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From YouTube: Planning and Zoning Board March 16, 2020
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A
A
F
C
D
B
D
G
D
G
D
A
This
is
a
quasi
judicial
proceeding
where
the
Planning
and
Zoning
Board
acts
in
a
quasi
judicial
rather
than
a
legislative
capacity
how
to
cause
a
judicial
hearing.
It
is
not
the
board's
function
to
make
law,
but
rather
to
apply
law
that
has
already
been
established
in
a
quasi
judicial
hearing.
The
board
is
required
by
law
to
make
findings
of
fact,
based
upon
the
evidence
presented
at
the
hearing
and
apply
those
findings
of
fact
to
previously
establish
criteria
contained
in
the
Code
of
Ordinances
in
order
to
make
a
legal
decision
regarding
the
application
before
it.
A
The
board
may
only
consider
evidence
at
this
hearing
that
the
law
considers
competent,
substantial
and
relevant
to
the
issues.
If
the
competent,
substantial
and
relevant
evidence
at
the
hearing
demonstrates
that
the
applicant
has
met
the
criteria
established
in
the
code
of
ordinance,
then
the
board
is
required
by
law
to
find
in
favor
of
the
applicant.
By
the
same
token,
of
the
competent,
substantial
and
relevant
evidence
at
the
hearing
demonstrates
that
the
applicant
has
failed
to
meet
the
criteria
established
in
the
code
of
ordinance.
Then
the
board
is
required
by
law.
To
fight
against
the
applicant.
A
D
A
D
E
It's
in
the
city's
special
area
plan,
South
gateway,
character,
district
and
again,
the
wetland
impacts
have
been
permitted
by
the
state
applicable
state
and
federal
agencies
and
mitigation
has
been
performed
within
the
city
limits
and
the
upland
area
is
shown
in
the
applicant
submitted
to
be
urban
area
fill
the
area.
With
those
two
notes
we
have
found
that
the
applicants
project
is
consistent
with
the
city's
comprehensive
plan
and
with
the
countywide
plan
requirements.
E
This
property
is
located
within
the
t5,
a
South
Pinellas,
F
transect
district
in
the
special
area
plan
and
that
district
allows
office
uses
by
Wright,
and
the
site
plan
is
consistent
with
the
uses
and
requirements
of
the
t5.
A
transect
district.
The
project
will
not
degrade
levels
of
service
for
facilities.
Your
the
staff
report,
page
3,
lists
the
facilities
PACS
for
this
project.
The
TRC
last
reviewed
this
project
on
january
9th
2020
and
had
no
objections
to
the
requests.
E
Staff
finds
that
the
application
for
site
plan
approval
is
consistent
with
the
applicable
review
criteria
and
staff
is
recommending
approval
of
the
site
plan
subject
to
the
following
conditions:
the
developers
responsible
for
meeting
the
minimum
criteria
of
the
land
development
code
and
for
acquiring
all
other
jurisdictional
permits
and
approvals
construction
plans
shall
be
consistent
with
the
approved
site
plan.
All
requisite
fees
attended
to
the
project
shall
be
paid
in
accordance
with
the
land
development
code.
Screening
walls
to
hide
parking
are
required
in
the
east
and
south
sides
of
the
parking
lot.
E
The
final
building
plans
submittal
shall
show
a
screening
wall
on
the
south
side.
In
addition
to
and
matching
the
design
of,
the
screening
law
noted
on
a
site
plan
for
the
east
side,
the
applicant
shall
submit
a
lighting
plan
for
the
property,
with
the
building
permit
application
submitted
to
include
light
fixture
product
sheet,
showing
cut-off
fixtures
for
all
outdoor
lighting.
On-Site
signs,
sign,
poles
and
lighting.
Poles
shall
be
designed
to
match
city
of
Tarpon
Springs
specifications
for
the
downtown
and
CRA
districts.
E
The
applicant
shall
submit
documentation
of
updated
state
and
federal
approval
of
the
proposed
dimensions
and
coverage
of
the
wetland
impact
area
and
the
status
of
the
mitigation
monitoring
for
those
impacts.
And
finally,
the
site
plan
shall
expire
one
year
from
the
effective
date
unless
an
application
has
been
filed
for
a
building
permit,
with
construction
plans
signed
and
sealed
by
a
registered
engineer
licensed
in
the
state
of
Florida.
Are
there
any
questions?
I.
D
D
I
Good
afternoon
my
name
is
JD
al-sabah
and
was
Sycamore
engineering,
83-70
West,
Hillsborough,
Avenue,
Suite,
205,
Tampa
Florida,
three,
three,
six,
one
five
and
I
already
sworn
I
am
the
engineer
for
the
project
and
the
agent
representing
the
owner
for
the
property.
So
as
Miss
McNeil,
she
indicated
that
we
proposing
medical
and
general
office
to
the
property
located
and
the
north
west
corner
of
us
alternate.
Nineteen
and
Maris
profit.
I
I
The
history
of
the
property
to
go
through
so
you
see
where
we
ended
up
where
we
ended
up
now.
So
if
you
look
into
the
package
I
represented,
this
is
the
submittal
we
did.
This
is
the
existing
wetland.
The
second
page,
the
third
page,
is
a
site
plan
submitted
to
city
of
turbine
spring
in
2010,
and
that's
like
a
plan
for
retail
center
13,000
square
foot
and
get
approved
under
ordinance.
I
10-0
33
by
the
city
at
that
time,
we
of
course,
and
during
you
know
after
get
approval,
we
went
and
pursue
with
the
mitigation
and
we
did
the
mitigation
to
the
site.
Of
course,
within
the
limit
of
this
city
of
turbines
Frank,
we
have
three
choices.
We
discuss
it,
of
course,
with
the
city,
dick
seaside,
dot,
park,
rain
rains
ville
site
and
we
choose.
I
I
This
is
a
plan
we
created
method
in
plan
to
the
wetland
located
in
the
north
anklet
River
Park,
and
this
is
of
course
this
is
doing
2011
and
we
build
it
and
submit
that
to
Swift
mod,
an
Army
Corps
and
approve
it
by
Swift,
mod,
an
Army,
Corps
and
the
city,
and
since
that
time
it's
an
operation.
