City of Englewood, Colorado Organized Trash Collection - Citizens Committee Meetings, 14 Dec 2021

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From YouTube: Organized Residential Waste & Recycling Collection Citizen's Committee - 14 Dec 2021

Description

Agenda HTML: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/127999?handle=8823D98BCF984DA082DEA9D78F91F730
Agenda PDF: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/127998?handle=6B7EF9709FCA4EEFA33008C76A2DED54

1. Call to Order & Roll Call

2. Old Business

Approval of Minutes

4.

6. Chairperson's Choice

7. Committee Member's Choice

8. Adjourn

4. New Business

Proposal Review

Cost Evaluation

Responses to Committee Questions

Schedule Next Meeting

Agenda HTML: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/127999?handle=8823D98BCF984DA082DEA9D78F91F730
Agenda PDF: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/127998?handle=6B7EF9709FCA4EEFA33008C76A2DED54

A

A

Testing, my audio, can you all hear me.

B

Yep great, thank you.

C

Director d'andrea has anyone said they wouldn't be able to make it.

A

Not that I'm aware of no.

C

So we're missing remember lay the number brown.

A

C

Are we at a quorum.

A

Yes, we um so we have five. Yes, we're good.

B

C

All right, then, let's uh call the meeting to order, and hopefully a member lib and remember, brown will join shortly.

C

So we've got recognition of public comment and there was none.

C

Or I'm sorry, I was looking at the the wrong thing, so we'll call the meeting to order and our initial things to start with are approvals of minutes.

C

Is there a motion to approve the june 9th meeting minutes motion to approve? Thank you vice chair mormon. Is there a second.

D

I'll second them up the motion.

C

Thank you and any discussion. Did anyone have any corrections or anything?

C

Okay, then, uh director d'angelo, please take a vote on that.

A

Yep um and michelle is on tonight, so she can, she can do the okay yeah.

D

We're supposed to roll.

C

B

C

Yeah and remember leib just joined.

B

Okay yeah: I apologize for being a few minutes late.

C

It's okay, thank you! So we're just missing! Remember brown! um So yeah, let's go ahead and do the roll call before this um current vote. um Okay, so please, uh ms chavez, please uh do the roll call first.

B

Of course, um chair green.

C

B

Vice chair, borman.

B

Here and member lee here.

C

Thank you and then we already have a um motion and second for approving the meeting minutes from june 9th. Will you please do the vote on that, as well as travis.

B

Tara, green.

C

B

Viceroy borman, yes, member brinker, yes, uh I don't see member brown yet uh member hufka, yes, remember, kawanabe, yes and member lee yes, motion carries.

C

Thank you. Is there a motion to approve the december 2nd meeting minutes motion to approve? Thank you for a second.

D

I'll, second, that.

C

Thank you uh please take or was there any discussion? Did anyone have any corrections? Oh it was pretty simple. um Then uh please take a vote. Ms chavez.

B

C

B

Vice chair borman, yes,.

B

Member brinker, yes, member brown, member hubka, yes, member kawanabe, yes and member lee yes motion- carries as well.

C

Thank you uh now we'll have recognition of public comment. I see there's at least two attendees at this time, um there's an expectation that any presentations will be conducted respectfully.

C

um We may ask questions to clarify, but it won't be a back and forth dialogue. Please limit your presentation to three minutes.

C

Dude is anyone present interested in speaking.

C

Do we know if they can raise their hands.

B

Yes, they should be able to.

C

Okay, so if any of the attendees would like to speak, please raise your hand or write in on the q a going going gone. Okay, um oh thank you, mr gardner. Thank you, frank um and we'll move on and close the.

C

Recognition of public comment and in our next item we have new business proposal review now. The republic services proposal costs and root and waste management proposal cost remove that nothing has changed there from what we went over and completed in our last meeting right director d'andrea.

C

A

C

Okay, they're just now included in the um packets, so the public can see it correct, yeah, okay, all right, thank you and then um were you able to uh um find a recording of the post rfp meeting with the haulers.

A

No, so if, if I said that at the last meeting I apologize so all I've done is reach out to both companies with some questions and both of them have responded with written answers to those questions. So that was a phone call to each one of those. Last week after our meeting.

C

So I'm talking about the meeting that happened prior to our meeting after the it's in the schedule of the rfp, you said a meeting was conducted and the other haulers attended, and then they didn't there. I I thought after the rfp was posted, there was.

A

Oh, I'm sorry! Okay, now I get you yeah, so we had a um mandatory pre-proposal meeting and yes, that was sorry I okay now I'm catching on. Yes, that was um conducted by our procurement office. So I will get that and send that on to you, okay, yeah, sorry! I I did. I totally spaced that off now I know what you're talking about so.

C

Okay, thank you. Yeah I'd like us to be able to access that okay um and then so for cost evaluation. Do you want to take us through what you have here.

A

Yep so um I'll just preface it before, we show those documents just to kind of um explain what I did so there's a lot of attachments there and what I did was try and get as close as possible to looking at the different scenarios. So we had um each company. You know proposed a little bit differently.

A

So what I wanted to show you is all those different iterations which basically came out to four, so I'll, walk through them and then focus on the one that is probably most apples to apples. I would say in terms of looking at the straight costs, so the first one that I'll pull up is comparison number one.

A

B

Why is that not up.

A

I have too many things open.

B

I can share my screen maria, if you would like me.

A

To if you wouldn't mind, I'm having problems, so thank you. Michelle.

A

I've got too many things open. I think there.

D

A

All right, so this is thank you for that yeah. If you could blow it up just a little bit and then slide it over just so we can kind of work from the top down yeah.

A

So, as you see, I'm trying to this is just the straight costs as submitted for both the pay. As you throw program which again was divided into the 32 gallon and the 96 gallons, we got prices for both of those yeah that'd be great per oh see, then that gets a little too small there.

A

It looks that looks pretty good. Okay, I don't know. If we can, we move that screen over or that piece on the side that says agenda. I don't know if that's possible.

A

There we go okay.

A

All right so yeah, so this one was so the first boxes, if you will um show the pay as you throw so comparing the 32 gallon and the 96 gallon cost to between one company and the other.

A

So this was as they submitted, which again one company um the one on the left does not include the large item pickup, so that that is a consideration, whereas um company b provided all of the what we call the base services, and so you can see there that the difference between the two, uh both on the individual line items and then overall you know the first company was roughly um a little less than five dollars, both on the seven year and on the ten year and as you can see, the company b did not propose on the five year plan.

A

So if you scroll just a little bit down michelle, then we have the uniform container, which is 96 gallons across for both companies, and you can see that the for company, a the prices under the pay, as you throw, are the same as the uniform container. So they're, basically the same. If it's a 96 gallon under the pay, as you throw versus under the uniform container and then again, no pricing for the five-year contract under the second company.

A

And then you can see the difference there of about a little over four dollars for each the seven year and the ten year.

C

Go ahead, member boorman with your question.

B

Director d'andrea, I can't remember if this is right or not so with the pay-as-you-throw every when, with the 32 gallon, you would get a 32-gallon garbage container and still a 96-gallon recycling container correct.

A

No, it was still the 90 or 32 and 32 recycling and garbage okay.

A

Yep and then you can see below there michelle could you just maybe do it up one notch? Let's just see if we can go up just um know the sizing just go up to maybe 125 see if we can still, because I'm I'm having trouble reading it on my little screen there we go. That's good yeah. If you can scroll down to the bottom, then what I did the bottom of each was just those other items.

A

I tried to compare those as well, so um you know if there's a if there was a additional residential, solid waste container. So if your family was large and you wanted to rent a second one, that would be the cost. The second company didn't provide that you can see. There's some differences there across the board, both higher and one case, some cases lower in some cases, which is indicated by the red. So again, it's comparing a to b any questions on that.

A

So that's kind of gives the layout and that's the straight costs across the board.

C

So this is without whatever the administrative fees would end up being. That's.

B

C

These are what do we think that is what what is the amount for the administrative fees.

A

We were right around two dollars per month per household.

C

Would that increase over time.

A

Most likely yeah due to because that was primarily made up of salaries for staff. I think what we're doing is evaluating exactly what staff, if you recall, that, was, and basically an administrative person, a person to oversee the program and then a part-time code enforcement. The question is whether we need the code enforcement person or not. So I think that may reduce that down, and then there was a vehicle associated with that. So we're still evaluating that.

