes,
thank
you.
This
is
jim
barbie
for
the
record,
I'm
the
chief
of
the
board's
technology
division,
in
addition
to
what
was
presented
by
the
previous
group
and
what
chair
gibson
has
talked
about
today.
The
casino
industry
has
some
unique
challenges
when
it
comes
to
making
use
of
cryptocurrency,
in
particular,
so
outside
of
the
bsa
requirements.
H
Perhaps
the
top
three
would
be
number
one:
they
have
to
calculate
their
taxes
and
report
their
taxes
in
dollars
and
cents
and
with
the
value
of
cryptocurrency
changing
you
know
hourly,
there
would
need
to
be
a
scheme
in
place
for
them
to,
at
any
particular
time,
be
able
to
evaluate
what
their
tax
burden
is.
Additionally,
we've
talked
about
patron
protection.
H
If
a
casino
were
holding
cryptocurrency
on
behalf
of
a
patron,
there
would
need
to
be
some
type
of
reserve
requirement
that
they
would
need
to
have
and
again
because
of
that
fluctuating
value
of
the
cryptocurrency.
H
There
might
be
some
challenges
in
determining
that
reserve
requirement,
but
one
of
the
most
interesting
aspects,
I
think
of
the
potential
use
of
cryptocurrency
for
gaming
operators,
would
be
using
it
to
conduct
actual
wagering
activity,
in
particular
conducting
future
wagering
activity,
and
that
would
be
in
the
realm
of
sports
wagering.
H
H
I
think
when
it
comes
to
making
use
of
cryptocurrency,
although
it's
not
specific
to
cryptocurrency,
I
think
there
was
some
talk
about
nfts
and
digital
assets
in
general,
and
that's
something
that
we've
seen
a
few
a
small
amount
of
interest
in
from
operators
now
on
how
the
board
and
commission
would
handle
digital
assets
like
nft,
for
example,
and
a
couple
of
potential
applications
of
nfts
in
the
gaming
space.
H
The
first
would
be
along
the
lines
of
an
award,
consider
a
slot
machine
that,
when
you
line
up
a
certain
combination
of
symbols,
instead
of
getting
paid
in
in
dollars
and
cents,
perhaps
it
was
an
nft
and
for
those
of
you
not
familiar
an
nft
or
a
non-fungible
token.
It's
really
a
unique
digital
asset,
primarily
they're
used
now
for
in
media
for
are
used
to
represent
media,
visual
and
audio
images.
H
But
let's
assume
that
a
licensee
was
advertising.
You
hit
the
progressive
and
instead
of
winning
dollars
and
cents
you're
winning
an
nft.
How
would
that
licensee
treat
that
nft
for
tax
reporting
purposes
that
one
for
us?
We
would
most
likely
look
at
that
as
they
would
any
other
asset
and
require
that
they
would
have
to
report
on
that
asset
for
whatever
its
cost
was
you
know,
for
example,
let's
say
you,
you
want
a
progressive
and
it
was
to
win
a
car.
H
Think
of
a
horse,
for
example,
in
a
horse
racing
game
where
this
horse
has
unique
aspects
to
it,
a
unique
characteristics
if
it's
good
in
a
straight
away,
if
it
has
burst
speed,
if
it
comes
on
heavy,
if
it
pulls
in
late
those
type
of
aspects,
those
can
all
be
coded
into
an
nft
and
someone
can
actually
own
that
horse
and
enter
that
horse
in
a
virtual
horse
race
against
horses
that
have
you
know
varying
attributes
to
them
and
then,
as
the
race
progresses,
there
are
rngs
called
that
compare
those
different
attributes
to
determine
who's
ultimately
going
to
win
that
event.
H
I'm
using
the
example
of
a
horse
race,
that's
the
most
straightforward,
but
you
could
really
conduct
that
type
of
gaming
activity
using
you.
Your
imagination
is
the
limit
of
what
you
could
include
that
it
could
be.
You
know
I'm
saying
horse
races.
It
could
be
spaceship
races.
You
could
have
sporting
events
that
are
conducted
where
you
know
the
players
are
nfts
among
themselves.
You
could
create
your
own
virtual
entity.
H
Let's
say
it
was
a
d
character
and
run
your
d
d
characters
through
some
type
of
campaign,
but
it
all
comes
back
to
those
game.