So
the
mitigation
completed
to
the
wetland
which
we
did
not
impact,
of
course
the
economy.
You
know
how
it's
happened
in
2010.
We
never
proceed
with
a
construction
for
that
site.
I
2018.
There
is
some
activity.
If
you
recall
this
possibility
gas
station
there,
they
never
proceeded
going
into
the
B
and
Z
and
they
never
submitted.
You
know
never
have
been
reviewed
by
a
B
and
C
and
City
Council,
so
it
clearly
we
have
here
and
of
course,
until
now
we
are
submitting
for
the
site
plan.
We.
F
F
D
D
D
I
A
poor
quality
Florida
require
three
criteria
for
wetland,
and
this
is
one
which
is
wet.
It's
a
tidal
influence.
You
got.
Salt
water
go
up
and
down
with
it
time.
So
as
far
as
wet.
If
you
go
now,
you
found
out
most
of
it,
of
course,
not
wet,
but
during
different
time
of
the
season.
Yes,
it
is
so
what
are
we
trying
to
do
we
clear
the
site
and
we're
gonna,
of
course,
add,
fill
and
compact
the
fill
and
up
to
certain
elevation.
D
J
I
Area
and
the
flood,
but
this
is
tidal
influence,
so
we
still
keep
it
up.
Seven
elevation,
which
even
the
road
is
four,
so
we
are
above
the
road
as
far
as
finished
floor
elevation
and
we're
gonna
go
with
all
the
requirement
for
that
foundation.
Flood
protection
or
such
I
think
miss
magnesia
indicated
that
condition.
One
of
the
condition
before
we
submit
building
plan.
I
J
D
I
You
and
with
me,
for
the
record,
if
you
don't
mind,
we,
as
you
know,
miss
magnesia.
We
are
not
applying
for
any
variants.
All
the
rule
apply
on
us
for
that.
You
know
CRD
the
community
area,
so
we
are
not
adding
for
variance.
We
apply
all
the
screening
requirement
landscape
requirement,
the
the
building
requirement,
all
of
it
apply
into
it
and
we're
not
asking
for
any
waiver.
I
Do
you
have
tenants
already
for
this
project?
All
the
best
of
them
are
ability.
There
is
some,
but
not
the
full
area,
so
you
know
that's,
but
the
market
going
in
the
right
direction
and
it
became
if
you
know
this
is
a
time
we
need
to
improve
it.
This
is
the
corner
of
the
city,
and
we
need
to
is
this
is
presentation
I
mean
the
interest
for
that
downtown
and
the
same
time
the
municipal
of
it
is
supposed
to
be
completed
next
months.
I
I
I
The
finished
fill
will
be
7
foot.
The
road
is
about
4.2,
the
sidewalk
and
that
what
we're
gonna
go.
Yes,
what
we
trying
to
do
to
create
building
was
a
friendly,
a
scale
which
means
somebody
walking
into
the
street
does
not
see
it
elevation
of
10
right.
So
that's
a
reason.
It
cost
more
to
put
those
protection
for
the
flood
more
than
you
know
to
to
raise
the
elevation.
What
we
try
to
create
something
you
know
a
close
to
be
real
to
scale
as
architectural
or
urban,
then
can
say
that
I
see.
I
I
I
C
I
I
I
Right
so
it's
open
we're
gonna,
fill
the
site
and
we're
gonna
have
a
retention
pond
and
we're
gonna
have
a
wall
wall
which
created
our
retention
pond.
It's
like
in
the
bounty
for
our
attention
pond.
So
that's
being
up
to
the
point
you
might
be
buying
to
think
that's.
Yeah
we're
gonna,
prevent
erosion.
I
I
Is
really
came,
it's
the
the
the
first
of
all
we're
gonna
use.
The
word
merits
because
most
people
would
you
know,
that's
you
know
it's
the
main
main
you
know
place
and
the
second
is:
is
it's
really
I?
It's
we
try
to
I
mean
it's
not
to
make
a
defense
and
the
bladder
or
the
the
showers,
but
it
started
that
name
in
the
beginning
and
we
try
to
keep
the
same
way
as
before.
G
G
I
I
Really
glad
to
to
give
me
the
chance
to
talk
okay
on
this,
so
what
we
have
we
wanted
to
do
the
mitigation
on-site,
oh,
and
that
was
in
the
city
limit,
so
we
I
mean
the
staff
is
excessively
helpful
from
when
we
worked
2010
until
now.
So
really
great
thanks
to
everybody
on
this,
so
they
pass
to
us.
We
have
a
site
this
site.
You
know
we
can
try
to
do
something
useful
to
the
city
at
the
same
time.
So
we
want
you
through
evaluate
each
one
of
them
where
we
can
create
something
useful.
I
We
can
utilize
it
for
mitigation.
This
site
is
good.
However,
we
don't
have
enough
accredit
to
grant
us,
for
we
require
a
point
for
unit
what
they
call
the
unit
as
far
as
mitigation
unit,
and
we
don't
have
that
when
we
go
to
each
one
of
them.
Its
point
one
point:
one:
five
for
each
one
of
the
site
so
based
on
that
and
with
coordination
with
the
city
staff.
I
G
E
And
if
stuff
could
be
recognized
credit
when,
when
these
agencies
look
at
mitigation,
they
look
at
what
you're
going
to
either
restore
and
I
have
a
little
bit
of
background
that
gets
higher
credit,
create
that
gets
not
as
high
of
credit
preserve
that
gets
even
less
or
a
bank
pay
into
a
bank.
That's
a
fourth
option.
So
what
I
think
JD's
trying
to
explain
is
some
of
these
other
sites
and
they
they
value
the
credit
by
what
kind
of
Whelan's
r3u
creating
as
opposed
to
what
you're
impacting.
What's
the
you
know,
what
is
the
mitigation?