C

um You know in our before we continue on with going through these. I I think some of the questions that we asked and I believe you may have some answers to really affect our perspective. On taking in these um these costs. I would like to potentially get the answers to the questions before we continue going through these costs so that we can discuss those answers as part of looking at the costs.

B

C

Like, for instance, you know the waste management trying to not do alley service, you know what was their response on that. The ambiguity around that.

A

Yeah, so I did receive those responses if you'd prefer for me to kind of summarize those I can.

C

I'd like to have that.

B

C

Before we go over the pricing.

B

All right since it.

C

Has such an effect on perspective here.

A

Then, if you wouldn't mind michelle um uh stopping the share and then I'll share those documents, um because I have access to those.

D

To clarify these, both haulers will do trashy pickup. Am I right.

A

I'm sorry, member hubka, would you mind repeating that? I'm sorry I should have raised.

D

My hand um just for clarification, both haulers agree to do ally.

B

And straight pickup right, correct.

A

C

Well, it was ambiguous in the waste management proposal because they put six pages into pushing against it.

A

So I did send this within the last half an hour to the the committee, um so I will summarize this and you can read it at your leisure, but um they did both provide me with written responses.

A

So this one I'll bring up first from waste management, and I again I did talk to both of them on the phone so um talk to them in person as well. Can you guys see my screen.

B

A

All right so again, this is uh waste, management's response, so this was a 17-page document, um so giving written responses there's a letter and then they focused on.

C

So we just right before this meeting received these, I haven't even seen this.

A

C

A

I haven't read it either, so I've I've been, I just received this today. um I have not had time to go through it, so I will summarize our conversation and again this will provide more detail um so they're talking about benefits of curbside collection, recycle value share, so that was that shareback program about recycling and basically sharing that risk um talking about the vehicles and then their customer service program.

A

So one of the top things we talked about, I did confirm that, although they would prefer to have um everybody curbside, their intent is still to uh service people in their alleys who are already receiving that service. So.

C

We're already already receiving that service. It's for anyone who wants that service, regardless of whether they currently have that or not right.

A

I'm I'm repeating what they told me, so I'm summarizing. What was repeated to me is that the people who are currently using the alleys that they would continue to service them in the alleys that you know whether somebody is currently on the street and they would prefer to have ali service. We did not get into that.

C

Well, that's what the rfp specified correct.

A

Yep and I'm just repeating what they said so.

C

And that's for both trash and recycling, correct.

A

C

Vice chair, borman.

B

Oops, I just left that up.

A

So it looks like they talk about some of the benefits, what they feel uh more convenience being on the street, so they.

C

Yeah I mean we've already seen six pages of them, pushing towards.

A

C

So more pages of that doesn't make any difference.

C

The reality is, we know that the citizens of englewood want ali service.

C

I mean that was the most raised issue and, if they're trying to get out of that by saying it's only available to people who already happen to use waste management and already happen to have it on the alley and that's not a sufficient response, since the rfp is specifically requiring that anyone who has an alley can use the alley or the curb remember, hubka,.

D

All right: well, they clarify that. Can you hear me? Okay,.

C

I can't hear you.

D

You guys can't hear me.

C

D

All right, that's weird, I'm using my computer. um They clarify that in the letter in that um the health and safety are often compromised when servicing helis alleys can be challenging to navigate.

C

Your audio is fading in and out. I can hear like some of the words, but not all of them. Can you speak closer to the mic.

D

Okay, what I'm gonna do is dial in, because.

C

D

B

Only happens on.

D

B

Call it's the weirdest thing.

C

All right so we'll get her questions when she rejoins.

C

I mean is that what your phone call is like? Is they just they're they're continuing to try to be ambiguous about it, instead of confirming that they're supporting what the rfp required.

A

No, I I think the intent is that they're going to continue to pick up in alleys, but.

C

A

C

Is is a is a hedge? It's ambiguous, it's not continue is not okay, it needs to be what the rfp says, which is anyone can choose ally or curb.

A

So no we, I did not ask that question.

C

That needs to be made super clear before we even you know, conti can continue considering them, since that was the most raised issue by all citizens, or you know a huge portion of the citizens from everything and we've all put that into the rfp as a most critical thing. It also needs to be super clear that it's both trash and recycling without any hedges. Without any ambiguity, you know that's an issue. Remember: are you back on.

D

Yes, I can how's that.

C

It's still quiet, but it's a little better.

D

All right: well, it's weird it's just this zoom meeting but anyway, um so waste management cannot go in all alleys because of low hanging wires and trees, and everybody who has ali service today should have alley service tomorrow.

D

What I think waste management wants to avoid is the impression that people who can't have ali service today are going to suddenly have it with this contract. I don't think it's fair to ask them to go address by address and specify, but my understanding is that where they can provide alley service, they they will. They are today, so they will tomorrow.

D

I don't think they're trying to get out of it.

C

Well, if there's I mean, there's rules around lines and if there's lines that are not up to code, then that needs to be addressed and if there's trees hanging into alleys below code as well, then that needs to be addressed and the the justification for the justification for utilizing city collective bargaining to get you know benefit to citizens. One of the main things is getting ali's service, including for the people who had services that stopped providing it and that's what was requested by citizens. That's what we voted on.

C

That's what's in the rfp, it's not about who has it now gets to keep it it's about. Anyone who has an alley has the option to have their trash and recycling on the alley.

D

Okay, then, I think both of these companies will not meet that requirement.

C

The other one uh did the other one accepted that, but they didn't accept the large item. Pickup part, they didn't hedge or put any ambiguity in on providing full alley uh service for both waste and recycling, whereas waste management has done that they're trying to push away from it. They can't even be straight in a conversation to address what the rfp specifies.

D

I wouldn't agree with that, but um you know we I, as far as code goes and trees and wires, that's a whole separate ball of wax. I don't think we want to go there. I think the objective of this is to try to find one carrier for one truck on the street at the best value and um a carrier that will have the option of alleys, but I did not think that the objective was to make sure that customers who don't have a alley pickup today, can have it tomorrow that.

C

Was absolutely discussed throughout the entire set of our meetings.

D

That that was not it's not realistic. We also know that it.

C

Is realistic, it's the.

D

B

C

Is to because we're looking at pricing that is significantly higher than what people are currently paying and we're not going to take.

D

Away, this is not significantly higher than people are paying. This is actually it's.

C

Significantly higher than I'm paying.

D

You have a deal and it's going to go up well.

C

And there's also there's also in the current situation, a new provider that just came in so as we have competition now we have little dumpster providing residential and they weren't during all of our meetings, you know so there there are other considerations than just.

C

We need to have a single hauler and the con. The concern from citizens when all of this effort was put into getting input from citizens was the alley pickup was critical and that was expressed by tons of citizens. Who've had ali service taken away. It's it's okay,.

B

Our rfp has been written.

C

To be specific to all out, all citizens have the choice of curb or alley and well.

D

Let me let me just put this another way we haven't decided the citizens haven't decided to do this. Yes, our job is to just pick which one is better to recommend to city council and then get citizen input. Actually, our job is.

C

Not to pick one and recommend one to city council, our job is to evaluate whether it even makes sense to consider the possibility of recommending.

D

C

To a single hauler.

D

Is that right, maria? Are we just going to scrap this whole thing because carson doesn't like either one of these agreements.

C

It's not about carson, it's about, we have, we defined an rfp and neither of the haulers have agreed to. What's in the rfp, I mean you're. Remember.

B

You're claimed to be someone.

C

Who deals with contracts, contracts and details matter, the the rfp is? Was we put all the time into the rfp based on the input of citizens? It's not just me, and I resent that you would imply that there are.

D

Well, you're you're really pushing back on. um This is a solution, um because I don't I just I'm not convinced that you like um the solution of a carry of one carrier altogether, that you still would rather have something like um choice. Actually.

C

B

Be getting off track.

C

I think it's an important discussion. I I disagree. I'm not again. I've been the same the whole time I care about service levels and cost, and also the environment nothing's changed there, I'm if and when we have a whole city, giving a contract to a provider they need to provide.

C

You know I've already had you know, we've already lost because of you know me being outvoted on things various aspects of what people currently have in their standard of service, meaning all the providers right now pick up yard waste outside of the containers with that for cheaper than what these numbers are.