Elements
are
based
on
nfts
and
ultimately
they're
competing
against
one
another
based
on
their
assets,
where
the
outcome
is
determined
by
an
rng,
but
it's
an
exciting
space.
There's
a
lot
of
talk
for
sure
about
the
use
of
cryptocurrency
and
blockchain
in
general.
What
I've
seen
so
far
is
more
of
a
casual
interest,
I
think
from
the
industry
right
now.
H
The
actual
use
of
cryptocurrency,
aside
from
aside.
B
I
I
would
just
note
that
there
are:
there
are
cryptocurrency
based
casinos
now
they're
they
tend
to
be
internet-based
casinos,
they're,
not
licensed
or
regulated.
I
think
there's
one
that
is
licensed
not
in
this
country
and
one
of
the
reasons
why
cryptocurrencies
are
so
attractive
for
that
kind
of
gambling
is
that
it's
difficult
to
trace
the
activity
back
to
any
individual.
A
Hey,
so
thank
you
for
that
presentation
that
was
super,
informative
members,
questions.
A
D
So
initially,
when
mr
ki
keffer
talked,
he
talked
about
bills
that
were
passed,
making
cryptocurrencies
property
and
then
also
exempting
them
from
taxation.
So
having
this
conversation,
does
that
mean
if
this
conversation
or
these
ideas
move
forward?
There
needs
to
be
changes
in
the
nrs,
making
virtual
currencies,
currencies
and
not
property
and
changing
that
taxability
situation.
E
Thank
you.
I
appreciate
the
question
assemblywoman
constantine
ben
key
kepler
for
the
record.
You
know
ours.
I
pointed
out
that
our
statutes
really
do
reflect
virtual
currencies
as
intangible
personal
property
as
they
as
they
currently
stand.
I
don't
think
that
that
necessarily
prohibits
a
the
gaming
control
board
and
the
gaming
commission
to
promulgate
and
adopt
regulations
that
that
would
allow
for
the
use
of
cryptocurrency
and
wagering.
I
don't
think
they're
necessarily
mutually
exclusive.
E
A
I
have
a
couple:
I'm
super
glad
you
guys
put
up
the
wrist
slide
awesome.
So
a
couple
of
things
ran
through
my
mind,
so
I'm
going
to
do
the
simple
ones.
First,
if
you
were
to
accept
crypto-
and
I
and
I
understand
that-
there's
a
casual
interest
right
now,
how
would
you
deal
with
crypto
for
tips.
H
My
initial
thought
on
crypto
and
tips
is
we
don't
weigh
into
that
space
as
it
stands
right
now,
whether
or
not
a
person
makes
a
tip
using
currency
if
they
were
to
make
a
tip
using
show
tickets
or
jewelry
that's
somewhat
outside
of
our
purview
as
it
stands
right
now,
that's
my
understanding!
That's
a
good
one!
Yeah!
I
think
that's
right.
E
And
madam
chair
ben
ki
government
for
the
record,
I'd
also
weigh
in
that
different
properties
could
look
at
adoption
of
cryptocurrency
very
differently.
You
know
if
a
property
were
to
decide
to
actually
hold
crypto
and
accept
wagers
in
it.
That
would
be
one
thing.
There
could
also
be
an
intermediary
that
does
more
of
an
instantaneous
conversion
of
crypto
into
a
fiat
than
in
the
us
dollars.
E
A
I
H
H
A
Okay,
and
so
I
have
another
question-
that's
a
little
bit
more
involved
with,
I
guess
gaming
revenue
that's
received
so
and
this
I'm
curious
about
this
question.
I
don't
know
the
answer.
It's
just
something
I've
been
reading,
but
one
thing
I
learned
was
that
there
are
short
term
capital
gains
and
losses
associated
with
revenue
from
crypto
as
well.
So
let's
say
a
gaming
property
accepts
revenue
and-
and
there
could
be
because
now
it's
on
your
sheets-
how?
How
have
you
guys
internally
discussed
this?
A
Because
if
r,
if
the
crypto
is
up
you're,
getting
a
gain,
because
I
fair
market
value?
Actually,
you
know-
let's
say
they
fair
market
value
at
the
time
was
40
000,
but
it
it
jumped
to
50
000.,
there's
a
gain
and
it's
still
attributed
to
the
entity
because
it
is
revenue
that
is
being
received
and
then
has
to
be
reported,
etcetera,
etcetera,.