E
F
G
I
Composition
and-
and
this
is
the
history
of
the
property
we
already
impact-
we
already
compensate
for
the
impact
of
the
wetland.
We
already
compensate
that
this
is
for
the
site
plan
at
that
time
for
13,000
square
foot,
and
we
are
here,
come
we
try
to
get
updated
site
plan
for
that.
So
what
I'm
trying
the
bottom
line
is
we
already
mitigate
for
that
wetland?
We
can
impact
now
we
we
mitigate
into
it
eight
ten
years
ago,
eight
years
ago,
so.
G
I
G
F
G
F
D
D
F
F
D
D
E
And
this
is,
as
mentioned,
an
application
to
build
a
dental
clinic.
This
will
be
sort
of
basically
an
extension
of
the
medical
clinic.
That's
it's
there
on
the
st.
Timothy
property
right
next
door,
so
the
community
health
centers
of
Pinellas
are
kind
of
expanding
their
resources
in
Tarpon
Springs.
With
this
addition.
E
This
is
again
a
5,000
square-foot
dental
clinic
the
properties
owned
by
city
of
Tarpon
Springs,
and
this
applicant
has
a
long-term
lease
arrangement
to
allow
the
building
of
the
clinic,
and
this
is
in
the
commercial
general
feature,
land
use
category
which
accommodates
commercial
and
office
uses,
and
this
project
is
consistent
with
the
comprehensive
plan.
It's
in
the
highway
business.
Zoning
district
and
again
these
uses
are
allowed
by
right,
and
this
use
meets
all
of
the
requirements
of
the
zoning
district.
E
The
project
is
not
expected
to
degrade
levels
of
service
in
the
facilities.
Impacts
are
listed
on
page
3
of
the
staff
report,
the
TRC
reviewed
this
application
of
their
February
6
2020
meeting
the
minutes
are
included
and
the
items
have
been
addressed
or
are
in
the
conditions,
so
staff
finds
the
application
for
site
plan.
E
Approval
consistent
with
the
applicable
review
criteria
and
staff
recommendation
is
to
approve
the
site
plan,
subject
to
the
following:
the
developers
responsible
for
meeting
the
minimum
criteria
of
the
land
development
code
and
for
acquire
all
other
jurisdictional
permits
and
approvals
construction
plans
shall
be
consistent
with
the
approved
site
plan.
All
requisite
fees
attended
to
the
project
shall
be
paid
in
accordance
with
the
land
development
code.
The
estimated
gallons
per
day
of
water
and
sewer
demand
shall
be
provided
with
the
submittal
for
a
building
permit.
E
Submittals
final
drainage
plans
and
calculations
for
approval
by
the
city
is
required
prior
to
application
for
a
building
permit
plants
submitted
for
a
building.
Permit
application
shall
be
revised
to
reconfigure
and
straighten
the
proposed
water
line
on
Martin
Street
and
to
remove
the
proposed
jogs
in
the
line.
On-Site
signs
sign,
poles
and
lighting.
E
Poles
shall
be
designed
to
match
City
a
tarpon
spring
specifications
for
the
downtown
and
CRA
area,
and
the
site
plan
shall
expire
it
one
year
from
the
effective
day
unless
an
application
has
been
filed
for
a
building
permit
with
construction
plans
signed
and
sealed
by
a
registered
engineer
licensed
in
the
state
of
Florida.
Are
there
any
questions.
D
K
It's
actually
a
good
time
to
be
building
medical
facilities,
Oh,
but
actually
I,
guess
in
its
simplest
terms,
the
people
that
need
medical
care,
the
dental
care
so
there's
just
a
need
to
expand
the
services
already
provided,
and
so
that's
exactly
what
they're
looking
to
do
along
the
way
there
was
some
small
local
flooding
on
Lime
Street
that
we
were
asked
to
take
care
of
which,
to
be
honest,
I
think
that's
a
great
idea.
We
had
extra
capacity
in
the
pond
and
so
I
know
from
the
big
picture.
D
E
K
Does
and
that
will
remain
there
and
we've
been
working
with
them.
They
asked
that
the
fence
be
expanded,
there's
a
gravel
area,
guess
where
they
park
or
do
something
right
next
to
it,
so
that
fence
will
be
expanded
to
include
that
and
the
driveway
on
the
other
side
actually
improves
their
access
to
it.
It
you
know
you
no
longer
have
to
pull
off
the
road
to
park.
Next
to
it.
You
can
just
pull
into
the
parking
lot
and
park
near
it
now.
Services.
G
Any
other
questions
from
the
board
I
have
a
question
sure
and
first
thank
you
from
as
a
resident
of
Tarpon
Springs
that
you're
able
to
take
a
little
bit
of
our
stormwater
and
park
it
somewhere.
That
is
nice
and
that's
very
nice.
Albany
there's
the
gift.
I
have
I,
have
a
question
about
the
site
plan
and
the
process
in
general
and
it's
just
kind
of
tied
to
the
orientation
of
the
building
and
how
that
came
about.
G
I,
always
wonder
where,
if
ever
during
the
process
of
design,
that
one
thinks
hey
if
we
orient
the
building
in
a
certain
way,
even
if
we
don't
put
PV
on
it
now
at
a
later
date,
it's
a
great
home
for
PV.
This
building
has
the
roof
shape.
That
would
accept
it.
But
it's
not
necessarily
oriented
right,
so
is
there
any
opportunity,
certainly
it's
too
late
for
this
one
now,
but
how
does
that
enter
the
discussion?
G
Did
it
ever
because
this
building
is
new
and
it's
going
to
be
public,
but
yet
there's
not
any
accommodation
made
at
this
point
granted,
there's
only
site
plan
for
taking
advantage
of
a
solar
as
one
example
of
reduce,
reuse,
recycle.
So
with
that,
just
can
you
comment
in
regards
to
the
design
process
and,
if
PV
is
ever
discussed
and
why
couldn't
that
building
be
rotated,
so
it
could
put
a
great
big
six
kW
array
on
it
at
now
or
later
in
the
future
right.