E

All of them don't um well public, doesn't.

C

Republic still does for a large portion of their customers who have always had it. They don't.

E

C

E

Heard from my neighbors that have had it they've been there years, they said that republic recently switched and turned to 350 a bag or a bundle, but maybe that's something to clarify with them, rather than us, trying to figure it out between us.

C

Sure and again, like that's irrelevant, because you know my interest in in that four citizens got overruled by the rest of this committee. You know I've given up on that like, but that doesn't mean that I'm against uh a single hauler, but if we're gonna recommend the city go with a single hauler, it should be based on the details of what we determined were the requirements for what a single hauler would provide, and the one thing we know is the biggest deal to the most citizens is alley service.

C

So this hedging and and big ambiguity and pushing against and acquiescing to some people might get that and some might not. You know, that's not. Okay, that's to me! That's a big deal and completely not okay, and to further to look at the pricing for a response proposal to the rfp that doesn't satisfy the basic premise of the rfp. To me makes little sense. I mean we can do it, but if they're not going to satisfy the terms of the rfp.

C

What's the point of the pricing.

E

Some things that are different from the rfp we can make do with and uh compromise on and some things we can't that's how I feel- and I tend to agree that I heard most citizens say that ali service was a top and um I agree that doesn't just go for the ones that have it now because, like you, scepter green, some had it before and it was taken away, but those folks would still prefer to have it in the alley just due to difficulties of their house being on a hill or or so forth.

C

Well, for myriad reasons but yeah. Thank you. Member brinker agree all right, so you know I'm sure everyone wants to continue to go through all this and look at these prices, but I think it's and I don't like that. We just got you know what a 17 page response from one and I don't even know what the other one is or is it 17 pages total from both.

A

No, the answers from republic were in an email, so.

C

All right, so we haven't had time to look at that and I think that those are those responses are important to consider I mean I, I took my time to go through everything you sent us, but I mean I didn't even realize he just sent us something minutes before the meeting and it's completely pertinent to the discussion.

C

You know we can look at numbers, but if they're, if they're numbers about a proposal that doesn't even satisfy the requirements of the rfp, then the numbers are are irrelevant. I mean.

A

I think excuse me, go ahead. Member hubka.

D

um Yeah, so we have one carrier who won't do a five-year contract and another carrier who will that will weigh heavily in a decision to move forward with both these companies, regardless of their ambiguity about ali service. In regards to ali service, I talked to a resident this evening. I go to water aerobics twice a week and all the ladies ask me stuff about our the committees I'm on. She would love ali service, but her alley is a two-lane little rut with the wires in the trees, so she's become accustomed to taking it out front.

D

I don't think that we should um not move forward with one of the contracts, because uh the ambiguity of the contract is something that um the city attorney can pick up, and we can certainly ask them to uh consider getting that more. uh You know most precise for our citizens.

D

At the end of the day, um I think we have to look at the price and the contract length and decide which one uh makes the most sense, which one we recommend that that really is our role.

C

That's not our role. Our role is to evaluate.

B

Whether it's even.

C

Possible you keep saying our role is to pick one of these. That's not accurate. The role of this committee is to consider the possibility of recommending or not a single hauler option to city council, the we could absolutely say we took all citizen input. We put a huge amount of time into defining an rfp for what would satisfy the needs of the community and no hauler offered a proposal that satisfies the rfp.

B

D

Always agree that no holler.

B

Satisfies it because, like even though there's some ambiguity, it's not that they said no valley service, we just need to get them to define more specifically what that means and that you know that still is one of those things again. I think we can't get bogged down in the weeds, because if we do we're never going to get anywhere, it's.

C

Not the weeds, though vice chair borman, it's the biggest issue brought up by the citizens that we are supposed to be representing, and we put I mean, I'm not familiar with all of your experience with rfps, but I've never dealt with an rfp that accepts proposals that completely ignore major aspects of the rfp.

C

Neither of the of the proposals satisfy the rfp. I mean one way to look at this is no one can do it. Okay, we define an rfp. No one can no one is willing to satisfy the requirements of the rfp at any price. So we recommend a city council that well it's not going to work. We can't we know what's important to people.

C

D

About this a lot- and we knew going into this- that there we have a great big bunch of requirements that we would like, but that we can't have we threw everything and on the dart board, and we've asked them to come up with the best program that they can. We did not say no.

C

We specified a set of requirements.

D

We did not say that we did not say it. You must do these things or it's off the table, because if that's true then I want all electric vehicles or we're not doing this at all.

C

Let's not do it at all then, and that is what it is. The rfp is very specific. I read it in detail, it's very specific. It includes the details of what is required, it's a set of requirements, and neither of these proposals satisfies the set of those requirements. Remember member brinker.

E

Thanks, um can we back up this step?

E

It's true that we specified in the rfp exactly what we wanted to see and it's true that neither proposal addressed 100 to the key, exactly what we want to see, and I think that means that we can either scrap the whole thing and said no one addressed it to a t or we can take a look at what we have and see if it is worth recommending, one or the other or both of these to city council to consider so maybe we make the best of the situation and continue looking through it and about allies.

E

Yes, that's a major thing: it's not a minor detail, but we established, like almost from the first sentence, that we're going to need some more clarification from waste management. On this point specifically, so I think we should get that clarification.

E

We'll have to try again because there's various um options on a spectrum one is uh that they absolutely won't on the alley for anybody who doesn't have it now, um that's the most extreme and we think that probably won't do the other end of the extreme. Is that what we were thinking last time? They would encourage people to move to this curb, but would still be willing to pick up on the alley and then there's a whole lot of options in between.

E

We have to figure out which one it is and if that's something that we can work with.

C

Thank you, member hobka.

D

Well, I'll, um I'm going to make a motion, but I'll make it later on in the evening. Let's just carry on with reviewing what we have.

C

So you have not read these director d'andrea no, and is your impression that republic, their response to the rfp satisfies to the t what the rfp requires for ally and curb service.

A

C

Impression was that they saw us.

A

Make a statement either way? No did.

C

A

Our intent is to discuss these with the citizens committee. The citizens committee is allowed to make whatever type of recommendation they want. As one piece of information going back to the city council, we will be formulating a communication plan to the community as well, that will roll out after the first of the year and all of that information, including anything back from the citizens committee, will be presented to the city council.

A

So we can continue. You know, as far as but again making you know to remember brinker's point we have what we receive, so the we can continue committee doesn't need to continue if they don't want to, um but I think we feel as staff that we have to do something back to the community to communicate that in some way at least share the the outcomes with them and get some input so.

C

All right, let's go to your the question. You have a summary of your conversations with them.

A

No, just that was verbal.

C

So how did you want to communicate with us what you learned from those conversations.

A

Well, they they provided this document and republic. I spoke with them and then sent them questions and they responded in an email with responses to those questions.

C

Okay, so we just now received the right before the meeting like minutes before um the responses that address are questions that pertain to whether either of these satisfy the rfp requirements or not. Remember brown.

F

Yeah, I'm sorry my xfinity went down so I have been listening by phone and I'm just concerned about everything that you've been talking about with the alleys, and I I I guess I don't know how you can just leave out allie pickup.

F

I mean I didn't hear at the beginning of the meeting, but I also thought at the last meeting we kind of said with republic that since they were not going to, let anybody opt out is republic even in the conversation anymore, or are we just focused on waste management now and what they are proposing.

C

Now we're at this point we're still evaluating both proposals, even though both of them left large holes in you know responding to the terms of the rfp, like you just pointed out, republic um went way overboard on their response about opt-out and, as we've been discussing, waste management is not apparently potent potentially not willing to provide ali's service throughout the city, but we don't have details on that. Yet so.

F

Well, I think that chair green is a big hole right now. That's just my opinion.

C

I agree. Thank you, member brown.

C

A

I just I I could we just chair green, perhaps if the committee would prefer we could. I could briefly summarize my conversations and then, if you have any other questions such as the ali service, like clarification, I can go back to them. Ask those follow-up questions. This will give you some then some time to digest the materials that have been provided, I'll, try and get those responses written and out to the committee and then be able to have all of you digest that before we have the next meeting.

A

Thank you director.

C

D'andrea, please do like fill us in on what what your, how your conversations went, the outcomes of that of those. So we have perspective on that. Then we can all consume these and I think we're just gonna have to like we're. Gonna have to reschedule to take next steps because we need time to be able to. I mean we need time to be able to consume what they sent back and we need.

