City of Englewood, Colorado Sustainability Commission Meetings, 22 Mar 2023

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From YouTube: Sustainability Commission Energy Codes Meeting 3/22/2023

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Agenda HTML: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/157686?handle=B96DD3626AD7458CA4EB25D2A556C548
Agenda PDF: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/157685?handle=EC54737B0F764491BC2F26F6F23FF29A

1. Chair Michael Chisholm approval of the agenda

2. Roll Call

3. Call to Order

4. Welcome Guests

5. Upcoming Tasks and Events

Energy Codes discussion

Vote on memo to council around proposed energy codes

6. Public Forum

This is an opportunity for the public to address the Commission regarding items not on the agenda. Commissioners may ask questions for clarification, but there will not be any dialogue. Presentations ...

7. Staff's Choice

8. Council Liaison's Choice

9. Commissioner's Choice

10. Adjourn

Agenda HTML: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/157686?handle=B96DD3626AD7458CA4EB25D2A556C548
Agenda PDF: https://englewoodgov.civicweb.net/filepro/documents/157685?handle=EC54737B0F764491BC2F26F6F23FF29A

A

Yeah I got it too. I went over to hung out with Mike on Saturday. First, we rode e-bikes.

B

A

It was a blast and then we went over in the he showed me what he's been working on with biochar, so um he sent me home with a little package. It was great.

B

Mike, you have an e-bike.

C

B

Didn't know that oh.

C

Yeah I uh I love it, but I said one of the biggest challenges is parking and security, because yeah I mean I, don't dare leave it out on the sidewalk and go into a store, so I mean it's something to think about, and then it's it's neither uh foul or beast, because it's not really a bicycle and it's not really a motorcycle. So there's there's some clarification that I think has to evolve in terms of etiquette safety. uh It'll come, but it's it's an unanticipated challenge. I think.

B

Yeah I think it was Rachel um paulia who had the idea of like secure increased, secured bike.

B

um Shelters for Englewood and I had reached out to RTD about that, because I thought it was such a good idea and they sent me kind of like information, hey Tiana, on what those could look like and they are really cool. But some of them are very pricey. So.

C

Anyways they're a lot of fun, they're, cool, and so is it. This Saturday is the EV meeting at Nixon's.

B

Yeah we have oh, my gosh the time between now and the end of April. There's actually a lot of events, so there's one this Saturday, so it's the Eevee event and people can come and give comment on the draft EB action plan. We wanted like an in-person and virtual option for folks um and there's one on April, 8th at Broken Tee and then um hopefully, we're gonna have more information about Earth Day tomorrow. Actually that has been a thorn in my side, but hopefully we'll have something for receive.

B

Then too all right, you all just so you all know you do have Quorum now that Tiana's here.

C

Thank you Tiana. Well, if we can call the meeting to order and uh both Logan and Mel uh coach me hi Tiana, thank you for coming up, um don't be afraid to wrote me in or coach me on on running a meeting. You won't hurt my feelings at all, so.

B

Oh, the one comment, so sorry yeah just so you know because you helped make um Quorum for today you are a voting member, um so your votes do count just so. You know.

C

Right you saved us, thank you, um Tiana, okay, so I'd like to call a meeting to order and I think we probably need to take roll correct so Rick. Why don't we start with you and we'll just go around the screen here? All.

D

Right Rick, Campbell, Hines member here.

A

Logan Dunning president.

E

Christine Brinker present.

F

Tiana president, okay Michael.

B

Jackson present.

C

Okay, okay: well, we have uh sort of a one item agenda tonight and I hope everybody has read through some of the materials and if I can just recap, my understanding and I trust. All of you will uh will join in.

C

At our last meeting, we had some discussions about the uh recommendations uh coming from the city departments relating to some of the uh proposed guidelines, recommendations, uh I say how how green do we want to be Christine's done a lot of work on understanding it and I will defer a lot of this to you, Christine you're, the content expert. But from my point of view it seems like the sustainability. Council uh ought to have an opinion and we ought to have a consensus and we ought to communicate clearly to city council. What our thoughts are.

C

uh I have some thoughts, but I'll hold back and so I would throw opened up anyone who'd like to to speak and share their thoughts.

A

So we got a response from um the city on some of our questions. Is that accurate.

D

Karen Karen responded: yeah Karen.

A

Responded so I would ask Christine or the group to maybe recap, Karen's response to our inquiries and whether or not um we need to adjust the memo based off of that. Okay.

C

Chris Christine dropped out there.

F

D

Is wonder where.

C

She is, we were talking about you, Christine.

E

My daughter called okay.

C

Go ahead, Logan maybe finish your sentence.

A

I sort of commissioned Christine on that one. Then she fell off as it said, if Christine or the group since since Karen responded to us, if we could kind of quickly recap her response to our inquiries and whether or not our concerns were addressed what's outstanding, and if we need to adjust the memo in any particular way or if we still want to push back. You know things like that.