K
This
particular
building
has
very
strict
sight
constraints,
there's
very
deep
I,
believe
it's
clay,
but
it
might
be
a
different
material,
sewer
pipe
that
has
a
wide
easy
around
it
so
that
you
can
access
the
deep
sewer
pipe
that
runs
in
the
front
of
it
and
the
entire
front.
Half
of
the
property
is
a
hundred
foot
wide
easement
in
which
you
can't
put
a
building
because
the
overhead
power
lines
and
then
there's
that
diagonal
storm
pipe
that
runs
across
the
back
part,
so
that
kind
of
wedged
you
into
that
little
triangular
area.
K
So
the
orientation
of
the
building
in
this
particular
case,
was
dictated
as
much
by
the
site
conditions
as
anything
else
and
because
it's
an
auxiliary
of
the
existing
function.
In
other
words,
people
going
to
the
medical
are
also
going
to
need
dental,
so
they
wanted
them
to
have
easy
access
from
one
to
the
other.
Having
them
aligned
and
close
together
made
the
most
sense
for
that.
To
answer
your
question
in
general.
Yes,
it
actually
is
something
that
is
looked
at
because,
frankly,
depending
on
your
use,
there's
money
on
the
table
for
pursuing
that.
K
D
C
D
G
E
So
this
is
coming
back
to
you
for
discussion
that
we
have
Louis
Serna
here
our
consultant,
and
we
have
the
city
attorney
here
to
address
some
of
the
things
that
came
up
so
give
me
one
more
second
and
one
thing:
I
should
interject.
As
you
all
know,
the
city
is
right
now
in
mode
for
taking
precaution,
some
protocol
for
Kovach
19.
So
that's
why
I'm
wiping
this
down
in
preparation
for
them
and
we
do
have
hand
sanitizer
here.
E
I
didn't
mention
it,
but
if
any
of
you
need
would
like
some
of
that,
it's
point
so
with
that
I'll
bring
up
and.
A
Keep
in
mind
too,
this
is
just
a
discussion
item,
so
there
won't
be
any
voting
on
the
amendments.
The
ordinance
this
evening,
it's
just
a
time
to
discuss,
ask
questions,
get
more
information.
Since,
at
the
last
meeting
there
was
a
lot
of
hesitation
on
being
able
to
make
a
motion
to
either
to
approve
it
as
it
was,
or
even
approved
with
conditions,
because
there
just
wasn't
enough
information.
J
Good
evening
planning
zoning
board
members
Louie
Sarna
with
Calvin
Giordano
and
associates
presenting
staff
comments.
As
we
indicated
last
time,
there
was
some
there's
legal
concerns
with
the
existing
sign
code,
primarily
dealing
with
signed
content
in
regard
to
a
past
decision
of
the
US
Supreme
Court.
So
that's
primarily
the
reason
for
for
the
updates.
The
attorney
who
prepared
this
Robert
Peston
Felder
is
here
today
he
can
explain
the
content
issues
better
than
I.
J
Can
so
we're
gonna
sort
of
do
a
tag
team
on
this
I
know
there
were
some
comments
last
time
generally
throughout
the
throughout
the
ordinance,
so
I
guess
at
this
point
we
can
just
take
your
comments.
I
can
allow
Rob
to
do
an
introduction
of
the
content
questions
but,
like
I
said
it's
a
little
about.
There
were
two
board
workshops
on
this
item,
so
the
items
in
blue
in
your
draft
are
changes
that
came
as
a
result
of
the
board
workshop.
So
the
board
has
seen
this
on
two
separate
occasions
as
well.
D
J
A
What
changes
are
being
made
based
upon
some
of
the
board
of
commissioners
workshops
and
how
those
changes
that
are
not
otherwise
required,
like
I,
think
one
of
the
things
were
the
sandwich
boards
with
chalkboard
writing
how
those
were
going
to
impact
members
that
have
local
businesses.
I
know
there
was
some
talk
about
the
Chamber
of
Commerce
not
being
involved
things
like
that
and
how
local
businesses
would
it
be
impacted
by
some
of
these
signs
and
permitting
for
some
of
these
signs.
J
Yeah
they've
been
notified
and
they
haven't
had
a
lot
of
comments.
I
think
they
were
concerned
with
the
the
bus-bench
signs
and
I
can
go
through
that
change
and
the
chalkboard
a-frame
signs
I
think
this
board
really
had
the
primarily
their
concern.
Was
they
didn't
have
enough
time
to
review
it
so
I
real
quickly?
I
can
talk
about
those
two
issues
as
please
the
bus-bench
signs,
while.
A
J
J
So
most
of
these
changes
you
see
in
there
are
based
are
because
of
that
there
are
a
number
of
other
changes
that
were
made
because
you
know,
as
you
go
through
this,
and
the
board
mentioned
that
they'd
like
to
see
some
things
changed
just
to
go
through
my
highlights
window
and
door
signs.
We
added
a
definition
of
window
and
door
signs
permanent.
J
These
signs
have
been
revised
to
regulate
all
window
and
Hort
sides
as
permanent
signage
and
to
establish
a
maximum
signs
for
non-residential
window
and
door
signage
as
a
percentage
of
the
total
surface
area.
This
is
based
on
staff
finding
that
they,
these
weren't,
being
regulated
in
the
current
code.
So
we
just
added
a
section
on
that
on
page
42,
the
poll
banner
signs
section
number
3
on
that
that
appears
on
page
42.
J
This
just
allows
the
allows
a
section
to
allow
banner
displays
on
light
poles
that
are
located
on
not
located
within
public
rights
away,
so
I
think
the
Advent
health
facility
they
have
banners
located
on
there
light
poles.
This
really
just
adds
a
section
of
code
that
allows
that
it
formalizes
that
to
allows
it
allow
those
to
be
done.
J
Fourth
item-
probably
most
one
of
the
controversial
items
on
page
43,
bus
bench
and
bus,
shelter,
advertising
sign
the
way
it's
been
proposed,
as
recommended
as
directed
by
the
board,
is
to
prohibit
those
in
the
city.