C

You know we need explicit um confirmation on the you know the most critical points of the rfp and their responses to it or, if they're, trying to push against it or you know what those answers are matter.

C

So yes, please, please tell us about your conversations. Okay,.

A

Oh, I see, member hubka is your hand up.

D

Right right, so I just want to clarify why we spend lots of time reviewing what has been presented to us city, council and based on citizen input can go with either one of these contracts without our input um they. This is not. It is not up to us to tell city council that we will not be moving forward with this, because this this um committee doesn't like that. We don't get all of the bells and whistles that we want.

D

um You know when we, when waste management spoke to us and other in the public too.

D

I forget which one said that they said to prepare yourself for the fact that you can't get all the bells and whistles that you want, and so our I'm gonna restate our goal and I'd like to review the prices again, and maybe uh all of us should consider and use this time wisely tonight, whether we like the pay as you throw um option versus the um the um other option, which is the uniform container and then evaluate just those prices and consider also do we want um to go with the company that gives us the option of the five-year contract.

D

Or um is it worth um with the limited ally service to go with the seven-year contract? The price is pretty good. I mean we're all together right now. Maybe we could spend some time doing that and discussing the private.

C

Thanks for your input, member hubka, um please go ahead and tell us about the remember brown.

F

Yeah, I just I'm sorry um just in response. You know I didn't come on this committee to work for city council. I think that our goal is to get the citizens what they want and we're having a hard time doing it. I don't expect that we get everything but alley. Pickup is pretty crucial.

F

So that's that's my thought on it and if it doesn't go to city council, it doesn't go to city council. If we cannot get clarification, I don't feel like I'm working for city council. I feel like I'm working for my neighbors.

F

So that's just my feeling, and also I just like to bring up, is that would any one of us sign a five seven year or ten year deal on anything I mean. Would you sign it on home insurance car insurance? No, because you can always get a more competitive price, and I don't understand why we're going in for this length of period. Is it for better price, or are we being remiss in thinking that there's no there's not going to be any more competition out there in those years.

C

Yeah the goal was partly by having the different further length time. Contracts was to improve price because for a company to take on the um the contract, they're going to have to invest a bunch in equipment etc, and it potentially makes it so that it's a more reasonable overall price if they have the commitment for the period of time.

C

But obviously, as you know, you know we're a committee of citizens that are that were brought together to represent citizen interests, and we know that citizen interest weighs heavily towards alley service for both waste and recycling and also you know. The other thing is that we spent you know a year and a half incorporating into a new rfp and to just arbitrarily throw away the most critical points of the rfp that we put together and act like it doesn't matter.

C

It doesn't make any sense to me and that's not representing citizens, for what they care about, and I'm not talking about bells and whistles. I'm talking about the most key core uh cares that were expressed by the largest portion of citizens. In you know, we know that the people who show up to a meeting like that each of their voices represents a lot of people who don't even know what's going on or should take the time to show up and and then even to speak up.

C

So you know I am here to represent citizens the same way that remember brown just expressed not to force something arbitrarily on them, against the wishes that we took into account. Remember hubka.

D

The citizens are going to have a chance. This is just preliminary we're not making any decisions on be for we're not working for city council, and we are um there's going to be a lot of due diligence after this between city council staff and the citizens. This is just preliminary.

C

Member brinker.

E

um Yeah, I agree with most of that so far, um but given that we do still have some large looming ambiguities that we're not going to know now and given that there's information here, we still want to read.

E

um I wonder if we could maybe make the best use of the time we still have um in this meeting and maybe do like member hubcus suggested and start to look at the prices um and then just just know that we're gonna have to get some more clarification on those on those larger issues.

C

Yeah, I mean part of the reason that I'm concerned about putting a bunch of effort and time into evaluating prices is that if, if they're not satisfying the rfp, for you know key portions of it, then we could be looking at prices that are about to change when we inform them that the rfp points need to be addressed, that they don't get to choose to ignore them. um Remember brown.

F

Yeah, I'm just going to re-ask this. Are we again just looking at republic after what they stated that they're not going to? Let anybody opt out. I mean what is the reason for looking at their prices, because you know citizens are not going to be happy with that.

C

uh I mean at this point we haven't officially accepted or thrown out anything we're we're still trying to evaluate the the responses, and normally the evaluation of responses to an rfp starts with, knowing that the points of the rfp that were the most specifically critical are satisfied. But in this case multiple of the most key critical points of the rfp are not satisfied, and so that's why it feels premature to even to me to put time into looking at these pricing prices, because they don't even necessarily reflect the base service necessary to satisfy the are.

C

You know the key points of the rfp, but I understand you know we can take the time to look at them and go through it. uh Vice chair, chairpin,.

B

I was just gonna say that you know instead of arguing because it feels like we're just going around in circles. I really feel like we have to at least make the use of our time, because even if we decide that you know the ali service is not adequate, you know we can knock them out. You know and then say: okay, fine. We can look at republic for just the fact that they do alley service and things like that. But I think we should just at least look at the stuff with our time because well.

C

And that's what until we have.

B

Our clarification, it doesn't matter a darn thing and that's why you know we have this meeting scheduled. Let's just do the damn thing. That's crazy.

C

B

C

To move on to have director d'andrea uh fill us in on what she learned from her conversation beyond the you know, the large documents that were sent to us moments before this meeting that none of us have had a chance to read.

B

Sounds good: let's do that.

C

Thank you, director d'andrea. Can you please inform us what you learned in your conversations.

C

A

Sorry about that, so the second point we talked about, I asked for clarification on what they call the value share program and without reading this I'll. Just summarize, so it's basically a risk sharing.

A

So um in with certain products mostly plastics, is that there there could be a market for those and sometimes and or there might not, and that might fluctuate by month, that might fluctuate by year, and so basically, what we're doing is we're sharing those costs or that risk with the company.

A

And so in the good months, when they're able to sell material, then we would see a credit and then in the months where we don't, we would have to bank those dollars in the within the city and because I'm because I asked specifically, I said you know, our one of our goals is to make sure that that amount is stable from month to month that that's not fluctuating.

A

So we would have to manage that internally. So, in the good months, we'd have to again bank those any savings. And then, if there's months, where there's not as much of a market for those materials, then we would have to pay more, and so that's where that difference comes in so you'd see a lesser bottom total cost for the citizen, but we'd have to do that now. How much of that is, you know again, there's there's risk there.

A

I guess so any questions on that that I can try to answer or is that enough of an explanation and.

F

Remember that was.

A

A savings of um I believe it was three dollars off of the 7.10 um disposal fee per month.

C

Is your thought that if that risk system was implemented that every month or quarter or whatever, that would actually potentially affect uh citizen cost.

A

No, so that's that that would be our intent is we'd set the price you know at the beginning of the year and that wouldn't change so we'd have to manage that internally. Those ups and downs.

C

So if it costs less, then we wouldn't be passing that on to citizens, correct we'd,.

A

Have to bank that now, if we could, maybe at the end of the year, we reassess that you know and and maybe there's the opportunity to reduce that, but is there the need, then to increase it either to come or cover those costs again. That's that risk element.

C

B

C

In there I mean you know again, we haven't been able to look at this yet because we just received it, but do you know if they've provided detailed examples from other municipalities that have utilized this? Do we have realistic comparables.

A

Yes, so that would be another step that I could take in this interim period is remember. We asked for references so as to reach out to the references and ask how it's going so I know that there's um entities that are currently on the value share that could share their experiences with us.

C

Yeah and obviously, even specifically in colorado, since those costs are probably region specific to some degree.

C

B

C

Did anyone else have any questions about that.

B

I've got a quick one. Would that raise the administrative cost at all.

A

I don't think so again I I it's it's not. I think it's a lump sum dollar amount. You know where they'd share with us hey this. This was a bad month or this was a good month. um I don't think we're looking at again individual accounts that we would have to do a lot with perfect.

B

Thank you, yeah.

C

Good question remember: quantity thanks.

A

Okay and then we talked a little bit about um smart trucks, so again, they're they're, looking at um this idea of of having they we're going to use the cng with their vehicles as they they buy these, and so there's just some more I've confirmed that they're using um cng vehicles and that they would buy those vehicles for the city contract if they move forward.