I
Take
your
assumptions,
as
fact
which
and
I've
known
you
long
enough
to
I'll-
do
that
with
confidence.
I
You're
talking
about
capital
gains
and
losses
that
have
to
be
accounted
for
by
the
by
the
entity
itself
and
then
ultimately
recorded
that
we'd
have
to
audit
those
it'd
be
a
complex
auditing
process
is
what
I
would
say.
We
have
about
80
auditors
here
inside
the
gaming
control
board,
and
it's
one
of
the
reasons
that
we
have
a
99
plus
tax
collection
rate
that
would
make
it
much
more
difficult.
I
assume
that
there'll
be
software
fixes
going
forward.
H
We
do
we
have
also
taken
into
concern.
I
don't
have
a
solid
answer
for
you
on
how
it
would
be
handled.
Madam
chair,
however,
internal
discussions
with
our
chief
of
audit
on
how
we
would
handle
cryptocurrency,
transact
or
cryptocurrency
that's
used
for
wagering.
The
question
comes
up.
If
it
loses
value,
is
that
a
loss,
a
gaming
loss?
H
This
would
be
outside
of
operating
revenue,
but
if
it
would
be
a
gaming
loss
or
a
win,
should
that
value
fluctuate,
and
I
think
that's
something
that
we
would
want
to
protect
against
that
if,
if
there
was
a
loss
due
to
the
significant
fluctuation
in
value,
does
the
state
take
a
hit
in
gaming
tax
paid
on
that?
So,
although
I
don't
have
an
answer
for
you,
that
is
something
that's
on
our
radar.
A
Okay,
good
because
I
know
that
some
of
the
early
irs
notices
have
been,
they
have
kind
of
answered
that
question
on
the
capital
gains
and
loss
piece,
but
I
just
think
internally,
I'm
glad
it's
on
your
radar,
because
I
think
that
if
you
guys
make
this
decision
in
the
future,
there's
some
extra
effort.
Also,
I
wanted
to
ask
a
question
about.
A
It:
was
the
third
party
network
transactions
there's
a
particular
rule
within
the
irs
on
how
they
treat
the
third
party
network
transactions?
And
I
think
you
guys
touched
on
that
a
little
bit,
but
I
I
guess
I
wanted
a
little
bit
more
understanding
on,
because
there
is
some
reporting
that
has
that
goes
into
that.
How?
What
have
you
guys
internally
looked
at
or
discussed
around
a
third-party
network
transaction?
That
is
that
is
receiving
payment
from
you.
I
H
We
do
have
an
entity,
that's
regulated.
It's
called
a
cash
access
and
wagering
instrument
service
provider
and
admittedly,
we
haven't
directly
explored
how
that
the
scenario
that
you're
describing
would
be
handled.
But
there
is
a
similar
structure
for
regulating
those
who
provide
cash
access
and
wagering
instruments.
A
A
My
understanding
is
that
income
from
an
nft
is
treated
as
inventory,
and
so
let's
say
you
accept,
you
end
up
collecting
an
nft
because
it's
a
part
of
a
transaction.
Are
you
now
I
mean?
Are
you
internally
the
conversations
that
you're
having
are
you're
now
in
possession
of
what
the
irs
considers
inventory
so
then,
how
would
you
guess?
How
are
you
going
to
treat
it?
How
are
you
going
to?
How
are
you
going
to
talk
about
it?
How
are
you
going
to
do
exclusions
and
inclusions.
I
Can
we
get
back
to
you
with
a
response?
I
mean
it
sounds
like
I
mean
so
you're
saying
it's
inventory,
I
don't
it
wouldn't
put
traditional
inventory
sort
of
standards
inside
of
a
casino,
it
sounds
like
intellectual
property
almost
or
or
you
know,
intangible
property.
I
A
But
I
can,
but
what
I
can
do
is
share
the
the
internal
revenue
notice
that
I
was
reading
and
I
also
learned
some
additional
things
in
my
national
meetings
that
I
go
to
on
tax
and
it's
it's
just
been
interesting,
because,
although
it's
intangible,
we
know
that
there
are
various
categories
of
intangible
right.