There's
also
been
amortization,
which
would
allow
removal
of
the
signs
they
would.
They
could
stay
in
place
until
January
1st
of
2026,
so
provisions
have
been
added
to
allow
for
the
ultimate
removal
of
those.
So
as
far
as
comments
go,
that
was
one
item
that
there
was
concern
about.
Can.
J
J
C
H
What
this
regulation
gets
to
and
really
when
you
read
the
definition
you
hopefully
will
visualize
is
that
business.
Some
businesses
will
take
an
old
car
that
probably
doesn't
even
run
anymore,
and
they
will
plaster
a
sign
on
it
and
stick
it
out
front
to
get
another
piece
of
signage,
and
so
that's
what
this
is
trying
to
get
at.
It's
not
getting
out
people
who
have
a
made
business
or
the
termination,
the
termination,
the
the
termite
died.
You
know
that
drive
for
house
to
house
and
treat
people.
That's
not
what
this
is
about.
C
G
G
J
A
couple
other
points:
the
wall
signs
staff
recommended
that
doing
away
with
the
limitation
of
one
wall
signs.
So
this
just
allows
more
flexibility,
the
sign
in
the
maximum
sign
area,
wall
sign
area
stays
the
same.
It
just
eliminates
the
word
one
and
that's
on
page
57
and
then
finally,
the
a-frame
sandwich
board
signs
the
other
controversial
issue.
I
guess
the
one
that
we
received
comments
on
is
on
page
64,
and
this
was
based
on
board
direction.
J
It
just
adds
some
limitations
on.
It
adds
some
design
standards
on
these,
primarily
that
they
be
composed
of
chalkboard
material.
I
know
there
have
been
some
pushback
on
that
and
again
we're
just
looking
for
directions.
So
when
you
get
to
that
point
that
we
can
take
to
the
board
that
Planning
and
Zoning
Board
does
or
does
not
like
that
portion
of
it
and
as
it's
written
now,
that
would
apply
citywide
I
think
at
the
last
P
and
Z
the
recommend
that
well
the
comment
that
really
wasn't
consensus
was
it
it.
J
Perhaps
it
should
only
apply
in
a
historic
district
if
you're
gonna
have,
if
you're
going
to
require
chalk
board
signs.
So
there's
there
some
ability
for
to
make
those
recommendations
as
well.
So
at
this
part
we're
really
just
taking
discussion,
but
that
that
was
that's
an
issue.
For
example,
that's
not
a
Content
related
issue
that
was
just
a
standard,
a
new
standard
that
the
board
recommended
be
put
in
this
new
ordinance.
So.
H
The
city
the
city
would
have
under
the
under
this
ordinance,
but
already
has,
under
its
current
code,
the
the
opportunity
and
authority
to
remove
it.
It's
a
matter
of
if
the
city
elects
to
remove
it.
You
know
I'm,
not
certain
how
proactive
the
city
staff
is
driving
around
looking
for
a
man
ensign,
so
it
may
be
where
somebody
has
to
call
him
and
say:
look
you
know
this
sign
appears
to
be.
H
You
know
well
abandoned,
like
you
know,
I
I
come
up
Gulf
to
Bay
from
the
Bayside
bridge
many
days,
and
you
know
in
this
course
is
in
Clearwater,
but
I
Drive
past
a
business.
That
long
has
been
closed
yet
sits
out
front
that
sign
and
so
Clearwater
certainly
also
has
a
abandoned
sign
provision.
Well,.
D
H
And
that's
a
political
discussion,
of
course
you
know
it's
not
something
that
that
we're
gonna
be
able
to
solve
tonight.
But
but
you
know,
and
they
certainly
are
elected
officials
face
dueling
pressures.
You
know
I
mean
you've,
got
one
side
of
the
community
saying
get
out
there
and
enforce.
Why
can't?
We
have
10
times
more
enforcement
officers,
and
then
you
have
other
folks
saying
you
know:
laissez
faire
leave
us
alone.
H
Let
us
be
private
sector,
and
you
know
so,
and
then
you
have
the
business
community
is
saying
you
know
we
have
to
make
money,
and
so
you
know
that
when
in
individual
day-to-day
operations
occur,
our
elected
officials
and
our
city's
management
have
to
just
make
decisions
about
what
they're
going
to
make
a
deal
of
and
what
they're
not
going
to
make
a
deal
of.
But,
as
mr.
H
Serna,
you
know
alluded
to,
you
know
part
of
why
we
started
this
process
in
2018
is
because
the
United
States
Supreme
Court
has
ruled
in
Reed
V
town
versus
Gilbert,
that
local
governments
can't
regulate
signs
based
upon
the
content
of
the
sign,
and
so
anybody,
that's
familiar
with
sign
codes
understands
that
that
for
decades
before
that
decision,
sign
codes
were
written
to
call
out
content
a
garage,
sale
sign
a
Construction
sign,
a
real
estate
sign,
you
know.
All
of
those
things
are.
H
You
have
to
read
the
sign
to
see
what
it
is
and
the
Supreme
Court
sort
of
really
upended
all
that
in
the
read
case
and
say
you
can't
do
that
if
you
have
a
regulation
that
requires
the
enforcement
officer
to
read
the
sign
in
order
to
see
if
it's
compliant
or
not
that's
a
violation
of
the
First,
Amendment
and,
and
the
court
explained
that
you
can
do
look.
You
know
governments
can
do
lots
of
other
stuff,
they
could
decide
how
big
a
sign
is
how
tall
a
sign
is,
whether
it's
lighted
or
not.
F
H
F
H
Part
of
the
problem,
I
think,
is
that
commissioners
heard
a
few
folks
from
the
business
community.
You
know
expressed
concern
and
it
always
is
the
case
that
that
you
know
you
could
put
this
out
there
a
year
ago,
and
the
business
community
will
only
start
paying
attention
when
it,
you
know,
is
about
to
be
adopted
and-
and
everyone
says
well,
we've.
Never,
you
know,
you
surprised
us
and
everything
so
I
think
the
commissioners
wanted
to
provide
tonight
as
an
opportunity
for
that
business
community
to
come
forward.