A

So again, just more information on that here.

C

This is you have a chance to find out if there was like what the difference between the gases collected at our waste station are and what, whether that's something that's refinable or sellable or utilizable for these trucks.

A

Yeah, I I did speak to somebody over at spr and I guess the material or the gas, if you will that we're that we're emitting goes into it has to be scrubbed and such so it is able to be accepted by excel energy in that form. But it's not something that can be easily converted to a cng type fuel if you will to go back into those directly into those vehicles, so there it would. There is another step in the process that we would have to investigate and invest in to be able to do that.

C

Do you know what excel does with it.

A

So they they treat it and they put it back into their system in some fashion.

C

Thank you yeah. It's just.

A

It's so it's usable as um gas, but not as cng the fuel that would fuel those via types of vehicles.

C

B

A

So the the trucks were a bigger question for republic, so we'll get to that in a.

B

A

um And then I think the last question for them specifically was touchdown was customer service, so we talked about that, so they do have, um even though they didn't write about this, they do have an email option, so they can send emails at any time of the day or night, and then the intent would be is to to respond to those on the next business day when they're in the office, um and then they go into more detail here, just in some of their specifics in terms of how they uh respond to people in the various this app that they have um and you can manage your service through there.

A

Obviously, your billing would be through the city, but pretty much any. You have a variety of options of how they um respond to people.

A

They would prepare a custom englewood website where we would, you know, have all this information, and I think that was generally what we, what we discussed.

F

Maria, I just asked you to go back some pages where it's their call time: okay, yeah! Let me see I'm sorry. I should call you director, I'm well you're, you're, fine,.

A

And I'm I uh if you didn't hear me, member brown, um I have not had a chance to read this, so if you saw something yeah, please stop me.

F

No, I was just wondering where they had the response time. I think it's it's somewhere in there that if they don't, if, if you have to wait, two minutes they'll get back to you, but it doesn't. Okay, yeah.

A

F

Have the option to get a call back? Do you know how long that callback would be.

A

No, but that's that's a great question, so I've been on a service like that, where I think it was my um must have been comcast, my cable, where you called them and then they yeah they. You can press in your number and then they'll call you back I'll. Ask if there's a timeline that they give you of when that callback will be received.

C

A

That allows you to not have to sit on the phone waiting.

F

Right or stay at home waiting for a call back and.

B

F

B

E

B

F

Yeah, thank you.

A

Any other questions around customer service that I can follow up on with them or.

C

A

Else with waste management.

C

I mean just looking at that sentence about the email it you know. We we said respond within one business day and they're, pushing it to 48 hours. I think that should be just one business day. It satisfies what they're, claiming that they're, making it for 48 hours for and makes it so that if someone does make a request on a monday that they don't get to push it 48 hours, they have one business day. You know.

B

C

It's less of a big deal than several of the other things we're dealing with.

A

All right, I'll, stop sharing and then the um I'll just uh talk through the responses from wasteman or from republic. Excuse me so one of the things I asked them was: you know why didn't they provide?

A

I think the biggest question is: why didn't they provide a um include cost to do the large item pickup and it was um interesting, so they still are going to provide those.

A

You know where you can call up and if you have a mattress that they'll come out and pick that up their concern is that with the two free vouchers and the number of items, the potential there that the volume was too much for them to be able to handle given their current staffing, their proposed staffing, and so what they're proposing instead is that they would do a bulk drop-off event like they do in other cities.

A

So again, this the downside is that you'd have to bring it to some where, like a park or something get the items there as opposed to leaving them out at the curb or in the alley.

A

So I think the you know, they're they're, saying that it's just too much for them to be able to handle is their summary.

B

Sorry for the interruption, but I I was thinking about this earlier- I think it might because their um train transfer station is further away than waste. Management's. Is you know waste management's on oxford across santa fe, I think or union, and I believe the um transfer station for republic was aurora, something like that very far out there. So if they were having to fill a truck with one couch and then they'd end up having to drive 20 miles to empty it, just a thought.

A

Yeah they did say here too, that the volume the city was asking for so remember we did the 10 bags of trash plus the 10 bundles of yard waste, and the three additional bulk items like furniture for each voucher is excessive is what they said.

A

So I did ask them too, I said well, how has that been received? You know, do you get a lot of complaints about? You know people not having the right vehicle or whatever to be able to transport the items to a drop-off event, and they don't really, you know, interact with the citizens the way that the communities do. So, I think that's another follow-up for me with their references to ask. Well, why did you opt for a drop-off event?

A

You know versus a pickup at the curb and then how is it going and are you getting complaints from people who just cannot simply transport those items to a central? You know, location.

C

Yeah, I mean the whole point of it is because they can't that's what large items all about. um Okay,.

E

I think that the bigger issue is the um um bags or bundles outside of the bin right. That's what our committee was more concerned about, in particular for large item pickup, because we said large item pickup would be nice to have. It would cut down on neighbors, getting mattresses dumped in their alley and having to pay for it and so forth. But that's the status quo right now is that, if something's dumped on your own property, if pay for it, so um that's something that we said.

E

We wanted to look at the cost um and evaluate if it's a amenity that we can afford so to speak. But I I remember discussions that the bigger issue was what to do about um when you have items that wouldn't fit in your bin right. Do I recall that correctly? That seemed to be the bigger question about large item pickup, even though it wasn't large, it might be a lot.

A

I think I think both you know, I think people who have a lot of yard waste and throughout the year and then also just what do you do with those types of you know, furniture mattresses? How do you dispose of them in a reasonable way, and I think our underlying or over arching goal was to try and minimize the amount of that people just dumping it and then the city having to pick that up and then essentially the community pays for those costs. Anyways.

E

Yeah definitely.

C

I thought that citizens were having to deal with them with it themselves. I mean I thought there was an anecdote about. The last mayor had to pay to have something that was dumped in behind her house.

A

C

A

We get a lot of stuff in the parks you know in.

C

What you should consider.

A

uh Public property, so we a lot of tvs. You know, especially the that type of thing. So yes, there still is that that and their commun or code enforcement is trying to um enforce that on the adjacent property owner. But we still get a lot of stuff of in other places that can't even be tied to a private party.

C

So what were you? Can you just reiterate for each of them waste management and republic? What were the questions that you asked them.

A

Yeah, so I talked with um waste management about primarily the ali service to to clarify that, so that needs some more clarification, but I wanted to make sure basically I asked: what do you mean by limited when you say limited service, and so the end? The response was, what we talked about is that people who are currently being serviced would continue to do so.

C

A

C

um Waste versus recycling on that.

A

No, I did not ask that.

C

That's key as well, because I know that a lot of waste management customers do have waste on the alley and recycling at the curb and our rfp is about both on the alley.

A

Yeah I'll clarify that, but no I I assume that it was again if, if you're being served in the alley that they're gonna pick up both garbage and recycling in the alley.

C

They used to, I mean for 15 years, that's how it was for me and then it changed.

A

And then, with waste management, I asked to clarify you know just how they're um what types of trucks they're using the the that they are indeed going to be using cng vehicles and then that question around the customer service. Is there any other aspects that weren't covered? They were at the last meeting, and so they heard those questions directly from the committee.

A

So and that was the response that they prepared.

A

So with republic, I asked about the um the large item pickup, which was a big question. Then I asked so.

A

um Why is republic opting to use diesel instead clean diesel instead of cng to service the englewood contract if they were to get it and um their response is basically that they would service inglewood out of their golden facility and right now golden whatever field or yard that they have? There does not allow for electric or excuse me for for cng vehicles and they're, also in the process of piloting electric vehicles and they're, hoping that they can start to implement that.

A

um I believe it was arizona and another state not colorado, where they're testing that right now some electric vehicles, they are very expensive, but they felt like they would rather invest in the clean diesel and put that into this contract versus the the cng. The cng vehicles are also more expensive um and so they've they've opted. That's the reasons that they've opted to go that route.

C

Did you address the their response to the opt out.

A

um Let's see, then I talked about oh yeah, the rate adjustment, um basically that um I'm just reading their response here. So you know we they're.

A

Okay, so I said, please explain republic's proposed annual rate adjustment and how that aligns with the rfp requirements to have the first two years of the program be fixed at year.