If
something
is
inventory,
if
it's
property,
you
have
to
treat
it
as
such
right
I
mean,
and
and
it's
and
it
becomes
a
different
thing
right.
A
If
this
was
1932
and
I
brought
in
a
horse
and
said
hey,
I
wanted,
I
want
a
wager.
I
want
to
give
you
my
horse.
I
mean
it's
an
entirely
different
conversation
that
we're
having
that
we're
we're
talking
about
this
digital
asset
that
is
taking
various
forms.
Then
we
have
to
treat
it
the
way
that
the
law
has
already
established
it.
You
know
what
I'm
saying.
I
Representative
of
the
san
francisco
fed
that
each
each
proposal
that
deals
with
whether
nfts
or
just
cryptocurrencies
generally
is
different.
We've
all
we've
we've,
you
know,
we've
said
all
we've
said
to
the
industry.
Please
bring
your
proposals
to
us.
We
will
vet
them
and
if
there's
something
that
looks
like
it's
viable
and
that
we
can
regulate
adequately,
ensuring
that
we
collect
the
tax
we
need
to
and
there's
no
laundering
issues
or
illicit
activity,
we'll
move
in
that
direction.
That's
that's
really
where
we're
at
right
now.
I
Our
sort
of
our
our
posture
is
not
one
of
rejection.
It's
also
not
one
of
trying
to
get
in
front
of
something
that
is
so
complex
and
has
so
many
variants
that
we
can't.
We
can't
possibly
understand
them
all.
We
are
in
a
in
a
posture
of
accepting
whatever
the
industry
wants
to
bring
to
us
and
betting
it
and
so
far.
Madam
chair,
we
haven't
seen
much
that's
rocks.
That
saw
it.
A
Okay,
I
mean-
I
I
I
know
senator
keith
keffer
probably
will
will
frown
on
this
next
comment.
However,
I
I
appreciate
the
pause
and
the
reflectiveness
that
you
guys
are
engaging.
In
I
mean
my
personal
sentiment
is:
don't
go
any
deeper
than
what
you're
already
gone,
but
I
know
that
I
probably
will
not
get
my
wish.
A
E
Madam
chair
been
key
cover
for
the
record
and
what
I've
been
impressed
by
in
my
time
since
the
fall
with
gaming
control
is
the
the
approach
that
they
do
take
to
regulating
industry
and
ensuring
that
they're
working
with
the
industry
to
move
in
a
direction
that
is
reasonable
and
necessary.
Right.
There's
no
point
in
us
spinning
our
wheels
for
to
create
an
entire
regulatory
structure
that
isn't
going
to
work
right
or
that
the
industry
is
not
going
to
use.
E
So,
as
as
chair
gibson
said,
we're
we're
in
the
posture
of
accepting
changes
that
the
industry
wants
to
propose
to
us
and
then
considering
them
and
working
them
through
our
traps,
and
I
think
that
that's
a
good
place
for
us
to
be
right
now,
as
as
the
indus
as
the
cryptocurrency
itself
continues
to
evolve,
and
as
the
gaming
industry
tries
to
figure
out
the
right
fit
for
it.
A
B
I
have
a
question:
is
there
any
property
now
in
the
state
that
is
pushing
for
the
ability
to
accept
cryptocurrency
directly
directly,
because
it
seems
to
me
if
we
have
third-party
vendors
that
are
providing
exchanges
for
it
just
leave
it
that
way,
just
allow
the
third
party
vendors
to
do
it.
We
don't
need
to
get
involved
with.
That
seems
like
what's
going
on
now,
and
that
seems
like
the
smart
thing
to
continue
with,
but
just
curious.
Is
there
any
property
that
says
you
know
we
want
the
ability
to
accept
this
directly.
I
Madam
chair,
through
you
to
assemblywoman,
because
I'm
I
cheap
rv,
you
deal
with
the
industry
with
the
with
the
manufacturing
side.
Quite
a
bit,
I
mean
they
seem
that
the
the
money
service
providers
or
the
trend,
the
kiosk
providers,
seem
to
be
the
most
vocal
in
this
space.
That's
my
experience.
I
know
that
that
that
circ
and
mr
stevens
have
talked
about
cryptocurrencies
and
that's
where
the
kiosks
exist.
I
I
believe,
but
I
have
not
been
approached
by
any
licensee
to
the
members
of
this
body
pushing
hard
for
the
for
the
use
of
cryptocurrency
and
actual
gambling
transactions.