H
It's
unfortunate,
you
know
no
one
has
but
at
least
as
the
Planning
Commission.
You
know
you
guys
have
this
in
front
of
you,
your
colleagues
who
aren't
here
tonight.
You
know
who
were
here
last
time
have
it
in
front
of
them.
When
we
can,
we
come
back
to
you
next
time.
Hopefully
everybody
will
be
ready
to.
You
know,
talk
about
it
and
make
whatever
recommendations
you
want
to.
You
know
have
go
to
the
Commission
so
that
we
can
bring
them
forward,
but.
D
D
H
The
the
code
was
sort
of
silent
on
them,
and
and
so
because
they
are
a
thing
now
that
the
business
is
used
I've
on
behalf
of
our
firm
I've
done
this,
I
encode
work
for
most
of
the
rest
of
our
clients,
and
so
in
working
with
with
the
city
staff
felt
that
it
was
a
you
know
important,
because
it
is
a
phenomena
to
go
ahead
and
put
the
detail
in
there
and
address
it
and
most
of
that
new
language.
Isn't
all
that
controversial?
H
You
know
bringing
in
at
night
that
sort
of
stuff
make
sure
it
looks
neat
but
I
think
the
big.
The
controversial
thing
is
really
the:
should
it
be
chalkboard,
should
it
not
be
chalkboard?
The
commissioners
have
discussed
it.
As
mr.
Serna
indicated
in
a
workshop
and
and
there
of
multiple
minds,
you
know
some
of
them
sort
of
like
like
like
done
eating.
For
instance,
you
know
one
of
our
clients
went
with
the
chalkboard
model
because
it
looks
artistic,
and
you
know
it's
kind
of
what
really
that
the
the
sidewalk
sign
originally
started.
H
As
is
you
know,
here's
my
daily
specials
and
let
me
draw
flowers
on
it,
but
a
lot
of
businesses
you
know,
came
and
made
the
point
that
both
in
our
other
jurisdictions
in
here
of
look.
We
aren't
artists,
you
know
we're
a
pizza
shop
and
we
don't
do
all
that
stuff.
We
just
want
to
plaster.
You
know
$5.99
for
a
pizza
and
put
it
out
there.
You
know
on
the
sidewalk,
please
let
us
do
our
thing
and
so
ultimately,
whatever
recommendation
you
all
make
ask
to
that
particular
question.
H
If
you
choose
to
make
a
recommendation,
you
know
the
commissioners
are
going
to
have
the
last
call
of
what
those
signs
are
going
to
look
like
and
with
a
lot
of
these
little
things
you
know,
I
will
tell
you
and
surgery
bless.
You
tell
the
Commission
that
we,
what
our
goal
is
is
not
to
let
perfection
be
the
enemy,
the
good
you
know,
I
mean
it
almost.
H
All
of
this
is
not
controversial,
and
and
as
I've
described
you
know
legally,
we
need
to
move
forward,
there's
always
an
opportunity
if
it
gets
adopted
on
one
side
or
the
other
side
of
one
of
these.
You
know
controversial
issues
and
six
months
in
or
whatever
experience
teaches,
we
need
to
come
in
and
tweak
it.
You
can
just
easily
come
in
and
do
a
follow
up
ordinance
to
just
tweak
that
section.
So
we
want
to
hold
the
whole
thing
up
just
because
people
are
not
sure
if
they
want
chalkboards
or
not.
Okay,.
A
Thank
you
and
I
think
one
of
the
things
on
the
the
sandwich
board
chalkboard
signs.
The
comments
that
were
made
are
this
applies
in
all
zoning
districts
that
are
commercially
zoned
and
the
comment
was
made.
You
know
if
there's
a
business
on
us,
19,
they're
chalkboard
sign,
isn't
doing
them
any
good
if
it's
made
with
chalk
board
and
specific
to
the
ordinance
that
says
that
it's
with
a
posted
speed
limit
of
40
miles
an
hour
or
less
so
it's
very
tailored
to
individual
areas
that
are
going
to
have
these
types
of
signs
through.
D
H
G
H
G
H
Because
the
so
anytime,
we
look
at
opening
up
an
ordinance
we
work
with
with
the
client.
You
know
in
this
case
our
planning,
folks
and
and
talk
about
the
scope
of
the
amendment,
and
we
talk
about
things
like
well.
You
know
this
code,
this
chapter
of
the
code
hasn't
been
touched
in
a
very
long
time.
It
uses
terms
that
are
antiquated,
it's
organization,
isn't
all
that
good?
H
You
know
you
know,
and
so
why
would
you
go
in
and
open
up
a
chapter
and
fix
one
thing
and
then
leave
a
bunch
of
other
stuff
that
really
needs
to
be
fixed,
and
so
that's
why,
in
working
with
the
city's
management,
we
went
ahead
and
since
we
were
fixing
the
content
based
stuff,
we
also
picked
up
a
lot
of
these
other
things
because
things
change.
You
know
the
you
know,
for
instance,
electronic
signs
and
so
forth
the
language
that
is
used
currently
versus
the
language
that
really
reflects
what's
now
used
by
the
industry.
H
G
So
that
answer
is
that
first
question
and
you
nicely
dovetails
right
into
the
discussion
portion
and,
and
that
is
I
want
to
just
make
sure
I
read
it
right
and
that
is
page
42
prohibited
signs
all
districts
so
as
I
understand
that
that
means
any
sign
within
the
city
of
Tarpon
Springs
proper,
that's
correct
from
Klosterman
to
the
top
and
close
whatever
okay
good
and
then
I
I
just
struggle
with
how
D
Benton
bus,
shelter,
advertising
signs
suddenly
became
worth
removing
completely
from
our
city.
This
is
just
open
discussion
and
then
you
mentioned
electronic
science.
G
H
Well
knows
so:
first
of
all,
you
have
to
read
the
code.