A

One prices followed by an annual increase of the lesser of three percent or cpi, and so they talk a lot about that water sewer trash index and that it's more applicable to the industry um and then currently, you know that that's running about six percent and rising, um especially in kind of the recent past year, and so, if we're going to restrict the haulers to a limited price increase, then it's.

A

It really just makes the pricing overall unacceptable so again, which is then basically front loading. Those those prices.

A

um I did not ask about the opt out. I think they were pretty clear. You know, I think, that's a point that we have to debate and decide whether that's doable or not. um I didn't ask for any further clarification on that, because I thought the proposal was pretty clear, um but I can certainly ask you know what their thought process was behind that. But again I think they detailed that in the proposal.

C

So your impression is that if we were to stick to the terms of the rfp that they would just not be interested in regard to the opt out.

A

Yeah, well, I guess I'd have to pose that question, but you know this is what what we received is what they're proposing. So I guess, then, the the ball is in our court. It's to whether or not that's acceptable or not, and so that's the information. I think that the staff is looking from the citizens committee. You all are closest to this. What do you think about that?

A

You know what how do you feel if, if we were to go to try to go out and tell people yeah regardless after year, one what's gonna happen is you're gonna have to automatically. You know, continue to pay this minimum price of you know 24 to 27.

C

Remember brown.

F

Yeah, so I guess there's no leeway on that. Is that what you're saying director.

A

Well, I I haven't, we haven't had those negotiations, I think we're just reacting to what they they sent us, but I you know I. I can certainly ask that question. Is you know if we were to say this is a deal breaker the opt-out, where you have to allow for people to opt out and not change your prices? Would they basically remove or or take back their proposal.

B

A

Would they have some other terms or conditions upon which you know they would still be interested.

F

Yeah I mean I would be interested because I just think you're putting people in a tough position saying they can't opt out.

A

And again, I think this is a good question for the for the um reference entities. So I believe that like sheridan has republic- and I believe that was one of the the companies or the cities that they referenced. So how do they handle that you know? Do they allow for opt-outs and then, um if they let's say they, don't, then how do they? What's the feedback from the public? I know golden allows it and they were, I believe, at about a two percent rate, which is what we then asked them to assume within the proposals.

A

um So is that you know if they're too, if golden's reading about two percent is that typical is that you know the norm and then what has been the citizen feedback on if you were allowed or not allowed to opt out that might give.

C

A

C

Go ahead remember great.

E

Thanks I had um it's been a while, but I thought I'd looked at what arvada did and I thought they had republic and I thought they had the same situation where, um in order to opt out, you still pay the base fee. I think the difference there, as I recall, was that their base fee was the lowest level of service like 13 bucks.

D

E

Also, their monthly cost for, if you are in the program, was also incredibly low, such that almost no one would want to opt out and those are both key differences than the situation we're facing, where um you'd still have to pay uh 24 a month and that doesn't seem to fly. For me, I mean thinking of what my neighbors would say. No way I mean that's, not an opt-out, it's really not so. In that sense, it's kind of against the rfp, because I thought we'd said we're.

E

Gonna have an opt-out option, but if you're still paying anyway, it's really not an opt-out option.

C

And it'd be more than that too, because of the admin fee.

A

We we went well, I forget, were we going to charge that I think we were just going to.

C

That's what you said was that okay, the goal was that I mean the way that we defined it when we.

A

C

The opt out would be just paying the admin fee because you have to deal with.

B

That I'm opting.

A

Out yeah, okay, yeah so yeah, whereas maybe two dollars might be acceptable. 24 plus two is probably not so I I will certainly follow up with the references on that.

C

Remember kawanabe.

B

I've got a quick question just on operational procedures, so the city council is making a final decision on this. Do they have a procurement department that does the contract negotiations such that if we are identifying the biggest holes, we're not the ones that are actually facilitating the those negotiations back and forth.

A

It's we do have a procurement division within our finance department, but it usually comes down to this. The staff like, in this case public works, who works back with the individual um proposers for any of our rfps.

B

Got it okay, thank you.

C

So, with waste management, you asked someone about ally and trucks, truck fuel and with republic you talked to them about large item truck fuel uh and rate adjustment. Were there any other things that you discussed with either of them.

A

Yes, so with republic, um I didn't catch this when we talked last, but in rereading it they had. If you remember, we had talked about making a decision this spring and then giving ourselves about six months or so to educate the public. If we went forward, educate the public and roll out probably fall of 2022., so they actually um proposed a schedule.

A

Well, actually, excuse me it wasn't in the proposal. That's why I had to go back after I talked with republic. I didn't really see it detailed in there, but when we were talking he said yeah we actually are going to have implementation pushed out till spring of 2023..

A

So I asked him to clarify that point as well, so which would be probably at least you know, six months beyond what we had originally anticipated.

A

So his thought process on not starting this work until april of 2023 is a result of the shortage of workforce. Every industry is seen across the country. We put the implementation out this far to ensure republic could have a full workforce trained and ready to go by the time the program began. Republic is hopeful. The labor shortage will improve over the next year. We want to ensure we are prepared labor-wise for this work.

A

So that was a new piece of information that I don't think was detailed very well in the proposal.

C

Okay, so then I think for so those are all the things that you talk to them about.

F

B

C

Have their formal responses that we can all consume before the next meeting, and we may have I mean hopefully we'll have more input as well, since we still don't have a clear answer on some of the biggest things like the alley for waste management.

C

One thing we could do with our time that I think would make sense, is looking at the um the yearly comparison to which is the you know. The index applied growing cost over the different length of contracts, so we can have some perspective on how that affects things. Even if the underlying numbers end up shifting due to you know, shifts due to rfp details. That matter remember brown.

F

I don't want to get off track, chair green, but I was just wondering uh have any of these companies and I think this has been answered before. But what? If someone? As a citizen, wanted to pay the whole year up front? Would they get any discounts? Because I know we're not getting any senior discounts correct.

A

uh Yeah we were, we had talked about senior discounts, but had not put anything formal in place. Member brown um you can certainly just like you could with your utility bill, is pay that in advance for the whole year, but we were not contemplating that there'd be a discount for that. If you paid you know the year in advance,.

F

Because I know some trash haulers will allow you to do that and take a certain percentage off, because they're getting the money up front. Sure.

C

As far as I'm aware, we haven't discussed that in any of our meetings. I don't remember ever talking about that, um but it's an interesting question. I mean certainly that's a common offering when you've got a subscription that you pay monthly or quarterly or you know annually, but I don't believe that we have discussed that so.

F

C

F

Too late chair green to discuss that.

C

I mean I I don't you know that would be more, I think on whether we want to put that to them and whether the city thinks that that would be feasible to coordinate or useful. I mean I'm certainly not opposed to potentially asking that to me that falls way below on priority compared to the key terms of the rfp that we still don't have a proposal that addresses.

F

Right I mean I, I agree with you, I'm just thinking that it also may cut down on administrative fees.

C

Oh because it's less paperwork right, yeah.

B

F

Although if it's.

B

C

The water bill, then you know it's not necessarily a separate mailing, so it's not necessarily going to cost much less right. Director d'andrea, since that's still going to have to go out, I mean now they went to monthly instead of quarterly, which seems odd, as far as like trying to make it more efficient. But but you know, since it's going to be doubled up, I don't know that it would actually save all that much.

A

Yeah, we would still send out the bill physically, regardless, if you had paid ahead of time so.

C

So yeah go ahead and guide us through this.

A

Okay, all right, so what you see on the screen there is thank you. Michelle is the comparison over the years, so you see both we're comparing the seven year and the ten-year contract again between company, a on the left company b in that middle column, and what you see is that I took out the large item: voucher expense just to be more apples to apples. So this was the option three or the scenario three that was included in your packet if you're interested. But again this to me was the most apples to apples comparison.

A

um So, as you can see there, yeah.

C

Oh, this is going to ask this is based on the what the last 10 years of the index that both republic and waste management requested. We utilize.

A

No, so what I did was I took so remember: the language within the rfp was the lesser of three percent or the cpi adjustment, so the cpi could be less than the three percent, but I went with the conservative of three percent. So if the.

E

A

Was let's say, 4.7 we'd still be at the three percent per the rfp, so what you see reflected here is an annual increase so the for year, one and year two were the same, and then I increased it. Three percent thereafter, meaning that that would be according to the rfp was the maximum amount that they could receive.

A

Is everybody clear clear on that so.