That's
what
I
can
say.
H
Good
afternoon
assemblywoman,
yes,
I
have
had
conversations
with
operators
and
manufacturers
about
the
potential
use
of
cryptocurrency
and,
as
chair
gibson
had
pointed
out,
our
response
to
them
has
been
open-minded
with
here
are
give
us
how
or
what
you
want
to
do
and
how
it
would
satisfy
some
of
these
fundamental
requirements
that
we've
discussed
today
and
then
we
can,
you
know,
come
at
that
from
a
better
position
of
knowledge
on
how
we
might
regulate
that.
I
would
go
back
to
my
comment
about.
It's
only
been
a
casual
interest.
H
I
haven't
had
a
lot
of
those
conversations,
but
we
are
having
those
conversations
for
some
manufacturers,
for
example.
They
want
to
explore
this
as
an
opportunity.
It's
it's
a
it's
a
hype
right
now.
It's
something
you
know
they
don't
want
to
be
on
the
back
side
of,
should
it
take
off,
so
they
might
be
looking
into
that
and
then
from
an
operator's
standpoint.
H
Yes,
it's
been
brought
up
about.
You
know
how
can
we
potentially
make
use
of
cryptocurrency,
whether
it's
a
cryptocurrency
that
we've
discussed
or
potentially
a
cryptocurrency
that
they
create
themselves?
So
yes,
we're
having
that
conversation,
but
it's
it's
not
been
pressing.
I
Madam
chair,
if
I
can
just
say
this,
I
I
thought
that
one
answer
to
the
cryptocurrency
volatility
issue
might
be
tethering.
The
currencies
to
the
fiat
dollar,
for
example,
and
I'm
disappointed
to
hear
from
san
francisco,
fed
that
that
has
not
been
a
solution.
I
That
was
something
that
we've
talked
about
internally
here
and
even
the
algorithmic
approach.
Where
you
have
multiple,
you
weigh
them,
for
example,
or
other.
You
know
pieces
of
a
of
a
sort
of
a
a
weighted
equation
that
doesn't
seem
to
be
the
answer,
so
we're
still
searching
for
a
way
to
ensure
that
we
don't
lose
tax
tax
dollars.
If
we
were
to
allow
cryptocurrencies
to
be
used
in
actual
gambling
transactions.
A
Yeah-
and
I
think
I
think
I
think
that
there's
a
broader
sense
out
there
that
there
is
a
fear
in
legitimizing
the
alternative
currency
and
if
you
were
to
tie
it,
then
it
further
establishes
it
as
a
legitimate
currency.
And
I
and
I
understand
it's
out
there,
but
I
think
that
I
think
that
that's
some
underlying
that
are
going
on.
There's
the
fear
that
it
could
break
the
traditional
market.
E
Met
mountain
chair
ben
cover
for
the
record,
I'd
point
out
that
you
know-
and
I
may
have
missed
it
earlier
in
the
presentation,
but
just
today
the
vice
chair
of
the
federal
reserve.
E
You
know
talk
spoke
with
testified
before
the
us
house
about
the
prospect
of
creating
a
central
bank
digital
currency,
which
is
not
a
cryptocurrency
right.
It
is
it's
basically
like
a
digital
dollar,
but
you
know
that
may
be
the
type
of
step.
If,
if
the
central
bank
would
were
to
create
something
along
those
lines
that
would
initiate
the
sort
of
technology
pieces
within
the
gaming
industry,
that
would
then
be
able
to
be
used
for
cryptocurrency
as
well.
I
guess
that
would
be
to
be
determined.
A
Okay,
I
I
hope,
not
I'm
probably
gonna,
be
this
outlier
saying
no,
not
nevada,
but
I'm
gonna.
I'm
gonna
leave
her
right
there,
I'm
not
a
fan.
Okay,
if
you're
picking
up
you're
picking
up
anything,
I'm
not
a
fan
of
this
but
okay.
I
appreciate
you
guys
presenting.
I
think
it
was
really
good
information
and
it
was
timely.
A
I
am
looking
at
some
bdrs
in
this
space,
I'm
I'm!
I
am
more
on
the
side.