E

um uh I'm still a bit confused about what, if our memo would still be necessary or not, or if we just still send the whole thing in that way, the council would know that we have been engaged throughout the process so to speak, or at least the past few weeks.

E

um uh Even if some of these minor things get changed um and then we can also make sure we have a record in case for some reason they don't get changed or somebody gets Lost in Translation.

E

um So the building responded back and said most of these C minor and definitional and or small tweaks, and they seem acceptable uh pertaining to um to family buildings, three stories or under, and so we wrote back just to clarify what about multi-family, building six stories and over, because that was also a gap and it seemed like she said that that um was okay, that that um she was okay with that with those changes as well.

E

um She didn't answer about our small change about the multifamily, to um move it from 10 to 15 for EV charging, um I'm, hoping that that's part of what she just said. um um The small tweaks seemed acceptable, hoping that it's grouped in with there, but she didn't specifically um call that out. The.

A

Major piece was making sure that electric ready was included. Can you brief me on whether or not that was addressed.

B

Laughs I: can it because you.

E

Sounded like yeah, do you want to read what she wrote to make sure I don't misinterpret it? Yeah.

B

So I just want to say that Karen has been awesome. She's had such a fast response time, which has been really really great um she's out of office for the later half of this day, which is why she couldn't make it um so we Christine had some follow-up questions um that I relayed to her to see if she could get them back for today. If she did because she's a superstar and um she said that one of the questions was just Clarity on.

B

If the building division was okay, with proposing electric ready for the code cycle um and in her words, which it makes sense, she said with Council approval, which all of this has to get Council approval staff would include electric ready requirements.

D

But but not electric preferred as I understand. Is that correct.

B

The question posed to her was just proposing electric ready, and so she said that she would include electric ready.

A

Electric ready was what was missing and what would bring us up to that minimum standard and qualify us for all the funding is that accurate.

E

Okay, right and we've had two rounds of comments back from here in the building official and and so that's why it might be confusing, but her first response back said: um uh no two electric preferred, maybe the next round, um because basically small steps at a time um it. It still seems worth it to include it in our memo, just to show that we want to continue pushing and then also to show that electric ready itself is quite minor.

E

You know, if you show The Next Step, then it makes that that step not seem not quite so big, um so I think we could still leave it in there as a suggestion just to make sure it stays on council's radar, although recognizing that the building division won't be proposing it or necessarily supporting it this round, um but from what we can tell, she would be okay supporting electric ready requirements. It's still not clear if she would put that into the March 27th study session materials um or if our memo here would provide double flag.

C

Okay, uh it's it says to me that there's still value in US saying what we mean and meaning what we say it seems like there's a parlay going on between who's, approving or recommending to my way of thinking. Sustainability commission makes a recommendation whether the department agrees with that recommendation is not our concern. I think this is our opportunity to put something on the record that we, the sustainability, commission, believe or support, so I got confused in Reading. uh Her response thinking we're not asking for Karen's permission to put anything in.

C

We are telegraphing to her. What we intend to put in so really we extended a courtesy to her and that's all well and good.

C

um I'll just finish my thought: I wrote a note to myself and it has to do with the tone and the tenor of the communication between us, the city and Karen.

C

um She said uh she's concerned that uh the amendment on universal charging stations might conflict with code next and that this planning process now I'm saying wait a minute. This is a dynamic planning process.

F

C

Us it doesn't make sense to me that our recommendations or thoughts would conflict with anything. She.

E

C

Requirements or on saying parking requirements should be considered early on in the process, and our Amendment only presents a a reasonable design consideration. So so again, who's asking for permission, I mean I, just think. We're communicating honestly and I and I feel like uh under the green code amendments um she's talking about what's convenient or inconvenient to the Community, Development and planning.

C

That's not the issue. I mean the city, the city, council and the citizens put forth recommendations and those are design parameters. The department responds to those design parameters, so I'm not I, feel like we're chasing our Tails somewhat and I. Don't want to do that. So I guess I feel strongly that um that you know any discrepancies between what we recommend and what the department thinks or whatever um they should be presented in a proactive Manner and that sooner those are talked about and considered the better.

C

So in other words, don't wait for the problem and then ask the department to fix the problem anticipate. So my whole thing is I. Want sustainability, commission to be proactive, throw our recommendations out in front and let the department say what they.

E

C

Our recommendations, I.

A

C

Anyways, what are you guys, thoughts on that.

D

Mike I think you said a lot there and I I think that from the head nods I'm seeing on the screen, I think we all kind of agree that you know we we need to be. We need to be at the front of this in terms of how we present things. uh Christine did a bang-up job on putting that together uh and uh the fact that that uh Karen has responded.

D

I think, like you, said, Mel, it's it's a good sign that she's engaged and she wants to be responsive and carry on a conversation with it. But as far as our actual present, uh you know memo to them. I say we. We don't change anything I, think we we let them know where we stand on this. We are a citizen group. We do represent the citizens of the city.