C

It's the first two years: it's no increase and then every other year it's a three percent increase, correct.

A

Okay, now per the rfp, it could be less if the cpi came in less, but what I was able to find from the um uh you know waste that waste index that they both referenced was each year and it's varied, but it's generally been a little bit over three percent in most years, so it's higher than the three percent.

C

And what was there didn't they at least one of them pushed back on that right. Both did.

A

Both wanted to use more, we we referenced in the rfp, the denver, aurora lakewood cpi and then in um they both reckon or wanted requested, at least that we consider using the water sewer trash index for the nation.

C

And that's the one that you looked at and over the last ten years was around three percent each year.

A

A little bit more, I I would say in the 2008 2009 um I had a hard time finding that, though, and that it was consistent data, but I will send that in the next packet, but it ranged anywhere from I believe, the highest that I saw in like 2008 2009 time frame was around six to seven percent. Oh wow, down to about a little over three percent in the more recent years.

C

When you do that, will you please include both the one that we had originally.

F

C

And then also the one that they're asking for so we can see the last 10-year difference between the two. Thank you remember, brown.

F

Yeah, could I ask uh on company a with the seven-year contract? Why are the prices the same for a 32 gallon and a 96 gallon, whereas company b 32 gallon is lower than the 96 gallon.

A

Remember brown, you just caught an error in my math, I that is an error. So, yes, the company, a should be higher on that seven year contract or the 96 gallon.

A

So I must have copied that down and then not referenced. The higher amount for the 96 gallon.

F

Okay, I was just curious why you know there was no difference in that.

A

No good good catch.

E

I I thought that it was the same in their bid off to go back and look was it I mean one company had had essentially no break in price for the smaller size. Well, maybe it did. Okay.

A

C

A it's the same values between pay as you throw in uniform container. Okay on all four, I just I've got everything up on my other screen. I just went through them.

E

I was assuming it's because they would say it cost them the same to lift up the the bim, regardless of what size it is take the same amount of labor.

F

I'm sorry so we're saying that these prices are correct. On company a.

C

It appears to be to me, based on the the look you know we got the the different um spreadsheets that she sent, which let's another thing that will help, I think, is understanding the difference between those with the tipping fees and stuff, because that's not totally clear to me, I would like to. We- can use, maybe more of our time today to be clear on what those differences are, but she sent us four different ones and company a it's. The same prices for pay-as-you-throw versus uniform container for all four of those.

A

It is yep, so I'm just verifying on my spreadsheet. That is correct. So what what you see reflected in that yearly summary? It does reflect the actual prices I misspoke emergency. Those are correct.

F

As you see them, okay, so why would anyone if we want say with company a? Why would anyone want a 32 gallon.

A

I think then, just for moving it. You know the physicalness of not having the room or not having the the strength to move a larger one. Okay,.

C

Yeah, we didn't know if pay as you throw, would end up being much of a benefit cost wise or not.

B

C

In in what we've, actually you know, the result of it is that it's actually more expensive because company a it's the same price, either way and company b um it's more expensive pay as you throw.

F

E

Companies, the larger size.

C

E

The larger sizes of like what a dollar more! But if you do have a 32 gallon, it was significantly less.

F

On company b, yeah number banker is that what you're saying yeah? Yes so yeah.

C

I just think most people are probably going to have the larger size and therefore it is more expensive for the bulk of citizens.

C

I mean, unless I'm totally wrong and more people go to 32, but I think most people are used to 96. So I bet you most. People are gonna need that.

C

um Any other questions on the or any other data to request from director d'andrea on the year-over-year thing.

C

All right uh director d'andrea, could you please explain the difference between each of the four cost comparisons.

A

Sure yeah, so um everybody was clear in this yearly comparison, so yeah, okay, yeah! If you could scroll back up michelle to option one or uh what I was I calling them comparison number one. So again comparison number one was directly what they proposed.

A

So you had the base service, which was intended to include the large item pickup um the tipping fee, which we broke out separately, and then I totaled those for as a cost per month for both for the pay as you throw for both the 32 gallon versus the 96 and, as you can see for company a. I had that asterisk there about that. The pricing does not include that large item pickup or a voucher program.

A

Basically, and you can see the cost difference between company a and company b on the far right or that right series of columns.

A

So anything in red would show that company a is less than company b. Anything in black would be where company b is greater than um or excuse me less than company a.

A

So, for example, on the base service under the 32 gallon that first line of data you can see the the monthly cost for base service is 23.33 for the or excuse me. Let's look at the seven years. Sorry so the base service for company a is 22.56.

A

And then for the seven year contract for company b, it's fifteen dollars and fourteen cents, so company b and the far right columns is seven dollars and 41 cents less. Okay. Does that make sense, but on the tipping fee, they're more because they're 710 versus 250., so they're higher on the tipping fee? And you can see the net difference there is that you're still saving with company b two dollars and 42 cents.

A

But then, when you get to the 96 gallon, you can see it's all red, so weight company a is cheaper across the board by 4.80.

C

Do you have any perspective on why the tipping fees would be so massively different.

A

No, um you know again, I think company b is wants. Is that um the value share program?

A

So you know, I think, there's probably incentive then to try and and get us to do that so which brings it down to 410 versus 250, which is still a fair amount of difference, um but I think also that you know the I I I couldn't say what that difference is because again, I think uh member quantum bay said this. You know that I would say that um company a is hauling it a longer distance.

E

Yeah, it's surprising, I thought.

D

E

Closer one would be less.

B

I was a member borman.

A

Oh, is it been performing sorry and then, oh god,.

C

A

C

uh Well I'll, I can ask my questions after you finish.

A

Okay and then just um quickly to look at the uniform container, so I just wanted to walk people through the math, as you move from left to right. So the uniform container is just then the one comparison between the 96 gallon for each company, and uh I apologize I misspoke, but, as you can see there, the prices for both 32 on the company, a 32 96 and then the uniform container 96 are all the same.

A

So they they didn't differentiate between the two programs for company a, whereas they did for those different scales on company b and only slightly.

A

Okay, so that's okay, comparison, number, two and again here's the prices for those other items at the bottom there, if you're interested comparison, number two what I did um if you could just go back up just to touch michelle, so I can read the top there yeah. So this was so what I did was I um reduced the tipping fee by that, assuming let's say we did the value share.

A

So if we were to do the value share, how do we compare you know company a to company b, so you can see, then, if you, if you laid the comparison, one versus comparison, two now they're closer right, because we're reducing that tipping fee by three dollars uh for company b across the board, so they get closer in terms of their pricing and how close they are to each other um in comparison.

A

C

But it could end up being higher because it's risk right exactly.

A

Yep, so you have to then count that risk in theirs is how yeah concerning? Is that that we would have to cover those costs in a month where some of those recyclable materials aren't as valuable.

C

But you're thinking that that would not be passed on to citizens.

A

The hope would be is that we, I don't feel like we can. You know, I think, that we have to advertise here's your rate for the year and then we make it up on the next year. If we wanted to go that that route, one way or the other, maybe it's a credit or maybe it's a it's an increase. But that's that's a feels like a pretty big risk.

C

Yeah remember brown.

F

uh But these prices don't include recycling, correct.

A

They do remember brown, yes,.

C

Yeah, I remember that was one thing that we ended up with recycling was not there's no option to opt out so.

B

C

So all the pricing is both waste and recycling.

F

Okay, thank you.

A

All right and then if we could go to comparison, three.

C

A

C

I had some questions on the bottom part. It could be on any of them just okay, um so the that first one additional waste container. It's it's n, a for waste management. Does that mean they're unwilling to even have that as an option or what does that mean.

A

um I'd have to look back again at the their proposal, but I I think that we just need to clarify that for them they they. The statement in the proposal was that they couldn't like, because we're leasing them or their own, that they're not going to sell another container, and I think it's the difference between a lease and a sale. You know, so um I think we just need to clarify that for them. Obviously, people are gonna. Do that you know they're gonna, be households who want more than one trash can.

A

So how do we accommodate that.

C

And then what is the outside of container pickup limited per year?.

A

So if you recall, we wanted to get a price, at least for if, if there was the opportunity to put things outside of the container, I think it was. If I remember correctly, um so that's the bundled.

C

Branches and up to five bags, whenever you want so they're.

A

B

C

Could pay an extra 50 bucks a year so that anytime they could put out bags and bundles correct yep, so uncomfortably.