Is
it
as
a
total,
and
there
is
a
grandfathering
provision
in
there
that,
if
you're
current,
if
you
currently
have
a
lawful
sign,
whether
it's
electronic
sign
or
any
other
kind
of
sign
and
and
this
code
would
make
it
unlawful,
you're
grandfathered
in
you
know
so.
H
Well
know
that
you
have
to
read
the
grandfathering
provision
and
the
grandfathering
provision
says
that
you
can
do
regular
maintenance
to
the
sign.
What
you
can't
do
it's
on
page
48-
and
this
is
this-
is
in
the
current
code
non-conforming
signs,
which
is
what
it
becomes
a
grandfathered
non-conforming
sign,
except
as
otherwise
provided
for
in
this
article
may
be
continued
in
operation,
provided
that
no
non-conforming
sign
shall
be
changed
or
replaced
with
any
other
non-conforming
sign.
H
That
would
increase
the
degree
of
nonconformity,
and
so
when
you
look
at
the
case
law
about
grandfathered
non-conforming
uses
and
because
not
just
for
science,
but
there
are
things
you
know
types
of
structure
the
courts
say
you
know
that
this
is
a
the
proper
way
for
local
governments
to
eventually
get
the
policy
that
they
want
to
get
to,
while
still
preserving
the
the
property.
Interests
are
the
folks
that
that
had
lawful
property
at
the
time
you
adopted.
G
G
Did
who
suggested
to
the
Board
of
Commissioners
our
Worthen
themselves,
that
did
someone
that
really
dislike
science
decided
that
they
wanted
to
take
us
back
a
hundred
years
in
signage
and
say
that
best
bench
and
bus,
shelter,
science
and
all
electronic
changeable
signs
from
this
date
forward?
This
has
sixty
days
no
more
electronic
science
in
the
entire
city,
I
guess
I'm
gonna
just
sort
of
lost
for
words.
My
misunderstanding,
something.
H
Well
again,
I
think
that
if
you
have
a
lawful
current
sign
within
the
city
that
lawful
current
sign
is
going
to
be
a
grandfathered
non-conforming
use.
So
it
is
incorrect
if
you
to
go
and
tell
any
business
who,
if
this
ordinance
gets
adopted,
you
must
rip
out
your
sign.
That
is
I.
H
G
I'm
gonna
go
back
in
time
just
for
the
spirit
of
why
I
might
be
asking
is
so
years
ago.
I
was
part
of
the
code
enforcement
Ward
and
at
one
point
and
I
was
there
for
quite
some
time.
We
had
this
wonderful
code
enforcement
officer
who,
for
whatever
reason,
decided
that
signage
was
how
she
was
gonna,
write.
Citations
know
she
would
overlook,
abandoned
lots,
filled
with
garbage
and
abandoned
cars,
but
man
she
would
score.
G
H
H
The
the
process
begins
with
our
office
going
back
and
forth
with
the
professional
planning
staff
here,
as
as
the
early
drafts
in
the
process
began
in
2018,
as
the
drafts
occurred,
planning
would
provide
feedback
of
you
know
the
we
city
staff
feel
you
know.
This
should
be
this
or
that
should
be
that
and-
and
it
gets
revised
and
tweaked
to
the
point
where
staff
felt
it
appropriate
that
it
was
in
good
enough
shape
to
then
bring
to
the
commissioners.
We
then
had
a
Spencer
indicated
two
workshops
with
the
commissioners.
H
You
know,
but
but
none
of
them
expressed
any
concern
about
being
more
clear
about
what
signs
are
prohibited,
and
so
certainly
you
know
if
the
Planning
Commission
feels
that
that
list
should
be
re-examined.
That's
part
of
your
function,
and
so
you
know
you
all
make
a
motion
and
make
your
recommendations
to
the
Commission
and
those
will
be
brought
forward.
F
H
Be
it
a
County,
Commission
or
City.
Commission
has
to
make
policy
decisions
that
balance
being
pro-business
with
also
community
aesthetics
and
what
residents
want
to
see
and
what
you
know.
Tourists
want
to
see
in
terms
of
you
know,
beauty
of
the
area
and
so
forth,
and
and
create
a
balance.
You
know
and
that's
not
that's
not
a
lawyer's
job,
that's
not
staffs
job.
You
know
we
draft
stuff
up,
and
you
know
answer
commissioners
questions
at
the
end
of
the
day.
H
A
Now,
and
for
y'all's
purposes,
you
know
obviously
three
of
the
four
you
have
not
had
the
benefit
of
having
looked
at
this,
although
you
were
provided
I
understand
mr.
Presley,
maybe
you
were
not,
but
the
rest
of
you
had
been
provided
the
packet,
so
you
had
the
ordinance
and
you
knew
it
was
being
brought
before
today.
The
intention
was
that
you
would
look
through
it
and
then
the
things
that
you
did
have
problems
look
like
the
things
that
we're
discussing
when
we
have
the
public
hearing
on
it.
A
That's
something
that,
if
the
board
as
a
whole
decides
that
something
that
you
want
to
recommend
be
changed
to
the
Board
of
Commissioners,
you
can
certainly
do
so,
but
keep
in
mind
that
as
a
the
body
as
a
whole
has
to
recommend
that
change.
So
you
know
if
at
the
next
hearing
it's
you
know
we
like
everything,
but
we
think
that
electronic
signs
should
not
be
banned
and
sandwich
board.
A-Frame
signs
should
be
able
to
be
whatever
material,
not
chalk,
and
the
whole
board
decides
that
you
know
that
motion
first.
D
A
You
know,
there's
a
motion
made
a
second
it
and
it
passes,
then
that's
the
recommendation
that
will
be
made
to
the
Board
of
Commissioners
and
just
like
everything
else,
that
this
board
does
once
it
gets
to
the
Board
of
Commissioners
they'll.
Take
that
into
account,
but
ultimately
they're,
going
to
decide
how
they're
going
to
decide
based
on
you
know
what
they
do
at
that
level.
A
A
eshton
Felder,
said,
for
there's
a
reason
for
that,
because
it
was
not
just
what
the
city
needed
to
do
to
comply
with
the
terms
of
the
Supreme
Court
ruling,
but
also
it's
a
good
time
to
take
advantage
and
look
at
the
code
as
a
whole
to
see
what
other
changes
would
want
to
be
made
from
a
future
planning
perspective.