If
I
want
to
protect
nevada
consumers,
I
want
to
protect
them
from
fraud
and
various
things,
and
I
and
I
I
see
it
as
a
doorway,
but
you
guys
will
see
eventually
what
I
put
out
there
and
either
ben
will
come
as
a
private
citizen
and
say
I
hate
all
your
bills
and
and
then
he
will
move
on.
We
will
move.
E
On
you
know
that
I
always
tell
you
when
I
hate
your
bills,
and
but
I
can
also
assure
you
that
gaming
control
and
the
gaming
commission
is
absolutely
committed
to
protecting
our
consumers
right.
Protecting
the
the
visitors
that
come
to
our
state.
The
people
who
play
within
our
state
ensuring
that
they
are
able
to
wager
safely
and
in
a
stable
environment,
is
of
critical
concern
to
to
the
regulatory
structure
of
gaming
in
the
state.
So
we're
we're
certainly
aligned
on
that
front.
A
C
A
A
I
would
say
30
days,
because
our
next
presentation
will
be
on
the
property
tax
and
that'll,
be
our
last
one
and
then
the
following
one
after
that
will
be
what
are
the
interim
bdrs
that
we're
going
to
consider
and
bring
forward
for
a
session
in
23..
A
So
we've
we've
talked
about
a
lot
and
there's
been
a
lot
of
nuance,
and
so,
if
there
is
an
issue,
please
please
please
send
to
russell
joe
and
michael,
so
we
can
review
that
list
and
then
know
what
we're
putting
forward
and
have
discussion
and
some
conversation
and
and
we'll
do
that
in
our.
I
would
like
to
do
that
in
our
july
meeting
I
have
conversations
on
your
vdrs.
A
A
A
Okay,
all
right
then
so,
as
always,
we'll
anna
will
send
out
the
next
meeting
it
will
be
in
june.
It
will
be
on
property
tax,
we're
trying
to
figure
out
what
that
agenda
looks
like
trying
not
to
do
too
much
in
that,
because
it's
a
big
topic
that
trying
to
get
also
some
some
some
issues
that
are
popping
up
in
the
space,
and
so
with
that
we
will
move
to
agenda
item
number
eight,
which
is
public
comment.
C
Up,
I'm
sorry,
okay,
so
just
maybe
the
help
staff
and
anna
that
for
the
june
meeting,
given
that
it's
close
to
end
of
the
may
here,
if
you
want
to
continue
soda
that
wednesday
thursday
or
that
thursday
meeting,
would
we
be
considering
we're
polling
the
members
for
like
the
29th
and
30th,
which
would
be
the
last
wednesday
and
thursday,
because
I
think
it
might
be
a
pretty
tight
turn
to
consider
having
the
meeting
on
the
22nd
or
23rd.
C
Given
the
property
tax
and
the
people
we
have
to
line
up
for
the
presentations
and
such
so
I
just
we
could
talk
about
it
more
later
if
necessary.
But
I
just
I
appreciate
your
staff
allowing
me
to
maybe
bring
that
up.
While
we
have
all
the
members
here
that
those
are
the
dates
that
you're
looking
at
as
the
29th
or
30th,
and
so
anna
then
can
then
send
out
an
email
asking
the
members
for
their
availability
on
those
days.
Is
that
acceptable.
A
B
Assemblywoman
anderson,
thank
you,
so
I
I
I
didn't
feel
that
I
needed
to
bring
it
up
during
the
presentation,
but
I
share
some
of
the
concerns
that
you
brought
up.
I'm
wondering
if
there
is
any
sort
of
information
from
oh.
I
can't
remember
what
entity
it
was
that
presented
to
us.
That
was
from
I
think,
of
the
national
council
of
legislators,
or
maybe
it
was
a
different
group
that
presented
to
us
on
other
topics.
I
think
it
was
two
meetings
ago
in
csl.
B
Okay,
if
there's
any
sort
of
information
that
we
could
also
get
from
the
crypto
just
from
the
other
states,
because
the
little
bit
very,
very
little
information
that
I
that
I
did
with
dr
google,
which,
by
the
way
is
not
always
the
best
researcher.
B
There
was
a
large
amount
of
commercialized
articles
that
came
out
that
were
very
slanted
either
pro
or
con,
but
very
slanted
so
just
wondering
if
there's
any
sort
of
information
that
we
can
get
from
ncsl
or
and
or
other
listservs,
and
everything
that
we
can
get
on
this
topic,
because
I
agree
with
you
that
it's
probably
going
to
come
up
again
and
I
just
have
big
concerns
about
it.