B

Remember brown.

C

That's something to be aware of, because I know that that was one thing that you are representing a lot of citizens on, um so that they they offered the option to pay extra to have that, whereas your public did not yeah.

A

So what is 50 divided by 12 so about four dollars per month? Extra for that which might or might not be a bad.

F

Price, I'm sorry, uh chair green. Could you just repeat what you said about.

C

Okay, so see the line that says outside of container pickup.

F

C

So what that's referring to is what we ended up with in the rfp was that it became an optional thing for the proposal for the provider to offer to pick up bags and bundles outside of the trash. Can we we did not get that as a required part of the rfp, but it was included as an optional part of the rfp republic did not provide a price for that they're saying they're unwilling to do it. Waste management said they are willing to do it for an extra 50 bucks a year.

F

E

I thought that republicans said they would do it, but it would be 350 a bag or a bundle. That's.

A

Instead of paying.

E

Yearly, you would pay per bag or bundle, which is what my neighbors say that they have now with republic.

C

And that bottom section um fits with what you're saying number brinker, because it does list trash bag and bundles as 350, for both of them.

C

I mean the difference would be like someone who's dealing with. You know a large yard with a lot of yard waste, and you know frequently three four bags 30 on leaf days stuff like that, but anyway yeah someone was about to say something. Sorry, I heard a voice, but I don't know who it was.

C

Okay. Those are my questions, so you can keep going with your.

A

Number three description: yep comparison number three. I took the difference between. um Basically I took out the lar, the voucher costs from company b, so still keeping keeping the tipping fees higher for company b. So not anticipating that value share.

A

So comparing if we just went apples to apples without the voucher program, what would the cost difference be? So you can see they're again um lower for company a on the 96 gallon um better for company b on the 32 and then on the uniform container. It was less for company a so I thought this was probably the closest comparison.

A

Three was probably the closest as being apples to apples comparison and then the fourth comparison I took out the um or I included the value share and then again reduce or removing the large item voucher. So if we, for some reason wanted to go with, you know no no voucher program and then also doing the value share.

A

You know it gets very, very close, then, between the two companies.

C

Do you have any feedback or sense, like maybe feedback from city manager or other people in the city or general sense about that value? Share program I mean: do you think, that's something that the city would actually consider that has possibly better or is that just too risky.

A

I I think I need to talk to the references again who are already doing this and how much are they seeing and what are their experiences? Basically, I think they're going to be our best source of information for that, and then how do they program within their budget to account for that and then how do they either pass that or absorb those costs with with their customers?

A

The citizens basically.

C

Okay, remember brown.

F

uh Yeah, I know I keep bringing this up, but could you what did why? Is there such a big difference on the tipping feet between a and b.

A

Yeah, I I'd have to ask you know the basis for their costs. For that I don't have an answer for that. Member brown.

F

Okay and who receives that tipping fee.

A

So it depends on which facility they go to. So that's the cost that the facility absorbs for taking the material and then handling it from there. Okay, so for waste management, they did say they would use the oxford station um to dispose of all their materials which is located in englewood.

A

um I believe company, a or republic would take it to their waste facility out on tower road, which is in commerce, city.

C

And does the tipping fee apply to both waste and recycling.

A

C

So that's why a portion of the tipping fee is affected by the value share or the risk share or whatever it is.

A

Correct yep, so the that portion of the tipping theme yeah is real, somehow related or tied back into or yeah. I don't know if it's half or what percentage of the tipping fee for garbage versus versus recycling.

C

And did you ask uh republic about why they didn't um offer the optional um outside of container pickup? I did not ask that question.

B

C

um All right, where does does anyone have any other questions want to go into this in more detail?.

C

How long do you think till we could have all of the things we've asked for you know at least a week ahead of you know our next meeting, so recording of the post rfp meeting the indexes both indexes for the last 10 years. The references for the value share, detailed response to the alley situation.

C

um What what kind of timeline do you need to be able to have all that so that we have it? You know at least a week before our meeting.

A

Yeah I I obviously can't speak for the the company representatives, but I would say that I could definitely um definitely have that information to you the week between christmas and new year's.

A

I can certainly reach out to the companies tomorrow to see if they could provide the materials you know that week as well, so that we could shoot for a meeting the first week in january. Perhaps.

C

Which is counting on us getting the information between.

A

The week of christmas and new year's correct, yeah.

C

All right so within we're talking about the week starting on the second, uh I think the.

A

Third is a monday.

C

Yeah yeah- I was thinking this sunday but okay, oh.

D

C

Sunday is the second um all right, so our next thing is to schedule our next meeting, um so this was a tuesday. I think our last one was on a wednesday. We've all been able to attend. Both of these, I don't have a sense of which is um better for more people.

E

I can't do the fourth, the tuesday.

C

You can't do the fourth okay.

B

C

B

Your no go for me.

C

The fifth better: no okay! What about the 11th or 12th.

E

What's wrong with the sixth? Is that out.

C

um I am not sure what about the sixth is anyone not able to do the sixth.

C

Oh okay. Well then, let's plan for the six, do we need to do 630 again vice chair borman, or this is what I'm good. Okay. Does everyone does six o'clock on the sixth of january work for everyone, or does it not work for anyone.

C

Okay, then, we'll plan for that six to eight on january 6th for our next meeting.

C

uh Does anyone have an issue with 6 30.

F

Well, do you think that we could be over by eight.

C

I don't know I mean this seemed like it might go shorter and we're still going to be ending up at two hours, so I I would not count on it.

D

Okay, well I'll be a little late. If we do um that day on january 6th at six o'clock, I will be late. The.

B

D

Sixth, yes,.

B

E

30 sounds like our best option.

C

Yeah, remember brown: are you not you have to leave? You have a hard end at eight or something.

F

I think it just depends. My plans are kind of indefinite at this point and I don't want to keep moving the date. So I guess, if I have to go leave early, I will.

C

Okay, then, let's, let's do 6 30 on the sixth.

D

B

C

So then, our next agenda item is chairperson's choice. I don't have anything then committee members choice. Does anyone else.

D

Oh yeah, let me.

D

Maybe we can review this next time, but I thought we really kind of glossed over waste management's solution for um smart trucks um and it's because we didn't really get a chance to look at it.

D

We all just looked at it, but let's next time um that sounds like a really good forward way of teaching people what goes in the recycle container, because then they get an automatic um message to them, telling them that it's you know the contamination is identified and a notification is sent to the customer via email or a text, and then waste management in the city will coordinate contamination charges if applicable.

D

You know that is one of the things we talked about was educating um people on what goes in the recycling container, and that would a solution like that would answer our problem.

D

So that's just uh uh a heads up, and maybe we can consider that in our decision um when we meet next month.

C

Sure yeah will you please um make sure we have info to consider that director d'andrea.

C

Thank you. Anybody else.

C

um All right and let's uh adjourn thank you. Everyone.

F

C

Oh, did someone have something.

F

Yeah, I'm sorry chair green, um I just wanted to know, uh does the do? Is there a franchise fee for trash haulers? That inglewood collects.

A

Yes, so, but it's just from the englewood oxford station.

F

Okay, because there was a core request done a while ago, and the clerk said, as per the code inglewood, does not have a franchise fee for trash haulers, and she also said trash haulers in inglewood must have a trash hauler's license, which is renewable annually.

F

Under that license, each hauler is required to pay 75 per truck per year.

F

So is she wrong or.

A

Let me clarify what the the name of the fee is so remember. We've talked about this before I can't recall what it is, but the city does receive a small fee or well. I won't say what the small large whatever, but there is a fee that's received from the oxford station, because it's located in the city of englewood, I will clarify what the name of the fee is for our next meeting. I don't know if it's called the franchise fee or what it's called exactly, but we did talk about this in the past.

F

Okay, so then, with the other hauler, where it's not at the oxford station, would they too collect a franchise fee.

A

No, so they they're taking their waste. As we read in the proposal to another facility outside of the city of englewood, so we would not receive any additional revenue or any kind of fee from that.

F

A

F

Okay, thank you for clarifying I'm done. Thank you.

C

All right, finally,.

F

Thank you. Everyone.

C

Let's uh adjourn the meeting we'll we'll see everyone on the 6th. Thank you. Bye.

B

Good night, everybody.

C

Good night bye.