Is.
H
You
how
it
how
it
works
is
when
the
Supreme
Court
rules,
you
must
comply,
so
so
the
reed
case
is
now
years
old.
You're
we've
worked
with
our
other
clients
to
get
them
into
compliance.
It's
just
taken
longer
here
in
Tarpon
for
a
variety
of
reasons,
but
but
I
guess
that
what
we
would
say
to
you
as
your
as
your
legal
counsel
is.
H
What
that
translates
into
is
that
every
week
that
goes
by,
if
something
comes
up
in
the
city
where
the
city
does
want
to,
you
know,
take
some
enforcement
action
or
whatever
it
will
have
to
think
twice
about
doing
that,
because
it
of
the
potential
that
the
the
person
who
gets
cited
will
go
get
a
first
amendment
lawyer,
who
will
just
say:
well,
you
know,
y'all
didn't
take
care
of
your
ordinance.
Yet
it's
unconstitutional
and
this
Court
strikes
it
down
and
then
will
be
left
with
nothing.
H
H
You
know
you
you're,
just
the
federal
courts
are
saying
that
you
can
go
this
far,
but
don't
go
any
further,
because
you
know
you
might
run
afoul
of
the
First
Amendment,
but
the
elected
officials
back
then,
and
the
90s
decided
we
want
to
be
even
stronger,
and
so
they
instructed
that
it
be
stronger.
The
federal
court
promptly
struck
it
down
and
it
created
like
a
five
six
month
window
where,
where
the
city
had
no
adult
use
ordinance
and
all
the
adult
useful
uses
flooded
in
because
you
know
there,
there
was
no
organs
in
place.
H
C
H
Reid
just
said:
if
you're
going
to
be
regulating
signs,
don't
do
it
based
on
content
and
and
so
the
electronic
sign
stuff
that
that
your
colleague
is
complaining
about.
That's
just
something
that
is
added
to
it's:
a
policy
choice
to
be
made.
Many
of
our
other
clients
have
done
that
if
tarpon
springs
chooses
for
policy
reasons
not
to
because
it
wants
businesses
to
use
electronic
changeable
copy
signs.
That's
great!
That's
fine!
You
know,
I!
H
Think
a
lot
of
governments
regulate
those
or
prohibit
those,
because
when
put
along
roadsides,
especially
at
night,
they
can
be
distracting
the
drivers
and
so
there's
a
safety
thing
and
if
they're
next
to
neighborhoods,
you
got
the
flashing
signs
and
people
trying
to
sleep,
and
so
again
it's
that
balance
that
you
know
our
commissioners
have
to
deal
with.
Thank
you
thank
you
and.
A
Again,
that's
something
that
you
guys
can
recommend
changing
either,
maybe
not
a
wholesale
ban.
Maybe
you
know
only
in
certain
zoning
districts,
but
if
you're
going
to
come
back
with
those
recommendations,
I
would
just
be
clear
that
you
know
what
zoning
districts
that
you
want
to
see
those
in
what
zoning
districts
you
don't
you
want
to
see
them
everywhere?
What
types?
A
Because,
when
you
make
your
recommendations
to
the
Board
of
Commissioners,
the
more
detailed
that
you
can
be
the
better
it
will
be
for
them
to
be
able
to
make
the
decision
and
not
have
to
sit
at
the
dais
and
wholesale
rewrite
the
section
of
code
that
they've
already
been
working
on
for
several
years.
So.
F
J
So,
as
Rob
indicated
just
because
the
Commission
passes
this
ultimately
doesn't
mean
they
cannot
immediately
turn
around
and
start
working
on
updates
based
on
what
everybody
wants
to
see.
But
we
do
want
to
get
a
pass
to
the
point
of
making
changes
back
and
forth
to
address
the
these
outstanding
legal
issues.
So.
D
J
H
You
and
to
follow
up
on
that.
You
know.
Certainly
y'all,
don't
get
appointed
to
a
position
like
this.
Unless
you're
very
involved
in
the
community,
we've
tried
a
great
deal
to
get
the
business
community
to
come
in
and
engage
with
you
all
I
mean
that's.
What
tonight
is
all
about.
That's
why
we're
all
here?
If
y'all
know
business
people,
you
know
make
sure
that
they
know
about
it,
make
sure
they
understand
it,
because
you
know
certainly
I
know
that
the
city
manager
and
the
mayor
and
commissioners
want
to
have
open
full
engagement.
H
You
know
it's
not
like
anybody's
trying
to
slip
this
through
it's
it's
just
we've
got
to
get
it
done.
It's
it's
been
rolling
for
almost
two
years
now
and-
and
you
know
just
as
we
get
closer,
people
are
starting
to
pop
up
and
say
well
wait
a
minute,
and
so
so
we're
taking
a
breather.
That's
part
of
why
we
did
tonight,
but
we
are,
we
do
need
to
move
forward.
H
E
A
Would
say
to
that
in
the
meantime,
between
this
meeting
and
next
meeting,
if
you
all
have
any
questions
or
something
comes
up
with
you're
reading
it
you're
not
quite
understanding,
please
reach
out
to
us,
you
can
reach
out
to
me.
I
can
forward
it
to
Robert,
to
Pat
whomever
needs
it
or
to
Louie
or
whomever,
and
that
way
we
can
get
your
questions
answered
before
the
next
meeting.
F
A
You
have
a
foundation
to
work
from
and
we
can
make
it
pretty
efficient
and
effective
and
and
maybe
Pat
you
can
send
out
something
our
Kim
can
send
out
something
to
the
whole
board
and
said:
hey.
We
had
a
discussion,
please
feel,
go,
go
back
and
watch
the
YouTube
video
for
those
who
weren't
present
and
then,
if
you
all,
want
to
watch
the
YouTube
video
from
the
previous
meeting
that
way,
you're
kind
of
all
caught
up
to
that
way.