A

I agree with you Mike in the sentiment that we should be the ones Forward, Thinking um and anticipating, and that's reflected in this memo, um whether or not the city or the Departments want to drag their feet. To be frank, that's that's outside of our control, but we can offer what we have vetted discussed and ultimately recommend and I. Think that that's what this memo does and so I would be in agreeance that we move forward with the memo as written and.

C

Probably my thoughts on proactive versus reactive don't need to be put in writing to anybody, but I. Think amongst us. I just I want to share that with you. If we can push if we can push the edge a little bit and you know prod them in the rear end, a little bit I think we should and I've got thick skin I mean I I, don't think we're doing anything radical at all, I think we're just speaking reasonably and I'm surprised that there's any disagreement on that. So um I have a question.

A

Go ahead when Karen says it runs contrary to code next is: does she is she referencing current city statute or is it she referencing the ongoing process? That of code next currently great question.

B

C

So the conversations are ongoing, so I don't know that code next has put anything forth to conflict with I mean.

E

C

E

It's mathematically impossible to conflict with it because code next now and in their future version, will set some sort of parking requirements based on building size, location building, type Etc and the EV requirements are a percentage of that parking. And then the universal spaces in turn are a percentage of those EV spaces. And so there's there's no way mathematically that that the subset could be bigger than the whole set and.

A

I think they're just and.

E

I wonder if, if that's unclear, um we could add a sentence essentially explaining we recognize that parking minimums are under discussion as part of the code next, but we don't force, we don't foresee any conflict between the two because uh such and such because they're a subset with that. Would that help maybe cut off some of the confusion? If she might have had that point of confusion, maybe city council might as well.

A

I'm fine with that I I. Think if we need to add that quick Amendment, that's fine um I do have about five minutes. um Seven minutes before I have to hop on another meeting, but um don't want to rush this so I, I, I'm, I think the the conclusion is.

A

um We submit we go forward with the current memo and if we need to have added clarifying Amendment toward the end that Christine just laid out, that's fine um but I, don't think we dial it back by any means. Okay,.

D

Christine, you can speak to this better than anybody because you're on the code next hearing committee, but I I, can't imagine that you know that anything is is so set in stone right now with code next that they can't. At least you know, look at this as a piece of that and and like you said, if it's a percentage of a percentage, then you know it's still going to be there. So yeah I would encourage you to put a line in there clarifying that a little bit, maybe.

B

Logan is leaving in five, he does make Quorum and you guys can't vote without him being here. So.

A

If you do want.

C

To vote anything yeah.

F

C

Know you're the new kid on the Block and I. Don't want to put you on the spot, but please offer your thoughts questions. uh Are we making sense to you and what what's? What's Your Gut telling you.

F

No I'm agreeing with most of what you guys are saying or all of what you guys are saying: I think that things shouldn't be um taken out because they ask us not to consider it right now. um I think it's still worth talking about and putting it on the record that we want them.

D

F

Yeah I was gonna, that's.

C

What I was trying to say? Okay,.

F

D

C

Trying to say well in the interest of time and and thank you, Logan you're right, um I, I I'm asking the group: can we bring it to a vote.

B

Are you voting with the amendment or voting on the memo? As is that's all, I need Clarity on.

C

Let's start with the amendment: what's the group feel.

E

Amendment that came up uh from Karen, which is that they don't have this staff now to to develop or Implement some of the additional green coach items and I wonder if we acknowledge that and say even if they're not ready now can we request that I.

C

E

In a process in place to start the ball rolling to make sure we're not just kicking it can down the road saying: oh, we still don't have staff. Well, we still don't know. Of course we didn't even ask for it all.

C

E

With those two amendments.

C

All right, here's a thought and Mel make sure this is all proper. Could we could we vote to approve the amendment? I'm sorry. Could we vote to approve Christine's draft with two amendments and we would trust that Christine and Mel could Wordsmith those amendments. We don't need to look over their shoulder. We have trust and good faith. Those two people can articulate what we've just been talking about is is.

B

That yeah, you all, have done that before that's totally fine yeah.

A

I think we're voting to approve the memo, as is and then with two amendments conceptually and have melon Christine Drafthouse.

C

Okay, if everybody's okay, with that all those in favor, raise your hand and say aye all right, all right opposed none, I! Guess: I! Guess: we've accomplished something here! You all! Thank you very much. Thanks.

B

C

Else we need to talk about or worry about, or do you.

B

Just have to officially adjourn and then you all are good question.

A

Does Mike, thank you, so much does Mike need to sign the anything or do we have a signature on this, or is it just good from the commission.

B

I believe it's good from the commission I, don't think we did one from the last one I'll double triple check and if so, Michael just send you like an e-sign for it sure cool thanks.

C

Logan well again, I can't thank you guys enough. It was a last minute but I think it's important enough. I wanted to get it in I. Think we've accomplished something here so again and Christine. Obviously thank you for all your work on this you're.

D

The you're, the expert and yeah we.

C

Really appreciate what you're doing so have a good evening look I! Let's move to I moved to adjourn how's that.

B

C

All right, good.

D

D