So,
yes,
yes,.
A
There
was
a
presentation
it's
on
insult,
which
is
this
state
and
local
taxation
committee
at
the
national
committee,
and
there
was
a
presentation
from
the
washington
revenue
office.
I
can
ask
them
for
that
presentation.
I
haven't
seen
it
become
public
that
get
it
sent
over
to
you,
so
you
can
read
what
I
guess
he
put
out
or
what
washington
state's
doing.
I
think
there
were
three
or
four
states
that
have
done
something
but
I'll
find
out
from
jackson
and.
D
If,
if
we
are
getting
some
more
information
on
cryptocurrency,
can
we
maybe
throw
in
like
sustainability
environmentally
wise,
because
the
research
that
I've
been
doing
it
seems
to
be
incredibly
energy
driven
and
uses
a
lot
and
enormous
amounts?
I'm
just
wondering
about
the
sustainability
of
it
and,
if
there's
long-term,
any
long-term
ideas
about
how
to
make
it
sustainable
without
using
like
the
gross
energy
product
of
argentina.
Every
week.
C
No,
I
just
wanted
to
say
thanks
for
the
presentations,
especially,
I
think
as
your
taxation
staff
as
legislative
staff
to
the
revenue
and
taxation
committees,
that
that's
one
of
the
important
issues
that
and
we've
been
asked
to
look
at
and
think
about.
This
is
that
the
private
sector
can
go
forward
and
especially,
and
then
there'll
be
those
for
that
are
regulated
at
the
state
or
federal
level
in
terms
of
decide
making
that
decision
to
use
crypto
currencies,
but
at
the
state
and
local
government
level.
C
I
I
don't
think
there's
many
states
that
are
going
to
allow
taxes
to
be
calculated
and
or
remitted
using
cryptocurrencies,
because
mr
barbie's
comment
on
that
point
is
because,
unless
it's
a
cryptocurrency,
that's
tied
and
pegged
to
a
currency
such
as
a
u.s
dollar,
so
that
at
dollars
a
dollar
that
would
always
be
the
risk
that
the
tax
is
calculated
100
of
crypto
or
it's
remitted
in
crypto
and
by
the
time
the
state
could
get
it
and
use
it.
C
It's
gone
from
a
hundred
dollars
down
to
eighty
dollars
in
value,
but
it
could
also
go
from
100
to
up
to
120.
So
you
would
be
subjecting
your
general
fund
revenue
sources,
those
taxes
tied
to
things
where
goods
and
services
are
being
paid
for
or
accepted
in
crypto,
and
so
that
I
just
think
that
would
be
one
of
the
big
issues
that's
going
to
have
to
be
resolved,
and
so
you
can
see
from
the
san
francisco
fed
that
there
are
some
of
these.
C
That's
the
stable
coin
that
may
be
more
viable
because
you
can
get
them
pegged
to
something
that
a
dollar
is
a
dollar
for
those
that
honor
dollar
dollar,
that
they
would
cause
your
your
staff
concerns
and
probably
elected
officials
about
well
somebody
paid
a
tax
in
a
dollar
and
it's
now
worth
80
cents,
and
so
that's
not
a
probably
a
good
way
to
on
a
tax
system
for
funding
state
operations.
C
That's
how
I
look
at
this
is
that
this
thing
is
functioning
as
money
or
currency
for
groups
of
people.
However
large
those
groups
may
be,
but
it's
also
being
used
as
an
asset
or
property,
and
so
from
that
perspective,
then
tax
current
considerations
can
come
into
play
when
it
when
it
may
be
property.
Being
used
for
asset
or
purposes
versus
it's
being
used
as
currency
to
conduct
activity
with
regards
to
people
producing
goods
and
services,
and
then
people
buying
those
goods
and
services.
C
A
Well,
we
know
that
your
opinion
matters
mr
kenyon
ginden,
and
so
when
you
retire
and
you
come
back
and
you
sit
at
the
table
and
you
object,
we
will
be
looking
forward
to
all
of
that.
C
I
appreciate
that
madam
chair,
when
I'm
bringing
testifying
in
support
of
cryptocurrency
bills.
Oh.